Farang Motorcyclists In The Pattaya Area.

[Mobi]

On Saturday my wife and I counted no less than 5 farang motorcyclists, east of Sukhumvit, with no helmets, no shirts, with two of them wearing very skimpy shorts.

Yesterday we saw three, similarly attired.

I despair!

[thaiclan]

Its clear to see that your use of the road obviously extends to your use of this forum..... so much similar behaviour......

Mobi your OP stated "Motorcyclists will never have equal rights on the roads here, and the Thais understand this and keep well to the left, or stay on the hard shoulder ." Then you go on to state that you have nothing against motorcylists... If they dont have equal rights is that because you (as a car driver) have more??

They don't have equal rights because if they try to assert their 'equality', in all probability they will end up dead. This is nothing to do with the law or whether or not I think, as a car driver, I have more rights. It is common sense and everything to do with a "survival of the fittest". As has been said many times in this thread, most (but not all) Thai drivers understand this, but very few farang motorcyclists do. Go back and read the views of farangs who ride bikes in Pattaya. Tropo doesn't agree with me, but just everyone else does.

I agree some drivers are the worst! And that goes for car drivers too. Just like the ones that believe motorbikes do not have rights to an EQUAL amount of the road.

(Yes, and here we can include most Thai drivers of cars, pickups, trucks and buses.)

Every vehicle training course in UK will tell you that car drivers must give the same amount of room to a motorbike as it would do to a car, yet the farang car drivers mostly omit this legality when in Thailand. Also "filtering" is perfectly legal when executed in a safe manner (that is to say weaving amongst the traffic to get ahead). I have notice whilst riding on a bike or in my car that it is mainly the farang car drivers who have problems with this and edge closer to close the gaps both in front and to the side.

Cars without doubt are the safer option, but I couldn't remain sane in Pattaya and sit in the endless traffic when I just need to do a short 2km journey.

As previously stated, I drive into Pattaya most days of the week, and provided I choose my routes and times sensibly, I rarely get held up badly in jams. I don't understand why some motorists have so much trouble, because traffic jams rarely effect me. Compared to Bangkok, Pattaya traffic is a dream

I urge just one thing. When you are sitting in your cars complaining about the amount of motorbikes gliding past you,

I never said anything of the sort. I never once complained about the number of motorcyclists gliding past me.Go back and read what I did say. My main complaint - by far - was that many farang many motorcyclists do not wear helmets, do not dress appropriately, and often have defective lights. I also said that many drive in a manner that increases the chances of them having an accident. Everyone is entitled to use the public roads of Thailand, and that's the way it is. I understand that many Thais have no choice but to use motorcycles, but for sure as heck, I will fight tooth and nail to prevent any of my loved ones from using that highly dangerous form of transport.

close your eyes and imagine a Pattaya when each one of those "idiots", farang or Thai have their own car and can elongate the traffic jams to Beijing proportions!

[Mobi]

Its clear to see that your use of the road obviously extends to your use of this forum..... so much similar behaviour......

When all reasoned argument fails - insult the OP

Edited January 7, 2008 by Mobi

[tropo]

On Saturday my wife and I counted no less than 5 farang motorcyclists, east of Sukhumvit, with no helmets, no shirts, with two of them wearing very skimpy shorts.

Yesterday we saw three, similarly attired.

I despair!

On Saturday my GF and I counted no less than 5,349 Thai motocyclists, west of Sukhumvit, with no helmets, almost all wearing sandals and skimpy clothing.

Yesterday we saw 2,789 more, similarly attired.

I despair!

[Mobi]

On Saturday my wife and I counted no less than 5 farang motorcyclists, east of Sukhumvit, with no helmets, no shirts, with two of them wearing very skimpy shorts.

Yesterday we saw three, similarly attired.

I despair!

On Saturday my GF and I counted no less than 5,349 Thai motocyclists, west of Sukhumvit, with no helmets, almost all wearing sandals and skimpy clothing.

Yesterday we saw 2,789 more, similarly attired.

I despair!

And your point?

This thread is about farangs, not about Thais.

I despair

P.S. I bet you didn't see a Thai without a shirt on

[NanLaew]

Let's keep it about farangs on bikes, OK?

1 ) When in Rome... etc.

2 ) I am on holiday... etc.

3 ) I drive better than the locals... etc.

4 ) I live here now, so I'm different... etc.

5 ) It will never happen to me... etc.

6 ) Insh'Allah (for our friends from where the tide never comes in)... etc.

7 ) Bammm!!! What the <deleted> was that!?... etc..

Ad nauseum.

But since the OP's efforts to keep this farang and bike related seem totally banjaxed, here's my tuppence on the 'them versus us' brigade.

Compared with Thai provincial cities the same size as Pattaya, this place is a loony bin for all motorists, 2, 4, 10 wheel... whatever. Everyone, locals and foreigners all drive like prats compared to most people in Korat, Chiang Mai or Nakhon Nowhere. Here, there's this inexplicable need to race to the next red light (or accident). Up country, everything is slower, there's time to react to the the other guys sudden change of direction or stopping.

I think one of the posters almost hit the nail on the head saying it could be attributed to lack of law enforcement. I would add that if enforcement is ever done to the letter of the law, then the punishment needs to be upped as well. Taking one's bike away for a few hours and paying 500 baht is always going to be an inconvenience but never a deterrent.

[NanLaew]

We know our place on the road and make allowances for it. Spending hours everyday to travel short distances is hardly the way to go. You wouldn't have a chance catching me in your big car.

And if you have assimilated the annoying local trait of squeezing your bike in among the locals beside and in front of my truck at the traffic lights, there's a very good chance I will be catching you WITH my big car.

[tropo]

And your point?

This thread is about farangs, not about Thais.

I despair

P.S. I bet you didn't see a Thai without a shirt on

My point? Humour.

I didn't see any Thais without shirts on, but that has nothing to do with motorcycle safety....just dress custom, apart from the fact that tourists (and maybe some expats) are trying to get suntans. I've enjoyed that myself in my hometown (a tourist resort) years ago when a suntan mattered, because it's a great way to get a suntan without getting too hot.

Irrespective of the dangers, it's just too damned hot in Thailand to be putting on full motorcycle boots, gloves, leather pants and jackets.

Don't despair Mobi, motorcyclists are usually only a danger to themselves. It's the car and truck drivers who wield the deadly weapons. If you hit one, you'll probably only have some scatches to worry about, and some blood stains your wife can hose off.

Edited January 7, 2008 by tropo

[tropo]

We know our place on the road and make allowances for it. Spending hours everyday to travel short distances is hardly the way to go. You wouldn't have a chance catching me in your big car.

And if you have assimilated the annoying local trait of squeezing your bike in among the locals beside and in front of my truck at the traffic lights, there's a very good chance I will be catching you WITH my big car.

Do you actually believe that squeezing between traffic to get ahead is a Pattaya riding technique? Where have you been?

Rest assured there is zero chance you will ever catch me with any car in Pattaya.

[NanLaew]

Do you actually believe that squeezing between traffic to get ahead is a Pattaya riding technique? Where have you been?

I never said that it was unique to Pattaya now did I? It doesn't matter if they do it in Bangkok, Bognor or Beijing anyway; this is the Pattaya whine forum so... oh, work it out for yourself. Making your way forward between lines of stationary vehicles is sensible but isn't my pet peeve here. That makes sense. It's the swarming of 20-30 motorcycles into the narrow strip between the front of vehicles waiting at an intersection and the cross-flow traffic. Like they are trying to get pole position in a bike race. But I suppose they are in their own small way. However, I haven't seen one yet that can do a proper standing start without wobbling, stalling, swerving and inevitably feeling the cold steel of my bull bar.

Rest assured there is zero chance you will ever catch me with any car in Pattaya.

Don't be so sure... I already have a row of 6 little motorcycle shapes with a big, red 'X' over them on my nacelle. Scratches and dents don't bother me and as you observed earlier, the blood washes off.

[tropo]

Do you actually believe that squeezing between traffic to get ahead is a Pattaya riding technique? Where have you been?

I never said that it was unique to Pattaya now did I? It doesn't matter if they do it in Bangkok, Bognor or Beijing anyway; this is the Pattaya whine forum so... oh, work it out for yourself. Making your way forward between lines of stationary vehicles is sensible but isn't my pet peeve here. That makes sense. It's the swarming of 20-30 motorcycles into the narrow strip between the front of vehicles waiting at an intersection and the cross-flow traffic. Like they are trying to get pole position in a bike race. But I suppose they are in their own small way. However, I haven't seen one yet that can do a proper standing start without wobbling, stalling, swerving and inevitably feeling the cold steel of my bull bar.

Rest assured there is zero chance you will ever catch me with any car in Pattaya.

Don't be so sure... I already have a row of 6 little motorcycle shapes with a big, red 'X' over them on my nacelle. Scratches and dents don't bother me and as you observed earlier, the blood washes off.

Yes, I'm one of those. I don't see any point in queuing behind cars and buses.

When the light turns green, I'm off in a straight line as most are and usually one of the first. You only catch the stragglers that can't ride straight...it must be frustrating driving a car in Pattaya.

[bri1guy]

Its the best way to get around while staying in Ptty .. Sounds like you are not one to take a risk but there are many more farangs that drive safely then the few that drive bad. If people don't have experience driving a motor cycle back home, then they shouldn't here. Well whats wrong with not wearing a shirt? its very hot sometimes sitting in trafficin the Thai Sun...

[Mobi]

Rest assured there is zero chance you will ever catch me with any car in Pattaya.

That sounds like a challenge.

If you would be so kind as to identify yourself and your machine, maybe Nanlaew and I can put your claim to the test - in our BIG cars.

[Mobi]

Its the best way to get around while staying in Ptty .. Sounds like you are not one to take a risk but there are many more farangs that drive safely then the few that drive bad. If people don't have experience driving a motor cycle back home, then they shouldn't here. Well whats wrong with not wearing a shirt? its very hot sometimes sitting in trafficin the Thai Sun...

It is culturally unacceptable.

Thais do not expose their upper bodies in public, and they deplore farangs who do so.

If you walked down town in Bangkok without a shirt you would be arrested.

I think there is a tolerance level in the immediate beach area, but once you get out on Sukhumvit and beyond, you are in "normal' Thailand and should follow the culture of the country in which you are a guest.

[Mobi]

If you hit one, you'll probably only have some scatches to worry about, and some blood stains your wife can hose off.

I've never hit one, but several have hit me - when I was stationery.

The only craetures I have ever hit in Thailand whist driving are dogs, who rush out from nowhere and commit suicide - leaving quite nasty mess on my bumper.

My next thread will be a crusade to get all dog owners to put crash helmets on their dogs.

[hiromj]

Without having time to read this entire thread, I will say that I have been riding motorcycles in Japan almost everyday for over 12 years without incident. In fact, I considered myself a very safe and cautious rider. Then one day last month, I hit a slick spot on the road (slow speed and didn't even see it). Next thing I knew, I was down. Now, I do remember precisley my head slamming on the pavement as it made quite a sound. If I was not wearing a very good helmet at the time, 100% chance that I am dead right now. I don't care how good a rider you think you are, it takes less that a split second for everything to change for the worse. I will never ride without a helmet again. BTW, the rest of my body is finally recovering.

Edited January 8, 2008 by hiromj

[JSixpack]

Without having time to read this entire thread, I will say that I have been riding motorcycles in Japan almost everyday for over 12 years without incident. In fact, I considered myself a very safe and cautious rider. Then one day last month, I hit a slick spot on the road (slow speed and didn't even see it). Next thing I knew, I was down. Now, I do remember precisley my head slamming on the pavement as it made quite a sound. If I was not wearing a very good helmet at the time, 100% chance that I am dead right now. I don't care how good a rider you think you are, it takes less that a split second for everything to change for the worse. I will never ride without a helmet again. BTW, the rest of my body is finally recovering.

My sympathies and understanding. That can happen to a motorcyclist at any time, absolutely (though a surprising number of motorcyclists are in denial of this fact). A split second leaves you no control.

Yes, the experienced know well the necessity for good helmets and protective clothing. We drive cautiously and defensively--most of the time anyway.

The OP's point is that there is an extraordinarily high percentage of farang riding around on motorbikes who obviously don't know how to drive a motorbike safely. They will likely suffer the consequences, which they will regret if still alive to feel any regret. They can do so, as the matter is between them and the Thai police, but they are at the least noteworthy, never mind the danger. Just last weekend I saw a couple of fat 65-year-old farang granddads having neither helmets nor hair separately driving down Naklua Rd. (where enforcement of the helmet law is especially lax), and thought, Well, they've come to Pattaya to commit suicide one way or the other. I wasn't at all surprised at the sight, however. 'Twas just another day in Pattaya . . . .

Edited January 8, 2008 by JSixpack

[tropo]

Rest assured there is zero chance you will ever catch me with any car in Pattaya.

That sounds like a challenge.

If you would be so kind as to identify yourself and your machine, maybe Nanlaew and I can put your claim to the test - in our BIG cars.

Missed the point you did.

The horsepower of your BIG car is totally irrelevant when your BIG car is stuck in Pattaya traffic. Point-to-point in Pattaya your BIG cars don't have a chance.

Sure, I'll challenge you to a race from Pratumnak Hill to the Dolphin Roundabout and back along Beach Road. I'll be on a Honda Air Blade (not that it matters anyway - any scooter will do). I'll wager any amount of money you can handle.

PM me.

[Gary A]

I just spent about ten days mostly relaxing in establishments along beach road in Jomtien. I witnessed many stupid contests and by far the most were by young farang tourists on those super fast crotch rockets. Traffic on the beach road was terrible and watching these bullet proof young guys was quite scary. Listening to the vroom, vroom and watching them slip at high speed between cars had to be the most foolhardy acts possible. One car door opening, one capped empty plastic water bottle, a dog, a cat, a child, a noodle cart or a pedestrian would have certainly resulted in major injury or death. My question is WHY? Why do these young guys think they are bullet proof? I would NEVER attempt that with a full face helmet, full leathers and boots let alone flip flops and shorts. Absolutely no regard for their own or other's safety.

[OneMikeInBangkok]

Rest assured there is zero chance you will ever catch me with any car in Pattaya.

That sounds like a challenge.

If you would be so kind as to identify yourself and your machine, maybe Nanlaew and I can put your claim to the test - in our BIG cars.

Missed the point you did.

The horsepower of your BIG car is totally irrelevant when your BIG car is stuck in Pattaya traffic. Point-to-point in Pattaya your BIG cars don't have a chance.

Sure, I'll challenge you to a race from Pratumnak Hill to the Dolphin Roundabout and back along Beach Road. I'll be on a Honda Air Blade (not that it matters anyway - any scooter will do). I'll wager any amount of money you can handle.

PM me.

I want a piece of the action

10 Baht on the AirBlade to win

50 Baht on the car driver getting there alive

[PeaceBlondie]

Without having time to read this entire thread, I will say that I have been riding motorcycles in Japan almost everyday for over 12 years without incident. In fact, I considered myself a very safe and cautious rider. Then one day last month, I hit a slick spot on the road (slow speed and didn't even see it). Next thing I knew, I was down. Now, I do remember precisley my head slamming on the pavement as it made quite a sound. If I was not wearing a very good helmet at the time, 100% chance that I am dead right now. I don't care how good a rider you think you are, it takes less that a split second for everything to change for the worse. I will never ride without a helmet again. BTW, the rest of my body is finally recovering.

Thanks for that, hiromj. Most of my m/c fall-offs occurred when I was paying attention, was sober, experienced, well trained, etc. But then suddenly I was lying on the road with a bruised shoulder, a broken shoulder, no skin on my palm, and hideous scratches on my helmet. A speed of even 40 kilometers per hour creates velocities that the human body was never designed to endure.

[Mobi]

I want a piece of the action

10 Baht on the AirBlade to win

50 Baht on the car driver getting there alive

So sorry for the confusion.

It was never intended to be a race!!

I'm far too old to get involved in racing!

No, it was more in the nature of Nan liew and me spotting tropo at his most vulnerable, and showing him once and for all who has a greater right to the road

All in jest - as I said, the last thing I would dream of doing on any public road is enter into a speed contest of any nature.

I value my life and the lives of others far too highly.

Safe motoring to you all.

[Kerryd]

[

Sure, I'll challenge you to a race from Pratumnak Hill to the Dolphin Roundabout and back along Beach Road. I'll be on a Honda Air Blade (not that it matters anyway - any scooter will do). I'll wager any amount of money you can handle.

PM me.

I want a piece of the action

10 Baht on the AirBlade to win

50 Baht on the car driver getting there alive

Same same. My money's on Tropo (if someone will spot me the 10 baht until I get home !)

[hiromj]

Without having time to read this entire thread, I will say that I have been riding motorcycles in Japan almost everyday for over 12 years without incident. In fact, I considered myself a very safe and cautious rider. Then one day last month, I hit a slick spot on the road (slow speed and didn't even see it). Next thing I knew, I was down. Now, I do remember precisley my head slamming on the pavement as it made quite a sound. If I was not wearing a very good helmet at the time, 100% chance that I am dead right now. I don't care how good a rider you think you are, it takes less that a split second for everything to change for the worse. I will never ride without a helmet again. BTW, the rest of my body is finally recovering.

Thanks for that, hiromj. Most of my m/c fall-offs occurred when I was paying attention, was sober, experienced, well trained, etc. But then suddenly I was lying on the road with a bruised shoulder, a broken shoulder, no skin on my palm, and hideous scratches on my helmet. A speed of even 40 kilometers per hour creates velocities that the human body was never designed to endure.

No problem. I may have been slightly off-topic but I wanted to take the oppotunity to point out, through personal experience, the importance of good equipment while riding in any hostile environment. Most of the helmets I see here are less than useless.

[billaaa777]

Sure, I'll challenge you to a race from Pratumnak Hill to the Dolphin Roundabout and back along Beach Road. I'll be on a Honda Air Blade (not that it matters anyway - any scooter will do). I'll wager any amount of money you can handle.

And I will wager any amount you want that your chances of dying driving a motorbike in Pattaya are at minimum 100 times greater than driving a car. Why don’t you just admit it, you would love to drive a car and feel safe, but you simply do not have the funds to own a car.

BAN ALL MOTERBIKES IN PATTAYA!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[1stbase]

I think that although there are many aggressive Thai drivers, they drive a lot safer than 'most' westerners.

When I see a motorbike driving down the road with his signals on, or a car driving too far to the left of the lane, preventing motorcycles from getting through, I have a fun time guessing that they are foreginers and am always right when i pass them and take a look.

You either drive aggressive here, or you stay to the left, there is no inbetween.

Another thing I noticed is that most Thais that ride motorcycles a lot such as taxi drivers, pizza delivery guys, etc, where jeans, a long sleeve sweater, and sometimes even a full face helmet. The little keepah helmets that everyone else wheres, if anything, will protect your skull only if they are strapped on tight and you fall straight on your head and not to it's side. The full face helmets here may not protect your jaw and teeth like they are supposed to, you can can insure than when you fall, they will protect your full skull (life) no matter how you fall.

In Bangkok, a majority of motorbikes drive with as much gear as the taxi guys here.

Just some observations. Take it as you please.

[tropo]

Sure, I'll challenge you to a race from Pratumnak Hill to the Dolphin Roundabout and back along Beach Road. I'll be on a Honda Air Blade (not that it matters anyway - any scooter will do). I'll wager any amount of money you can handle.

And I will wager any amount you want that your chances of dying driving a motorbike in Pattaya are at minimum 100 times greater than driving a car. Why don’t you just admit it, you would love to drive a car and feel safe, but you simply do not have the funds to own a car.

BAN ALL MOTERBIKES IN PATTAYA!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Now, now, there's no need to insult someone just because they don't want to buy a car...and anyway, being a tourist here on a tourist visa, buying a car is not an option for me.

Back at home I always had a car AND a motorcycle. I would choose to ride the motorcycle in any situation where traffic was heavy and slow. I'm a person who doesn't enjoy waiting in traffic.

If all the motorcyclists were to use 4 wheeled transport you wouldn't be going anywhere in a hurry.

You must be a real pussy, being too afraid to ride a motorcycle in a tourist resort like Pattaya.

There's no need for a lecture on dangers either, I've broken plenty of bones from motorcycle accidents in the past. An x-ray would reveal a fair bit of surgical steel...but I still ride.

[tropo]

I think that although there are many aggressive Thai drivers, they drive a lot safer than 'most' westerners.

When I see a motorbike driving down the road with his signals on, or a car driving too far to the left of the lane, preventing motorcycles from getting through, I have a fun time guessing that they are foreginers and am always right when i pass them and take a look.

You either drive aggressive here, or you stay to the left, there is no inbetween.

Another thing I noticed is that most Thais that ride motorcycles a lot such as taxi drivers, pizza delivery guys, etc, where jeans, a long sleeve sweater, and sometimes even a full face helmet. The little keepah helmets that everyone else wheres, if anything, will protect your skull only if they are strapped on tight and you fall straight on your head and not to it's side. The full face helmets here may not protect your jaw and teeth like they are supposed to, you can can insure than when you fall, they will protect your full skull (life) no matter how you fall.

In Bangkok, a majority of motorbikes drive with as much gear as the taxi guys here.

Just some observations. Take it as you please.

This is an incorrect observation. The vast majority of motorcycle Taxi riders don't wear anything protective. If they do, it's only to protect themselves from the burning sun.

[tropo]

I want a piece of the action

10 Baht on the AirBlade to win

50 Baht on the car driver getting there alive

So sorry for the confusion.

It was never intended to be a race!!

I'm far too old to get involved in racing!

No, it was more in the nature of Nan liew and me spotting tropo at his most vulnerable, and showing him once and for all who has a greater right to the road

All in jest - as I said, the last thing I would dream of doing on any public road is enter into a speed contest of any nature.

I value my life and the lives of others far too highly.

Safe motoring to you all.

The thing is Mobi, I would beat any car on that circuit I mentioned riding at a very safe 40 km/h.

[1stbase]

Witnessed the aftermath of another fatal crash a few hours ago on third road. Thai guy.

Oh another thing which most of you guys will disagree with me is I think learning to ride a bike for the first time in Thailand is better than learning on normal roads because if your experienced with normal roads you won't be prepared for the bumps here or know how to handle them wheras if your learning to ride, you should be scared shitless the first time hitting a main road so will deal with the bumps, bad road conditions, and aggressive traffic like its normal.