How Much Is Enough?

[kerrybill]

Perhaps someone out there can reassure me that my two year old grandson can be cared for with the material things of life. The emotional side, one can only hope that his mother and her family will love him as much as we do here in Australia. We will do all we can from afar and there is an open invitation for the boy and his mother to visit. At present she has a multi entry visa and he has his Australian passport. His Father hopes to always be part of his life but has been threatened with the usual " you will never see him again"

My son has tried for 2 years to to live with his little family,not in Thailand as his work has been in the Philippines and China but it has been unsuccessful. His Thai partner has been unable to cope away from Thailand and has been both physically and verbally aggressive seemingly to stem from extreme jealousy. They have had wonderful apartments,cars, domestic help and she had a allowance which she has always sent home, plus anything she wanted for herself and the baby.

Relunctantly he has said no more and because he loves his son very much his former partner ( they never married) has been given $10,000 (Aus) to improve her family home, in a village 2 hours north of Bangkok, to make it more comfortable for the little boy and financial support of $400 (Aus) a month.

Can they live comfortably on this? My son is aware that the money will be used for "other " things and isn't worried about this as he feels it is like a donation to Oxfam.He has been sent progress pictures of the building improvement in progress.

[khunandy]

Very sad to hear this but it is very common. I think that is a generous amount and applaud him for offering long term support. I wouldn.t expect the kids life to be any different to any other child in his environment and it may drive your son a bit crazy wondering if the child is actually benefitting from the money sent.

I hope it works out for all involved.

People tend to forget about the impact these events have on the Grandparents in all societies.

[JacknDanny]

Perhaps someone out there can reassure me that my two year old grandson can be cared for with the material things of life. The emotional side, one can only hope that his mother and her family will love him as much as we do here in Australia. We will do all we can from afar and there is an open invitation for the boy and his mother to visit. At present she has a multi entry visa and he has his Australian passport. His Father hopes to always be part of his life but has been threatened with the usual " you will never see him again"

My son has tried for 2 years to to live with his little family,not in Thailand as his work has been in the Philippines and China but it has been unsuccessful. His Thai partner has been unable to cope away from Thailand and has been both physically and verbally aggressive seemingly to stem from extreme jealousy. They have had wonderful apartments,cars, domestic help and she had a allowance which she has always sent home, plus anything she wanted for herself and the baby.

Relunctantly he has said no more and because he loves his son very much his former partner ( they never married) has been given $10,000 (Aus) to improve her family home, in a village 2 hours north of Bangkok, to make it more comfortable for the little boy and financial support of $400 (Aus) a month.

Can they live comfortably on this? My son is aware that the money will be used for "other " things and isn't worried about this as he feels it is like a donation to Oxfam.He has been sent progress pictures of the building improvement in progress.

I had a similar situation with my son when he was 2.

Problem with his mother, couldnt live together. When we decided to split up, I was told in no uncertain terms that she was going to take custody of my son, and if I didnt agree, I would never see him again.

Being in Thailand, I was sceptical of my rights, but I did not nor could I give up. I fought for my son, got myself a very good lawyer and within a few months I had gained sole custody of my son and his mother lost any parental right.

He is now almost 7, we are still happily here in Bangkok. I could not have allowed her to take him, simply because I know that she would not have been able to look after him and give him the start to life that I am able to.Plus I could not bear to be away from him.

So if it is not too late I would urge your son to do something, so at least he is recognised in Thai law to have some parental right, otherwise it would not surprise me if your ex daughter in law makes up all sorts of crap such as desertion etc etc, and he could be prevented from ever seeing his son.

[kerrybill]

Perhaps someone out there can reassure me that my two year old grandson can be cared for with the material things of life. The emotional side, one can only hope that his mother and her family will love him as much as we do here in Australia. We will do all we can from afar and there is an open invitation for the boy and his mother to visit. At present she has a multi entry visa and he has his Australian passport. His Father hopes to always be part of his life but has been threatened with the usual " you will never see him again"

My son has tried for 2 years to to live with his little family,not in Thailand as his work has been in the Philippines and China but it has been unsuccessful. His Thai partner has been unable to cope away from Thailand and has been both physically and verbally aggressive seemingly to stem from extreme jealousy. They have had wonderful apartments,cars, domestic help and she had a allowance which she has always sent home, plus anything she wanted for herself and the baby.

Relunctantly he has said no more and because he loves his son very much his former partner ( they never married) has been given $10,000 (Aus) to improve her family home, in a village 2 hours north of Bangkok, to make it more comfortable for the little boy and financial support of $400 (Aus) a month.

Can they live comfortably on this? My son is aware that the money will be used for "other " things and isn't worried about this as he feels it is like a donation to Oxfam.He has been sent progress pictures of the building improvement in progress.

I had a similar situation with my son when he was 2.

Problem with his mother, couldnt live together. When we decided to split up, I was told in no uncertain terms that she was going to take custody of my son, and if I didnt agree, I would never see him again.

Being in Thailand, I was sceptical of my rights, but I did not nor could I give up. I fought for my son, got myself a very good lawyer and within a few months I had gained sole custody of my son and his mother lost any parental right.

He is now almost 7, we are still happily here in Bangkok. I could not have allowed her to take him, simply because I know that she would not have been able to look after him and give him the start to life that I am able to.Plus I could not bear to be away from him.

So if it is not too late I would urge your son to do something, so at least he is recognised in Thai law to have some parental right, otherwise it would not surprise me if your ex daughter in law makes up all sorts of crap such as desertion etc etc, and he could be prevented from ever seeing his son.

[kerrybill]

Thanks for taking the time to answer. My son is in China at present but should be in Bangkok in three months so I will pass on your reply and hopefully he will act on your suggestion. How does he find English speaking the legal help proficient in family law?

[Boo]

Your embassy should have a list of lawyers they recommend.

[torrenova]

What does or did the mother do ? What is her background ? May I infer that if the $10k which equates to about Bt300k makes such a difference then her family is not well off ?

Well, to be blunt, you can't leave the kid with her. If the father is not part of the growing up process then you have to look whether the welfare of the baby would be better served if the child was under the supervision of the father.

Growing up in what I believe is a village setting with some ramshackle housing, little education, getting bitten by stray dogs and possibly missing out on routine injections, dental care and any english language input will leave the child severely disadvantaged.

Sending the equivalent of Bt12,000 home per month would be enough to take care of the mother and the baby in some comfort but as you already know, it will most likely be misappropriated for other things. Once school fees kick in are you talking local Thai school or something more appropriate ?

I suspect you already know the answers and all you want is someone to reassure you. If you want the best for the baby then it will be difficult to achieve that in Thailand if they are not together. Now the Phillipines and China are not the best destinations for a Thai woman or indeed anyone (apologies to residents of those countries) so perhaps your son should consider moving somewhere which is more suitable for the whole family. Is Australia not an option, even if he has to work away for some brief periods ?

Other options are more drastic but the needs of the child must come first.

[khunandy]

Just a thought but is there any chance that they can give the relationship another go with his wife and son remaining in Thailand?

Some people are just not able to function outside of their own environment. Working in China myself I cannot really see a Thai lady living here.

Another more drastic alternative would be to plan a snatch and run, the child has an Aussie passport after all.

If she is a black hearted women I imagine she may be prepared to fight tooth and nail for the "meal ticket" the son has become.

[Heng]

"Enough" is relative. Yes, if it's well managed, and no if the kid doesn't see a cent. For my niece and nephew whom I've taken responsibility for, I don't give the dead beat (well, maybe just underachieving) parents a satang. I do pay their school tuition directly though and will continue to do so at least up through an undergrad degree and perhaps one masters degree. They'll also get a relatively low value (under 3,, Baht) shophouse which doesn't get transferred to them unless we deem them responsible enough to handle it. I figure that's as good a pushoff as any, and certainly better than the one I got.

That two countries issue does complicate things though. If I were the dad, I'd find a way to move to Thailand so that I could monitor and affect my child's development.

[GuestHouse]

Before discussing money, I'd be inclined to look at the other life issues your grandson has ahead of him.

The life he will have is not so much related to the money your son gives over but is far more dependent upon the family values he is being raised in.

What for example is the educational background of the mother? What life choices has the child's mother made in the past? And are these jelously issues just that, or are they a part and parcel of other emotional problems? These questions are also valid of the mother's wider family since it is almost certain that your grandchild will be raised by his extended maternal family and hence grow up with their values aspirations and life options.

If the answers to those questions are not satisfactory, then I think your son has some hard choices to make - He might decide to attempt to gain custody of the child, and you (his extended family) ought to advise him on that.

But I fear that he has already set the scene for the way things are going to be - While you are discussing what is a reasonable maintenance payment, and as others have said your son has been generous, the fact is that his generosity is also a positive reinforcement of the economic lesson that the child is a key to his father's wallet.

I'm not sure how he came to the agreement to pay a lump sum and monthly maintenance payments, but I think if those have been made without any formal agreement for access to the child and preconditions on things like the education of the child then your son, I'm sorry to say, has been very badly advised.