Boom In Los For English Speaking Teachers?

[phormio]

My family , including me, my Thai wife, and baby daughter are planning to emigrate from the US to Thailand at the end of 2004 . My wife has several connections with upper middle class professionals in Thailand who have told her that the teaching market for farang teachers is red hot right now.

I quote from another topic from the Teaching forum:

Oh, and regarding the "troublemaker" aspect- most places are so desperate for decent workers, they're happy to help you out- up to the point you've signed the contract, then...

Do you guys think so? If there is a boom for native English speaking teachers, why is it happening and why now? How long do you think it will last - is it a "boom" or a "bubble"(temporary surge) ? Is it causally related to the boom(bubble) in the Thai economy and real estate markets?

Thanks in advance for your thoughts and comments.

[mbkudu]

There has always been a high demand for English teachers in Thailand, especially native speakers. There are a few reasons. One is obvious; Thais see learning English as a way to get ahead in life with a better job and higher salary.

There are many Asian expat families living mostly in Bangkok who will pay a premium for English lessons. The constant shortage of teachers is mainly because

not many people want to do it. The hours are long and the pay compared to other types of work is low. A lot of teachers teach for awhile until they find something else that pays more and might be more interesting or challenging work. If you enjoy teaching and can find some private work to supplement your income, you can live quite well in Thailand.

[Khun Larry]

If there is a boom for native English speaking teachers, why is it happening and why now?  How long do you think it will last - is it a "boom" or a "bubble"(temporary surge) ? Is it causally related to the boom(bubble) in the Thai economy and real estate markets?

If you consider 800 - 1000 baht a month for teaching english a boom then it is going strong.

Thai real estate is in a bubble for sure.

Don't bet your future in Thailand, you will someday regret it.

Nice place to visit but I would not want to live there on a budget.

[mbkudu]

If you consider 800 - 1000 baht a month for teaching english a boom then it is going strong.

What exactly does this mean?

[Ijustwannateach]

I think he may be trying to cite HOURLY rates for good part-time work here... no idea otherwise.

Note that I said the desperation was for DECENT workers- there are plenty of other kinds freely available!

To be serious, though, a few years back market demand for all-English programs and teachers went through the roof- so a buncha enterprising schools and private organizations started up their programs- unfortunately for them, they based their projections on foreign staff availability on conditions at that time, BEFORE they all created demand for foreign staff at the same time. The market doesn't seem to have caught up with the reality of the high demand and limited supply- so in the meantime the losers are the schools who don't keep their prices up high enough to compete, plus the decent teachers who are tricked into working for them (very temporarily, of course!)

My advice would be to play them off against each other as much as possible right now when demand is high, and get into a stable school (if possible) with a really good contract. Then when times are harder you're already locked into a decent contract.

"Steven"

[mbkudu]

Don't bet your future in Thailand, you will someday regret it.

Nice place to visit but I would not want to live there on a budget.

Please do tell us where the best place in the world is to invest in a future.

If you think it's America or England, then all I can do is !

[Ijustwannateach]

Yes, we all know about that American job stability and economic/political consistency the last few years....

My folks lost half their investments (or more) after 9/11 and thanks to Dubya my sister's been unemployed for 3 years (after Siemens withdrew from the U.S. thanks to Dubyananigans) and my mother and invalid stepfather have been killed on medical costs thanks to Dubya's cuts on social spending and the elderly, even though they have insurance [among the lucky]. And let's not forget those hurricanes which just uprooted every tree in my family's yard! Thanks, U.S.! I think I'll invest my future there! Right!

Personally, I think most folks in my generation will just have to work until we drop. It'll take another generation or two to reach the big disaster that world economic mismanagement is lurching towards- probably to be solved by World War III or IV. But I'm getting really off-topic.

I think genuine teachers (especially subject teachers) will continue to be welcome in almost every country, and even Thailand will eventually have to offer more attractive long-term conditions to attract real teachers.

"Steven"

[phormio]

If you consider 800 - 1000 baht a month for teaching english a boom then it is going strong.

Thai real estate is in a bubble for sure.

Don't bet your future in Thailand, you will someday regret it.

Nice place to visit but I would not want to live there on a budget.

But as you can see(below) astral has got a good idea - work in Thailand to make enough to live on and keep your savings invested elsewhere(I might add unless you have some good connections in the LoS that will allow you to pick up some real estate real cheap).

Keep your money in the UK bank until you need it.

...

You can then ask your UK bank to TT money to your Thai account.

Be sure to insist that they send Pounds, not Baht.  The exchange rate here is much better than in the UK!!

If you manage to find a job here, not an easy task, then you can move your UK funds to the Channel Islands or the Isle of Man, so that you do not pay tax on your investment.

yup

[mbkudu]

Steven,

Sorry to hear about your family. One thing Thais fail to understand is that westerners have it rough as well in many cases. Thailand is as good a place as any to settle down to and start a new life. I have been working back here in California the past 5 years after 8 years teaching in Thailand. I left to secure a bank loan and would say I am ready to return to Thailand soon. I think many Americans are starting to rethink their lives mainly because pensions, social security and other safety nets are just not there anymore. It is worth the risk to pull up the stakes and seek a new life in a foreign country because there is really nothing to lose.

[phormio]

...

Note that I said the desperation was for DECENT workers- there are plenty of other kinds freely available!   

To be serious, though, a few years back market demand for all-English programs and teachers went through the roof- so a buncha enterprising schools and private organizations started up their programs- unfortunately for them, they based their projections on foreign staff availability on conditions at that time, BEFORE they all created demand for foreign staff at the same time.  The market doesn't seem to have caught up with the reality of the high demand and limited supply- so in the meantime the losers are the schools who don't keep their prices up high enough to compete, plus the decent teachers who are tricked into working for them (very temporarily, of course!)

My advice would be to play them off against each other as much as possible right now when demand is high, and get into a stable school (if possible) with a really good contract.  Then when times are harder you're already locked into a decent contract.

"Steven"

Just the kind of assessment that I was looking for.

I taught English conversation in South Korea in the early nineties to managers of LG group while in the US Army. After finishing military service I was offered full time work at $25000 per year teaching English for Hyundai in Ulsan(didn't accept it); wage rates in Korea are much higher, but Thailand is nicer in many ways.

I've got 7 years of engineering education so can probably work teaching science or math, though no advanced degree or teaching certificate in the states.

I'm also not desperate for money so can take the time to look around for good opportunities; thanks for helping to define what a good teaching job is.

[dr_Pat_Pong]

If you consider 800 - 1000 baht a month for teaching english a boom then it is going strong.

What exactly does this mean?

A drinker or maybe even worse addictions. As a communicator he'd make a great Tuk Tuk driver.

[Storekeeper]

Yes, we all know about that American job stability and economic/political consistency the last few years....

My folks lost half their investments (or more) after 9/11 and thanks to Dubya my sister's been unemployed for 3 years (after Siemens withdrew from the U.S. thanks to Dubyananigans) and my mother and invalid stepfather have been killed on medical costs thanks to Dubya's cuts on social spending and the elderly, even though they have insurance [among the lucky]. And let's not forget those hurricanes which just uprooted every tree in my family's yard! Thanks, U.S.! I think I'll invest my future there! Right!

Personally, I think most folks in my generation will just have to work until we drop. It'll take another generation or two to reach the big disaster that world economic mismanagement is lurching towards- probably to be solved by World War III or IV. But I'm getting really off-topic.

I think genuine teachers (especially subject teachers) will continue to be welcome in almost every country, and even Thailand will eventually have to offer more attractive long-term conditions to attract real teachers.

"Steven"

Are you learning any family values in Thailand ? Maybe you might want to go back home and help the family out ?

[Storekeeper]

Is this the "I'm a Democrat"...where's the line for hand-outs thread ?

[Ijustwannateach]

^^ Well, I think the last thing my family needs is another unemployed mouth to feed just now- at least I can work and eat here. Incidentally, in Florida there are a lot of newly homeless people who need handouts right now- no doubt you'd rather just let them starve? Fortunately, my relatives don't see things that way, and several of them are participating in organizing soup kitchens to help out their neighborhoods- (in Republican gollum voice): naaaaasstyyyy hannnnnndooooouts!

Anyhoo, this is still off-topic. For whatever reasons Thailand wants foreign teachers, I'm happy to be one here.

"Steven"

[phormio]

...

Anyhoo, this is still off-topic.  For whatever reasons Thailand wants foreign teachers, I'm happy to be one here.

...

I'm really surprised Nemmy hasn't tiraded on this topic.

Maybe I'm doing something wrong

[mbkudu]

Is this the "I'm a Democrat"...where's the line for hand-outs thread ?

Actually quite the contrary. A long time ago I decided that my well being in my retirement years was up to me and not the government's, so this is why I have decided to put a lot on the line in Thailand because I think I have a better chance of making a good go of things when I am older. I suppose Americans should expect a little more from social security because we pay enough bloody tax, but the government has more important things to spend our money on.

[PeaceBlondie]

Methinks the poster meant "800 to 1,000" American dollars. But a starting salary of 25,000 baht per month is about $615, and in your first year, you might not get 12 paychecks (I got 9). You probably won't be making US$1,000 every month until 2008, unless you already have an M.Ed or its equivalent, in which case you could be making $4,000 in Texas.

It's crazy: the demand for decent teachers is high, but the salary is still low.

[Khun Larry]

If you consider 800 - 1000 baht a month for teaching english a boom then it is going strong.

What exactly does this mean?

Sorry about that, a mistake. Many teachers make $800 - $1000 a month.

This is what a new teacher will likely get paid.

[PeaceBlondie]

Maybe in Bangkok, with a BA and a TEFL cert but little else, they might get $800 per month starting (32,800 baht) for ten months. In the provinces, 25,000. Chiang Mai, 19,000. Then subtract either A) tax of about 900 baht/month; or visa runs every month.

[mbkudu]

Maybe in Bangkok, with a BA and a TEFL cert but little else, they might get $800 per month starting (32,800 baht) for ten months. In the provinces, 25,000. Chiang Mai, 19,000. Then subtract either A) tax of about 900 baht/month; or visa runs every month.

This is if one is doing everything by the book.

[kenkannif]

^ Kind of but the Visa run part (which as PB says can cancel out the tax saved on not having a WP) would mean it's not all by the book.

[mbkudu]

^ Kind of but the Visa run part (which as PB says can cancel out the tax saved on not having a WP) would mean it's not all by the book.

Kenkannif, what I meant by, "by the book," is that you don't do any privates outside your place of work where your work permit is registered. In other words, if a typical work permitted teacher goes by all the rules, he will make a pittance.

[Thetyim]

Maybe in Bangkok, with a BA and a TEFL cert but little else, they might get $800 per month starting (32,800 baht) for ten months. In the provinces, 25,000. Chiang Mai, 19,000. Then subtract either A) tax of about 900 baht/month; or visa runs every month.

I think the wages have gone up.

I am in Phrae and two schools here are paying 30,000 baht a month for a 25 hour week with tax paid and all visa runs (air fares) and WP paid for.

With a few private lessons the money goes up.

The agency they use has more vacancies.

[kenkannif]

^ Kind of but the Visa run part (which as PB says can cancel out the tax saved on not having a WP) would mean it's not all by the book.

Kenkannif, what I meant by, "by the book," is that you don't do any privates outside your place of work where your work permit is registered. In other words, if a typical work permitted teacher goes by all the rules, he will make a pittance.

Yes, I know what you meant mate. If a teacher played it ALL by the book they wouldn't have a WP most likely in the first place!

[Ajarn]

Maybe in Bangkok, with a BA and a TEFL cert but little else, they might get $800 per month starting (32,800 baht) for ten months.  In the provinces, 25,000.  Chiang Mai, 19,000.  Then subtract either A) tax of about 900 baht/month; or visa runs every month.

I think the wages have gone up.

I am in Phrae and two schools here are paying 30,000 baht a month for a 25 hour week with tax paid and all visa runs (air fares) and WP paid for.

With a few private lessons the money goes up.

The agency they use has more vacancies.

Wow, Phrae has really changed! In years past, there was only a tiny market for foreign teachers, and nothing even close to the money you're talking now....And Phrae is so beautiful, too! Lucky guy