Should I Let The Imac Seduce Me?

[Phil Conners]

However, pricing for the iMac is now very reasonable and the only thing holding me back is a leap of faith on my part!...or lack of!

I'm not arguing that the Mac looks sweet, just that the price is IMO still unreasonable.

I just picked up a pricelist in Tukcom and the cheapest MacBook is 45,900. This includes a 2.0 GHz Intel Core 2 Duo CPU, 1 GB RAM, 80 GB HD and an unspecified graphics card. A similar spec'ed Notebook (but with double the disk space - 160 GB disk.) from Acer, the 4720-301G16 is 32,900

That's almost 50% more for the MacBook.

There's a similar difference between Mac and PC desktops. (I'm not suggesting anyone should buy Acer, just comparing to a known brand.)

Edited February 4, 2008 by Phil Conners

[dsys]

under Tiger i didn't have much problem even under a windows domain,

WOW WOW WOW who do you work for - who is your domain admin? Whoever it is , is a superhero!

Certainly knows his/her forests from his/her trees:) [sorry really bad windows domain joke]

Edited February 4, 2008 by dsys

[endure]

under Tiger i didn't have much problem even under a windows domain, Printer sharing may be a problem though depending if the printer is standalone or plugged with another PC

What kind of Windows domain are you talking about? The old NT type domain or Active Directory?

[CobraSnakeNecktie]

However, pricing for the iMac is now very reasonable and the only thing holding me back is a leap of faith on my part!...or lack of!

I'm not arguing that the Mac looks sweet, just that the price is IMO still unreasonable.

I just picked up a pricelist in Tukcom and the cheapest MacBook is 45,900. This includes a 2.0 GHz Intel Core 2 Duo CPU, 1 GB RAM, 80 GB HD and an unspecified graphics card. A similar spec'ed Notebook (but with double the disk space - 160 GB disk.) from Acer, the 4720-301G16 is 32,900

That's almost 50% more for the MacBook.

There's a similar difference between Mac and PC desktops. (I'm not suggesting anyone should buy Acer, just comparing to a known brand.)

if you figure out the difference in price over its likely 4 year lifetime would be like 10 baht a day and when you calculate Apple excellent resale value then the long term cost would be just a couple of baht a day. My last powerbook I had for 3 full years and when I went to sell it I got a full 35% of the purchase price and it sold within days here in CM. For people who use their computers a lot its barely noticeable price premium. Also if a person has any kind of business then its a write off anyway.

[Kyosuken]

Windows 2003 domain, with active directory.

Note that the Mac wasn't "part" of the domain (it had an account on the domain) but it wasn't at login (i don't even know if login over a windows domain is possible under OSX). By adjusting the settings in the utility folder i could join the domain no problem, and any file "sharing" would just work. Problem was printing though, if the printers were networked it would work (this is what i meant by "depending if the printer is standalone - networked- or shared by another computer).

Mind you i was an admin in the company i worked with and the mac was mine... Now maybe because our network topology was fairly simple the mac just worked, but besides that i didn't face any real difficulties.

[nikster]

I just picked up a pricelist in Tukcom and the cheapest MacBook is 45,900. This includes a 2.0 GHz Intel Core 2 Duo CPU, 1 GB RAM, 80 GB HD and an unspecified graphics card. A similar spec'ed Notebook (but with double the disk space - 160 GB disk.) from Acer, the 4720-301G16 is 32,900

That's almost 50% more for the MacBook.

Saw the MacBook for 41,900 at login.co.th. In Singapore, it's 39,615 BHT.

Saw the Acer 4720-301G16 for 39,900 at http://www.acer.co.th/backend/backoffice/w...te/notebook.php

My previous experience is that you won't get a big discount over the Acer online website, except for older models.

So... BHT 2000 difference shows this in a somewhat different light. The 80GB HD is lame, that is true. Then again, Acer usually has the best features for price, esp. in the low end.

[kudroz]

I have over 25 Intel Macs running here, around 20 iMacs and the rests are Macbook. They all work fine and authenticate with Open Directory (Kerberos) under MacOS. They are all running great and I would never ever consider going on to XP/Vista OS ever again.

[kudroz]

[Richb2004v2]

I too have been considering a Mac. When I bought my last PC over three years ago I didn't buy a MAc on account of there been few Mac outlets in Thailand. There is now a Mac dealer in Pattaya quite near my home. So in the coming months I may go Mac. However I only use the internet and other simple stuff, so was considering a MiniMac. What are the experiences with this machine, and how much are they now?

[canuckamuck]

Macs are great untill you want to upgrade or until it breaks. Before you buy one make sure you live in Bangkok because thats where it will go as soon as the dvd player quits working, or it starts having blackouts, the keyboard malfunctions, or various other problems I have watched my Mac afflicted friends endure.

For myself, I can get my PC fixed in an hour if it is needed, or I can buy new parts for upgrades whenever I want.I can buy a new PC desktop use it for a couple of years, then swap out the processor and mainboard and have a new system for still less than the price of one Mac. It's like two or three for the price of one.

[nikster]

Macs are great untill you want to upgrade or until it breaks. Before you buy one make sure you live in Bangkok because thats where it will go as soon as the dvd player quits working, or it starts having blackouts, the keyboard malfunctions, or various other problems I have watched my Mac afflicted friends endure.

For myself, I can get my PC fixed in an hour if it is needed, or I can buy new parts for upgrades whenever I want.I can buy a new PC desktop use it for a couple of years, then swap out the processor and mainboard and have a new system for still less than the price of one Mac. It's like two or three for the price of one.

Hear hear... havent had any problems with my last few macs that the dealer didn't fix in less than a day, in Chiang Mai. That's better or as good as Acer Thailand which is also excellent. BTW I have, amongs other laptops, a 6 year old titanium Powerbook. The slot loading DVD drive in that works just fine. Blackouts? Keyboards are standard USB keyboard, any will work.

"two or three for the price of one".. I am getting somewhat tired from trying to debunk this myth. I guess there are some people who just want to believe what they are already believing, and who do not listen to reason or bother to check the readily available online pricing of computers before making that statement.

Even at the heyday of overpriced Macs, they weren't 2x as expensive. Now, they are pretty evenly matched, give or take. Mac premium is about 2000 baht. If you could even call it a premium considering the rather better standards in hardware design and materials.

Edited February 5, 2008 by nikster

[dsys]

@nikster

Agree with you on this point. I find the service form official mac centres to be 100 fold better than any pc outlet, also the point about hardware replacement/upgrades.

I find running a PC is more expensive than a mac - you NEED to upgrade PC's a lot more than you NEED to upgrade a mac. You can get a good three years out of a mac but you'd be hard pushed to get a good three years out of a PC.

right that's it im not posting in this discussion anymore - i think i am turning into a fanboy! That would look great on my next contract; turn up with a mac and ask where the domain controller is!

[Phil Conners]

I just picked up a pricelist in Tukcom and the cheapest MacBook is 45,900. This includes a 2.0 GHz Intel Core 2 Duo CPU, 1 GB RAM, 80 GB HD and an unspecified graphics card. A similar spec'ed Notebook (but with double the disk space - 160 GB disk.) from Acer, the 4720-301G16 is 32,900

That's almost 50% more for the MacBook.

Saw the MacBook for 41,900 at login.co.th. In Singapore, it's 39,615 BHT.

Saw the Acer 4720-301G16 for 39,900 at http://www.acer.co.th/backend/backoffice/w...te/notebook.php

My previous experience is that you won't get a big discount over the Acer online website, except for older models.

So... BHT 2000 difference shows this in a somewhat different light. The 80GB HD is lame, that is true. Then again, Acer usually has the best features for price, esp. in the low end.

Why would you pay more than the official price in the current Acer pricelist (32,900)? If anything you should relatively easy be able to get a lower price than that. But I agree, if you can get the MacBook for 41,900 it's only a 9,000 baht premium for the Mac.... And that assumes that login.co.th's price is actually current - the link for the MacBook on http://www.login.co.th/product/notebook/ gives me error 404. Not 2,000 though, never.

As for resale value, I've sold several Acer notebooks second hand for better than 35% of the purchase price, so I dont think thats a valid argument either, thats entirely up to how good a sales person you are ...

Edited February 5, 2008 by Phil Conners

[A_Traveller]

I have been using macs since 1974.

Hm.. That's clever, if I recall correctly, Apple was only founded in '76 and produced its first machine in '77 with the GUI based systems arriving in '83.

Regards

[Plus]

I find running a PC is more expensive than a mac - you NEED to upgrade PC's a lot more than you NEED to upgrade a mac. You can get a good three years out of a mac but you'd be hard pushed to get a good three years out of a PC.

They run on the same hardware now.

You don't need to upgrade a PC any more than you need to upgrade Mac. Notebooks are unapgradable, but desktops are like Lego. You are free to do anything you want with your PC, and it's very cheap.

In two years time take you computer to the nearest shop and pick it up three hours later with all the latest, fastest hardware available, and it will be cheap. Not as good looking, though, but you can get "designer" parts, too, if you want to show off.

I don't believe we are having this conversation. In terms of upgrades PCs are unrivalled, they last practically forever, you just keep regenerating their insides. Old macs you can throw away.

[canuckamuck]

Macs are great untill you want to upgrade or until it breaks. Before you buy one make sure you live in Bangkok because thats where it will go as soon as the dvd player quits working, or it starts having blackouts, the keyboard malfunctions, or various other problems I have watched my Mac afflicted friends endure.

For myself, I can get my PC fixed in an hour if it is needed, or I can buy new parts for upgrades whenever I want.I can buy a new PC desktop use it for a couple of years, then swap out the processor and mainboard and have a new system for still less than the price of one Mac. It's like two or three for the price of one.

Hear hear... havent had any problems with my last few macs that the dealer didn't fix in less than a day, in Chiang Mai. That's better or as good as Acer Thailand which is also excellent. BTW I have, amongs other laptops, a 6 year old titanium Powerbook. The slot loading DVD drive in that works just fine. Blackouts? Keyboards are standard USB keyboard, any will work.

"two or three for the price of one".. I am getting somewhat tired from trying to debunk this myth. I guess there are some people who just want to believe what they are already believing, and who do not listen to reason or bother to check the readily available online pricing of computers before making that statement.

Even at the heyday of overpriced Macs, they weren't 2x as expensive. Now, they are pretty evenly matched, give or take. Mac premium is about 2000 baht. If you could even call it a premium considering the rather better standards in hardware design and materials.

If you would have read closer you would have seen I based my price comparison on the fact that I can swap out my mainboard and processor and have a new again computer two years down the road at a price lower than what Mac guys pay for a one time deal. Two PC's for less than 1 Mac.

As far as repairs go, I did not know they had a repair center in Chiang Mai, so that makes two places in Thailand you can get one fixed. Big deal, all the other Mac outlets in Thailand ship the repairs, and you cover the cost unless it's warranty. Three days to get it back. The guy in Pattaya held us up for three hours before he said he was going to ship it away, wasted most of a day for me.

My PC has never needed any overnight work. Usually one hour to get it back, and 100 to 200 baht for their time.

[A_Traveller]

Old macs you can throw away.

It's worth noting that the OS's with Macs are far less backwardly compatible. In effect, every few years Apple hits the reset button and says upgrade, no option. One of the reasons for Windows vulnerabilities, after all, is the legacy code required to run older programs, which allows for a more gradual upgrade path. Both approaches have advantages/disadvantages, and cost ramifications within the life-cycle of the products.

Regards

[nikster]

I have been using macs since 1974.

Hm.. That's clever, if I recall correctly, Apple was only founded in '76 and produced its first machine in '77 with the GUI based systems arriving in '83.

Talk about early adopters

[nikster]

If you would have read closer you would have seen I based my price comparison on the fact that I can swap out my mainboard and processor and have a new again computer two years down the road at a price lower than what Mac guys pay for a one time deal. Two PC's for less than 1 Mac.

As far as repairs go, I did not know they had a repair center in Chiang Mai, so that makes two places in Thailand you can get one fixed. Big deal, all the other Mac outlets in Thailand ship the repairs, and you cover the cost unless it's warranty. Three days to get it back. The guy in Pattaya held us up for three hours before he said he was going to ship it away, wasted most of a day for me.

My PC has never needed any overnight work. Usually one hour to get it back, and 100 to 200 baht for their time.

Maybe the dealer in Pattaya is just bad.

Point taken, you didn't claim - as I thought - to be able to buy 2 new PCs for one new Mac. My apologies.

However, it's still an apple and pears comparison. You can get a 3 year optional warranty on Macs and with that, and under your assumption that something will fail, the 3 year warranty will be cheaper than any replacement parts. That's not Macs vs PC per se, you can just as well get an extended warranty for most PCs.

No question the ability to go down to the local PC store and get any kind of replacement part is nice. But IMHO its always overvalued by PC enthusiasts. PC enthusiasts get such a kick out of tinkering with their hardware that all manner of rationalizations are made up to support the idea that they are just being financially prudent. Which I don't buy. It's been a while since I upgraded PCs, but it was a rocky road. Performance wasn't always as good, and usually you just hit a dead end after a few years. Then there's all that time spent running around looking for parts, reading up on it, and finally assembling it - time is money, if I go by my usual rate any second I spend on PC hardware is a total writeoff.

If you have fun doing it - good on you. It's a great hobby. If not - much more effective to get an all in one with good specs, and a new one when that doesn't do anymore.

Macs will last about 2 - 3 years depending on the demands you put on it. For internet surfing and email, my 6 year old PowerBook is working just fine.

[canuckamuck]

If Mac users could tinker with the main parts they would do it just as much as PC users.

They are not allowed that's all. They would soon find cheaper components and mess with Apple's monopoly and profit margin.

[FrankFrink]

I've always admired Macs. I've used both PC and MAC in earlier days for different purposes, however these days almost 100% PC due to much greater diversity of software and customisation. Now with Virtual Machine technologies there is the potential to run a Mac inside a PC and vice versa, therefore aside from aesthetics and economics the line becomes increasingly blurred. I've been running Mac OSX 10.4.3 quite well on my Sony laptop...

However, that all doesn't make this article any less true or pinpoint accurate: http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/20...5/comment.media

Hillarious..

AMH

[traveller5000]

^ haha, nice one

[nikster]

If Mac users could tinker with the main parts they would do it just as much as PC users.

Nah. Some people like to tinker, some don't. Some like to work on their cars, others like their car to work.

Each to their own

[Plus]

I get "upgrade" orders from household members. They never do it themselves.

Take computer to a shop, they'll give you a list of what they can do, and pick it up in a couple of hours. You don't need to do a lot of research on the Net, they are pretty much on the ball about the latest available hardware in their store and can explain everything.

Same as taking a car to a service center, it doesn't have to be a hobby.