I'm Going To Court: Suing A Thai

[TonyLeung]

why would you lend 30k baht to a policeman/bar owner?

[MrSquigle]

Exactly...and why would you think a policemna/bar owner was really your friend.

Anyway, I have a case in about 2 weeks, so will see how that little episode goes.

[TheDon]

How long did you know this person before loaning him this money????

[zorro1]

Ok maybe the OP made a mistake lending money to a Thai person

onzestan

case`closed live n learn

Edited December 2, 2007 by zorro1

[kennkate]

I would forget it. Put it down to experiance and you wont get caught out again

You cant get blood out of a stone.

Your lawer will get paid, so he will be sure to say you will recover the money.

But at the end of the day its not up to him.

The man is in the police service. He will have mates out on the streets,

you could find yourself looking at a police officer in a funny way or driving too fast, or showing disrespect to the Royal Family Ect Ect

Could be a real can of worms.

As has been said I think it would be better to take it out of his bar, or his women tell him that would be acceptable to you

Try to work out a compromise

whatever you do BEST OF LUCK

[actiondell4]

It seems you didnt have so much trust for him as a friend,otherwise you would not have gone to the trouble of both turning up to see the Lawyer ,not to mention you paying the Lawyers fees to draw up the loan agreement,i wondered why you went out of your way to do this,UNLESS there was something in it for you?

If you done all this out of the goodness of your heart,then i would love to be your friend too.

[LoveDaBlues]

If you really have to make a loan, then make sure you get collateral for when they default.

Contracts are not worth the paper they are written on for loans. Even if you win the case, he proves he has nothing to pay you back and he goes to jail (maybe?). You still don't get your money back. Plus you have to pay legal costs and waste your time.

This is a civil matter, not criminal so no jail time. It should be a slam-dunk to win the case. Collecting is another story.

Plenty of foreigners win in court against Thais. It's bar-stool drivel that foreigners cannot win in a Thai court.

[blizzard]

i do question op thinking..............

but why all the negativity............................lol. op has kind heart his generosity should be lauded..............lol.

[JetsetBkk]

Be sure to keep notes and please keep us informed as to progress.

Cheers & Good Luck.

Of course you should do it and, as Ken says, lets us know the outcome. Best of luck.

[mikethevigoman]

Here are the details! what do you think, will I prevail?

Dec 2006 loaned 30,000 B to a local buisiness man, a karoak/bar owner close to my house that I frequented. I got to know the guy and became friendly with him. He approached me about the loan.

Had a loan agreement made up by my attorney(signed by all parties & witnessed by attorneys) stipulating the loan to be paid by Apr. of 2007, no interest charged.

Apr. comes and Thai guy says he cannot pay back all at once, so made gentleman's agreement that he repay a small amount every month.

May repaid 2000 B after that NOTHING!

repeated attempts by myself and attorney to collect have resulted in nothing. So on attorney advice am sueing him in court for the balance due(28,000), interest since May, court costs and attorney fees.

Ps the defendant is a low level police officer in the local amphur, not that it matters or maybe it does. Not a patrol officer but more of a clerical position.

Think I have a shot at justice? or just smoke and mirrors to placate the farang. Attorney thinks it's a no brainer for me to win the suite, and says that courts will hound the guy until he pays up and may eventually confiscate some of his assets to satisfy the debt if I win.

It'l be interesting

If i were you id sue your attorney !, didnt he tell you that money lent in thailand is on a one way ticket, .. seriously, wipe your mouth and think yourself lucky it wasnt 300,000,. Edited December 2, 2007 by mikethevigoman

[Jingjok]

Good on you CM-Happy for ignoring the nay-sayers, sticking to your guns, and suing the guy. There’s a whole lot of hogwash talked about ‘no justice for foreigners’, ‘be aware of threats’ etc.

I’m sure you will see your money once the court case, which will be a public loss of face for the debtor, nears, or at worst soon after. It’s not an impossible amount so can probably be sourced from elsewhere to get you off his back.

In the three years I’ve been building a house here, I have been warned not to stand up to rip-off contractors, because there might be ‘trouble’, and have received veiled threats. Oh really. In ALL cases once one is seen as not a soft touch, or scared of a lot of big talk, they always back down. It may not win friends, but so what?

Sometimes it is necessary to stand up for what is honourable and right.

Jolly good luck to you.

[mikethevigoman]

Here are the details! what do you think, will I prevail?

Dec 2006 loaned 30,000 B to a local buisiness man, a karoak/bar owner close to my house that I frequented. I got to know the guy and became friendly with him. He approached me about the loan.

Had a loan agreement made up by my attorney(signed by all parties & witnessed by attorneys) stipulating the loan to be paid by Apr. of 2007, no interest charged.

Apr. comes and Thai guy says he cannot pay back all at once, so made gentleman's agreement that he repay a small amount every month.

May repaid 2000 B after that NOTHING!

repeated attempts by myself and attorney to collect have resulted in nothing. So on attorney advice am sueing him in court for the balance due(28,000), interest since May, court costs and attorney fees.

Ps the defendant is a low level police officer in the local amphur, not that it matters or maybe it does. Not a patrol officer but more of a clerical position.

Think I have a shot at justice? or just smoke and mirrors to placate the farang. Attorney thinks it's a no brainer for me to win the suite, and says that courts will hound the guy until he pays up and may eventually confiscate some of his assets to satisfy the debt if I win.

It'l be interesting

Here is my advise for what its worth,if and i am guessing, its anythink like the uk ,if and i mean if he has any assets then go for it, i have sued 3 times, won easy each time, .however the defendants in each case were potless, result, never did get a penny, dont throw money at a lost cause,. if he has assets go for him,.

[Bobegraves]

I won my court case 9 years ago. A long story so won't bore you with it all, i won the amount i was fighting for plus 7.5% interest per year, i was told that i had 10 years in which to collect my money.So far i've received not one baht, she's still roaming around on Soi Bangla and will still be crying the poor tale. One good thing though, it meant she'd a criminal record and so won't get a visa to another country to rip off anyone else! I had death threats and all sorts of problems but felt she should learn a lesson, i doubt she did. I learned a very good lesson though and have never given money to anyone since.Good luck if you pursue it but don't be disappointed if you don't get your money back.

[Heng]

Agree with those who said you'll likely win the case but not see a satang of your funds back.

[dog412]

Agree with those who said you'll likely win the case but not see a satang of your funds back.

and why would that be? cannot it be checked if or not any "chanotes" are held in his name? does he have other assets? seems he does have a salary that should be able to be "attached". if none of the aforementioned have any validity, then this country does not even have the "shadow" of rule of law that so many TRY to give it. why even have the appearance of legal contracts if they can become so invalid so easily.

[pnustedt]

Did the court award interest as well as lawyers costs?

Yes

[tijnebijn]

Agree with those who said you'll likely win the case but not see a satang of your funds back.

I am not so sure about that .

First of all the Op told us the man in case is a police officer , so he does have

monthly income , so very unlikely he will take his job in risky area when not

repaying , so when the Op wins it could turn in his favor perhaps he is a policeman .

[kankaroo]

Well I wouldn't have loaned the money in the first place, but I respect your determination to get it back.

I liked Soundman's post about running up a 28k tab Especially if he has fit birds on the premises heheheh, what can he do, ask you to "check bin" ? In fact that is definitely what I would do !

Otherwise good luck and be careful. I have been beaten to a pulp by a bunch of BIB for merely pushing one who was drunk, out of uniform and hitting me first !!!!!!!

Remember Thais tend to think with their hearts.

[dog412]

Well I wouldn't have loaned the money in the first place, but I respect your determination to get it back.

I liked Soundman's post about running up a 28k tab Especially if he has fit birds on the premises heheheh, what can he do, ask you to "check bin" ? In fact that is definitely what I would do !

Otherwise good luck and be careful. I have been beaten to a pulp by a bunch of BIB for merely pushing one who was drunk, out of uniform and hitting me first !!!!!!!

Remember Thais tend to think with their hearts.

no offense, but you seem to have a "strange" definition of heart, unless your definition of heart in Thailand means protecting your "own" by any means. and while i can agree that this IS happening here, i would not attribute it to their understanding of HEART. jai yen it is not.

[kankaroo]

Jai yen it was certainly not LOL !

However they were laughing while they were doing it

[dog412]

Jai yen it was certainly not LOL !

However they were laughing while they were doing it

well, you have maybe SEEN more of the Thai heart than i have, at this point i only try to excuse the THAI from this type of violence by the THAI'S own creed of "JAI YEN". however, i also believe it has little to do with the reality of the modern day THAILAND, unfortunately.

[Heng]

Agree with those who said you'll likely win the case but not see a satang of your funds back.

and why would that be? cannot it be checked if or not any "chanotes" are held in his name? does he have other assets? seems he does have a salary that should be able to be "attached". if none of the aforementioned have any validity, then this country does not even have the "shadow" of rule of law that so many TRY to give it. why even have the appearance of legal contracts if they can become so invalid so easily.

Low ranking police officer = likely living in police subsidized apartments. Unlikely that he owns anything. Anything that he does own (my guess would maybe be a motorcycle) can be conveniently "sold" so that he has the equivalent of what a creditor would have to deal with if someone had filed chapter 11. The court isn't going to make him sell his boots, clothes, gun, etc.

Loan contracts certainly can be enforced (and I don't mean by force), you just have to have the will to collect it and to never loan funds unless it is secured with a chanote with a sell by proxy contract tagged to it registered with the land department.

I certainly empathize with folks who can't adapt to the local playbook though.

[Heng]

Agree with those who said you'll likely win the case but not see a satang of your funds back.

I am not so sure about that .

First of all the Op told us the man in case is a police officer , so he does have

monthly income , so very unlikely he will take his job in risky area when not

repaying , so when the Op wins it could turn in his favor perhaps he is a policeman .

Nothing wrong with being optimistic.

[jumnien]

There is no country in the world where justice is being served in the courtrooms; it's just not on the menus. OJ Simpson comes to mind!

[dog412]

Agree with those who said you'll likely win the case but not see a satang of your funds back.

and why would that be? cannot it be checked if or not any "chanotes" are held in his name? does he have other assets? seems he does have a salary that should be able to be "attached". if none of the aforementioned have any validity, then this country does not even have the "shadow" of rule of law that so many TRY to give it. why even have the appearance of legal contracts if they can become so invalid so easily.

Low ranking police officer = likely living in police subsidized apartments. Unlikely that he owns anything. Anything that he does own (my guess would maybe be a motorcycle) can be conveniently "sold" so that he has the equivalent of what a creditor would have to deal with if someone had filed chapter 11. The court isn't going to make him sell his boots, clothes, gun, etc.

Loan contracts certainly can be enforced (and I don't mean by force), you just have to have the will to collect it and to never loan funds unless it is secured with a chanote with a sell by proxy contract tagged to it registered with the land department.

I certainly empathize with folks who can't adapt to the local playbook though.

so the "local playbook" now includes attorneys "certified" in Thailand. i also emphasize with those, Thai and non Thai,who have been and are continuing to be defrauded by the system perpetrated by those that have the ability to do so. i certainly hope by "folks" you were including not only "foreigners" but also those "Thai" folk who the country continues to use and abuse for their "smiling" ability, and who always end up on the same end of the losing stick.

[Tony Clifton]

I think that I'd leave it, especially with him being cop....

And that's exactly why he's not paying.

[Tinkelbell]

Is it worth it? You need that 28k? I think that I'd leave it, especially with him being cop....

cm-happy, just think it is 28,000 baht lesson.

Fourteen years ago, I made one of the big mistake in life by loaning my closed friend (known him for over 35 years). He gave me a promise note that he would repay the loan 48,000USD plus 8% interest a year within 5 years.

Guess what, it's almost 2008, I still have not seen my money, and still waiting all these years. At the beginning, I was fighting hard trying to get him pays me but he always avoid seeing me.

As years pass by, I came to accept that I had lost a friend and the money.

I take it as a big lesson.

Never again I would loan money to friends or family. If I can afford to help them, I would make it as a gift, this way I still have friend, not enemy.

[jumnien]

Using spiritual means you are 100% guaranteed to lose all your resentment and anger over lost money. Using legal means you are unlikely to find peace. Your choice.

[Heng]

Agree with those who said you'll likely win the case but not see a satang of your funds back.

and why would that be? cannot it be checked if or not any "chanotes" are held in his name? does he have other assets? seems he does have a salary that should be able to be "attached". if none of the aforementioned have any validity, then this country does not even have the "shadow" of rule of law that so many TRY to give it. why even have the appearance of legal contracts if they can become so invalid so easily.

Low ranking police officer = likely living in police subsidized apartments. Unlikely that he owns anything. Anything that he does own (my guess would maybe be a motorcycle) can be conveniently "sold" so that he has the equivalent of what a creditor would have to deal with if someone had filed chapter 11. The court isn't going to make him sell his boots, clothes, gun, etc.

Loan contracts certainly can be enforced (and I don't mean by force), you just have to have the will to collect it and to never loan funds unless it is secured with a chanote with a sell by proxy contract tagged to it registered with the land department.

I certainly empathize with folks who can't adapt to the local playbook though.

so the "local playbook" now includes attorneys "certified" in Thailand. i also emphasize with those, Thai and non Thai,who have been and are continuing to be defrauded by the system perpetrated by those that have the ability to do so. i certainly hope by "folks" you were including not only "foreigners" but also those "Thai" folk who the country continues to use and abuse for their "smiling" ability, and who always end up on the same end of the losing stick.

Actually I didn't have any folks in mind in particular.

[cm-happy]

yes, the The Thai guy does live in police subsidized housing, owns a large piece of land in Poayo, a motor cy and a pick up truck. Not sure if his police salary could be attached and the assets of his karoak buisness.

And might be thinking that because he is a police guy is immune(or above the law) and that farang would not have the balls to take him to court. As far as retribution is concerned, the guy is not stupid. If some unfortunate criminal act should happen to me he would be a prime suspect. Harrassement, don't think so, he does not have enough juice(power or authority). Have asked him why he is not a patrol officer, doing the motor-cy check thing to make a few extra baht? Does not want to or be THAT kind of policeman.