Mood Stabilizers

[deejah]

looking for suggestions and leads

on natural or pharmaceutical elements

to assist in the process of stabilizing mood swings and depression

and/or to aid in establishing balance and order neurologically due to giving up a number of bad habits

already undertaking regular exercise, good diet, supplements and meditation

but man its tough going

this probably should be 2 posts but what they hey

i trust people in this thread are more gentle compassionate and caring than in the general topics thread

please bear that in mind

[JSixpack]

looking for suggestions and leads

on natural or pharmaceutical elements

to assist in the process of stabilizing mood swings and depression

You've come to the right country. Waste no time on hocus-pocus: go direct for Thai generic Prozac (Fluoxetine hydrochloride) OTC at any pharmacy, dirt cheap! Safe & non-addictive; nobody claims it's perfect, but hasn't it already helped 54 million people?

Edited March 16, 2008 by JSixpack

[gunnyd]

looking for suggestions and leads

on natural or pharmaceutical elements

to assist in the process of stabilizing mood swings and depression

and/or to aid in establishing balance and order neurologically due to giving up a number of bad habits

already undertaking regular exercise, good diet, supplements and meditation

but man its tough going

this probably should be 2 posts but what they hey

i trust people in this thread are more gentle compassionate and caring than in the general topics thread

please bear that in mind

There are many nurses that post on this forum. If you could give us more information on your current condition, any medical diagnosis's you have recieved and were being treated for and what your treatment or lifestyle activities that you are looking to detox from.

That way we won't be making uneducated guesses

[mrtoad]

looking for suggestions and leads

on natural or pharmaceutical elements

to assist in the process of stabilizing mood swings and depression

You've come to the right country. Waste no time on hocus-pocus: go direct for Thai generic Prozac (Fluoxetine hydrochloride) OTC at any pharmacy, dirt cheap! Safe & non-addictive; nobody claims it's perfect, but hasn't it already helped 54 million people?

There's a big difference between a mood stabaliser and an anti- depressant. I'd suggest that the OP posts a few more details first regarding what diagnosis he or she exactly has, before suggesting something like Prozac. There is, as Gunnyd has suggested a number of nurses on the forum who have trained in different areas of nursing, howeever there is not going to be any sensisible suggestions that can be given without a few more details.

[Sheryl]

As others have mentioned, mood stabilizers and anti-depressants are different things. The conditions which require them also differ, i.e. depressive disorder as opposed to bipolar. And then there are anxiety disorders, which are yet different still. What effectively treats one condition can make the other condition worse.

To further complicate matters, the diagnosis of bipolar disorder is not always staight foward and it does not always come in the classic "manic-depressive"form, there are other form,s which can easily be mistaken for depression or anxiety. And both depression and anxiety disorders can take other than the "classic"forms.

I think the best thing for you to do would be to get some therapy (see the pinned notice at the top of this forum on sources) and, once you have had found a therapist you are comfortable with and that therapist has had enough time to get a sense for you, ask him/her what type of medication might be indicated. They may be able to recommend something right off the bat that you can buy over the counter, or they may advise you to consult a psychiatrist.

You could also consult a psychiatrist to start with, in which case either Samitivej or Bangkok Hospital may be a good place to look, but you'll need to use your own judgement in deciding if they asked enough questions and spent enough time to realy know what you need. Frankly, a therapits, even though usually not a physician, is more likely to have an accurate understanding since they get top know the pastient much better; also there is the cultural aspect to consider as all the pyschiatrists I knopw of are Thai whereas Western therapists can be found. It's not that Thais can't be good mental health professionals, just that any mental health professional can more easily read clues and signs in someone from a similiar cultural background.

If despite the foregoing you decide to self-medicate, please be very careful. Anti-deprerssents (such as Prozac, altho that one would not be my first choice) can trigger episodes of mania in people who are bi-polar....altho they can literally be life-saving in people with pur depression. Hence the need for a proper diagnosis.

Also, if you are recently coming off drugs and/or alcohol, these take soime time to clear the system and those details need to be known by anyone advising you regarding medication. Otherwiuse there is a risk of dangerous interactions. And, if you have previously used drugs or drunk heavily, it would be advisable to check your liver function before starting on medications which in most cases need to be metabolized in the liver.

Hang in there and good luck. I think that you will feel much, much better once you have talked with a supportive therapist. This is a lot to try to handle all on your own.

[JSixpack]

looking for suggestions and leads

on natural or pharmaceutical elements

to assist in the process of stabilizing mood swings and depression

You've come to the right country. Waste no time on hocus-pocus: go direct for Thai generic Prozac (Fluoxetine hydrochloride) OTC at any pharmacy, dirt cheap! Safe & non-addictive; nobody claims it's perfect, but hasn't it already helped 54 million people?

There's a big difference between a mood stabaliser and an anti- depressant. I'd suggest that the OP posts a few more details first regarding what diagnosis he or she exactly has, before suggesting something like Prozac. There is, as Gunnyd has suggested a number of nurses on the forum who have trained in different areas of nursing, howeever there is not going to be any sensisible suggestions that can be given without a few more details.

Sorry, I had responded yesterday morning but my post never made it through.

Well, you will note that Sheryl did not wait for further details from the OP.

To summarize, I stand by my initial advice and I don’t see anything in Sheryl’s post that contradicts it. The OP can try the Prozac and monitor her condition over a few months for improvement. Maybe nothing more will be needed, if she’s lucky. If insufficient improvement or worsening or undesirable side-effect, she can try mood stabilizers also or switch to something else. The advantage of Prozac is that it’s dirt cheap, OTC, proven, non-addictive, relatively harmless, and a wealth of information (notably, contraindications and side effects) about it is available on the ‘net, which the OP can study.

I also observed that for professional advice the OP really should see a psychiatrist but that doing so obviously will cost, and the prescribed inevitably non-generic meds will be expensive as well. Typically those of us living in LOS are on a limited budget and that is often a reason we seek advice in forums; and such advice may range from very good to mere quackery, like chelation therapy and dental amalgam removal. I noted that it would be good to have a current list of recommended psychiatrists (in the way that we have list of recommended plastic surgeons, if you read through the threads).

I also observed that counseling is a possibility and gave the link to mental health resources here at TV:

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=90910

However, I don’t have much faith in counselors for depression or mood swings as I believe (along w/ many medical professionals, which I’m not) that they are due to chemical imbalance. “Better Living Through Chemistry” I say, and have known old friends (literally old—gettin’ old is no fun, really, no matter what spin you want to make on it) back home who’ve done quite well on Prozac alone. But every case is of course different. Good luck to the OP.

[BigSnake]

Relax there are many things in LOS that can enchance ones Mood, a good Massage for a start with lots of Herbs, with can be found at most 4 star hotels and else where. Price range Bt800-2500.

[deejah]

update

first of thanks all for your input

its been well over a month

eliminated many bad habits

the cravings are easier to handle

good diet and exercise program

the moods have stabilized

well at least the highs and lows swinging

but kind of stuck in a low

something is not right in the body

went for general blood tests

urine and stool too at a local clinic run by a friend

i sent the urine and stool to 2 separate labs to see if they were consistent with each other

of course they were not

went to the hospital and saw my doctor friend

got another urine test!

most all of the tests came back negative or inconclusive

i suspect i have a kidney or internal organ issue

i am touchy and irritable easy aggravated and annoyed

i have a strange uncomfortable sensation smack dab in the middle of my gut, comes and goes

my lower back / kidney area hurts a bit

sometimes one side sometimes both

i looked into kidney flush and cleansing on the Internet

there are many different programs to choose from

i know this is not much to go on

but i am open to anyone in the same boat or

helpful advice

or a good simple plan to clean out the kidneys and/or other organs

i suspect stones or build up and lower ability to discharge toxins

so i will pick a plan, do a flush/cleanse, and if no improvement back to the hospital for more and different tests

[deejah]

it is also possible i had a urinary tract infection that migrated to my kidneys

not sure how to check or detect this

any ideas?

thanks

[Sheryl]

If you had pyelonephritis (kidney infection) you would have fever and generally be quite ill.

What do you mean by saying the urine and stool tests were "inconclusive"? Inconclusive how/for what?

I think you should start by getting a proper physical check-up (complete package) rather than peice-meal tests through friends.

If the physical shows no serious health problem, then you might indeed benefiot from a detox/cleanse program. Personnally recommend Health Oasis on Koh Samui, google their site. But do get a proper physical before going to be sure there is no serious disease present.

[deejah]

you ask an excellent question

the answer may be enlightening to some

one stool test (and not on the other stool test) came back with

blastocystis hominis

(and then it said something like vollicualted form,

not sure, will check when i get back to town)

after a few hours of research all i could come up with is that this 'parasite' might be an indication of another problem or parasite

it is inconclusive in and of itself

the doctor told me to not eat solid foods and it could be from dried pork and beef that i eat

any ideas?

[Sheryl]

Blastocystis is a common protozoa often found in human stool, including in people who are without any sign of disease. Consequently there is a lot of uncertainty as to whether it in itself can cause disease or whether it is just an incidental finding.

As mentioned, I think you would do best to have a thorough physical exam. Among other things, if you have previously been abusing drugs or alcohol, your liver function needs to be checked.

If you get a clean bill of health then a detox/fast program might be just the thing.

[deejah]

thanks sheryl

who / where would be the best place in Bangkok or lopburi to get a full check up?

every doctor i ever saw in Thailand says something different

therefore i trust my professional friends to care a bit more than a stranger

according to my blood, if i trust the lab results, my liver function is fine

i can check the name of the labs i used at a later date for feedback on quality

now completely free of alcohol, caffeine, sugar, pills, medicines, etc....

since i trust myself More than anyone or any lab,

did some research and did a 24 hour watermelon fast yesterday for the kidneys and to get myself started on cleansing and further detox

with plenty of water

the effect was overall better health

constipation totally gone

just a bit of red excrement (from watermelon no doubt, not a blood red) with a few white and black seeds

for anyone who hasn't fasted in a while

what an amazing experience

besides the headache and a bit tired yesterday

still felt a bit bloated and uncomfortable

i still suspect parasites

partly because i feel fine if i don't eat

then when i do, it hurts a bit, or it feels like something moving around inside of me

or occasional nausea in the a.m., something i never had

sooooooooo:

today i ate only pumpkin seeds

then added raw garlic and carrots and later will eat some onions and vinegar

this is a cleanse for possible parasites

[mrtoad]

looking for suggestions and leads

on natural or pharmaceutical elements

to assist in the process of stabilizing mood swings and depression

You've come to the right country. Waste no time on hocus-pocus: go direct for Thai generic Prozac (Fluoxetine hydrochloride) OTC at any pharmacy, dirt cheap! Safe & non-addictive; nobody claims it's perfect, but hasn't it already helped 54 million people?

There's a big difference between a mood stabaliser and an anti- depressant. I'd suggest that the OP posts a few more details first regarding what diagnosis he or she exactly has, before suggesting something like Prozac. There is, as Gunnyd has suggested a number of nurses on the forum who have trained in different areas of nursing, howeever there is not going to be any sensisible suggestions that can be given without a few more details.

Sorry, I had responded yesterday morning but my post never made it through.

Well, you will note that Sheryl did not wait for further details from the OP.

To summarize, I stand by my initial advice and I don’t see anything in Sheryl’s post that contradicts it. The OP can try the Prozac and monitor her condition over a few months for improvement. Maybe nothing more will be needed, if she’s lucky. If insufficient improvement or worsening or undesirable side-effect, she can try mood stabilizers also or switch to something else. The advantage of Prozac is that it’s dirt cheap, OTC, proven, non-addictive, relatively harmless, and a wealth of information (notably, contraindications and side effects) about it is available on the ‘net, which the OP can study.

I also observed that for professional advice the OP really should see a psychiatrist but that doing so obviously will cost, and the prescribed inevitably non-generic meds will be expensive as well. Typically those of us living in LOS are on a limited budget and that is often a reason we seek advice in forums; and such advice may range from very good to mere quackery, like chelation therapy and dental amalgam removal. I noted that it would be good to have a current list of recommended psychiatrists (in the way that we have list of recommended plastic surgeons, if you read through the threads).

I also observed that counseling is a possibility and gave the link to mental health resources here at TV:

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=90910

However, I don’t have much faith in counselors for depression or mood swings as I believe (along w/ many medical professionals, which I’m not) that they are due to chemical imbalance. “Better Living Through Chemistry” I say, and have known old friends (literally old—gettin’ old is no fun, really, no matter what spin you want to make on it) back home who’ve done quite well on Prozac alone. But every case is of course different. Good luck to the OP.

I'm sorry, I'm going to have to disagree on your post. Having worked as a a CPN/CNS in Mental health field for 15 years, I think that to take your advice is very foolish. Any drug regime does need to be monitored, and a proper assesment needs to be carried our before commencing any drug therapy in this field. There are a number of options available, but until the OP provides further details, which he has but again only through a forum, there is nothing to suggest that the information that he has obtained so far, should mean the commencement of Prozac. The words "proper assesment" are crucial in this thread.

As for your suggestion that counselleors do not have much impact in this field, that is total and ntter nonsense. It is a pretty wide held belief within my field that a mixture of "therapy" and "chemical" as you put it can be very effective. You never put your eggs in one basket, when dealing with such.

[JSixpack]

I'm sorry, I'm going to have to disagree on your post.

If you read my post carefully you will find that you don't really disagree as much as you want to think that you do. Anyway the OP now seems to be making progress.

[mrtoad]

I'm sorry, I'm going to have to disagree on your post.

If you read my post carefully you will find that you don't really disagree as much as you want to think that you do. Anyway the OP now seems to be making progress.

Which is the main thing

BTW, I do agree that there does need to be some reccomendations regarding Psych doctors, as if anyone can remeber the problems Simon43 had with his wife it was pretty apparent that there was a lot of imcompetence in the assesment and diagnosis by a number of doctors initially.

[geriatrickid]

To build on Mr. Toad's sensible position, I strongly suggest that one attempt to identify the organic factors if any are involved. This necessitates being very specific in one's information given to the consulting physician. One needs to go in with a list of all symptoms and perhaps a typical day's activities to help with the diagnosis. Perhaps a weeks worth. Note when the symptoms occurred and the events or time period. I admit to being prejudiced in that I see things as organic or behavioural.

I am leery of antidepressants as they can lead to general lethargy which in turn can exacerbate the underlying condition. For example I find that when I am down, exercise jolts me back into the land of the semi sane. However, antidepressants can rob you of a desire to go out and do something so you end up vegetating and getting fat etc. My emphasis on being patient and doing the metabolic and chemical analysis first is that the root cause can often be as something mundane as a hormone imbalance or organ disruption. Too many physicians are way too quick to toss out pills because that's what patients expect, especially here. You owe it to yourself to invest the time to see what's there. If the consulting professional doesn't want to give the time to consider a proper history and diary then get another professional. Having a medical diploma means nothing without the experience and disposition to accompany it. Most importantly, don't stress over this. All of us get these situations and the body with proper nutrition and exercise adapts. However, that works best once you get that important medical consult from people with experience.

[ilyushin]

Bag of grass is what you probably need.

[Sheryl]

thanks sheryl

who / where would be the best place in Bangkok or lopburi to get a full check up?

I prefer Samitivej Hospital (Soi 49 Sukhumvit) Wellness Center, ask for Dr. Phuchai as the doctor, if he's not there then Dr. Anchana, both are very thorough. There are a number of packages to select, and it is possible to add on specific tests to them if needed. You don't need an appointment but do need to fast completely from midnight the night before.

Usually one selects the package and has the lab tests etc first then meets the doctor to review the results. In your case tho I would suggest you ask to talk to the doctor to decide what additional tests might be indicated based on your symptoms.

Good luck

[geriatrickid]

Bag of grass is what you probably need.

Subject presenting is human, not a cat. Although a bit of grass does clean out my cat's tummy, I do not think the subject indicated a digestive tract disorder.

[Neeranam]

Relax there are many things in LOS that can enchance ones Mood, a good Massage for a start with lots of Herbs, with can be found at most 4 star hotels and else where. Price range Bt800-2500.

If I wanted I ccould get a 'special' massage near my house for 300 baht!

A 2 hour massage costs between 200 and 800 baht in Khon Kaen