People's Alliance For Democracy To Renew Movement

[younghusband]

I was of the opinion - in spite of everything (economics, politics, court cases etc) that the PPP government would be able to muddle along.

This Phra Viharn thing has changed everything. Just like the sale of AIS to the singaporeans pissed off even Thakins hard core supporters, so will the compromise on Thai Soverignty for personal profit and gain.

Thaksin appears not to have learnt his lesson. The Thai populous doesn't give a flying fukc if you kill innocents in the name of a war on drugs, pile unarmed defenseless muslim suspects to suffocate in the back of a truck. He could scam all the money he wanted from the airport. The voting public wouldn't care....

But give away once inch of Thai soil...political suicide.

Really? I think you substantially exaggerate the impact.Anyone with even the shakiest grasp of Thai history would know its borders have constantly changed sometimes ceding several provinces.If you're looking for developments that will destroy this wobbly government look no further than the dark clouds in the world economy and its likely effect.

Different things we are talking about here. Thailand lost and gained land. These were political deals which at the end of the day protected Thailands soverignty (and of course economic asperations). They gave back Kedah, they got Satun. They negotiated with the French, and gained undisputed recognition of Siams rights to Issan - which is ethnicially Laos. The prevented an even further encroachment by the British and the French.

The difference is here, Cambodia isn't threatening to invade Thailand.

Ultimately, these weren't done for personal gain (although I'm sure there was gain made along the way).

Thailand fought Laos back in the 90's over some land that was disputed up in the North. Encroachments by Laos, even over a few metres are taken extemely seriously, and resulted in force being applied.

Thailand protested heavily over the location of the border wall Malaysia was constructing, even if it encroached even a few cm. into Thai territory. They took Cambodia to international court about Prah Viharn.

The standard diplomatic route with all of these border disputes, especially long running ones, is to get an international arbitrator to settle them

And what where are these protests now for Cambodia? Silent. Give away a few meters maybe, but for what? Casino and petroleum concessions in Cambodia issued to a one Dr Thaksin Shinawatra? Where is the benefit for the Thai people there? Where is the justice for those soldiers sent to fight and die for the few hundered square meters of land that Laos claimed back in the 1990's.

You are also ignoring recent history. The sale of Shitcorp to the Tamasek was what really gave legitimacy and boosted the stocks of the PAD pre-coup.

Thaksin is repeating the same mistake again.....

You're correct we're talking about different things.My point is just that I don't think the Pra Viharn issue has "legs" and that economic issues will be more instrumental in this government's downfall.

Incidentally your view of the "negotiations" involved in the alteration of Thai borders is misleading although has a sinilar drift to the hotchpotch of lies taught about history in Thai schools.Thailand or Siam was almost always on the back foot and reacting to the wishes of (and rivalry between) the great colonial powers.

Interesting you mention the border conflict with Laos in the late 1980's.You omit to mention the Thais got a very bloody nose from the Laos.Still one doesn't really expect military prowess from the army that has more generals per enlisted man than any other army in the world.

What on earth does the sale of Shin shares to Temasek have to do with this?It's only economic illiterates who would have a problem with this.There's an argument on the tax avoidance side- a weak one in my view- but that's another matter.

Edited June 18, 2008 by younghusband

[sriracha john]

PM in urgent meeting with Army and Police chiefs

Prime Minister Samak Sundaravej on Wednesday summoned Army Chief General Anupong Paochinda and National Police Chief General Patcharawat Wongsuwant for an urgent meeting at his office.

Sources said Samak ordered the two to beef up security at Government House in light of the threat by the People's Alliance for Democracy to march to the seat of government on Friday.

Patcharawat said he needed to consult with Anupong in order to brace for the PAD-led protest. He said authorities had no plans for a crack down and that police will not allow the PAD to pass Makawan Rangsan Bridge to Government House.

- The Nation

[sriracha john]

A throwback to the "Stereo Wars" of college dormitory days....

Police Once Again Disrupted the PAD Leaders' Speeches by Loud Music

Police once again played loud music over the speeches of PAD leaders. The PAD rally retaliated by playing loud music of their own.

- Thailand Outlook (today)

[sriracha john]

'Arms moved to Bangkok' to create trouble, Interior Minister claims

BANGKOK, June 18 (TNA) - Thailand's Interior Minister Chalerm Yoobamrung said Wednesday that a large amount of weapons have been secretly taken into Bangkok aimed at "creating trouble later this week".

Chalerm said he was informed by an ex-army general that a portion of the weapons were now cached in the capital and would be used to create chaos.

Saying that the informant was reliable "because they were jailed together in 1981", Chalerm said, referring to the aftermatch of an unsuccessful coup attempt, the weapons are expected to be used by members and supporters of the anti-government People's Alliance for Democracy (PAD) who are holding a noisy demonstration in front the United Nations Economic and Social Commission for Asia and the Pacific (ESCAP, the UN's regional headquarters), demanding the ouster of Prime Minister Samak Sundaravej.

The PAD and its supporters are planning to move their rally to Government House where Samak officially works, on Friday. The activist group began its protest against the government nearly a month ago, charging Samak and his People Power Party a proxy of ousted premier Thaksin Shinawatra.

Chalerm said he was confident police could control the situation and that the PAD would not be able to create any disorder. He charged that the PAD had hired another 80 men well-trained in using weapons as guards, less that the 200 they had previously had for security.

While the PAD has marked this Friday as its 'D-Day', or deadline, to bring about the ouster of the coalition government, Chalerm said the demonstrators "game" needed much patience and the party which loses patience, or the energy to continue, will finish last.

[samran]

You're correct we're talking about different things.My point is just that I don't think the Pra Viharn issue has "legs" and that economic issues will be more instrumental in this government's downfall.

Incidentally your view of the "negotiations" involved in the alteration of Thai borders is misleading although has a sinilar drift to the hotchpotch of lies taught about history in Thai schools.Thailand or Siam was almost always on the back foot and reacting to the wishes of (and rivalry between) the great colonial powers.

Interesting you mention the border conflict with Laos in the late 1980's.You omit to mention the Thais got a very bloody nose from the Laos.Still one doesn't really expect military prowess from the army that has more generals per enlisted man than any other army in the world.

What on earth does the sale of Shin shares to Temasek have to do with this?It's only economic illiterates who would have a problem with this.There's an argument on the tax avoidance side- a weak one in my view- but that's another matter.

I think the Phra Viharn thing and the Shin sale are very related, as they both were/will be again the catalyst for solidifying the beginnings of a critical mass against the PPP/TRT party.

Just as the sale of shincorp did, the phra viharn thing will piss of the nationalists, and will stir the ire of not only the Bangkok lattee sippers who support the PAD, but also raise the eyebrows of rural folk who are PPP's biggest supporters. I share the view that it will be the economic issues are part of the reason for their eventual demise, but the government has within its power to water down, subsidise, or just plain cave into demands of people who are being hardest hit by high prices to shut them up.

On the other hand, the Phra Viharn thing is the first 'non-negotiable' as far as most of the Thai electorate are concerned - they won't like it and won't stand for it, and the longer the MOFA and the PM dither on this, the angrier everyone will be - not just the PAD. It will help bring about a faster end to this government than otherwise would be.

Which is why I said Thaksin hasn't learnt his lesson. The electorate let him get away with alot. There are a few things that they won't let him do, and a breach of national sovereignty (either real or perceived) isn't one of them.

As for economic illiteracy - you've unfairly tarred me there..... I actually think that his sale of Shitcorp was one of the things he had an absolute right to do. I have no problem with it, nor do I have a problem with him not paying tax on it. As an offshore entity, thaksin was legally avoiding taxes that didn't need to pay. Many companies, including the ones I work for minimise their thai tax liabilities through offshore vehicles.

The problem is, not with me, it is with the electorate. Right or wrong, they viewed the sale of Shitcorp as 'selling the country'. That is the view of 99% of people you speak to (It will be the same with the Cambo deal). All this I found quite funny, as the catalyst for Thaksin losing his popularity back in 2006 was not all the things he did wrong, but the one thing he was perfectly within his rights to do.

As for all the other things you say (re loas etc..totally agree).

[h90]

You're correct we're talking about different things.My point is just that I don't think the Pra Viharn issue has "legs" and that economic issues will be more instrumental in this government's downfall.

Incidentally your view of the "negotiations" involved in the alteration of Thai borders is misleading although has a sinilar drift to the hotchpotch of lies taught about history in Thai schools.Thailand or Siam was almost always on the back foot and reacting to the wishes of (and rivalry between) the great colonial powers.

Interesting you mention the border conflict with Laos in the late 1980's.You omit to mention the Thais got a very bloody nose from the Laos.Still one doesn't really expect military prowess from the army that has more generals per enlisted man than any other army in the world.

What on earth does the sale of Shin shares to Temasek have to do with this?It's only economic illiterates who would have a problem with this.There's an argument on the tax avoidance side- a weak one in my view- but that's another matter.

I think the Phra Viharn thing and the Shin sale are very related, as they both were/will be again the catalyst for solidifying the beginnings of a critical mass against the PPP/TRT party.

Just as the sale of shincorp did, the phra viharn thing will piss of the nationalists, and will stir the ire of not only the Bangkok lattee sippers who support the PAD, but also raise the eyebrows of rural folk who are PPP's biggest supporters. I share the view that it will be the economic issues are part of the reason for their eventual demise, but the government has within its power to water down, subsidise, or just plain cave into demands of people who are being hardest hit by high prices to shut them up.

On the other hand, the Phra Viharn thing is the first 'non-negotiable' as far as most of the Thai electorate are concerned - they won't like it and won't stand for it, and the longer the MOFA and the PM dither on this, the angrier everyone will be - not just the PAD. It will help bring about a faster end to this government than otherwise would be.

Which is why I said Thaksin hasn't learnt his lesson. The electorate let him get away with alot. There are a few things that they won't let him do, and a breach of national sovereignty (either real or perceived) making the deal so secret is seen as proof for wrongdoingsisn't one of them.

As for economic illiteracy - you've unfairly tarred me there..... I actually think that his sale of Shitcorp was one of the things he had an absolute right to do. I have no problem with it, nor do I have a problem with him not paying tax on it. As an offshore entity, thaksin was legally avoiding taxes that didn't need to pay. Many companies, including the ones I work for minimise their thai tax liabilities through offshore vehicles.

but he changed laws to make it possible, thats clear a conflict of interests.

The problem is, not with me, it is with the electorate. Right or wrong, they viewed the sale of Shitcorp as 'selling the country'. That is the view of 99% of people you speak to (It will be the same with the Cambo deal).it is a different if any capitalist company is trying to avoid taxes or if it is the premier All this I found quite funny, as the catalyst for Thaksin losing his popularity back in 2006 was not all the things he did wrong, but the one thing he was perfectly within his rights to do.

As for all the other things you say (re loas etc..totally agree).

some small adds in red

[sriracha john]

Protesters flock to Bangkok for weekend rally

Supporters of the PAD, including members of state enterprise labour unions in other provinces, are heading for Bangkok to lay siege to Government House tomorrow to try to oust the Samak administration. Demonstrators from Nakhon Ratchasima left for Bangkok on private vehicles, buses and trains in groups of 10-20 to avoid being prevented from travel at police checkpoints set up to block people from joining tomorrow’s protest in Bangkok. More demonstrators will depart from Nakhon Ratchasima on five chartered buses today. If police obstruct them, they will get off the buses and blockade the Friendship highway, Sarapee Boonpratuchai, a leading PAD member in Nakhon Ratchasima said. More than 130 members of the Provincial Electricity Authority labour union in Chiang Mai and the EGAT labour union in Lampang travelled in private vehicles and regular passenger buses to avoid being stopped by police. From the South, PAD supporters in Songkhla were yesterday seeking a train ride to Bangkok. Supichet Suwanchatree, head of the southern labour union of the State Railway of Thailand, said railway staff would simply give a free ride if over 100 demonstrators showed up for a Bangkok-bound train because the union had already resolved to support the PAD’s rally. PM Samak declined to comment on PAD’s rally, saying it was not his business. Police spokesman MajGen Surapol Thuanthong vowed to block the PAD from moving to Government House. The police approach would start with negotiations then move to the use of water jets and tear gas if the protesters kept moving.

Continued here:

http://www.bangkokpost.com/breaking_news/b...s.php?id=128331

[sriracha john]

They're coming into Bangkok from all directions...

PAD Nationwide to Join Rally at Government House on Friday

The People's Alliance for Democracy affiliates all over the country prepare to join the PAD march on Friday to Government House, aimed at ousting the People Power Party government.

To oust the People Power Party-led government, which many claim is a shadow government for deposed Prime Minister Thaksin Shinawatra, the People's Alliance for Democracy supporters in provinces all over the country are preparing to join the rally-goers in Bangkok as they prepare to stage a mass-gathering in front of Government House.

Today, the Phuket PAD reveals that the group will arrive in Bangkok on Friday. The Thailand Watch Foundation members in Phuket are also joining the PAD.

Phuket PAD leader Nutjarong Ekpermsab says many PAD members have registered their names to enroll in the PAD rally in Bangkok along with at least 10 Phuket PAD leaders.

Two buses have been prepared to carry the Phuket PAD members to Bangkok and the first trip for the rally will begin tomorrow. Reporters reveal that the atmosphere at Phuket's Sapanhin Cape in the city district is crowded as many PAD members in the province gather to watch the ASTV news reports on the rally activities in Bangkok.

Meanwhile, many PAD members in Songkla's Hat Yai District continue to gather as members follow the ASTV news reports on the ongoing rally at Makawan Bridge.

Meanwhile, Loei National People's Assembly leader, Hinchanuan Asoktrakoon, reveals that many PAD members in Loei have already prepared for Friday's rally at Government House. The Loei NPA leader says the group is ready for the Friday rally, to oppose the PPP-led government and its role to free the ousted Thaksin government from its corruption penalty.

Hinchanuan states that many who are to join the Friday rally are preparing labels and the yellow clothing, used by the PAD to represent the group's unity.

- Thailand Outlook

[hammered]

'Arms moved to Bangkok' to create trouble, Interior Minister claims

BANGKOK, June 18 (TNA) - Thailand's Interior Minister Chalerm Yoobamrung said Wednesday that a large amount of weapons have been secretly taken into Bangkok aimed at "creating trouble later this week".

Chalerm said he was informed by an ex-army general that a portion of the weapons were now cached in the capital and would be used to create chaos.

Saying that the informant was reliable "because they were jailed together in 1981", Chalerm said, referring to the aftermatch of an unsuccessful coup attempt, the weapons are expected to be used by members and supporters of the anti-government People's Alliance for Democracy (PAD) who are holding a noisy demonstration in front the United Nations Economic and Social Commission for Asia and the Pacific (ESCAP, the UN's regional headquarters), demanding the ouster of Prime Minister Samak Sundaravej.

The PAD and its supporters are planning to move their rally to Government House where Samak officially works, on Friday. The activist group began its protest against the government nearly a month ago, charging Samak and his People Power Party a proxy of ousted premier Thaksin Shinawatra.

Chalerm said he was confident police could control the situation and that the PAD would not be able to create any disorder. He charged that the PAD had hired another 80 men well-trained in using weapons as guards, less that the 200 they had previously had for security.

While the PAD has marked this Friday as its 'D-Day', or deadline, to bring about the ouster of the coalition government, Chalerm said the demonstrators "game" needed much patience and the party which loses patience, or the energy to continue, will finish last.

Arms in the capital! Better beware of the armed sons of influential people. Maybe better to avoid going to a pub this weekend. Still there is always a nice little demo to keep one away from such dangerous places and dangerous young people.

[younghusband]

You're correct we're talking about different things.My point is just that I don't think the Pra Viharn issue has "legs" and that economic issues will be more instrumental in this government's downfall.

Incidentally your view of the "negotiations" involved in the alteration of Thai borders is misleading although has a sinilar drift to the hotchpotch of lies taught about history in Thai schools.Thailand or Siam was almost always on the back foot and reacting to the wishes of (and rivalry between) the great colonial powers.

Interesting you mention the border conflict with Laos in the late 1980's.You omit to mention the Thais got a very bloody nose from the Laos.Still one doesn't really expect military prowess from the army that has more generals per enlisted man than any other army in the world.

What on earth does the sale of Shin shares to Temasek have to do with this?It's only economic illiterates who would have a problem with this.There's an argument on the tax avoidance side- a weak one in my view- but that's another matter.

I think the Phra Viharn thing and the Shin sale are very related, as they both were/will be again the catalyst for solidifying the beginnings of a critical mass against the PPP/TRT party.

Just as the sale of shincorp did, the phra viharn thing will piss of the nationalists, and will stir the ire of not only the Bangkok lattee sippers who support the PAD, but also raise the eyebrows of rural folk who are PPP's biggest supporters. I share the view that it will be the economic issues are part of the reason for their eventual demise, but the government has within its power to water down, subsidise, or just plain cave into demands of people who are being hardest hit by high prices to shut them up.

On the other hand, the Phra Viharn thing is the first 'non-negotiable' as far as most of the Thai electorate are concerned - they won't like it and won't stand for it, and the longer the MOFA and the PM dither on this, the angrier everyone will be - not just the PAD. It will help bring about a faster end to this government than otherwise would be.

Which is why I said Thaksin hasn't learnt his lesson. The electorate let him get away with alot. There are a few things that they won't let him do, and a breach of national sovereignty (either real or perceived) isn't one of them.

As for economic illiteracy - you've unfairly tarred me there..... I actually think that his sale of Shitcorp was one of the things he had an absolute right to do. I have no problem with it, nor do I have a problem with him not paying tax on it. As an offshore entity, thaksin was legally avoiding taxes that didn't need to pay. Many companies, including the ones I work for minimise their thai tax liabilities through offshore vehicles.

The problem is, not with me, it is with the electorate. Right or wrong, they viewed the sale of Shitcorp as 'selling the country'. That is the view of 99% of people you speak to (It will be the same with the Cambo deal). All this I found quite funny, as the catalyst for Thaksin losing his popularity back in 2006 was not all the things he did wrong, but the one thing he was perfectly within his rights to do.

As for all the other things you say (re loas etc..totally agree).

Sorry if I interpreted your views on the Shin deal incorrectly.It's just that there was so much half informed little Thailander nonsense spouted about this transaction at the time,inspired by the very same anti-globalisation corporate monopolists who ended up supporting the feudalist coup.To some extent the lower middle class supporters of PAD, though in some cases with decent intentions, acted as a Thai counterpart of Lenin's "useful fools" ie a mass movement providing ballast for the inefficient Thai monopolists who loathe international competition.Anyway what's done is done and the the major international investors including the increasingly important Sovereign Wealth Funds simply ignore Thailand, not least because of the Temasek experience.Temasek investment in Shin would have been good for Thailand but the opportunity has passed in a welter of ersatz nationalism, lies and vested interests.

Of course Thaksin's move was politically inept and there is a debate to be had on the tax side (whatever the detail of the latter there is no easy glib answer).

[Plus]

anti-globalisation corporate monopolists who ended up supporting the feudalist coup

Who are these people? I can think of only Uncle Prachai, PAD had taken his money, but when elections came he flopped - no one supports his cause.

[samran]

Sorry if I interpreted your views on the Shin deal incorrectly.It's just that there was so much half informed little Thailander nonsense spouted about this transaction at the time,inspired by the very same anti-globalisation corporate monopolists who ended up supporting the feudalist coup.To some extent the lower middle class supporters of PAD, though in some cases with decent intentions, acted as a Thai counterpart of Lenin's "useful fools" ie a mass movement providing ballast for the inefficient Thai monopolists who loathe international competition.Anyway what's done is done and the the major international investors including the increasingly important Sovereign Wealth Funds simply ignore Thailand, not least because of the Temasek experience.Temasek investment in Shin would have been good for Thailand but the opportunity has passed in a welter of ersatz nationalism, lies and vested interests.

Of course Thaksin's move was politically inept and there is a debate to be had on the tax side (whatever the detail of the latter there is no easy glib answer).

No stress.

As I've actually said, I think we share many of the same views, especially with respect to economics. I'm pretty anti-establishment economically and pro-competition in many respects. I'm all for getting rid of monopolies.

As for foreign investment ignoring Thailand. At a superficial level I guess this is true. But dig deeper and I think the main reason many of these funds ignore Thailand is a combination of two things:

1) Firstly, 90% of Thai companies listed on the SET do a crap job in marketing themselves to investors. I regularly work with/am exposed to a couple of SET listed clients who aren't like that, and their ultimate levels of foreign ownership reach up to 60% through various methods. They are well on the radar of foriegn investors who have a plethora of investment options, and if the Thai companies don't go knocking on their door, then the investor isn't going to know about it. Additionally, their corporate communications are <deleted>....

2) Many of the players listed on the SET really shouldn't be listed. It seems a bit of a status symbol to be listed there. So there are quite literally a bunch of 'Somchai Rayong Brick production Public Company' equivalents on the SET, who's only operation is one tiny factory located in the Baan nok industrial zone. The small operation, combined with an illiquid float on the SET (due to the company founders still holding 95% of all shares) means that even if they were on the radar of a fund, they wouldn't want to invest given they can't enter and exit their investment easily without affectiing the price.

The list below gives you an idea of the SET companies that a foreign fund would be interested in. It isn't very extensive for the reasons I outline above.

http://content.members.fidelity.com/epropd...C%7C%7C,00.html

[hammered]

From TOC

Police once again played loud music over the speeches of PAD leaders. The PAD rally retaliated by playing loud music of their own. PAD leader Sondhi Limthongkul told the PAD supporters to stay calm.

Quite what that has to do with upholding the law in a democracy who knows. That the police have started to act in a way expected in an authoritarian police state rather than a democracy does not auger well for short term future.

[hammered]

POLITICAL TENSION

Govt House cordoned off

By The Nation

Published on June 19, 2008

PAD plans to over-run administration compound

Army chief General Anupong Paochinda and Police chief Patcharawat Wongsuwan held a tense meeting yesterday afternoon with Prime Minister Samak Sundaravej to devise a plan on how to prevent the People's Alliance for Democracy (PAD) from taking over the Government House compound tomorrow.

Following the meeting, Patcharawat said the police would only allow the PAD to hold its rally at the Makhawan Rangsan Bridge and would use all means possible to block the rally from moving to Government House tomorrow.

The police plan to bring in more than 3,000 officers to ensure security around Government House.

Police Lt-General Vichien-chote Sukchotirat, the Govern-ment House spokesman, issued a warning: "The PAD has committed itself to becoming either a coup-maker or a traitor," he said.

"The protesters can't besiege Government House, which is the symbol of democracy and of the administration. When they stage a coup, they have to take over Government House. If they are successful, we call it a coup or a reform. If not successful, we call it the act of a traitor.

From the Nation. Rest at: http://www.nationmultimedia.com/2008/06/19...es_30075931.php

The spokesperson seems to be quite unintelligible. Interesting that there used to be demos outside government house every year and that now they are suddenly off limits. Definitely a step in the wrong direction in a democratic society. I rememeber one that went on for ages and during which the Chuan Leekpai government managed to carry on functioning as well as the parliament, something that doesnt seem to happen these days.

Of course an invasion of government house would be a more serious matter but a peaceful demonstration not being allowed to demonstrate near the government in a new precedent for Thailand.

The movement of the police from being upholders of the law, which I guess includes the constitutional right to assemble and demonstrate peacefully, to a position of increasingly trying to undermine opponents of the government is a worrying development too.

The sides are lining up in as the lust for power comes to a head. It is a kind of shame that nobody is thinkiing of bigger issues as the world economy deteriorates, but I guess for some pure personal feud victories are far more important than what happens to the country.

[sriracha john]

and just to escalate things further... the mob of hired thugs are promising to come out on Friday... and are looking to take over the police force's area of responsibility....

Anti-PAD rally threatened if PAD beseiges Government House

People Power Party MP Pracha Prasopdee on Thursday threatened to mobilise a counter protest if the People's Alliance for Democracy goes ahead to beseige the seat of government Friday.

"Anti-PAD protesters will congregate at Sanam Luang to assess the situation should police fail to deter the PAD from moving to Government House," Pracha said.

- The Nation

[sriracha john]

but then again, perhaps the event won't even make it to Friday...

Chamlong Believes Police Will Try to Disperse PAD Tonight

At around 2 a.m. this morning key PAD leader Chamlong Srimuang revealed that police have cancelled the plan to disperse the supporters of the PAD who are scheduled to move their protest to Government House on Friday.

However Chamlong says he believes the police will try, once again, to disperse the protesters tonight before they are able to begin to gather and move to the Government House.

- Thailand Outlook (today)

[Moonrakers]

and just to escalate things further... the mob of hired thugs are promising to come out on Friday... and are looking to take over the police force's area of responsibility....

Anti-PAD rally threatened if PAD beseiges Government House

People Power Party MP Pracha Prasopdee on Thursday threatened to mobilise a counter protest if the People's Alliance for Democracy goes ahead to beseige the seat of government Friday.

"Anti-PAD protesters will congregate at Sanam Luang to assess the situation should police fail to deter the PAD from moving to Government House," Pracha said.

- The Nation

What a fuc*ing contradiction, so the PAD, or any anti government group are not allowed to protest but anything pro-government are encouraged to do so.

Also:

"The PAD has committed itself to becoming either a coup-maker or a traitor,"

At what point have the PAD committed themselves to this action??? Maybe they do have this intention, I don't really know, but they have not "committed" themselves to this until they try to do so.

I really do hope that somebody pulls Samak aside and "Has a word", otherwise I fear for the worst.

Edited June 19, 2008 by globalj

[hammered]

and just to escalate things further... the mob of hired thugs are promising to come out on Friday... and are looking to take over the police force's area of responsibility....

Anti-PAD rally threatened if PAD beseiges Government House

People Power Party MP Pracha Prasopdee on Thursday threatened to mobilise a counter protest if the People's Alliance for Democracy goes ahead to beseige the seat of government Friday.

"Anti-PAD protesters will congregate at Sanam Luang to assess the situation should police fail to deter the PAD from moving to Government House," Pracha said.

- The Nation

Dont worry Im sure the police are quite capable of denying the PAD their constitutional right to demonstrate. They are already trying to stop demonstatrtors reaching Bangkok and have tried to drown out speeches although God only knows what that has to do with police work.

The anti-PAD gang have the right to demonstrate but the police should be expected to give the same treatment to both sides and to keep them apart. It will be interesting to see if the police play music over the speeches of the anti-PAD demonstrators.

Police neutrality is looking very questionable right now

[hammered]

and just to escalate things further... the mob of hired thugs are promising to come out on Friday... and are looking to take over the police force's area of responsibility....

Anti-PAD rally threatened if PAD beseiges Government House

People Power Party MP Pracha Prasopdee on Thursday threatened to mobilise a counter protest if the People's Alliance for Democracy goes ahead to beseige the seat of government Friday.

"Anti-PAD protesters will congregate at Sanam Luang to assess the situation should police fail to deter the PAD from moving to Government House," Pracha said.

- The Nation

What a fuc*ing contradiction, so the PAD, or any anti government group are not allowed to protest but anything pro-government are encouraged to do so.

Also:

"The PAD has committed itself to becoming either a coup-maker or a traitor,"

At what point have the PAD committed themselves to this action??? Maybe they do have this intention, I don't really know, but they have not "committed" themselves to this until they try to do so.

I really do hope that somebody pulls Samak aside and "Has a word", otherwise I fear for the worst.

That final quote is pure politcal hetoric. One can only hope he is an ex-police officer and not speaking on behalf of the police because what he is saying is quite dangerous. Maybe he is just on drugs on the other hand.

[Tony Clifton]

As the police started buzzing around last night, it looked more serious around 2 a.m., Chamlong was sitting amongst the crowd with a microphone and kept reassuring everyone very calmly, even making jokes, everyone seemed very relaxed and not intimidated at all by the police activity going on behind them. He did insist thatno one resist or fight should they start arresting people. A sudden rain shower may have changed plans for the police or they are simply bluffing, I doubt they will take any action as the usual PPP-TRT method is to hire goons who can't be directly linked to anyone.

[Plus]

I really do hope that somebody pulls Samak aside and "Has a word", otherwise I fear for the worst.

There's a newbie on this board with one post only, but his contribution is quite fitting here.

"Sadly this is a beautiful country being run without any adult supervision".

At this point anyone capable of "having a word" has simply given up and the royal institution is not going to be involved either.

[h90]

As the police started buzzing around last night, it looked more serious around 2 a.m., Chamlong was sitting amongst the crowd with a microphone and kept reassuring everyone very calmly, even making jokes, everyone seemed very relaxed and not intimidated at all by the police activity going on behind them. He did insist thatno one resist or fight should they start arresting people. A sudden rain shower may have changed plans for the police or they are simply bluffing, I doubt they will take any action as the usual PPP-TRT method is to hire goons who can't be directly linked to anyone.

I have seen it. Chamlong told very direct, arrest without arrest warrant (spelling??) is illegal and everyone should make pictures of the officers.

If they come without uniform they will get some wood on their heads....

He also read a letter he got from the army.

Read about Chamlong in 1992 and his life on wikipedia. That guy is not silly, he has more brain than the complete government together.

[sriracha john]

Pro-Government Group Prepares for PAD Mass Rally on Friday

A pro-government group, under the leadership of a People Power Party MP, said the group is ready for the People's Alliance for Democracy rally tomorrow at Government House by setting up a counter rally.

The Mahaprachachon Group Leader and People Power Party MP, Pracha Prasobdee, stated in regard to the People's Alliance for Democracy rally set for tomorrow at Government House that Mahaprachachon is to stage a rally against the PAD.

Pracha claimed the PAD rally at Government House will cause trouble for the people. Regarding whether Mahaprachachon will stage the anti-PAD rally, Pracha said it depends on whether the police can handle the situation.

Pracha said Government House is a symbol that represents the image of the nation and national democracy. If the government cannot save Government House, it shows its lack of efficiency in continuing its administrative work.

Regarding the PAD preparing to use the shields with the image of His Majesty the King on them during the mass rally at Government House tomorrow, the Mahaprachachon Group Leader says this will instigate public anger. He said the Mahaprachachon will protect the Monarchy.

Pracha stated that now more people are voluntarily joining his team. He says Mahaprachon is not hoping for the situation to worsen, but the PAD continues to wreak havoc and if chaos does occur the PAD is, therefore, responsible for it.

Pracha said Mahaprachachon will petition a letter to the Revenue Department on Monday, asking for a check on the amount of financial support being donated from the public to ASTV and the Manager Group's Thaiday Dot Com Company.

- Thailand Outlook (today)

[seagull]

From TOC

Police once again played loud music over the speeches of PAD leaders. The PAD rally retaliated by playing loud music of their own. PAD leader Sondhi Limthongkul told the PAD supporters to stay calm.

Quite what that has to do with upholding the law in a democracy who knows. That the police have started to act in a way expected in an authoritarian police state rather than a democracy does not auger well for short term future.

In an authoritarian police state, the PAD would not have gotten past it's first day of protest.

[bubba]

I happened to notice that at around 6:30 PM, there were three large private tour buses pulling in to the Border Police HQ in Phaholyothin Road. If you have followed Thai history regarding coups and protests that turn violent, you may have noted that the Border Police are sometimes the ones called in to do...hmmm...some unsavoury work.

Might it be the the BP are being mobilised for action tonight?

[sriracha john]

The ominous tone from the government increases...

Samak promises no use of military

A day before the People's Alliance for Democracy (PAD) plans a show of force, Prime Minister Samak Sundaravej vowed the government would not use military force against protesters.

He made no such promise about police, however.

The PAD has planned to stage a mass rally at parliament on Friday. Police said they would not allow them to approach Government House or parliament.

http://www.bangkokpost.com/breaking_news/b...s.php?id=128355

[Moonrakers]

I don't know what worries me more, Samak saying that he WILL use the military, or promising NOT to use the military, .

[sriracha john]

Thailand heads for another political showdown

Bangkok - On Friday the People's Alliance for Democracy (PAD) will march on Government House to force the resignation of Prime Minister Samak Sundaravej and his cabinet, who have been running the country for less than six months.

There promises to be thousands of peaceful protestors, long speeches, tents set up opposite Government House to protect people from the monsoon rains, food deliveries from unknown backers and, no doubt, a long wait before anything happens. The scene is all too familiar for Bangkokians.

The PAD, a loose coalition of disparate groups united only in their hatred for former premier Thaksin Shinawatra, staged almost daily protests in the capital for much of 2006 until the tanks rolled on to the streets on September 19, ending the political impasse.

Twenty-one months after Thaksin's political downfall and six months after a general election brought the pro-Thaksin People Power Party (PPP) to power, coup rumours are rife again.

"I think the PAD's backing goes very high up and involves military elements, because otherwise they would not be so rabid,' opined Thitinan Pongsudhirak, a political analyst at Thailand's prestigious Chulalongkorn University.

Although the military ousted Thaksin, they could not prevent the proxy PPP from winning the December 23, 2007, general election, and putting in place a 'nominee' cabinet of Thaksin allies.

The PAD returned to the streets on May 25 shortly after the current government began to push for constitutional amendments that are likely to lead to the dismissal of about 16 corruption cases against Thaksin, a billionaire telecommunications tycoon who was prime minister between 2001 to 2006.

The military justified their September coup with charges that Thaksin has been involved in mass corruption, undermined the monarchy and divided the nation.

So far, only the last charge has stuck.

Thaksin, who was banned from entering politics for five years by a constitutional tribunal ruling a year ago, continues to be at the heart of Thailand's political divide.

Although he holds no political post, the hand of Thaksin is seen in whatever the current 'nominee' cabinet does.

For instance, the government's decision this week to support Cambodia in its bid to nominate Preah Vihear, a centuries old Hindu temple on the Thai-Cambodia border as a World Heritage Site, has been seen as part of a sinister business deal, typical of the Thaksin era.

It doesn't help matters that Thai Foreign Minister Noppodon Patama is Thaksin's former lawyer and one day after he disclosed the country's support for Cambodia's Preah Vihear bid, Thaksin announced plans to build a casino-hotel complex on Koh Kong, an island off Cambodia's western coast bordering Thailand.

Pheah Vihear is a sensitive issue for most Thais. The magnificent Hindu temple was the source of a border dispute in the 1950s that ended up in the Hague's International Court. The court decided the temple belonged to Cambodia.

Thailand opposed Cambodia's proposal to list Preah Vihear temple at UNESCO last year on the grounds that the Cambodian site map included still disputed territory.

Cambodia submitted a new map last month, which Noppodon approved this week, paving the way for the temple's lisitng at a UNESCO meeting on July 2, and providing a publicity boost for Cambodian Prime Minister Hun Sen's party in a general election scheduled on July 27.

"It looks like Thailand decided to help Mr Hun Sen in the elections," said Kraisak Choonhavan, a member of the Democrat opposition party.

"The government's way of handling this has created the suspicion that personal gains are more important than national gains," added Kraisak.

That was one of the main complaints against Thaksin's two-term premiership, which increasingly looked like a runaway private gravy train.

Pent up outrage against Thaksin's self-serving government style finally exploded in January 23, 2006, when his family sold their 49 per cent equity in the Thaksin-founded Shin Corp conglomerate to Singapore's Temasek Holding for a tax-free 2 billion dollars.

That gave the PAD the ammunition they needed to mount a a popular anti-Thaksin campaign that finally led to the 2006 coup. Now the PAD is back on the streets for similar reasons.

"I think the Thaksin overhang has been constant," said Thitinan. "This government is not to be trusted, and Thaksin exacerbates that."

Increasingly, with or without a coup, observers are saying that the only long-term solution for the political divide caused by Thaksin is to get Thaksin out of politics for good.

"The only solution is if a court case can quickly come out with a sentence that Thaksin is guilty, then politically he would be out," said Kraisak.

Unfortunately, Thailand's judicial system is notoriously slow and certain elements may not be able to wait for the courts.

- DPA / 19-06-08

[sriracha john]

Police to close all roads leading to Government House this evening

Police on Thursday issued a statement warning motorists to avoid roads surrounding the Government House starting this evening in order to brace for the Friday's protest organised by the People's Alliance for Democracy.

The five roads are Phitsanulok, Ratchasima, Rama V, Sri Ayutthaya and Rajdamnoen Nok. Police will set up road blocks to check vehicles passing the seat of government.

Police said the roads closure was deemed necessary because the PAD might move up its march to this evening from tomorrow at 1 pm.

They also repeated that anti-riot forces were under strict instruction to repel protesters and not to allow the PAD to beseige the Government House.

- The Nation

===========================================================================

Government House officials to take Friday off in light of protest

The security office of Government House on Thursday sent out a circular asking officials to take a day off tomorrow so as not to interfere with security preparations to brace for the besiege by the People's Alliance for Democracy.

All units located within Government House were instructed to order non-essential staff to stay at home and for those reporting to work, not to park vehicles in the compound.

- The Nation

[sriracha john]

NHRC calls on government not to use force against demonstrators

The National Human Rights Commission (NHRC) requested the government not to use force to disperse a demonstration.

Saneh Chamarik also called on demonstrators to rally peacefully without the use of weapons, adding that the government should not use force with them as they have the right and liberty to stage a demonstration in line with the Constitution and the international human rights standards.

Regarding the issue of Preah Vihear, Saneh says the government did not inform people of the matter enough and it decided on the matter without asking for the parliament’s consent as required by Article 190 of the Constitution.

He also suggested that the government should clarify all issues which affect people and the environment to the public.

- ThaiNews (today)