Civility On The Chiang Mai Forum

[mcgriffith]

Lack of civility? Nonsense. We have some of the most charming, civil and erudite ladies and gentlemen in all of Thailand.

And here are a few pictures of the members:

[attachm

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nt=47556:McG_Bodybuilder.jpg]

[WaiWai]

Many of the oooooold users can occasionally be a bit curt with new users who are too lazy or do not have the intelligence to search for the answer to their question before they post a new thread to ask, for the tenth time that month, where they can find a pair of shoes/doctor/guesthouse/pizza etc. Almost all questions have been asked and answered many times before and the instructions to search are posted at the top of the forum's first page. It is simply bad netiquette, read rude, and shows disrespect to the members of the forum to not look and read before you ask.

Have certainly observed incivility towards the newcomers, on many occasions. It's also true that queries from newcomers are more likely to be ignored.

As for asking questions that have been very recently answered, I have to say I think it's uncommon for the forum to have very recently answered *exactly* the question you may wish to ask. If that's not the case, why not a little generosity of spirit towards someone who is probably up to their neck in translocation arrangements or isn't much of a search whizz ?

On the whole, though, it's a very useful and well moderated forum.

[WaiWai]

Nice shorts you have, mcgriffith !

[naka]

Please feel free to report any posts you find objectionable under the forum rules and we'll do our best to take care of it.

By the way, we are sorry that not all our local forums are as polite and to the point as the Pattaya forum.

That's a low blow ... And possibly against the forum rules

Naka.

[Donnyboy]

But please - don't ask who makes the best pizza in Chiang Mai

Welcome to the forum and Chiang Mai.

CB

so has anyone been to Omalleys or The Red Lion recently?

I'll get my coat

[WaiWai]

By the way, nice cartoon, tigerbeer.

Whatever did we do before the internets ?

[chanchao]

Before the Internet we had Fidonet.

And most uncivil it was.

And the moderators were power-craving nazis.

So then we said 'screw this' and ditched Fidonet for /\lien Net, where there were no moderators.

/\narchy ruled.

Then we entered the Internet era, though there was no Web yet.

And God said, let there be News! And there were newsgroups, great ones like rec.travel.asia, soc.culture.thai, and alt.sex.fetish.orientals.

And it was good. Until spammers discovered it.

Then e-mail mailing lists came about, and then the Web, with online forums..

And most uncivil it was

And the moderators were.. erm.. remarkably decent on this sub-forum.

[tigerbeer]

By the way, nice cartoon, tigerbeer.

Whatever did we do before the internets ?

we lived in caves? dragged whichever women we wanted back for a "chat"

edit: apologies to the OP, another senseless and uncivilised comment here.

[SwaziBird]

"Fair enough' to all those who suggest I should be a contributor, not a critic. I guess I have had to decide whether this was the right place to contribute something or not. I haven't been certain of that. And, more important, I hope to have something useful to share. Last, maybe I am just shy!

To those suggesting comparisons of this board to other "worse" sites, too bad for those fora and the people who read them!

To those loving the "flavor" of this Chiang Mai site, I agree that Chiang Mai has MANY flavors. I like that a lot, but I also believe some people are simply turned off by what they find here on this site and thus end up under-represented here. They just don't come back, let alone contribute. Should this forum just be a "chat room" for buddies? It certainly isn't that all the time, but maybe too much of the time.

Should the forum be an "encyclopaedia" of Chiang Mai I don't think so, and I don't hope so, but here's hoping it gets better than a parade of casual replies with "emoticons."

Hi Mapguy,

You're the freshest thing to hit the CM forum for a long time.

I do not mean to be sarcastic.

What you've done, is to galvanize members who have not only become very protective of their "institution' ( which, IMHO, is quite rightly the case) but who might also just be thinking of making it an even better forum.

I'm certain that you know full well, that there simply isn't a better CM forum in the WORLD - isn't that right ?

Get into it !

Enjoy.

Cheers

[ProThaiExpat]

I am one for as much civility as is possible under the circumstances. I suppose when one is personally attacked for a post, a rationalization can be made that the attacker considers you one of his "friends", but no thank you.

In the spirit of positive posting and civility, it would be a good thing if the forum rules provided that attacking the content of a post is very legitimate but attacking a poster personally is against forum rules and moderators should excise that type of post.

I would be happy to help the volunteer moderators by referring to them the posts that attack posters personally, but most moderators are great at their jobs so they don't need me to do that, unless requested. What needs to be done is to establish a rule that all personal attacks on posters be excised.

Moderators usually know about the cliques and who is a friend to another, so that form of "banter" post could be allowed, if no complaint is made.

New posters may not know how to do a search or not be very adept at doing it, so those who feel the question has been asked without research, should tell the newbie how to search, even giving him/her the right key words, rather than attacking the new poster with comments like "your lazy" etc. Such a post, calling a poster a derogatory name should be against forum rules and the post excised immediately by a moderator or reported by others so moderators are advised.

I don't believe there is a forum rule now about personal attacks, although there are some on "flaming" and "trolling". If a personal attack on a poster, ie. calling him a derogatory name or alluding to his person in some way is considered a "flame" then I sit corrected, if I am so informed. I will then start reporting such posts, if by any stretch of the imagination it is not just "banter".

I acknowledge that some have posted that they wish there was a forum rule against wordy and long posts like this one, but to date there is none such, so until there is, I will continue expressing myself accordingly.

[Wizzard of Oz]

Yet another Supermod who lurks, reads and occasionally posts!

Perhaps I am parroting what has gone before but the forum will only ever be what you and other members/contributors make of it. As mods we try to keep things within bounds, but we sometimes miss problems for the simple reason that we are volunteers and we, or most of us, do have lives apart from ThaiVisa and the Chiang Mai forum. If you have a problem, PM a mod or two or use the report function to let us know. It will be dealt with.

Many of the oooooold users can occasionally be a bit curt with new users who are too lazy or do not have the intelligence to search for the answer to their question before they post a new thread to ask, for the tenth time that month, where they can find a pair of shoes/doctor/guesthouse/pizza etc. Almost all questions have been asked and answered many times before and the instructions to search are posted at the top of the forum's first page. It is simply bad netiquette, read rude, and shows disrespect to the members of the forum to not look and read before you ask.

As to banter - Any group of friends/work colleagues/community members on the planet will enjoy taking part in a little banter and leg pulling amongst each other. It is human nature. All you have to do to belong is simply join in our discussions and you will most likely be accepted and, eventually if you prove yourself to be a valued member of our community, you will find joking banter directed at you too. If you step too far out of line - Well that is where we Supermods come in - and you could find yourself being warned or even being shown the door.

Join in - You can't lose by doing so.

While you do have lives outside thaivisa, the problem is that you look for problems with 'rules' you set down looking for specific details and ignore the bigger picture, which is - has this persons 'banter' (as you described it) turned every thread he does this to into a joke, thereby making this forum nothing but a place to waste time for people who sadly have nothing else in their life?

All you have to do to belong is simply join in our discussions and you will most likely be accepted and, eventually if you prove yourself to be a valued member of our community, you will find joking banter directed at you too.

Awesome to see a moderator who not only enjoys the drivel here, but encourages it. Keep up the good work!

[Contractor]

I think the CM forum is useful, and I have found some good and useful advice on here.

Yes, we have to put up with the cliques and private jokes and the endless posts on the best burgers/fries/pizzas/shakes etc, but that should not be allowed to spoil the overall experience.

One thing I think that should be enforced is that Mods either join in a discussion OR close it, if that is what is warranted. It is not fair that a Mod sees a post, gives a response and opinion and then prevents further discussion.

Other than that, keep up the good work. I enjoy the forum and appreciate it has to be policed.

Regards

[PeaceBlondie]

Thanks, PTE. Here are just a few of the forum rules, highlighted:

Please respect fellow members! No bad or dirty language! No flaming of fellow members!

By using this service you agree;

1) You will not use thaivisa.com to post any material which is knowingly or can be reasonably construed as false, defamatory, inaccurate, abusive, vulgar, hateful, harassing, obscene, profane, sexually oriented, referencing prostitution (including bargirls and barboys), referencing suicide, threatening, invasive of a person's privacy, or otherwise in violation of any law.

2) Posting another members personal details, photos or web site details is forbidden and will result in being banned. Excessive, aggressive posts against other members, moderators and admin; or flaming will not be tolerated. 'Flaming' is best defined as posting or responding to a message in a way clearly intended to incite useless arguments, rants, and/or for launching personal attacks, insulting, being hateful, useless criticism, name calling, swearing and other bad behavior or comments meant to incite anger.

[Tywais]

I don't believe there is a forum rule now about personal attacks,

2) Posting another members personal details, photos or web site details is forbidden and will result in being banned. Excessive, aggressive posts against other members, moderators and admin; or flaming will not be tolerated. 'Flaming' is best defined as posting or responding to a message in a way clearly intended to incite useless arguments, rants, and/or for launching personal attacks, insulting, being hateful, useless criticism, name calling, swearing and other bad behavior or comments meant to incite anger.

[miltonbentley]

useless criticism

A great phrase!

[Rasseru]

useless criticism

A great phrase!

Useless praise?

[ProThaiExpat]

Thanks, PB, I will "report" personal attacks in the future and see what happens. To make it clear, I assume that an attack on a post that is about the posters personal experience, is a personal attack. A factual post can be attacked in my view, as to the subject, content and meaning since the poster did not include his personal experience in the post.

An opinion post is personal in my view, and that is where civility is needed, as disagreeing with another about an opinion, which is a personal view, takes some tact?

[ProThaiExpat]

Yet another Supermod who lurks, reads and occasionally posts!

Perhaps I am parroting what has gone before but the forum will only ever be what you and other members/contributors make of it. As mods we try to keep things within bounds, but we sometimes miss problems for the simple reason that we are volunteers and we, or most of us, do have lives apart from ThaiVisa and the Chiang Mai forum. If you have a problem, PM a mod or two or use the report function to let us know. It will be dealt with.

Many of the oooooold users can occasionally be a bit curt with new users who are too lazy or do not have the intelligence to search for the answer to their question before they post a new thread to ask, for the tenth time that month, where they can find a pair of shoes/doctor/guesthouse/pizza etc. Almost all questions have been asked and answered many times before and the instructions to search are posted at the top of the forum's first page. It is simply bad netiquette, read rude, and shows disrespect to the members of the forum to not look and read before you ask.

As to banter - Any group of friends/work colleagues/community members on the planet will enjoy taking part in a little banter and leg pulling amongst each other. It is human nature. All you have to do to belong is simply join in our discussions and you will most likely be accepted and, eventually if you prove yourself to be a valued member of our community, you will find joking banter directed at you too. If you step too far out of line - Well that is where we Supermods come in - and you could find yourself being warned or even being shown the door.

Join in - You can't lose by doing so.

While you do have lives outside thaivisa, the problem is that you look for problems with 'rules' you set down looking for specific details and ignore the bigger picture, which is - has this persons 'banter' (as you described it) turned every thread he does this to into a joke, thereby making this forum nothing but a place to waste time for people who sadly have nothing else in their life?

All you have to do to belong is simply join in our discussions and you will most likely be accepted and, eventually if you prove yourself to be a valued member of our community, you will find joking banter directed at you too.

Awesome to see a moderator who not only enjoys the drivel here, but encourages it. Keep up the good work!

Wizard: Unfortunately, economics plays a role in Thaivisa, the revenue that can be generated by the owners is directly related to the number of hits it receives, thus controversial threads that generate many hits only enhances T.V.s statistics. A post by lopburi3 or others that is a definitive answer to a thread issue stops dead with that post, while a inaccurate, poorly phrased and misleading post about someones experience at Jomtien immigration can generate hundreds of hits and thus affect statistics in a beneficial way for the owners. However, I must say, the moderators do keep flaming and trolling to a minimum and these practices, if not controlled, would enhance statistics in the short term at least.

Likewise, "emotion only" posts and one word posts, make a posters personal statistics hit the roof, while thoughtful and completely informative posts to the contrary. I for one feel "emotion only" posts are justly criticized by your post and I would support banning them. After all, they are only "f_rts in the wind".

[Loaded]

people really do have empty lives - it's only a forum on a website. If you don't like posts, don't read. If you don't like posters, ignore. If you don't like a particular thread, don't click on it.

[cmsally]

people really do have empty lives - it's only a forum on a website. If you don't like posts, don't read. If you don't like posters, ignore. If you don't like a particular thread, don't click on it.

[realthaideal]

.....and sometimes the topic runs its course in a pg. or two, and the rest becomes a bunch of blah blah blah.

Unless it's about pizza, burgers, n ribs of course. I've said it b4 elsewhere, but burgers and ribs are like flowers and chocolates for men. And for women ? Not sure. Good salad thread (Civil Salad Thread?!), where's that one ?

[Dustoff]

people really do have empty lives - it's only a forum on a website. If you don't like posts, don't read. If you don't like posters, ignore. If you don't like a particular thread, don't click on it.

Brief, to the point, appropriate to this thread and right on!

We do have some genius wordsmiths here, don't we? Going on and on in grand displays of their own prejudices and lack of awareness outside of their own box. Such is much of humankind and I am happy to expect/deal with it.

Everybody has an opinion...

[CobraSnakeNecktie]

people really do have empty lives - it's only a forum on a website. If you don't like posts, don't read. If you don't like posters, ignore. If you don't like a particular thread, don't click on it.

Brief, to the point, appropriate to this thread and right on!

We do have some genius wordsmiths here, don't we? Going on and on in grand displays of their own prejudices and lack of awareness outside of their own box. Such is much of humankind and I am happy to expect/deal with it.

Everybody has an opinion...

I think the problems that are being encountered are due to the website's aging technology. The social networking sites that are gaining these days are the likes of Digg.com. Sure its impossible to expect every user to act constructively so some of the newer sites are allowing users to bury inappropriate or worthless postings. More valuable postings will tend to be tagged and rise to the top and viewed more and unconstructive or worthless postings will tend to be hidden.

Currently many forum sites like TV rely on moderators to apply manual labor and enforce conduct. I believe this inefficient practice will give way to better software in the future.

As a band aid its probably possible to enable filtering . A user could hide postings that are tagged by other users, moderators as being inappropriate, worthless, or suspect. A user could also switch filtering to view all postings.

This way users don't feel like moderators are being control freaks and deleting valuable information as the information is still there but its hidden away and less likely to derail threads and upset people.

For me a lot of times I just want to read the good postings and not waste time on the garbage.

[DavidOxon]

555 sorry guys to ressurect this ancient thread, but I did a search for 'choirs' but unlike WTK, I can't be bothered to list the top ten irrelevant replies, I did find this one.... Mapguy, read and blush baby

Crappy new year to all

David

[Mapguy]

Awwwwwwwwww, shucks !!!!!!!!!!

[Gladiator]

Happy New Year Everyone!

This Post reminds me of an old joke:

An order of mainly silent Monks who are only allowed to speak every five years,

The first time a Monk gets up and says "I don't know about the rest of you - but the food here is bloody awful"!

Five years elapse. Another Monk gets up and says. Sorry but I diagree - I find the food here to be very good.!"

Another five years and a third Monk gets up and says -"I'm outta here - too much bitching!"

[hellodolly]

555 sorry guys to ressurect this ancient thread, but I did a search for 'choirs' but unlike WTK, I can't be bothered to list the top ten irrelevant replies, I did find this one.... Mapguy, read and blush baby

Crappy new year to all

David

Maybe Dave 2 can cement the deal with a picture. LOL

[Asmerom]

Welcome to the forum Mapguy

I don't understand this "Welcome to the Forum"chant by so many responders. Mapguy has made 1226 posts on this Forum and he's been a Member since 2007 about 4 years. "I've been lurking on this site for a number of months", says Mapguy. How many, may I ask ? 48? "Basically new to Chiang Mai", he says. Really? How come he's a super advanced member? All a little confusing.

[Asmerom]

Just noticed the thread is very old and just recently disinterred.

[dave2]

david oxon

re .. I did a search for 'choirs'

hello dolly.

re .. Maybe Dave 2 can cement the deal with a picture

of a choier ...sorry.. no : (

of an xmas band at airport plaza in dec 08 ... yes : )

happy new year everyone coz its going to be another great year in paradise

dave2