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[britmaveric]

Kat- dunno circus like atmosphere isn't too funny when you think it could have been terrorists entering the House of Commons or Buckingham Palace. Downright Scary!

Anyways your election will be here before you know it and at the very least the debate will be over for 4years!

[IamMaiC]

He degraded men that fought for their country,

Fought for their country? How was going half-way around the world to fight the "yellow man" (Springsteen) fighting for their country? Fighting for their corrupt lying government yes, but fighting for their country?

Sir have you been in the military?? Some men in vietnam fought for the US True?? If not then what I have heard from veterans that were there they are a bunch of liers.

Sure the war was wrong Vietnam it was fought wrong also read your history but men did fight!!!

[kat]

In an interview with Time magazine, President Bush declared the war in Iraq a "catastrophic success."

How's that for a bon mot paradoxial oxymoron?

Catrastrophy for Iraq and the US taxpayer / soldier, a success for Haliburton / Cheney.

Boy are Americans dumb.

Yeah you moron it was a Catastrophic Success All wars are!!! You have people dying That's what's Catastrophic have you been to Iraq Sir?? I have I been in a few firefights I was about to go to the big one in najaf, The insurgents run and hid in that ###### mosque they have because they know the US will not attack it.

And what you see on the news!! You ever see the good things going on in iraq No of course not only the bad I was north of baghdad Iraqi people want the US in there, Iraqi People are joing the Army and sercurity forces because they want to have a better country.

I am proud of what I have done and so are the soldiers i served with

IamMaiC:

I am at serious odds with my government, but I don't fault you for a second. Please stay safe out there. I am so sorry that you and other men and women are in harms way for a corrupt and illegal war that is not congruent with the country's interests. I'm going to pray for you.

[IamMaiC]

In an interview with Time magazine, President Bush declared the war in Iraq a "catastrophic success."

How's that for a bon mot paradoxial oxymoron?

Catrastrophy for Iraq and the US taxpayer / soldier, a success for Haliburton / Cheney.

Boy are Americans dumb.

Yeah you moron it was a Catastrophic Success All wars are!!! You have people dying That's what's Catastrophic have you been to Iraq Sir?? I have I been in a few firefights I was about to go to the big one in najaf, The insurgents run and hid in that ###### mosque they have because they know the US will not attack it.

And what you see on the news!! You ever see the good things going on in iraq No of course not only the bad I was north of baghdad Iraqi people want the US in there, Iraqi People are joing the Army and sercurity forces because they want to have a better country.

I am proud of what I have done and so are the soldiers i served with

IamMaiC:

I am at serious odds with my government, but I don't fault you for a second. Please stay safe out there. I am so sorry that you and other men and women are in harms way for a corrupt and illegal war that is not congruent with the country's interests. I'm going to pray for you.

I am no longer there Kat If the war is illegal or not that is not for me to judge, But I am glad Saddam Hussein is gone and some other radical regimes have gone with it The Taliban and Lybia. So the world is not safer of course. But it takes time.

I am scared if Mr. Kerry is elected to the office he will stop this war and bring all the troops home. Then what do we do worry about after school programs?? When the enemy is worried about killing as many americans as they can!!! Sure I was scared in iraq I am or course only human but i did what i had to do. To survive. I am not sorry i went and some other soldiers are not sorry either We had a guy over here with one leg!!!! He was still doing what needed to be done.

[Tornado]

In an interview with Time magazine, President Bush declared the war in Iraq a "catastrophic success."

How's that for a bon mot paradoxial oxymoron?

Catrastrophy for Iraq and the US taxpayer / soldier, a success for Haliburton / Cheney.

Boy are Americans dumb.

Yeah you moron it was a Catastrophic Success All wars are!!! You have people dying That's what's Catastrophic have you been to Iraq Sir?? I have I been in a few firefights I was about to go to the big one in najaf, The insurgents run and hid in that ###### mosque they have because they know the US will not attack it.

And what you see on the news!! You ever see the good things going on in iraq No of course not only the bad I was north of baghdad Iraqi people want the US in there, Iraqi People are joing the Army and sercurity forces because they want to have a better country.

I am proud of what I have done and so are the soldiers i served with

IamMaiC:

I am at serious odds with my government, but I don't fault you for a second. Please stay safe out there. I am so sorry that you and other men and women are in harms way for a corrupt and illegal war that is not congruent with the country's interests. I'm going to pray for you.

I am no longer there Kat If the war is illegal or not that is not for me to judge, But I am glad Saddam Hussein is gone and some other radical regimes have gone with it The Taliban and Lybia. So the world is not safer of course. But it takes time.

I am scared if Mr. Kerry is elected to the office he will stop this war and bring all the troops home. Then what do we do worry about after school programs?? When the enemy is worried about killing as many americans as they can!!! Sure I was scared in iraq I am or course only human but i did what i had to do. To survive. I am not sorry i went and some other soldiers are not sorry either We had a guy over here with one leg!!!! He was still do what needed to be done.

Ian - what is next door to the Hilton Hotel in Baghdad? Let us see if you were really there?

[IamMaiC]

I wasn't in bahgdad and your questioning if i was there or not!!!! I don't give a <deleted> if you believe me I was north of baghdad and i am not saying where because i am not compromising the men and women that are still there

[Nemesis]

Yeah you moron..... it was a Catastrophic Success..... You have people dying ......I am proud of what I have done and so are the soldiers i served with

Yeah, people are dying all right, dummies like you sent there by idiots like Bush and Cheney who who were smart enough to not 'serve."

You still are proud of killing people for no good reason?

You are dumb.

[Tornado]

I wasn't in bahgdad and your questioning if i was there or not!!!! I don't give a <deleted> if you believe me I was north of baghdad and i am not saying where because i am not compromising the men and women that are still there

why so angry? asked a question! dont beleive you.. pm me and we will see what you know.

I get sick of these try hards pattaya types who think they were something special - you werent there other wise you would say where you were.

Where did you go on RaR - I would guess the same place as the rest of the US military - so dont spout your crap - you would know what Im talking about if you had been over there.

You have one lifeline and you can call a friend

[IamMaiC]

Yeah you moron..... it was a Catastrophic Success..... You have people dying ......I am proud of what I have done and so are the soldiers i served with

Yeah, people are dying all right, dummies like you sent there by idiots like Bush and Cheney who who were smart enough to not 'serve."

You still are proud of killing people for no good reason?

You are dumb.

No good reason!!!! So I was to let them kill me then!!! Fat Chance. You go to Iraq and say the same thing you said to me to the soldiers there now and see if you come out alive sir!!

[kat]

IamMaiC:

I share some of this ambivilence. I by no means even pretend to know all the right answers to this mess we're in. For the record, I don't think Kerry ever said he would bring all the troops home. We are now in a "damned if we do, damned if we don't" situation. We are in a quagmire, IamMaiC. A sinkhole of blood, innocent lives, violence, ill-will, and bilions upon billions of dollars.

But I refer to Iraq as an illegal and corrupt war, because every reason for going to war has been proven to be untrue or somehow missing. There are also too many circumstances surrounding the decision to enter this war that are disquieting to say the least. We entered this foray after being hit from Afghanistan. We have not even completed the reasons for entering that war, and then we unilaterally enter another war under dubious pretenses. And the result is Iraq, this quicksand of a place that we should of studied more carefully, learned more about from history, and at the very least allow the IAEA to do their jobs. Yes, there are good things about getting rid of Saddam. But do the costs of this war outweigh the benefits? Do the means justify the ends, and if so, are we really certain we can predict the end of this current debacle? Let's take a look back at Viet Nam. What was it all for?

For me, this is an extremely painful waste of human lives, both for Iraqis and all of the soldiers (our own and others) that have had to die or live and pay a terrible price physically and psychologically.

[Tornado]

Yeah you moron..... it was a Catastrophic Success..... You have people dying ......I am proud of what I have done and so are the soldiers i served with

Yeah, people are dying all right, dummies like you sent there by idiots like Bush and Cheney who who were smart enough to not 'serve."

You still are proud of killing people for no good reason?

You are dumb.

No good reason!!!! So I was to let them kill me then!!! Fat Chance. You go to Iraq and say the same thing you said to me to the soldiers there now and see if you come out alive sir!!

soldiers kids with metallica pulsing through the head phones. That aint a soldier, that is a badly trained gymp with a bad attitude. The US soldier is not rated in the top 10 in the world, the only thing close to a soldier you have is delta and they were trained by the British SAS - that is how they started. next!

[IamMaiC]

I wasn't in bahgdad  and your questioning if i was there or not!!!!  I don't give a <deleted>  if you believe me    I was north of baghdad and i am not saying where because i am not compromising the men and women that are still there 

why so angry? asked a question! dont beleive you.. pm me and we will see what you know.

I get sick of these try hards pattaya types who think they were something special - you werent there other wise you would say where you were.

Where did you go on RaR - I would guess the same place as the rest of the US military - so dont spout your crap - you would know what Im talking about if you had been over there.

You have one lifeline and you can call a friend

I am not PMing you for what!!!! I dont care what you say I am not a pattaya type loser I was with the National Guard not the regular army we had totally different missions. so you can join those losers in pattaya sir

[Tornado]

I wasn't in bahgdad  and your questioning if i was there or not!!!!  I don't give a <deleted>  if you believe me    I was north of baghdad and i am not saying where because i am not compromising the men and women that are still there 

why so angry? asked a question! dont beleive you.. pm me and we will see what you know.

I get sick of these try hards pattaya types who think they were something special - you werent there other wise you would say where you were.

Where did you go on RaR - I would guess the same place as the rest of the US military - so dont spout your crap - you would know what Im talking about if you had been over there.

You have one lifeline and you can call a friend

I am not PMing you for what!!!! I dont care what you say I am not a pattaya type loser I was with the National Guard not the regular army we had totally different missions. so you can join those losers in pattaya sir

Ok at least now you are being honest about what you might of did

You were a reservist, nothing wrong with that, but you spout on like you were saving the world.

Dont call me sir, I worked for a living

[kat]

Yeah you moron..... it was a Catastrophic Success..... You have people dying ......I am proud of what I have done and so are the soldiers i served with

Yeah, people are dying all right, dummies like you sent there by idiots like Bush and Cheney who who were smart enough to not 'serve."

You still are proud of killing people for no good reason?

You are dumb.

Bush and Cheney were RICH and PRIVILEGED enought to stay out of wars, not smart. Please watch your mouth, and your ill-conceived idea of the powerful and powerless.

In America, a majority of the people serving in the military are from economically-disadvantaged backgrounds. Are you then saying that you are far superior because somehow you had other choices Many young people entered the military becasue it was the best way to get an education or a job. Now they are in a protracted war that was supposed to last no longer than a month.

You are demonstrating a very ugly, classist, or at best myopic viewpoint at the moment.

And we can not really be sure if he served or not can we, except by what he says. Suppose you are wrong Tornando in your assumption that he didn't serve?

[Tornado]

And we can not really be sure if he served or not can we, except by what he says. Suppose you are wrong Tornando in your assumption that he didn't serve?

somehow I think Im right on the mark

[britmaveric]

Tornado- beg to differ with you US Special Forces are ranked with the best of them in the world.

-Delta Forces

-Navy Seals

-Rangers

-Green Berets

-ParaRescue

Now I'm biased SAS is clearly spot on tops, but then again I'm British!

[kat]

soldiers kids with metallica pulsing through the head phones. That aint a soldier, that is a badly trained gymp with a bad attitude. The US soldier is not rated in the top 10 in the world, the only thing close to a soldier you have is delta and they were trained by the British SAS - that is how they started. next!

You should really watch your mouth as well. I think it is profoundly disrespectful and callous of you to talk about people that are in the process of dying over there for something that was not their fault.

If they are not your idea of a soldier, that is not their fault but our government's. Why don't your reserve your ire and cynicism for the people who deserve it.

I really cannot fathom how you guys can piss all over someone who may have currently been engulfed in a war zone.

[Nemesis]

[Nemesis]

I think it is profoundly disrespectful and callous of you to talk about people that are in the process of dying over there for something that was not their fault.

If they are not your idea of a soldier, that is not their fault but our government's.

That's exactly what makes Bush and any other gutless politicians so despicable - sending other people's sons and daughters off to fight a bogus un-declared unconstitutitonal war that they themselves don't fight in neither do their Fortunate Sons.

[Tornado]

soldiers    kids with metallica pulsing through the head phones. That aint a soldier, that is a badly trained gymp with a bad attitude. The US soldier is not rated in the top 10 in the world, the only thing close to a soldier you have is delta and they were trained by the British SAS - that is how they started. next!

You should really watch your mouth as well. I think it is profoundly disrespectful and callous of you to talk about people that are in the process of dying over there for something that was not their fault.

If they are not your idea of a soldier, that is not their fault but our government's. Why don't your reserve your ire and cynicism for the people who deserve it.

I really cannot fathom how you guys can piss all over someone who may have currently been engulfed in a war zone.

and you watch yours - been over there have you?? War, what do you know about it?

respect is earnt, learn why before you carry on like a know all - CNN makes it look so professional.

yes your right why should I speak bad of the idiots you call an army - trailer trash is still trailer trash, it doesnt matter where they are. You will dislike that comment, but you would not buy a house next door to them

You a yank Kat?

Blame your leader, walk the streets in protest and dont vote for him.

another armchair dictator.

[Tornado]

Tornado- beg to differ with you US Special Forces are ranked with the best of them in the world.

-Delta Forces

-Navy Seals

-Rangers

-Green Berets

-ParaRescue

Now I'm biased SAS is clearly spot on tops, but then again I'm British!

whos ranking them though Brit?

Yes the SAS are the best and no one comes close.

The Brits, the Kiwis and the Aussies - factual!

[britmaveric]

Ask the lads yourself- special forces soldiers are all brethern and equally good at getting the job done.

I've had an opportunity to have a chat with some ex-SAS on a prior occasion. Had a lively convo about Sherpas in WWII.

[kat]

soldiers    kids with metallica pulsing through the head phones. That aint a soldier, that is a badly trained gymp with a bad attitude. The US soldier is not rated in the top 10 in the world, the only thing close to a soldier you have is delta and they were trained by the British SAS - that is how they started. next!

You should really watch your mouth as well. I think it is profoundly disrespectful and callous of you to talk about people that are in the process of dying over there for something that was not their fault.

If they are not your idea of a soldier, that is not their fault but our government's. Why don't your reserve your ire and cynicism for the people who deserve it.

I really cannot fathom how you guys can piss all over someone who may have currently been engulfed in a war zone.

and you watch yours - been over there have you?? War, what do you know about it?

respect is earnt, learn why before you carry on like a know all - CNN makes it look so professional.

yes your right why should I speak bad of the idiots you call an army - trailer trash is still trailer trash, it doesnt matter where they are. You will dislike that comment, but you would not buy a house next door to them

You a yank Kat?

Blame your leader, walk the streets in protest and dont vote for him.

another armchair dictator.

I carry on like a know-it-all, tornado? Who stood corrected about whether or not the man was over there?

That's right respect is earned, but not everyone understands simple things, like remembering your own humanity.

I am lucky enough to have never fought in a formal war zone, but people who have been sent to the military are not the only ones who have fought wars.

Don't deign to tell me where I would or would not live, or how I approach dissent - There is nothing you could possibly know or tell me given your penchant for crude stereotypes.

[francois]

hi'

The Saudi's and other people were flying only after air traffic had been legally resumed.

wrong!!

I do think people should not only watch F 9/11, but also a lot of other documentaries ...

like "the world according to bush", the Hamburg's cell" and some others ...

some facts are absolutly true and no one can say a thing about :

the plan for a war against Irak were ready before bush "election" ...

there were NO weapons of mass destruction

this war is not legitimate by others that US and some stupid followers who can find some financial interest in it

put a country under a constant state of terror has only one point ... being able to create some laws that refrain citizen's freedom of being (read ;patriot act no2)

the bush government is : christian biggots (saying payer before each meeting)

richer than any others before

driven by financial interests

lying to their own people without any shame

acting like they are right, and the others wrong

they have created b.laden, if not directly, at least by what they did in the past, and this include a lot of past governments ...

one more thing ... the fbi and the cia knew about some imminent threats to the US soil,

and no one moved ...

they knew it, they knew that it would come from the sky ...

they the fbi and the cia knew even some names, but this was followed by "no action required"

now, tell me that this president is not a danger for the world ... just say it!

if you think he is good for america, think it, it does not hurt

I do agree that saddam was not good for his country, and a lot of people suffered a lot cause of him, I might be glad that Irak got him out ... but what is better now?

people continue to suffer, nothing is done to avoid all these small groups of b.laden related, doing whatever they want.

if US stay, it's going to get worse for everyone there, if they leave, Irak will become

a tough Islamic regime ... with a lot a "princes" ...

the only way (imho) is to let some peace force to come replacing US(slowly), and then help all these Iraky people to go on their own way under International control, just to avoid a real catastrophy like it is now.

francois

ps; American people are surely not the best to have a good judgement of what is happening in their country ... they are for most of them intoxicated by any political side,

talking, meeting .. and the worst of it, TV!

an outside look is sometime more accurate ...

it has been said that US never had such a dummy in the white house ... and a lot of people appreciate him, because they may think, if he is president, so can I .....

is it the real America?

I hope not

[Nemesis]

[Nemesis]

"I was not involved in the September 11 attacks in the United States nor did I have knowledge of the attacks. There exists a government within a government within the United States. The United States should try to trace the perpetrators of these attacks within itself; to the people who want to make the present century a century of conflict between Islam and Christianity. That secret government must be asked as to who carried out the attacks....The American system is totally in control of the Jews, whose first priority is Israel, not the United States." OB Laden

50% of New Yorkers think the US government knew in advance about the 'attack' on WTC / Pentagon and did nothing.

Bin Laden says he didn't do it.

Who did?

Cheney was running Pentagon war games on the same day September 11. Quite a coincidence, no?

The US Government attacked its own people. Truth is indeed stranger than fiction. Who could have made that up?

[Tornado]

soldiers    kids with metallica pulsing through the head phones. That aint a soldier, that is a badly trained gymp with a bad attitude. The US soldier is not rated in the top 10 in the world, the only thing close to a soldier you have is delta and they were trained by the British SAS - that is how they started. next!

You should really watch your mouth as well. I think it is profoundly disrespectful and callous of you to talk about people that are in the process of dying over there for something that was not their fault.

If they are not your idea of a soldier, that is not their fault but our government's. Why don't your reserve your ire and cynicism for the people who deserve it.

I really cannot fathom how you guys can piss all over someone who may have currently been engulfed in a war zone.

and you watch yours - been over there have you?? War, what do you know about it?

respect is earnt, learn why before you carry on like a know all - CNN makes it look so professional.

yes your right why should I speak bad of the idiots you call an army - trailer trash is still trailer trash, it doesnt matter where they are. You will dislike that comment, but you would not buy a house next door to them

You a yank Kat?

Blame your leader, walk the streets in protest and dont vote for him.

another armchair dictator.

I carry on like a know-it-all, tornado? Who stood corrected about whether or not the man was over there?

That's right respect is earned, but not everyone understands simple things, like remembering your own humanity.

I am lucky enough to have never fought in a formal war zone, but people who have been sent to the military are not the only ones who have fought wars.

Don't deign to tell me where I would or would not live, or how I approach dissent - There is nothing you could possibly know or tell me given your penchant for crude stereotypes.

know it all? - NO! had experience in what Im chatting about ? - YES! and you?

yeah sure!

Kat, you bore me to tears with you crap, I couldnt care about your "wars" - a courthouse isnt even similiar.

Kat I can tell by your longing posts that you have been through maybe a divorce or seperation ? or something has happened bad in your life? get over it, your army is <deleted> and Ive served near them - have you?

go and be a martyr somewhere else or take over another thread that has nothing to do with the title.

Bush is a ######, your country was wrong to invade and its all down hill from here.

sorry you deserved it !

[britmaveric]

Nemesis- I dare say you must be related to Adolf. Jews are to blame for every ill in the world? Sad part about all of this is that there are twisted Nazi(s) in our midst.

[kat]

You are the one who has taken over this thread with inacurrate and mindless insults. Your usual style. Beat your chest some more about how you're the king of the thread and resort to mindless rantings whenever you're wrong. Yawn.

Weren't you the one who referred to a whole group of people as Darkies on another thread? I guess that is evidence of your civilizing superiority, from whatever esteemed has-been empire you happen to be from.

You are chasing straw-men now, or just blinded by your own blather, because I never defended the war. So why are you now pretending to argue with me over something I never said? Because you have nothing significant to say, except engaging everyone in your ridiculous piss contests.

I couldn't give a shit about my effect on you as I am way over your head anyway. Your attempts to squeeze me into one of your simplistic stereotypes is amusing.

[kat]

Nemesis- I dare say you must be related to Adolf. Jews are to blame for every ill in the world? Sad part about all of this is that there are twisted Nazi(s) in our midst.

Yeah, and next he's going to say that all the Jews who work at the WTC called in sick that day. It's like Elvis -- he's left the building.