Quick Visa Question

[galwaygirl]

some of you might remember me for the question regarding getting a work visa to volunteer. well i achieved the unachievable and found a NGO that could provide me with a letter to get into the country and legally work. very happy now!

small question though, i'l be in thailand for a month and say, ten days volunteering. then i'l be going to cambodia for a week with a mate and after that returning to thailand for another 10 days until i fly to Hong Kong. As an irish citizen i dont need a visa for visits under 29 days so after going to cambodia i wont need a new visa to get back into thailand will i? could they assume i'l be working again (which i wont be, i'l be heading to the islands to bum it on the beach) and not let me enter without a new work visa?

this might be a silly question but i dont want to leave anything to chance!

[sriracha john]

Don't get too excited just yet. Getting the visa that makes you eligible to work as a volunteer here is only half way through the requirements.

PRIOR to working as a volunteer, you'll need a work permit to be processed and approved through the Labor Ministry.

There's no such thing as a "work visa".

[galwaygirl]

Don't get too excited just yet. Getting the visa that makes you eligible to work as a volunteer here is only half way through the requirements.

PRIOR to working as a volunteer, you'll need a work permit to be processed and approved through the Labor Ministry.

There's no such thing as a "work visa".

sorry my bad i looked up the correct name on the site its called a Non-immigration Visa?

Looked it up. so labour ministry? weird i was talking to my country's consulate and they didnt mention this.

[sriracha john]

Don't get too excited just yet. Getting the visa that makes you eligible to work as a volunteer here is only half way through the requirements.

PRIOR to working as a volunteer, you'll need a work permit to be processed and approved through the Labor Ministry.

There's no such thing as a "work visa".

sorry my bad i looked up the correct name on the site its called a Non-immigration Visa?

Looked it up. so labour ministry? weird i was talking to my country's consulate and they didnt mention this.

Strange as it may seem, depending on the country and the consulate, it's not unusual that a foreigner working at the consulate and who's never been here to Thailand would be unfamiliar with the local requirements.

You're on the right track with a non-imm. visa, however, so it's a start.

Discuss with the NGO if they are willing to sponsor and pay for your work permit. Most likely, they won't...and it will necessitate you paying for it and doing much of the running around government offices, once here, to obtain it. It is, however, crucial to be legal to have it completed first BEFORE you begin working.

As you can imagine, volunteerism here is no easy task. It's a shame things are that way....but they are.

Edited April 25, 2008 by sriracha john

[galwaygirl]

any cost to the charity i'l cover myself. they're pretty up right when it comes to legal stuff so i'l send an email now to see whats the story regarding this.

Edited April 25, 2008 by galwaygirl

[jstumbo]

How long does it take to get a work permit processed? Won't she have to be in Thailand to apply for it? If she is coming and plans on only volunteering for a month, most of that would probably be used up before she even gets the work permit? Maybe you should plan on your trip to the islands when you first get here, then you can be relaxing while they are processing your work permit.

[sriracha john]

Good luck to you, galwaygirl... I hope you are able to process this all through.

Please keep us updated to your progress. It's rare to hear of success stories.

[galwaygirl]

no, i wont be able to go to the islands first as my friend is arriving in late june to go with me down there. shes a few years younger then me and she wouldnt be willing to spend a month alone in a different country. she's already bought her ticket so that isnt really a option (shes not very flexible). Can i not get the ball rolling while here or can the charity?

*sigh* every time i think i've it sorted theres something else to arrange. no wonder everyone goes over illegally to volunteer. i wont do that but i can very well understand why they do it. ok, just so i know, IF i can somehow get this permission off the labour ministry, then what? do i need to do anything else?

[galwaygirl]

ok doesnt look like i can get a work permit. say i hold this non-i visa but dont work as its illegal. can i still travel around thailand with it? would i get asked for my work permit even though i wouldnt have worked? say on leaving thailand to go to cambodia?

also if i go to cambodia for a week can i re-enter thailand for under 29 days without another visa or extention??

[jstumbo]

You could get a tourist visa instead. It would be good for 60 days. You could get a re-entry permit at immigration (1000 baht) while in Thailand that would allow you to leave the country and come back in to continue your existing entry made with your visa. You can even get these at the airport, so you could get it when you first arrive it you want and then you would not need to worry. Or you could see about a double entry tourist visa. Then you would not have to worry about the re-entry permit and the cost probably is not too much more.

Edited April 26, 2008 by jstumbo

[Maestro]

galwaygirl, you will be perfectly free to use your multiple-entry non-immigrant visa to enter Thailand as often as you like during the period of its validity even if you do not apply for and get a work permit in Thailand. There is no legal or regulatory requirement that a person arriving on a non-B visa must then get a work permit. In fact, I have seen posts of several ThaiVisa members saying that they are in Thailand on a non-B visa but have no work-permit.

--

Maestro

[sriracha john]

ok doesnt look like i can get a work permit. say i hold this non-i visa but dont work as its illegal. can i still travel around thailand with it? would i get asked for my work permit even though i wouldnt have worked? say on leaving thailand to go to cambodia?

also if i go to cambodia for a week can i re-enter thailand for under 29 days without another visa or extention??

Thanks for the update, galwaygirl. As you might imagine, I wasn't surprised to hear the NGO wasn't able to sponsor your WP and I'm sorry you've learned of Thailand's inane rules on giving freely of oneself to others. It staggered me, as well, when I first learned of it myself, as I was complete unaware of these imperceivable and unimaginable rules...but upon learning of them, I stopped volunteering... much to my chagrin.

As for your visa... if you're not going to be working, it's not necessary for you to get the non-immigrant visa. However, you may still want it after figuring the cost benefit versus that of a double-entry tourist visa.

If you're only going to be coming in twice for those time periods described earlier, the tourist visa would be more frugal. If you're going to potentially be in and out several times, the multi-entry non-imm. would be less expensive.

Anyway, sorry to hear of your disappointment. You're not alone.

Enjoy your time here with your friends and help out informally and limitedly when the opportunity occurs.

[jstumbo]

In fact, I have seen posts of several ThaiVisa members saying that they are in Thailand on a non-B visa but have no work-permit.

--

Maestro

I am in that group. I come in and out of Thailand to do business. Buying products from two different factories.

[jstumbo]

You could get a tourist visa instead. It would be good for 60 days. You could get a re-entry permit at immigration (1000 baht) while in Thailand that would allow you to leave the country and come back in to continue your existing entry made with your visa. You can even get these at the airport, so you could get it when you first arrive it you want and then you would not need to worry. Or you could see about a double entry tourist visa. Then you would not have to worry about the re-entry permit and the cost probably is not too much more.

I want to revise my comment. If you will only be staying for a couple of weeks after going to cambodia, then you would only need a single entry tourist visa. You could enter on it, then leave and go to cambodia. No re-entry permit required because you would get 30 days at the border when coming back from cambodia. Just make sure to have your ticket with you that you are using to leave thailand in case they want to see it when you are re-entering thailand after your trip to cambodia.

Of course if you are now not going to be here that long volunteering, and you only need to stay for a couple of weeks, you will not need any visa at all. You would be able to enter Thailand for 30 days without any visa at all. Just need to make sure that you have a ticket leaving thailand before the 30 days are up.

[galwaygirl]

well i've already applied for a non-i visa so i might as well use that. since i'l only be leaving the country and coming back once i think i mightn't bother getting a muli entry non-i visa, my consulate told me i couldnt get one anyway. since i'l only be in thailand for like 10 days max on my second trip in theres no point messing around with visas.

still tempted to volunteer without a wp. i know i shouldnt but i'l be really remote and rural and i dont think i'd get caught. i'm not sure what to do.

my flights booked so i dont have the option of cutting my trip short due to a number of factors. if i dont volunteer i'l be by myself without a purpose for month.

Edited April 27, 2008 by galwaygirl

[Maestro]

Let’s take a practical approach to this. Let’s not say that you are not doing volunteer work. Instead, let’s say you are visiting friends or acquaintances. You may even be visiting them almost every day for a month, because you like them a lot and they like you. During these visits, you also talk to other persons who are there. You are not doing manual labour, eg building a house or some such thing. Therefore, even if worse should come to worst, you are not working, you are visiting people. You are not doing anything illegal. That's one way of looking at it.

--

Maestro

[sriracha john]

[galwaygirl]

would they really put me in prison? i mean i know i could get deported and fined and would but i assumed prison was reserved for more serious offences like working, earning a wage and not giving the government any tax or something. oh i dont know what to do, im quite scared.

[sriracha john]

Working without a work permit is illegal in Thailand. Wake-up before you end-up in the Immigration Detention Center

However you cut it, work is work, including voluntary work.

Thanks for your responses.

What happens if you get caught?  Fine / deportation / prison / blacklisted for return to thailand?

If you get caught you may well have all four you mention thrown at you

I believe the prison term can be up to 3 years for the offense.

Edited April 28, 2008 by sriracha john

[sriracha john]

Additional referencing...

The penalty for working without a valid work permit in Thailand is basically the same as for overstay:

Jail, fine, deportation and possibly blacklisted from entering the Kingdom again. Read this info: http://www.thaivisa.com/303.0.html

I repeat, there are NO exceptions. All foreigners need a valid work permit. About 200 western foreigners per year are deported for illegal work. (Plus some 50,000++ migrant illegal workers from Burma, Cambodia, Laos etc., but that's another story...)

Edited April 28, 2008 by sriracha john

[sriracha john]

My memory served me correctly... Three years it is...

From the Phukette Gazette:

Tsunami volunteers warned: get work permits

PHUKET: Foreign volunteers assisting in tsunami-related charity work are required to hold work permits, regardless of whether they are being paid for their efforts or not.

Sayan Chuaiyjan, Head of the Phuket Provincial Employment Service Office [ESO], told the Gazette yesterday that there could be no exceptions and that his office would begin to enforce the regulations soon.

“There can be no exceptions. Work is work, even if it is for charity,” he said.

He pointed out that any foreigner caught working with out a work permit is liable to hefty punishment.

“If our officers, police officers or immigration police learn [of foreign volunteers] who don’t have work permits, the maximum penalty is three years in jail, a 30,000 baht fine [or both],” he warned.

[lopburi3]

Do not believe anyone is going to jail more than a few days for charity work; during legal proceedings prior to deportation if arrested. The chance for arrest is extremely small in these type of cases. The Thai do not enforce rules with a blind eye and go out of there way to avoid pleasantries. But any time you disobey the laws you are at risk, be it Thailand or any other country.