Singapore Permanent Residency

[ade100]

Currently I work in SIN on an Employment Pass but am considering applying for PR. The Singapore Immigration website gives information on criteria and how to apply but does not discuss the implications of becoming a PR.

http://app.ica.gov.sg/serv_pr/per_res/app_for_pr.asp

I imagine the main advantages are not having to renew Employment Pass when changing jobs and not having to leave the country should I be unemployed for a period. The CPF I also know about.

However I am not sure how it affects taxation and if there are any other issues to consider.

Anyone any ideas?

[sabaijai]

I can't imagine there are any cons. Pretty sure your tax situation would remain the same, as you'd still need a work permit, etc.

[Captain Chaos]

I am also in Singapore on an EP and am considering the move to PR.

As far as I can see (so far) the major pro is that it allows you to apply to buy 'landed property' (ie. a house). The other stuff like being able to change jobs more easily you have already spotted.

A major disadvantage is that I believe that the children of Sing PR's are liable for national service ... need someone to verify that as fact rather than hearsay ... and I'm sure there are ways around it (leaving the country for a start, although don't know whether that impacts their ability to legally return)

Another potential disadvantage is that if you hold PR for a long time (say 10 years or so) you will be invited to take up Singapore citizenship ... this can put you in a potentially awkward situation. Happened to a friend of mine who took legal advice which was not to decline it but simply to ignore it if he didn't want to accept - that way no 'face' was lost and the status quo maintained. Doesn't sound like end of the world stuff but something to be aware given that the Sing govt has a stated aim of increasing the population via encouraging higher immigration.

If your main focus is on the job flexibility, how about applying for the new Personal Employment Pass (PEP)? That means you can change employers easily and if you should lose your job you have an extended period to find a new one, but it doesn't come with any of the potential baggage attached to PR. The PEP is described as a "one time, 5 year pass", so my intepretation is that at the end of it the Sing govt would probably invite you to apply for PR anyway, which would make sense to me.

CC

[ade100]

I can't imagine there are any cons. Pretty sure your tax situation would remain the same, as you'd still need a work permit, etc.

I don't think you need a work permit if you are a PR in Singapore.

One rumour I had heard was if you are PR you are taxed on any income anywhere in the world. I have property in France which if I sell, I don't really want to be taxed on both in France and Singapore. I just can't find any written proof of this.

[ade100]

I am also in Singapore on an EP and am considering the move to PR.

As far as I can see (so far) the major pro is that it allows you to apply to buy 'landed property' (ie. a house). The other stuff like being able to change jobs more easily you have already spotted.

A major disadvantage is that I believe that the children of Sing PR's are liable for national service ... need someone to verify that as fact rather than hearsay ... and I'm sure there are ways around it (leaving the country for a start, although don't know whether that impacts their ability to legally return)

Another potential disadvantage is that if you hold PR for a long time (say 10 years or so) you will be invited to take up Singapore citizenship ... this can put you in a potentially awkward situation. Happened to a friend of mine who took legal advice which was not to decline it but simply to ignore it if he didn't want to accept - that way no 'face' was lost and the status quo maintained. Doesn't sound like end of the world stuff but something to be aware given that the Sing govt has a stated aim of increasing the population via encouraging higher immigration.

If your main focus is on the job flexibility, how about applying for the new Personal Employment Pass (PEP)? That means you can change employers easily and if you should lose your job you have an extended period to find a new one, but it doesn't come with any of the potential baggage attached to PR. The PEP is described as a "one time, 5 year pass", so my intepretation is that at the end of it the Sing govt would probably invite you to apply for PR anyway, which would make sense to me.

CC

Interesting what you say about the citizenship invite. It's slightly worrying because of course Singapore don't accept dual nationality. I would have to give up my EU passport and then have trouble getting back into my own country.

The National service issue - I think the best way round that is to only have daughters :-)

I looked at the PEP but you have to be in Singapore on an EP for 2 years. For me its only one year so far.

[Loom]

National service is for male children of PRs.

National Service Liability

Under the Enlistment Act, all male Singapore Citizens and Permanent Residents (PRs) are liable to register for National Service (NS) upon reaching 16 1/2 years old. They are required to serve 2 years of full-time NS at 18 years old, followed by 40 days of Operationally Ready National Service per year till the age of 50 years (for officers) or 40 years (for other ranks).

Main applicants who are granted PR status under the first generation Professionals/Technical Personnel and Skilled Workers (PTS) Scheme or the Investor Scheme are exempted from NS. Male children who are granted PR status under their parents' sponsorship are liable for NS upon reaching 16 1/2 years old.

NS-liable PRs are expected to serve NS. Should they renounce or lose their PR status without serving or completing full-time NS, this would have an adverse impact on any application by them to work or study in Singapore.

PR couples are eligible to buy HDB resale flats.

I've never heard of being asked to be a citizen. There's no dual citizenship allowed for PRs who become Singapore citizens. So you're required to renounce your old citizenship in the process of becoming a Singpaore national. With this condition, I don't see how they could ever force you to become a citizen. I believe you can apply within a year or two after getting PR status.

It has no impact on Singapore income tax. Also, Singapore citizens and residents are not taxed in Singapore on offshore income.

The CPF contributions are withheld from your pay and employer has to come up with matching contributions.

[Loom]

I can't imagine there are any cons. Pretty sure your tax situation would remain the same, as you'd still need a work permit, etc.

PR status does away with need for a separate work permit.

[Loom]

National service is for male children of PRs.

National Service Liability

Under the Enlistment Act, all male Singapore Citizens and Permanent Residents (PRs) are liable to register for National Service (NS) upon reaching 16 1/2 years old. They are required to serve 2 years of full-time NS at 18 years old, followed by 40 days of Operationally Ready National Service per year till the age of 50 years (for officers) or 40 years (for other ranks).

Main applicants who are granted PR status under the first generation Professionals/Technical Personnel and Skilled Workers (PTS) Scheme or the Investor Scheme are exempted from NS. Male children who are granted PR status under their parents' sponsorship are liable for NS upon reaching 16 1/2 years old.

NS-liable PRs are expected to serve NS. Should they renounce or lose their PR status without serving or completing full-time NS, this would have an adverse impact on any application by them to work or study in Singapore.

PR couples are eligible to buy HDB resale flats.

I've never heard of being asked to be a citizen. There's no dual citizenship allowed for PRs who become Singapore citizens. So you're re

[asiaworld]

Hi ade100 . As for NS your male kids will Have to do it , as for taxatio, from which i gather you are EU citizen, Sg residency & possible citizenship will give you enormous advantages over EU .. Coz very unlikely they'll bother with your overseas assets, and than if whenever you plan to visit EU for less than 3 month at a time it'll be a breeze with Sing passport , which is visa free to most countries incl. USA . Being in the asean, it'll actually improve your travelling abilities* over any EU passport you hold at the moment, and than taxes are also less vicious, than anywhere in EU ..

i am dual also & i am more worried, about showing off any of my assets on my EU ID, but, would rather use my non-EU passport, even for banking in EU ..

[Loom]

There are meaningful tax benefits using the PR as a path to Singapore citizenship for US passport holders as well. Singapore citizens/corporates are not taxed on offshore earnings or capital gains, income tax rates are substantially lower than in the US. There's a 15% tax limitation on long-term capital gains in the US (wherever the gains are booked), but paying nothing as a singapore citizen looks like a really good alternative. As a travel document, the Singapore passport seems to be just as flexible if not more so than the US passport. Problem is the required renunciation of your old citizenship.

[samran]

There are meaningful tax benefits using the PR as a path to Singapore citizenship for US passport holders as well. Singapore citizens/corporates are not taxed on offshore earnings or capital gains, income tax rates are substantially lower than in the US. There's a 15% tax limitation on long-term capital gains in the US (wherever the gains are booked), but paying nothing as a singapore citizen looks like a really good alternative. As a travel document, the Singapore passport seems to be just as flexible if not more so than the US passport. Problem is the required renunciation of your old citizenship.

the flip side of the sinaporean passport is to look at what singaporeans are doing themselves.

Just a straw poll of mates down there, and most all of them hold Australian PR "just in case". They too like the felxibility of not being restricted to a small island off the tip of Malaysia - no matter how advanced it is.

Sounds to me like having Singaporean PR is as far as you need go especially if you already hold a western passport.

[Captain Chaos]

I am also in Singapore on an EP and am considering the move to PR.

As far as I can see (so far) the major pro is that it allows you to apply to buy 'landed property' (ie. a house). The other stuff like being able to change jobs more easily you have already spotted.

A major disadvantage is that I believe that the children of Sing PR's are liable for national service ... need someone to verify that as fact rather than hearsay ... and I'm sure there are ways around it (leaving the country for a start, although don't know whether that impacts their ability to legally return)

Another potential disadvantage is that if you hold PR for a long time (say 10 years or so) you will be invited to take up Singapore citizenship ... this can put you in a potentially awkward situation. Happened to a friend of mine who took legal advice which was not to decline it but simply to ignore it if he didn't want to accept - that way no 'face' was lost and the status quo maintained. Doesn't sound like end of the world stuff but something to be aware given that the Sing govt has a stated aim of increasing the population via encouraging higher immigration.

If your main focus is on the job flexibility, how about applying for the new Personal Employment Pass (PEP)? That means you can change employers easily and if you should lose your job you have an extended period to find a new one, but it doesn't come with any of the potential baggage attached to PR. The PEP is described as a "one time, 5 year pass", so my intepretation is that at the end of it the Sing govt would probably invite you to apply for PR anyway, which would make sense to me.

CC

Interesting what you say about the citizenship invite. It's slightly worrying because of course Singapore don't accept dual nationality. I would have to give up my EU passport and then have trouble getting back into my own country.

The National service issue - I think the best way round that is to only have daughters :-)

I looked at the PEP but you have to be in Singapore on an EP for 2 years. For me its only one year so far.

My friend was invited in writing to apply for Singapore citizenship - he has been here for many years though (now 15+ in total), and is absolutely loaded $$$ wise, so they may have tried to 'cherry pick' him ... perhaps I should have said 'PR's MAY be invited to apply for citizenship...' Note that he wasn't 'forced' to accept it though - his lawyer advised to just ignore the letter and that was the end of it.

So far as 'renouncing your [other] citizenship' is concerned, what is actually required? Another friend of mine who took Thai PR and eventually citizenship, told me that whilst he was required to show that he had cancelled his UK passport in order to be granted his Thai citizenship, that did NOT prevent him from re-applying for a new UK passport the day after he'd got his Thai one! Obviously, he feels he has the best of both worlds and I'm inclined to agree! Anyone know if you can get away with the same stunt in Singapore?

If the OP has only been in Singapore 1 year, then unless he can show he's going to bring in lots of money and invest it somewhere, he may have to wait a little while to be granted PR. That's why I suggested PEP - it's a new scheme but the 'one time only' nature of it strongly suggests to me it is intended as a stepping stone to get people to PR - why would you go back down to an EP (and be tied to an employer again) after having a PEP?

Samran's comments about Singaporeans holding Aussie PR are interesting. I will move towards Sing PR because it seems likely that if I want to be in SE Asia in my line of work (finance) for the long term (I'm 37), I am most likely to be here. However, whilst Singapore is a great place to make money, I have no intention to spend it all here (ie. I'll retire somewhere else) - seems like the locals may feel the same?

CC

[samran]

Samran's comments about Singaporeans holding Aussie PR are interesting. I will move towards Sing PR because it seems likely that if I want to be in SE Asia in my line of work (finance) for the long term (I'm 37), I am most likely to be here. However, whilst Singapore is a great place to make money, I have no intention to spend it all here (ie. I'll retire somewhere else) - seems like the locals may feel the same?

CC

not by any means a scientific poll. But sitting around with banker mates, all had studied in OZ, gotten PR, and now bounce between the two.

The last census showed that there were 50,000 singaporean born people in Australia.

[ade100]

Thanks everyone for all the feedback.

I have certainly read, and a quick google search confirms, that Singapore does not accept dual nationality. I have also heard that they may be willing to turn a blind eye.

The ICA does not seem to comment either way:

http://app.ica.gov.sg/serv_citizen/citizen...citizen_faq.asp

Asiaworld, are you saying you have dual nationality?

[Loom]

So far as 'renouncing your [other] citizenship' is concerned, what is actually required? Another friend of mine who took Thai PR and eventually citizenship, told me that whilst he was required to show that he had cancelled his UK passport in order to be granted his Thai citizenship, that did NOT prevent him from re-applying for a new UK passport the day after he'd got his Thai one! Obviously, he feels he has the best of both worlds and I'm inclined to agree! Anyone know if you can get away with the same stunt in Singapore?

If the OP has only been in Singapore 1 year, then unless he can show he's going to bring in lots of money and invest it somewhere, he may have to wait a little while to be granted PR. That's why I suggested PEP - it's a new scheme but the 'one time only' nature of it strongly suggests to me it is intended as a stepping stone to get people to PR - why would you go back down to an EP (and be tied to an employer again) after having a PEP?

Interesting...does say below you could submit a letter stating surrender of foreign passport (not renunciation of foreign citizenship). If you're "stateless" or below the age of 21, this wouldn't apply.

So in some cases dual nationality is allowed. I don't know if it would be possible to become stateless for this application process and reclaim original citizenship later. In the case above the UK authorities must have known what was going on but went along with it anyway.

For Citizenship Registration

• Original and a photocopy of the Renunciation letter of foreign citizenship and/or letter stating the surrender of the foreign passport from the authorities concerned. This is not applicable for applicant below 21 years old and for applicant whose nationality is "stateless".
  

[cafes]

Interesting discussion. After 20+ years in Thailand and having to show my face every 3 months a Soi Suan Plu I am seriously thinking of either relocating to Singaproe or KL......

[ade100]

Interesting discussion. After 20+ years in Thailand and having to show my face every 3 months a Soi Suan Plu I am seriously thinking of either relocating to Singaproe or KL......

I don't know KL but from what I have heard, Singapore has the advantage of low crime and being English speaking. The dissadvantage would be higher cost of living (in fact its just housing and cars that are expensive. Food, clothes and public transport are all quite cheap)

[ade100]

For those interested in obtaining PR status in Singapore, I thought I would keep this thread updated.

After considering the options, I decided to go ahead with the PR application. One of the reasons for choosing PR over Personal Employment Pass was that should I need to change jobs, many employers are stating “Singaporeans or PR only” in job adverts.

I contacted my employers (my umbrella company) who said they would do the whole thing for me for a fee of 100SGD. They will gather and photocopy all the documents, stand inline at the ICA and generally deal with any questions or issues that should arise. They also said that Singapore is welcoming foreign talent “with open arms” at the moment so I would almost certainly be successful.

So all I have to do is let them borrow my passport and degree certificates for a day, pay them 100SGD and sit tight and wait. I will refrain from making any comparisons with Thailand.

I will keep you posted.

[wanderer9020]

i just got my new blue IC (thats for PR, pink for citizen), one month ago, and waht can I say, yeah ,nothing really glorious about it.Well, lemme summarize.Now, I can trade contra in SGX without having to deposit money on my trading account, now I have CPF which I can take out whenever I planned to get out from this country. ANd yeah, no thank you, Im not interested to take the Singapore passport.And last but not the least, I dont need to carry my passport whenever I have to apply or something, and, I can work at Mc Donalds lol. SO, take your pick....

[Prakanong]

"I contacted my employers (my umbrella company) who said they would do the whole thing for me for a fee of 100SGD"

Yes these agencies are rather efficient and a very good bargain. My company pays of course but I can remember even little things costing me a lot more than 2300THB to do anything in Thailand.

Just think of the cost to get to PR in Thailand!

Welcoming foreign talent - most certainly and thats one of the reasons the relatively open economy of Singapore has a per capita GDP of over 23000 USD and Thailand is still 3rd world.

[soihok]

A point worth remembering is that once you have taken up PR status you are required to be present and employed/business owner/contribute towards Singapore for a certain period of time .

I have known people that have taken up PR and taken employment in other countries , not returned to Singapore for some time , then lost their PR status which has then had an adverse effect on their employment situation when they saw a chance to return.

Sorry dont know time period required.

Once PR status is withdrawn it cannot be reinstated.

[ade100]

A point worth remembering is that once you have taken up PR status you are required to be present and employed/business owner/contribute towards Singapore for a certain period of time .

I have known people that have taken up PR and taken employment in other countries , not returned to Singapore for some time , then lost their PR status which has then had an adverse effect on their employment situation when they saw a chance to return.

Sorry dont know time period required.

Once PR status is withdrawn it cannot be reinstated.

Thanks for your input but you clarify what you mean about not being able to re-instate PR.

According to the ICA website:

Can I give up my SPR status and then reapply to become a SPR again in the future?

Yes, but the re-application will be considered on its own merits under the prevailing conditions at that time. You will also need to reinstate whatever CPF contributions (with interest) that you have withdrawn.

(http://app.ica.gov.sg/serv_pr/per_res/app_for_pr_faq.asp#q18)

Thanks

[Prakanong]

A point worth remembering is that once you have taken up PR status you are required to be present and employed/business owner/contribute towards Singapore for a certain period of time .

I have known people that have taken up PR and taken employment in other countries , not returned to Singapore for some time , then lost their PR status which has then had an adverse effect on their employment situation when they saw a chance to return.

Sorry dont know time period required.

Once PR status is withdrawn it cannot be reinstated.

Thanks for your input but you clarify what you mean about not being able to re-instate PR.

According to the ICA website:

Can I give up my SPR status and then reapply to become a SPR again in the future?

Yes, but the re-application will be considered on its own merits under the prevailing conditions at that time. You will also need to reinstate whatever CPF contributions (with interest) that you have withdrawn.

(http://app.ica.gov.sg/serv_pr/per_res/app_for_pr_faq.asp#q18)

Thanks

As you say its not impossible but I do not think they like it -as they say prevailing situation at the time ie need for talent, who you work for etc.

I am sure if your comapny moved you away and then back again and its the type of company they want ie regional HQ of MNC's you would have no problem.

[wanderer9020]

PR is valid for 5 years and you have to renew it, subject to approval.You should have a Singapore job on the time you want to renew it, otherwise, it will be not be renewed

[Captain Chaos]

For those interested in obtaining PR status in Singapore, I thought I would keep this thread updated.

After considering the options, I decided to go ahead with the PR application. One of the reasons for choosing PR over Personal Employment Pass was that should I need to change jobs, many employers are stating “Singaporeans or PR only” in job adverts.

I contacted my employers (my umbrella company) who said they would do the whole thing for me for a fee of 100SGD. They will gather and photocopy all the documents, stand inline at the ICA and generally deal with any questions or issues that should arise. They also said that Singapore is welcoming foreign talent “with open arms” at the moment so I would almost certainly be successful.

So all I have to do is let them borrow my passport and degree certificates for a day, pay them 100SGD and sit tight and wait. I will refrain from making any comparisons with Thailand.

I will keep you posted.

Please do let us know how you get on with this Ade ... my (pub gossip) understanding was that PR was unlikely to be granted unless or until you either had been in Sing for a few years (working, paying taxes obviously) or else you brought some money in to invest in property/other ...

My plan had therefore been to apply for a PEP when my EP expires in Nov 2008 and look to move towards PR thereafter. However, it appears you have been in Singapore even less time than I have so if this process goes as smoothly as you have described it, I would probably apply for PR myself in the summer.

Good luck,

CC

[wanderer9020]

A friend was granted PR even if he is just an EP holder for 6 months,its a case to case basis depending on your qualifications..Another friend took him just 2 weeks for his PR to be approved against the usual 3 months, Mine was just 3 weeks....

[Prakanong]

A friend was granted PR even if he is just an EP holder for 6 months,its a case to case basis depending on your qualifications..Another friend took him just 2 weeks for his PR to be approved against the usual 3 months, Mine was just 3 weeks....

Yup - a few in our office after just 3 months of EP and others after 6 months.

As you say case by case plus the industry you are in and the amount its bringing into the country.

Biotech is booming and if your company is building 1 billion Euro plants +, has places in the Biopolis as well and with guys sitting on the EDB I suppose it counts.

[Loom]

I applied for and received PR status a year and a half after working under an EP. Approval took a month and a half. It's been two years since getting PR and I've received an invitation to apply for citizenship. My inclination is to give it a pass but since the Singapore passport is just as good, if not better than my US passport for travel, got to take a closer look.

I will check out the contention that Singapore citizens like to keep a toehold in other countries "just in case".

[asiaworld]

Actually a lot of wealthy folks, all over the world do it .. i don't concider myself one, but still eep my toehold in 5 countries (incl.my passp. lands) . Do you know how many (*MAANY!) S'poreans hold properties abroad .. & how many of them send their kids to study abroad.. So really it's more out of opportunism, rather than fear ..

[ade100]

Quick update:

I handed all my documents over today to my company who will make the application tomorrow at ICA (Immigration and Checkpoints Authority).

To the point raised by CaptainChaos, there is nothing on the application form that asks for bank account, savings or investment information. They don’t even ask if I own property in SG. However they are very interested in salaries current and previous.

Apparently approval should take 2 – 3 months but could be less.

Incidentally I was asking about bringing my Thai gf to SG and was told the simplest thing is for her to apply online for an Employment Pass Eligibility Certificate. This is just an agreement in principle to give her a work permit as soon as she finds a job. Once she has this certificate she can spend up to a year in the country while she looks for work. Very, very helpful government.