Question About Isaan Wedding

[Gary A]

I'll tell you a little short story. My first wife was a virgin. Yes, that was great that she saved herself for her husband. Or was it? A couple of years after we were married she decided that she had missed something in her life and she turned into a super slut.

NEVER would I have married another virgin. The best wives are those who have been around and know what they want. You self righteous people know NOTHING!

Abide by the living in Thailand rules and you are very likely to have a good life. The rules are;

Never spend more than you can afford to walk away from.

Never be worth more dead than alive.

Keep a low profile and mind your own business.

[tracer5050]

You need to be careful. Some of the Thai girls do what they need to do to eat and take care of a child a Thai husband is not taking care of. Enought of this we all we all know this.

But I know a girl here in Issan who has 4 flang men taking care of her . She married 2 of them here , And one is building her a house here. Oh by the way I also know her thai husband . By the way when the Flang honeys are here or she goes to Bangkok he is her cousin, Hes great he even takes them around in the new truck hes driving.

But there are so good ones here as well. I am sure yours is, But be careful.

[hhfarang]

(PS. you are marrying a bar girl??? in your home country, would you marry a prostitute?)..take care my friend)

I would never of thought of marrying a bar girl or a prostitute at anytime in my life until I met her and got to know her.

Sometimes if your the only one capable of supporting your family, you have to do what you have to do to make ends meet and I respect her for what she had to do to take care of her family. Do I agree completely on the way she made a living, I don't think so but I do respect her very much for the things she went through in order to put food on the table for her son, her grandmother and her brother and to pay for the things necessary for her family to live day to day.

What would you do if you had no formal education or skills? How would you be able to get a respectable job to make enough money to support your family if your from Buriram?

Now she no longer works in the bar and I take care of her and her family. She need not worry about how she is going to make enough money to eat for the day or how some farang a$$hole is going to treat her like a piece of meat.

She reminds me daily how lucky she is to have me and I remind her daily of how lucky I am to have her, how proud I am of her to get a job paying 5 USD a day or whatever ridiculously little amounts she makes working 10 hours a day but I am none the less very proud of her.

This girl is one in a million, she is a great mother, she is very beautiful, smart, funny, sarcastic, great dancer, makes me laugh, makes me smile and takes really good care of me and her family.

The girls in USA have nothing to compare to her and believe me I've compared every single one of my ex-girlfriends (have to weight the positives with the negatives right ?

I've been sending upwards of 15-20k baht a month and I am by no means rich at all for a 30 year old.

Sounds like a good start. I hope those feelings between both of you continue. I'm married to an upper Issan girl and she was married before to a Thai (arranged by her father, failed quiclky). I still payed around $1000 U.S. in dowry to give her Mom and Dad good "face" in the village. As for support, yours seems a bit high... my wife is from a village of about 150 people and I think the entire village probably makes around 15-20k baht per month collectively. I've been married 12 years now and my wife's father passed away some years ago. Since then I have been sending her mother 6000 baht per month and she has completely remodeled her home and is widely considered to be the richest woman in the village. She uses at least half of that 6k for required meds (chemo meds) and medical visits and treatments and still has plenty of money left to live well and have a little fun. I do this entirely because I want to and none of the other family members (several brothers and sisters and many nephews and nieces) have ever asked me for anything.

As for the wedding. It is at the same time fun, grueling, and confusing. Try to take a friend to video it or at least take some quality still photos. You'll be happy you did later. The wedding and party cost me nearly $2000 U.S. (not counting the dowry) and the entire village (150) were invited, and came. Both the ceremony and party will be a lot of fun for all and most people will probably stay drunk from beginning to end so don't worry about making mistakes, looking silly, or anything else and just have fun and go with the flow. There were three parts to mine, the first (somewhat serious) was the blessing by nine monks followed by feeding of the monks and a little break. Then came the wedding ceremony presided over by someone who does this for a living which included a lot of chanting and tying strings around us and the little (Christmas tree looking centerpiece, sorry forgot what it is called), as well as the presentation of the dowry (cash for Dad and gold for Mom). Then the guests will file by and tie you with more strings and give you wedding gifts (usually in the form of cash, usually 20 baht and 100 baht bills, maybe a couple of 500s; remember these are poor Issan farmers.) I gave all the wedding gift money to my wife to do whatever she wanted to do with it.

The party is great fun with lots of singing and dancing, eating and drinking. My wife's sister rented a huge canvas tent top (said U.S. army on it!) and a buttload of folding chairs as the wedding was at her house and the party in her yard (overflowed to all the neighboring houses and yards).

The only problem I had was that the ceremonies took hours and I had to spend most of that time in a Thai style legs folded under sitting on the floor position and when it was all over I could barely walk from the pain and partial paralysis from my hips down!

Good luck and I hope you have a long and happy marriage.

[ronthompson]

one small thing to add, carry a folding chair in your car or truck, Nothing wrong with a chair. When I visit the local Wat one of the Monks will always carry my chair and I sit close to the head Monk. I always get blessed a lot and perhaps thats why i have been so lucky.

[Gary A]

one small thing to add, carry a folding chair in your car or truck, Nothing wrong with a chair. When I visit the local Wat one of the Monks will always carry my chair and I sit close to the head Monk. I always get blessed a lot and perhaps thats why i have been so lucky.

I learned a neat trick from an old Thai hand. You know those cheap plastic chairs you see at many Thai restaurants? He took one of those and cut the legs off. That left the legs about five or six inches long. That way he didn't sit too high above the Thais sitting cross legged on the floor and it also gave him some back support.

[Mason45]

I've been through this situation with my Isaan inlaws, if I'm footing the bill then I make the rules. I told them to make a choice, either they take a dowry or monthly payments, they demanded both and I told them bluntly I'm not going to be a victim of the old syphoning money from the farang scam. I also added that as their daughter had been married before she had lost a significant amount of value from her dowry, they opted for the monthly payments. To me demanding a dowry and also monthly payments is just straight out double dipping. We had a beautiful wedding around 200 guests and it cost me around 50,000 baht and everyone enjoyed themselves. As the night was coming to a close several of the males demanded more whiskey as most were really intoxicated, they were told no more and that's final. I gave my wife a 30,000 baht diamond ring to show my love for her and it really impressed her family and friends. If you allow yourself to be milked dry in the Isaan area you will be broke before you know it. When my wifes family comes to our home in Bangkok, no one is allowed to stay for to long, they must sit down on chairs at the table when eating and as I have enough bedding for at least 10 people there's no sleeping allowed on the floor, if they want to live like third world nation people well that's up to them and if they don't like that well don't bother coming and by the way my wifes brothers always in her ear to ask me for money, he's half my age and extremely fit so I told her to tell him to get a job and if his parents give him money out the monthly money that I give them well more fool them. A word of warning keep ahead of these people and never drop your guard and emphasise that no means no, I worked long hours for 45 years to get what I've got now, I got my brother inlaw a job in Pattaya with a friend and he never showed up so that's his perogative but he'll never get one cent from me, play the game but don't let them play with you.

[prakhonchai nick]

I've been through this situation with my Isaan inlaws, if I'm footing the bill then I make the rules. I told them to make a choice, either they take a dowry or monthly payments, they demanded both and I told them bluntly I'm not going to be a victim of the old syphoning money from the farang scam. I also added that as their daughter had been married before she had lost a significant amount of value from her dowry, they opted for the monthly payments. To me demanding a dowry and also monthly payments is just straight out double dipping. We had a beautiful wedding around 200 guests and it cost me around 50,000 baht and everyone enjoyed themselves. As the night was coming to a close several of the males demanded more whiskey as most were really intoxicated, they were told no more and that's final. I gave my wife a 30,000 baht diamond ring to show my love for her and it really impressed her family and friends. If you allow yourself to be milked dry in the Isaan area you will be broke before you know it. When my wifes family comes to our home in Bangkok, no one is allowed to stay for to long, they must sit down on chairs at the table when eating and as I have enough bedding for at least 10 people there's no sleeping allowed on the floor, if they want to live like third world nation people well that's up to them and if they don't like that well don't bother coming and by the way my wifes brothers always in her ear to ask me for money, he's half my age and extremely fit so I told her to tell him to get a job and if his parents give him money out the monthly money that I give them well more fool them. A word of warning keep ahead of these people and never drop your guard and emphasise that no means no, I worked long hours for 45 years to get what I've got now, I got my brother inlaw a job in Pattaya with a friend and he never showed up so that's his perogative but he'll never get one cent from me, play the game but don't let them play with you.

Excellent

Set the ground rules from Day 1 and stick by them. Succumb to the family and they will crawl over you forever.

[yorkman]

And to think, the OP only asked 3 fairly straightforward questions eh..

[thomo]

Listen to the bloke at the bottom of page 1.

Yeah the guys who marry BGs... yeah, the opportunity to not have to sell your body to 200kg 60 yr olds, have your families debt paid off, live in a nice house... of course, they're hardly gonna turn that down, what prostitute would turn that deal down.

In other words, they would really of taken ANY farang that could offer that - regardless of age, weight, personal hygiene... etc.

Take it for what is... fun, loving, and that nice feeling you get when helping out someone who needs your help.

As they say, 'land of illusions for the easily self-tricked'

Come out here, go with the flow for a few years and then if everything is the same, then marry her - what's the rush. You might be a little bit wiser by then.

All the best.

[waddy]

She need not worry about how she is going to make enough money to eat for the day or how some farang a$hole is going to treat her like a piece of meat.

But you must of treated her like a piece of meat when you bar fined her ?

Best test for her if you think she loves you say you cant send any more money as you have lost

your job see what the reaction is that is my advice to you .

[aussiecollin]

She need not worry about how she is going to make enough money to eat for the day or how some farang a$hole is going to treat her like a piece of meat.

But you must of treated her like a piece of meat when you bar fined her ?

Best test for her if you think she loves you say you cant send any more money as you have lost

your job see what the reaction is that is my advice to you .

Waddy, Oh YES!!! Love it!!! ie the bit about shutting the ATM down...the other bit is a bit errr meaty...err...not really in the spirit of things. The Guy really loves her....and came here to look for sane advice....your 'lost mt job' advice is simply magic...ah, meaty.

G'night[/b]

[stgrhe]

Question 1. How much should I expect to pay in dowry to her grandmother if any? (mother and father passed away), she was married before and I understand first husband payed $100k baht.. I have been sending enough money for months now supporting her and her family and will continue to do so after the wedding. She has no formal education (college) nor trade skills.

As others have suggested a dowry is really up to you. Several postings suggest that you should not give any given that you are sending so much money every month, which by the way I too think is far too much. The dowry is, however, an important part of the Thai culture. Use common sence for you own sake!

Question 2. What should I expect at the village ceremony? She says small party (proposal to her and family, friends/family/neighbors/village elder/monks (maybe spend 10-20k baht on the party?) I will bring a ring for my proposal to her. Is that it, a ring, ceremony and party? Anything else I should expect? We plan to have a larger party later when we can do it the right way. I know this may include more gifts of baht, gold, food, drink, etc. etc). This will be done later next year upon our return from united states back home to Thailand.

"yorkman" has posted a lot of good information, which you can read about on http://www.apmforum.com/columns/thai15.htm. Another site of interest is http://www.weddingsinthailand.com/traditio...hai_wedding.php. With regards to the ring my suggestion you buy Thai gold instead. Two or three baht (The weight of Thai gold is measured in baht and one baht is a little bit more than 15 grams). Do not buy anything from the US with 14 carat gold as that is known as "cat gold" in Asia. Later you can buy a ring if you like and you may feel free to ask me for some advice. I am a gem colletor!

Question 3. Is the Amphur or Registry Office easy as an affidavit form completed notarized and translated into Thai and after that is completed we are officially married in Thailand? Is there anything else I need to bring besides my passport and affidavit and how long should I expect this process to take?

The cermonial wedding you are havingdoes not mean that you would be legally married. Check this out from Sunbelt Asia's site for more advice http://www.sunbeltlegaladvisors.com/Thailand-Marriage.php. You need to do some preparations first before you leave the US. However, my recommendation to you at this time is to wait with the legal part. In the eyes of the Thais the cermonial part is often regarded as the important part. And after all you two do apparently not know one another that well yet so it may be adviced to wait with the legal part.

I appreciate any input if anyone of you might have any. I want to ensure I have everything ready for my return to Thailand in January.

Thanks all, cheers, goodluck, thank you, chok dee kup, kop kun kup

My comment to your questions is above. Like some others I too like you to ask yourself if you really are aware of what you are about to be doing? Mrjih's posting (#25) is rather interesting and has a lot of common sence in it. Read it again and reflect!

First about the bar girls. I do believe there are both good and bad ones as it is withus farangs. Many such ex bar ladies have married into a hel_l by choosing the wrong guy. The same goes for many men, who later find themself without a wife and with very little money to spare. So my friend be careful and remenber that "it is easy to bring a girl out of a bar but difficult to bring the bar out of the girl". The quote is not mine.

Secondly, in a marrige you need to be able to meet on several levels, e.g.: 1) Emmotionally - I think you got that; 2) Culturally - Not so easy, and it takes a lot of hard work and a genuinely positive attitude from both parties, but can be overcome; and 3) Intellectually - How in earth are you two going to be able to satisfy your intellectual need when she has no education to speak of? In addition to that you have the language barrier as I suppose your fiance is not so well spoken in English.

I mean well and wish you good luck!

[nidge]

Secondly, in a marrige you need to be able to meet on several levels, e.g.: 1) Emmotionally - I think you got that; 2) Culturally - Not so easy, and it takes a lot of hard work and a genuinely positive attitude from both parties, but can be overcome; and 3) Intellectually - How in earth are you two going to be able to satisfy your intellectual need when she has no education to speak of? In addition to that you have the language barrier as I suppose your fiance is not so well spoken in English.

I can agree with counts 1 & 2. Number 2 is probably the most difficult hurdle to cross. Number 3 is brought up all the time and is the biggest myth i have ever seen regarding relationships. My wife went to college to become a hairdresser and has no academic qualifications whatsoever. I have a degree in geophysics and an IQ of 139. If i ever wanted to talk about plate tectonics or study seismic charts i would not chose my partner however smart they were. I know a handful of really smart guys that have partners with a lower educational level than my wife. They are all really happy. I have my own ideas about why this myth exists but they are not politically correct and so they will remain unvoiced.

[NovaBlue05]

"........If i ever wanted to talk about plate tectonics or study seismic charts i would not chose my partner however smart they were. I know a handful of really smart guys that have partners with a lower educational level than my wife. They are all really happy......"

Besides....If you want to discuss geopolitics or classical literature, you can go to an internet forums . There, you can always have the last word too

[aintravingr8]

I appreciate all of the responses that I've received from each one of you thus far and thanks again for all of your input.

Let me state that the amount of money which I have been sending to her was my idea as I had really no clue as to how much daily expenses for a four person family would be in Buriram. A few hundred dollars a month sure doesn't really sound like much but apparently goes a long way in Isaan. She had never mentioned any specific amount but of course we talked and she did say 'up to you'.. Dreaded famous last Thai girl's words right??

Our last visit together back in Sept was great. She met me at the airport and had a taxi waiting for our journey to Buriram. I didn't have any idea on what I was about to experience after the 5 hour ride but knew grandmother, brother and son would be up and awaiting for our arrival when we got home. Everyone was really happy and excited to see a tall white farang and I was greeted with many smiles from the family. I was very nervous as I didn't know what to expect, I didn't know where I was going to sleep, or even for that matter what they were talking about but none the less, they made me feel very welcomed and a part of the family. I knew my sweet friend would take good care of me and she surely did.

We spent several nights together at her home in Buriram and had many bonding experiences with her and her family and friends. The last day was spent with her grandmother and she perfomed a ceremony for her deceased daughter which included candles, food, incense, and blessings of tequila? GF's mother passed away in an automobile accident some time ago. I'm not sure if it was a birthday or if this was something that I needed to see, a special day maybe? I also was blessed by the village elder who apparently was in town as he performed baa sai for me and my sweet friend. It's been several months now and yes the strings are still there.

Before leaving Buriram, I gave her brother 1000 baht and grandmother 10000 baht. I also bought my sweet friend a gold bracelet in Pattaya and gave her 10000 baht and sent her on her way back home as I went to the airport and she went to Buriram.

She no longer is working in Pattaya and is back home and taking care of her family with support from me. We agreed that she leave Pattaya, become my 'girlfriend', and me to take care of her and of course the family. I have been doing that for several months now and apparently her and the family are living like kings & queens now which I think is great news.

- I have no plans on paying sin sot or dowry, she's been there done that and I'm not from Thai culture

- Will propose to her next month with a gold-diamond ring. . I want her to have a diamond and she likes gold..

- We will go to the American Embassy, get paperwork done/translated, and then to the amphur office upon my arrival to BKK

- We will go through village ceremony, 30 guests, small party she says, 10-15k no problem

- I will return home and start processing her paperwork for fiancee visa for her to come to America

- She will get a job here and support her family in which we have already talked about

- We will process paperwork for her son's visa and return home for the BIG party and pickup of her son

- She has a job now paying 4500 baht a month cleaning house. She wants to work to save to buy me a ring.. One months pay to spend on me, that's very thoughtful of her. What I make in less than a day she makes in a month..

Am I really just a customer or walking ATM? Is this all a dream? Is she not lucky? Am I not lucky?

I could of had any Thai girl I wanted but I found one in a million. This is her story, our story.

[Mikenmod]

Hello to all at THAIVISA.com and hope all is well for all! Great place you have here.

I'm an American looking to marry an ex-bar girl who was previously married and now divorced with a 5 year old son living in Isaan.

I have been sending money to her to support her and her family (grandmother, son, brother) for the last several months since my return from Isaan. We have been talking almost on a daily basis since my arrival back home via phone.

I hope one of you knowledgable people will be able to help with a few questions.

Question 1. How much should I expect to pay in dowry to her grandmother if any? (mother and father passed away), she was married before and I understand first husband payed $100k baht.. I have been sending enough money for months now supporting her and her family and will continue to do so after the wedding. She has no formal education (college) nor trade skills.

Question 2. What should I expect at the village ceremony? She says small party (proposal to her and family, friends/family/neighbors/village elder/monks (maybe spend 10-20k baht on the party?) I will bring a ring for my proposal to her. Is that it, a ring, ceremony and party? Anything else I should expect? We plan to have a larger party later when we can do it the right way. I know this may include more gifts of baht, gold, food, drink, etc. etc). This will be done later next year upon our return from united states back home to Thailand.

Question 3. Is the Amphur or Registry Office easy as an affidavit form completed notarized and translated into Thai and after that is completed we are officially married in Thailand? Is there anything else I need to bring besides my passport and affidavit and how long should I expect this process to take?

I appreciate any input if anyone of you might have any. I want to ensure I have everything ready for my return to Thailand in January.

Thanks all, cheers, goodluck, thank you, chok dee kup, kop kun kup

From one American to another, I'm glad you are happy and appear to be in "Love". But I want to pass along a little advice and have you take a "BIG" step backward and ask your self some very serious questions before you "leap". I'm going to make some very hard points for you to think about and play Devils advocate.

I retired to Thailand over a year ago and I love the country for many reasons. One of the things I have learned here is as a "single American" male", that I will never be "lonely". By my own choosing I can always have a bedmate, girl friend, or partner. A beautiful Thai lady who can be either young or old. She will give me the greatest pleasure a man can experience. Why" Money. But just like an American women, when the "honeymoon" is over, she can be pure "hel_l". And as quickly as it is over, I can find another just as willing lady to take her place. In fact even when I'm with one there's always one trying to move in. I've been there and I've done that. I came here to meet a beautiful Thai lady whose family treated me like royalty when I first arrived. In fact, if I didn't get along with the daughter, I had my choice of a cousin or two. And none to these were ever Bar Girls (maybe). Get the message here?

Unlike American women, Thai women have been raised to please the man from birth. They will parade you around like you were a King and treat you as such. All her friends will be impressed with you and treat you equally the same. Why? MONEY. You have "raised" her and her family to a higher status level and now they will do anything to keep you from leaving. That is the true and hard cold fact of what you are experiencing and getting into. You are young at 30. But I think, you are thinking with the wrong head. Where did you first meet her? As a bar girl? She's divorced. Why if she is so great? Thai men don't just throw them away. I suspect she got pregnant and he left because he did want to be saddled with the responsibility. Not important.

Let's assume all is well and hunky dory like you say.

First question, is she expecting you to bring her to the US? If you think you are going to bring her to the US after you get married you are sadly mistaken. And you need to get a real grip on that. I've checked and it is possible but a very long road ahead. And it will be costly. You are faced with some serious hurdles even though you will be able to provide for her better in the US than you will in Thailand. This by the way is the number one reason Thai ladies marry foreigners. To get a better life for them and their family and MOVE to another country. And when they discover they can't. It's Bye-Bye!

Second question you need to ask. Thinking of moving to Thailand? What are you going to do for a job? Are you incredibly rich? I'm not saying you can't but if you open a business there are a ton of rules you need to learn about first. Thais come first in Thailand, foreigners come last. Ask any of the expats here and they can help you. You can make money but its not easy.

Third question and the most important. If you were to lose your current job and couldn't send money to her, how long do you think she will wait for you? What do you think will happen? Remember, it's not like you are living down the street from her and just call her up. I would place a bet in Las Vegas on this. And I would make a lot of money.

If you have carefully thought out all these issues and questions. Have a plan of action that will take some time to complete and if you see it through, then kudos to you. Personally I see you sending money to a bottomless pit right now. Your intentions are well meaning but the problem lies in the fact that she is NOT your wife at the moment. And you are only living a dream. And unfortunately one that is going to be very difficult to fulfill without a better plan. One that I don't think you have made. What I learned is you dream in the US, but you plan and make things happen when you get here.

Good luck to you.

[yorkman]

I could of had any Thai girl I wanted

I don't know where to even start with that......

So.... bites lip, I won't

[rgs2001uk]

I appreciate all of the responses that I've received from each one of you thus far and thanks again for all of your input.

Let me state that the amount of money which I have been sending to her was my idea as I had really no clue as to how much daily expenses for a four person family would be in Buriram. A few hundred dollars a month sure doesn't really sound like much but apparently goes a long way in Isaan. She had never mentioned any specific amount but of course we talked and she did say 'up to you'.. Dreaded famous last Thai girl's words right??

Our last visit together back in Sept was great. She met me at the airport and had a taxi waiting for our journey to Buriram. I didn't have any idea on what I was about to experience after the 5 hour ride but knew grandmother, brother and son would be up and awaiting for our arrival when we got home. Everyone was really happy and excited to see a tall white farang and I was greeted with many smiles from the family. I was very nervous as I didn't know what to expect, I didn't know where I was going to sleep, or even for that matter what they were talking about but none the less, they made me feel very welcomed and a part of the family. I knew my sweet friend would take good care of me and she surely did.

We spent several nights together at her home in Buriram and had many bonding experiences with her and her family and friends. The last day was spent with her grandmother and she perfomed a ceremony for her deceased daughter which included candles, food, incense, and blessings of tequila? GF's mother passed away in an automobile accident some time ago. I'm not sure if it was a birthday or if this was something that I needed to see, a special day maybe? I also was blessed by the village elder who apparently was in town as he performed baa sai for me and my sweet friend. It's been several months now and yes the strings are still there.

Before leaving Buriram, I gave her brother 1000 baht and grandmother 10000 baht. I also bought my sweet friend a gold bracelet in Pattaya and gave her 10000 baht and sent her on her way back home as I went to the airport and she went to Buriram.

She no longer is working in Pattaya and is back home and taking care of her family with support from me. We agreed that she leave Pattaya, become my 'girlfriend', and me to take care of her and of course the family. I have been doing that for several months now and apparently her and the family are living like kings & queens now which I think is great news.

- I have no plans on paying sin sot or dowry, she's been there done that and I'm not from Thai culture

- Will propose to her next month with a gold-diamond ring. . I want her to have a diamond and she likes gold..

- We will go to the American Embassy, get paperwork done/translated, and then to the amphur office upon my arrival to BKK

- We will go through village ceremony, 30 guests, small party she says, 10-15k no problem

- I will return home and start processing her paperwork for fiancee visa for her to come to America

- She will get a job here and support her family in which we have already talked about

- We will process paperwork for her son's visa and return home for the BIG party and pickup of her son

- She has a job now paying 4500 baht a month cleaning house. She wants to work to save to buy me a ring.. One months pay to spend on me, that's very thoughtful of her. What I make in less than a day she makes in a month..

Am I really just a customer or walking ATM? Is this all a dream? Is she not lucky? Am I not lucky?

I could of had any Thai girl I wanted but I found one in a million. This is her story, our story.

you are dreaming, seeing as your intended lives in issan, wake up and smell the buffalo sh1t.

if as you say you clould have had any girl you wanted , why didnt you? instead you have lumbered yourself with a woman no thai man would take.

this girl has no skills to get a job in thailand, what transferable skills does she have that will make her employable in america.

how many thai woman have you actually been involved with, i am not talking about working girls or their friends. how many teachers, nurses, bank staff, etc etc have you dated.

what are you actually comparing this girl to, what is the benchmark, other girls from the same line of employment.

to put it bluntly seing as you asked, yes you are just another customer/walking atm machine, she has played you from day one, you dont even know the rules, these girls have phds in kidology, bullshit and anything to make you feel special, if she was so special why did no one else take her on.

what is she bringing to the table, a load of excess baggage, you aint even going to be second or third in her thoughts.

but never mind you can fool yourself, you cant fool us, best of luck to you, you sound like a genuine guy, if you can afford it then do it, please dont forget to come back in a few years and let us know if you feel the same.

[aintravingr8]

you are dreaming, seeing as your intended lives in issan, wake up and smell the buffalo sh1t.

if as you say you clould have had any girl you wanted , why didnt you? instead you have lumbered yourself with a woman no thai man would take.

this girl has no skills to get a job in thailand, what transferable skills does she have that will make her employable in america.

how many thai woman have you actually been involved with, i am not talking about working girls or their friends. how many teachers, nurses, bank staff, etc etc have you dated.

what are you actually comparing this girl to, what is the benchmark, other girls from the same line of employment.

to put it bluntly seing as you asked, yes you are just another customer/walking atm machine, she has played you from day one, you dont even know the rules, these girls have phds in kidology, bullshit and anything to make you feel special, if she was so special why did no one else take her on.

what is she bringing to the table, a load of excess baggage, you aint even going to be second or third in her thoughts.

but never mind you can fool yourself, you cant fool us, best of luck to you, you sound like a genuine guy, if you can afford it then do it, please dont forget to come back in a few years and let us know if you feel the same.

Alright probably not any girl but you get what I'm saying. I stand corrected..

Thanks for your vote of confidence though I really appreciate it as it sounds like you know everything about our relationship.

Your right she may not have any skills, she may not be a rocket scientist but I know she has a good heart and you can't tell me differently.

Maybe you have been burnt one too many times and that's why your comments are very negative..

[bergen]

The two statements:

- I could of had any Thai girl I wanted - and - you sound like a genuine guy -

doesn't match in my ears

[rgs2001uk]

you are dreaming, seeing as your intended lives in issan, wake up and smell the buffalo sh1t.

if as you say you clould have had any girl you wanted , why didnt you? instead you have lumbered yourself with a woman no thai man would take.

this girl has no skills to get a job in thailand, what transferable skills does she have that will make her employable in america.

how many thai woman have you actually been involved with, i am not talking about working girls or their friends. how many teachers, nurses, bank staff, etc etc have you dated.

what are you actually comparing this girl to, what is the benchmark, other girls from the same line of employment.

to put it bluntly seing as you asked, yes you are just another customer/walking atm machine, she has played you from day one, you dont even know the rules, these girls have phds in kidology, bullshit and anything to make you feel special, if she was so special why did no one else take her on.

what is she bringing to the table, a load of excess baggage, you aint even going to be second or third in her thoughts.

but never mind you can fool yourself, you cant fool us, best of luck to you, you sound like a genuine guy, if you can afford it then do it, please dont forget to come back in a few years and let us know if you feel the same.

Alright probably not any girl but you get what I'm saying. I stand corrected..

Thanks for your vote of confidence though I really appreciate it as it sounds like you know everything about our relationship.

i now only what you have posted

Your right she may not have any skills, she may not be a rocket scientist but I know she has a good heart and you can't tell me differently.

sounds like your mind is made up, but you still havent answered the questions i asked,what are you comparing this girl to, and how many other thai women have you had a relationship with?

Maybe you have been burnt one too many times and that's why your comments are very negative..

sorry if my comments sound negative to you, maybe the truth hurts.

i live here, i dont mean i work overseas and come here on holiday, i live here full time. nothing personal against you, but i see your type come and go all the time. in fact right now a thai girl up the street has her latest farang boyfriend living with her, at the same time the thai boyfriend has gone back upcountry.

it is you that said you have only been to thailand 4 times, well i am glad you are such an expert. i first came here over 20 years ago, now living here, and i learn something new everday, the stories i hear no longer shock me.

no i havent been burned, i was smart enough to take the advice of friends, people who live here, and thai people before i got married. i have been married for 13 years now, and yes if you get a good one they are the best women on earth, if on the other hand you pick the wrong one, well buyer beware.

i dont know one man who has not had problems marrying a girl with the type of background the one you intend to marry comes from. its almost embarassing to have growm men crying their eyes out as they pour their stories out to me.

never mind, you have set your heart on getting married, best of luck to you.

[Dave the Dude]

I appreciate all of the responses that I've received from each one of you thus far and thanks again for all of your input.

Our last visit together back in Sept was great. She met me at the airport and had a taxi waiting for our journey to Buriram. I didn't have any idea on what I was about to experience after the 5 hour ride but knew grandmother, brother and son would be up and awaiting for our arrival when we got home. Everyone was really happy and excited to see a tall white farang.

I have been doing that for several months now and apparently her and the family are living like kings & queens now which I think is great news.

Hi aintravingr8

Firstly, can I say congratulations and long may you stay happy, but you must also appreciate that there are many people here that may know more about Thai culture and understandings towards Ferangs compare to you.

Yes, I know its easy to generalize and take the p1ss, but IMHO you should think long and hard on your attitude towards her family. Why is it such 'a great thing' that these people suddenly get this large change in their income?? I am not trying to be negative towards your situation, cos 'I have been there,done that' too but I was very careful not to increase expectations cos rural folk think all ferangs are rich with unlimited funds.

Its good that you get happiness from helping your future family ( I do too) but when you see them, mentally 'step back' for a while and see if YOUR money is being used wisely. Have they now got new phones,motorcycles or just drinking/gambling your cash. please believe me, this is not too unusual. I have been lucky, we have both worked hard and now have a minimart that is busy every day(my money has been well spent).

If you hav'nt already read 'Thailand Fever', I would recomment it, its a very interesting read about Thai/Western relationships and its written with each page in both Thai and English.

GOOD LUCK and HAPPY NEW YEAR

Dave

[stgrhe]

Hi aintravinegr 8,

You are obviously madly in love and that is a great feeling and I do wish you the best of luck and happines. I think all of us wish you well but most of us have gained at lot more experience of Thailand than you appear to have. You are still young and your time will come. It is apparently that others have been burned when being in a similar situation like the one you are in now. It is understandable that they are crying out for the wulf, and for good reasons too.

The Thai culture is very difficult to understand for us from the west. It takes years even to get a hint of it and you need to have a good knowledge of buddism and their history event to start with. I have studied hard and have 25 years of experience and I still know so little, and that shortcoming is not due to poor intelligence.

The very basic you should know of the Thais is that they do not want to tell you bad things. My Thai wife is well educated with a masters degree and she has still sometime difficulty in telling me things that she thinks is bad news. The cultural habit of theirs is so deep roted. Secondly, immage is everything in Thailand, which makes the Thais to go to the extreme make things look better than they are. Hence, the reason for the importance of "face".

A common consequence of that when you have met a lady it will take VERY LONG TIME before she finally tells you everything. I was in your situation many years ago but took the advice from friends and went slow moving instead of rushing into a marrige. This lady was was like your very beautiful and charming and at the time known as "the Queen of Phuket". Everyone was after her, even the Thais, but she choosed me . I was so proud! Luckily for me I listen to the advices and managed to bail out when her true self surfaced after about two years. Now I am happily married with an even more beautiful woman who is well educated and can match me on an equal level.

Take you time my friend and should you still go ahead with the legal wedding at least ask a solicitor to draw up a pre-nup (in Thailand) before you legalise your marrige. That way you would at least have a way out should the worst thing happen. You can then rip it apart later on if your marrige is what you are hoping for.

Once again, best of luck.

[tracer5050]

Very good advise from Stghe. Been there done that. I am verry happy living 1/2 my time i Issan , rest in BKK and US.

Wife says and tells her friends I have no secerts form my husband, RIGHT, Sometime she just dont want to tell me someting Bad.Thais really want to save face.

Best of Luck to you. I know it can workout, But you need to be open to a live you dont know and be ablr to really adapt

[macduff]

Hello to all at THAIVISA.com and hope all is well for all! Great place you have here.

I'm an American looking to marry an ex-bar girl who was previously married and now divorced with a 5 year old son living in Isaan.

I have been sending money to her to support her and her family (grandmother, son, brother) for the last several months since my return from Isaan. We have been talking almost on a daily basis since my arrival back home via phone.

I hope one of you knowledgable people will be able to help with a few questions.

Question 1. How much should I expect to pay in dowry to her grandmother if any? (mother and father passed away), she was married before and I understand first husband payed $100k baht.. I have been sending enough money for months now supporting her and her family and will continue to do so after the wedding. She has no formal education (college) nor trade skills.

Question 2. What should I expect at the village ceremony? She says small party (proposal to her and family, friends/family/neighbors/village elder/monks (maybe spend 10-20k baht on the party?) I will bring a ring for my proposal to her. Is that it, a ring, ceremony and party? Anything else I should expect? We plan to have a larger party later when we can do it the right way. I know this may include more gifts of baht, gold, food, drink, etc. etc). This will be done later next year upon our return from united states back home to Thailand.

Question 3. Is the Amphur or Registry Office easy as an affidavit form completed notarized and translated into Thai and after that is completed we are officially married in Thailand? Is there anything else I need to bring besides my passport and affidavit and how long should I expect this process to take?

I appreciate any input if anyone of you might have any. I want to ensure I have everything ready for my return to Thailand in January.

Thanks all, cheers, goodluck, thank you, chok dee kup, kop kun kup

From one American to another, I'm glad you are happy and appear to be in "Love". But I want to pass along a little advice and have you take a "BIG" step backward and ask your self some very serious questions before you "leap". I'm going to make some very hard points for you to think about and play Devils advocate.

I retired to Thailand over a year ago and I love the country for many reasons. One of the things I have learned here is as a "single American" male", that I will never be "lonely". By my own choosing I can always have a bedmate, girl friend, or partner. A beautiful Thai lady who can be either young or old. She will give me the greatest pleasure a man can experience. Why" Money. But just like an American women, when the "honeymoon" is over, she can be pure "hel_l". And as quickly as it is over, I can find another just as willing lady to take her place. In fact even when I'm with one there's always one trying to move in. I've been there and I've done that. I came here to meet a beautiful Thai lady whose family treated me like royalty when I first arrived. In fact, if I didn't get along with the daughter, I had my choice of a cousin or two. And none to these were ever Bar Girls (maybe). Get the message here?

Unlike American women, Thai women have been raised to please the man from birth. They will parade you around like you were a King and treat you as such. All her friends will be impressed with you and treat you equally the same. Why? MONEY. You have "raised" her and her family to a higher status level and now they will do anything to keep you from leaving. That is the true and hard cold fact of what you are experiencing and getting into. You are young at 30. But I think, you are thinking with the wrong head. Where did you first meet her? As a bar girl? She's divorced. Why if she is so great? Thai men don't just throw them away. I suspect she got pregnant and he left because he did want to be saddled with the responsibility. Not important.

Let's assume all is well and hunky dory like you say.

First question, is she expecting you to bring her to the US? If you think you are going to bring her to the US after you get married you are sadly mistaken. And you need to get a real grip on that. I've checked and it is possible but a very long road ahead. And it will be costly. You are faced with some serious hurdles even though you will be able to provide for her better in the US than you will in Thailand. This by the way is the number one reason Thai ladies marry foreigners. To get a better life for them and their family and MOVE to another country. And when they discover they can't. It's Bye-Bye!

Second question you need to ask. Thinking of moving to Thailand? What are you going to do for a job? Are you incredibly rich? I'm not saying you can't but if you open a business there are a ton of rules you need to learn about first. Thais come first in Thailand, foreigners come last. Ask any of the expats here and they can help you. You can make money but its not easy.

Third question and the most important. If you were to lose your current job and couldn't send money to her, how long do you think she will wait for you? What do you think will happen? Remember, it's not like you are living down the street from her and just call her up. I would place a bet in Las Vegas on this. And I would make a lot of money.

If you have carefully thought out all these issues and questions. Have a plan of action that will take some time to complete and if you see it through, then kudos to you. Personally I see you sending money to a bottomless pit right now. Your intentions are well meaning but the problem lies in the fact that she is NOT your wife at the moment. And you are only living a dream. And unfortunately one that is going to be very difficult to fulfill without a better plan. One that I don't think you have made. What I learned is you dream in the US, but you plan and make things happen when you get here.

Good luck to you.

Very very very well put together. i think you have put everything in it's place and people in love with an ex bar girl needs to read this thread carefully

[ricky63]

- I have no plans on paying sin sot or dowry, she's been there done that and I'm not from Thai culture

- Will propose to her next month with a gold-diamond ring. . I want her to have a diamond and she likes gold..

- We will go to the American Embassy, get paperwork done/translated, and then to the amphur office upon my arrival to BKK

- We will go through village ceremony, 30 guests, small party she says, 10-15k no problem

- I will return home and start processing her paperwork for fiancee visa for her to come to America

- She will get a job here and support her family in which we have already talked about

- We will process paperwork for her son's visa and return home for the BIG party and pickup of her son

- She has a job now paying 4500 baht a month cleaning house. She wants to work to save to buy me a ring.. One months pay to spend on me, that's very thoughtful of her. What I make in less than a day she makes in a month..

Am I really just a customer or walking ATM? Is this all a dream? Is she not lucky? Am I not lucky?

I could of had any Thai girl I wanted but I found one in a million. This is her story, our story.

I have a few comments about the above:

- Good that you are not paying sin sot, as you probably will be paying for awhile (or forever?).

- A diamond ring is look upon very highly by other Thai women. Your fiance will be very excited to get this and show it off

- I asked my wife about the marriage ceremony in Thailand. She did not want it. I think she is embarrassed to have one. I believe it is because she was married to a Thai man before, and for a Thai lady... divorce is a bad mark you carry forever.

Our "marriage ceremony" consisted of getting marriage pictures professionally done in Bkk at a studio. She says the pictures are what really prove you are married to other Thai people. This took most of a day, and cost $125. Excellent quality digital photos, with disk and some prints, and included all of the fancy clothes, hairdressers, photographer, and support staff.

Why should you pay for the wedding? You are American, and in American culture the father of the bride will pay for the wedding, and the guests provide the gifts.

- Obtaining a fiance visa is not very easy... I know because we got one. It took about one year and allot of paperwork and effort. My wife was the General Mgr at a large resort hotel, and I am an executive with a good job, good references, credit rating, etc. I think the reason that we were able to get it was I asked my State Senator's office to send some emails to the US Embassy in Bkk (which they did). Your wife also has a child, which will complicate things if you add him/her to the visa application.

Before getting married, be sure to have a prenuptual agreement signed off in your hand. You have 90 days from when your fiance arrives, to get married.

I don't mean to be harse, but you are asking:

"Am I really just a customer or walking ATM?" Probably

"Is this all a dream?" It is reality, but the road to you being happily married to her and residing in the USA is a long one, full of blind curves and potholes.

"Is she not lucky?" She is very lucky to have you

"Am I not lucky?" If your fiance is a "good one," then you are indeed lucky.

"I could of had any Thai girl I wanted but I found one in a million." I think the "one in a million" thai girl has graduated university with a few degrees (many have Masters and PhDs), has a rich family with good connections (very important), has assets, has had very little "experience" with men, is beautiful, talented, hardworking, honest, etc etc. Difficult to find, but I think they are in Bangkok somewhere...

Best of Luck, and Happy New Year

[Colonel_Mustard]

Hello to all at THAIVISA.com and hope all is well for all! Great place you have here.

I'm an American looking to marry an ex-bar girl who was previously married and now divorced with a 5 year old son living in Isaan.

I have been sending money to her to support her and her family (grandmother, son, brother) for the last several months since my return from Isaan. We have been talking almost on a daily basis since my arrival back home via phone.

I hope one of you knowledgable people will be able to help with a few questions.

Question 1. How much should I expect to pay in dowry to her grandmother if any? (mother and father passed away), she was married before and I understand first husband payed $100k baht.. I have been sending enough money for months now supporting her and her family and will continue to do so after the wedding. She has no formal education (college) nor trade skills.

Question 2. What should I expect at the village ceremony? She says small party (proposal to her and family, friends/family/neighbors/village elder/monks (maybe spend 10-20k baht on the party?) I will bring a ring for my proposal to her. Is that it, a ring, ceremony and party? Anything else I should expect? We plan to have a larger party later when we can do it the right way. I know this may include more gifts of baht, gold, food, drink, etc. etc). This will be done later next year upon our return from united states back home to Thailand.

Question 3. Is the Amphur or Registry Office easy as an affidavit form completed notarized and translated into Thai and after that is completed we are officially married in Thailand? Is there anything else I need to bring besides my passport and affidavit and how long should I expect this process to take?

I appreciate any input if anyone of you might have any. I want to ensure I have everything ready for my return to Thailand in January.

Thanks all, cheers, goodluck, thank you, chok dee kup, kop kun kup

From one American to another, I'm glad you are happy and appear to be in "Love". But I want to pass along a little advice and have you take a "BIG" step backward and ask your self some very serious questions before you "leap". I'm going to make some very hard points for you to think about and play Devils advocate.

I retired to Thailand over a year ago and I love the country for many reasons. One of the things I have learned here is as a "single American" male", that I will never be "lonely". By my own choosing I can always have a bedmate, girl friend, or partner. A beautiful Thai lady who can be either young or old. She will give me the greatest pleasure a man can experience. Why" Money. But just like an American women, when the "honeymoon" is over, she can be pure "hel_l". And as quickly as it is over, I can find another just as willing lady to take her place. In fact even when I'm with one there's always one trying to move in. I've been there and I've done that. I came here to meet a beautiful Thai lady whose family treated me like royalty when I first arrived. In fact, if I didn't get along with the daughter, I had my choice of a cousin or two. And none to these were ever Bar Girls (maybe). Get the message here?

Unlike American women, Thai women have been raised to please the man from birth. They will parade you around like you were a King and treat you as such. All her friends will be impressed with you and treat you equally the same. Why? MONEY. You have "raised" her and her family to a higher status level and now they will do anything to keep you from leaving. That is the true and hard cold fact of what you are experiencing and getting into. You are young at 30. But I think, you are thinking with the wrong head. Where did you first meet her? As a bar girl? She's divorced. Why if she is so great? Thai men don't just throw them away. I suspect she got pregnant and he left because he did want to be saddled with the responsibility. Not important.

Let's assume all is well and hunky dory like you say.

First question, is she expecting you to bring her to the US? If you think you are going to bring her to the US after you get married you are sadly mistaken. And you need to get a real grip on that. I've checked and it is possible but a very long road ahead. And it will be costly. You are faced with some serious hurdles even though you will be able to provide for her better in the US than you will in Thailand. This by the way is the number one reason Thai ladies marry foreigners. To get a better life for them and their family and MOVE to another country. And when they discover they can't. It's Bye-Bye!

Second question you need to ask. Thinking of moving to Thailand? What are you going to do for a job? Are you incredibly rich? I'm not saying you can't but if you open a business there are a ton of rules you need to learn about first. Thais come first in Thailand, foreigners come last. Ask any of the expats here and they can help you. You can make money but its not easy.

Third question and the most important. If you were to lose your current job and couldn't send money to her, how long do you think she will wait for you? What do you think will happen? Remember, it's not like you are living down the street from her and just call her up. I would place a bet in Las Vegas on this. And I would make a lot of money.

If you have carefully thought out all these issues and questions. Have a plan of action that will take some time to complete and if you see it through, then kudos to you. Personally I see you sending money to a bottomless pit right now. Your intentions are well meaning but the problem lies in the fact that she is NOT your wife at the moment. And you are only living a dream. And unfortunately one that is going to be very difficult to fulfill without a better plan. One that I don't think you have made. What I learned is you dream in the US, but you plan and make things happen when you get here.

Good luck to you.

Very very very well put together. i think you have put everything in it's place and people in love with an ex bar girl needs to read this thread carefully

And those in love with non bgs too.