Ups - Uninterruptible Power Supply

[Tywais]

Tywais, out of those 100 computers you are running, how many have a PSU with Active PFC and what brand are they? I'd usually expect to find PSUs with APFC in computers built for gaming and/or low noise rather than in a business environment.

I'm responsible for writing up the specs and approving the orders for all PCs. I specify all the internal components, mainboard, cpu, memory type, video, etc. Then send for a quotation request letting the company decide on the case and power supply. I have to work with budget constraints and as such the majority of cases and power supplies are generic. Surprisingly, the percentage of PSU failures is fairly small considering the majority are either Thai made or Taiwanese. However, for my servers I'm more picky and will use CoolerMaster PSes with active PFC. But even with these I don't use pure-sine UPSes.

[Greenside]

However, for my servers I'm more picky and will use CoolerMaster PSes with active PFC. But even with these I don't use pure-sine UPSes.

Help! I feel like I shot myself in the foot...

I included the Asus PSU in the spec when having this computer assembled as I understood it was worth moving above the generic units that the vendors here chuck in with the case as often as not. Now I get the impression that I may have let myself in for a needlessly over priced and highly specced UPS to keep it running when all I really want to avoid is losing the shot I'm editing at the time the power fails rather than running mission critical enterprise level servers.

Tywais, does the statement above mean that active PFC doesn't require a pure-sine UPS? I'm confused

By the way, looking at the APC device at http://www.apc.com/resource/include/techsp...ase_sku=SUA750I as Crossy kindly suggested, made me remember that someone told me that the APC power outputs on the back are non standard sockets - they look like female "kettle plugs" to me.

[jeffer]

I had a long period of frustration trying to work out why none of my UPS would work with an Enermax PSU. It didn't matter what brand or size UPS we used, whenever we pulled the plug the result would be a series of rapid clicks followed by a beep and then the computer would reboot. No one could come up with an answer until someone decided to take it and test it at an office that used a couple of very expensive Power King UPS models for their servers (TSW). It worked fine. Later we found on the Enermax website that you need to use a true sine wave UPS with their APFC power supplies. I've heard this may no longer be the case with the latest models but reading what Greenside wrote, his experience sounded exactly like what happened to us, and we tried a lot of other things besides to try and get things working. Ended up buying a new cheaper PSU and it worked with our UPS as soon as we hooked it up.

From what I can tell no one ever mentions anything about problems using some of these good quality power supplies with a UPS in any review because most of the reviews are from the US or countries where it's rare to have power failures, certainly not like the daily ones you get in many parts of Thailand so it's a non issue for most people. People might use a surge protector but not many use a UPS for a home computer when their power might fail only once a year. When I searched for information I kept finding that people would say it should work but that they only used a UPS for their computer at work and invariably they would be ones with TSW (usually the APC Smart series) because a business is prepared to spend the extra money it costs to have such a UPS. Even in Thailand, how many people use even a simple UPS for their home computer? I've seen very few despite the dozens on sale in some of the big IT shops. A business will use them but home users here don't seem to bother.

To answer your question about if you need a true sine wave UPS then it's hard to find a definitive answer. Tywais says his Coolermaster models work so it's not a problem for all PFC power supplies. Try what I suggested and see if you can get things to work with a different UPS. You should be able to plug in a fully charged UPS to a computer and have it work as soon as you test it so if you can't with a different brand then I think you need to look at what I'm suggesting as the reason why. Asus have a forum so try posting there and see what you can find out. Asus may not even make their own PSUs, could be rebranded like some companies do, I don't know.

The APC plugs will not be a problem. At worst you might have to buy a couple of plug adaptors cosing 20 baht.

If anyone wants to buy an Enermax 400w modular PSU in very good condition for 2000 baht then let me know because it's back sitting in the original carton as it's no use to me when it can only work with a UPS that costs almost as much as my computer

Edited March 30, 2008 by jeffer

[Greenside]

I had a long period of frustration trying to work out why none of my UPS would work with an Enermax PSU. It didn't matter what brand or size UPS we used, whenever we pulled the plug the result would be a series of rapid clicks followed by a beep and then the computer would reboot. No one could come up with an answer until someone decided to take it and test it at an office that used a couple of very expensive Power King UPS models for their servers (TSW). It worked fine. Later we found on the Enermax website that you need to use a true sine wave UPS with their APFC power supplies. I've heard this may no longer be the case with the latest models but reading what Greenside wrote, his experience sounded exactly like what happened to us, and we tried a lot of other things besides to try and get things working. Ended up buying a new cheaper PSU and it worked with our UPS as soon as we hooked it up.

From what I can tell no one ever mentions anything about problems using some of these good quality power supplies with a UPS in any review because most of the reviews are from the US or countries where it's rare to have power failures, certainly not like the daily ones you get in many parts of Thailand so it's a non issue for most people. People might use a surge protector but not many use a UPS for a home computer when their power might fail only once a year. When I searched for information I kept finding that people would say it should work but that they only used a UPS for their computer at work and invariably they would be ones with TSW (usually the APC Smart series) because a business is prepared to spend the extra money it costs to have such a UPS. Even in Thailand, how many people use even a simple UPS for their home computer? I've seen very few despite the dozens on sale in some of the big IT shops. A business will use them but home users here don't seem to bother.

To answer your question about if you need a true sine wave UPS then it's hard to find a definitive answer. Tywais says his Coolermaster models work so it's not a problem for all PFC power supplies. Try what I suggested and see if you can get things to work with a different UPS. You should be able to plug in a fully charged UPS to a computer and have it work as soon as you test it so if you can't with a different brand then I think you need to look at what I'm suggesting as the reason why. Asus have a forum so try posting there and see what you can find out. Asus may not even make their own PSUs, could be rebranded like some companies do, I don't know.

The APC plugs will not be a problem. At worst you might have to buy a couple of plug adaptors cosing 20 baht.

If anyone wants to buy an Enermax 400w modular PSU in very good condition for 2000 baht then let me know because it's back sitting in the original carton as it's no use to me when it can only work with a UPS that costs almost as much as my computer

As you say, it sounds like we have the same issue. I'll just have to do some more experiments and will post again if I find a UPS that will work. In the meantime I'll just have to stick with the surge protector power strips and save my work every couple of minutes

[CosmicSurfer]

All the APC Smart series are true sine (AFAIK), however you will be paying a premium for something I don't feel is necessary unless you are running Enterprise class servers and network boxes. The vast majority of PC PSUs will not have problems with stepped sine wave (the cheaper UPSes use filtered square waves and would steer clear of them). Reason is that the PC PSU is switched mode and will not really see the difference. Actually I just went through the design process for an inverter for a fuelcell project at work and used the fundamentals of UPSes for it.

Yes, there are some PSUs that will not work correctly with stepped sine wave, but I would put that as rare. I am running over 100 computers with non-pure sine UPSes and never an issue.

What the %&*# is a PSU ????

CS

[Tywais]

What the %&*# is a PSU ????

Power Supply Unit.

[jfchandler]

GGGRRRR!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I went for months in my new home in BKK/Sukhumvit without the power going out.... good deal...

Now in the past month, the power's gone out, without advance notice, at least a half dozen times...usually right when I'm in the middle of writing something for TV... It began with a construction accident on my soi that left the whole street dark for a day...then has continued lately with periodic blip outs..just long enough to kill my work... before the power comes back in a few seconds...

Some of it may be due to the weather...rain and lightning... But I think it's more due to continuing project construction on my soi and the electric folks trying to finish the long-term repairs from the original problem, that I think they quick fixed at the time just to get power back to everyone...

I don't have a UPS now, and never needed one in the U.S. So, I guess I'll be looking at the Powercom UPS 800VA ..I saw it for about $79 U.S., and the APC Back Pro AVR 500, which I see online for $116... All I want is something to cushion my Dell Pentium (350 watt power supply) and 19-in. LCD monitor from getting zapped, either from momentary outages or longer ones, giving me a chance to do an orderly power down...

On a related question, I'm running my PC and monitor from the U.S. now on a 1000 watt voltage regulator/converter that takes the Thai 220 power and converts it to 110 U.S. power for my machines. The monitor and the PC and some other things (U.S. speakers and printer) are all plugged into a master power base that's plugged into the regulator/converter. The master power base allows each device to have its power individually turned on or off.

Question is: my monitor has a 110/220 power adapter box, and my Dell PC has a voltage switch on the back of the power supply that allows selection between 110 or 220.... Is there any reason I cannot/should not plug those units directly into surge protected Thai 220 power. I didn't want to do it when I first got here, fearing I might fry something!!!

[croftrobin]

The monitor will work fine plugged into the Thai Mains or a Thai sourced UPS. So will the PC but before you plug your Dell PC in you will have to flick the switch to 220.

Question is: my monitor has a 110/220 power adapter box, and my Dell PC has a voltage switch on the back of the power supply that allows selection between 110 or 220.... Is there any reason I cannot/should not plug those units directly into surge protected Thai 220 power. I didn't want to do it when I first got here, fearing I might fry something!!!

[Thanh-BKK]

I had a long period of frustration trying to work out why none of my UPS would work with an Enermax PSU. It didn't matter what brand or size UPS we used, whenever we pulled the plug the result would be a series of rapid clicks followed by a beep and then the computer would reboot.

If anyone wants to buy an Enermax 400w modular PSU in very good condition for 2000 baht then let me know because it's back sitting in the original carton as it's no use to me when it can only work with a UPS that costs almost as much as my computer

Hello

I second that. I'm using a 450 watts Enermax and it, too, wouldn't work with two UPS i tried, one of which was a brand new (but cheap) one.

However i now have a Leonics 750 VA (around 3.500 Baht) and with that it works excellent, the UPS is now around... errm..... one year or so old and the machine (plus monitor and ADSL router-modem) keep running for little over 20 minutes before the warning comes on (fast beeps). I have to ad that the monitor is an Acer 19" LCD and the computer isn't too high powered - single core AMD Sempron 2800+ @1.800 MHz, 2 GB RAM, 2 HDD's.

Anyway do you stay in Bangkok, if so, where? I'm interested in that Enermax. Is it the model with the two fans/golden grilles? I'm in Bangna near BITEC, if you are not too far we can do business, i can always use a spare Enermax.

Best regards.....

THanh

[jeffer]

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[Thanh-BKK]

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Hi

Got it and replied

Thanh