New Beginning

[Tom Kagai]

I'm a 43 British guy who wants to live and work in Thailand. I've spent a long time reading your forum along with ajarn.com and it's all been unbelievably helpful. However, as each case is individual to an extent, i'd really like to outline my particular scenario and see what your opinion is of my best course of action.

I have been holidaying in Thailand for several years and quite simply love the place when compared to day to day life in the UK. I have no ties in the UK and i'm considering selling my property and seeking work legally in Bangkok (initially). I would like to add a TEFL to my degree and work over there as an English teacher.

When i reach 50 i would like to apply for a retirement visa and support myself on the equity that i have from the property sale plus earnings at that time. BUT in the meantime, is this what i should do (assuming that my house is sold and i am ready to go for it!):

1) Apply for a multiple entry non-imm. visa prior to leaving UK.

2) Immediately look for work in a school that will support a work permit application.

3) With a work permit obtained, revert to a non-im. 'B' visa.

4) Take it one year at a time until i turn 50, then apply for the retirement visa.

I know this may come across as a very simplistic plan, but i want to make sure that i'm not going to goof big-time before swotting up on the specifics of each step. The thing is, once i sell my house, I can't see me being able to come back, nor can i think why i would want to!

All tips are very much appreciated, as is the site!

Cheers.

[dr_Pat_Pong]

When you are ready, apply for a multi entry non-immigrant visa at RTC Hull. Good luck.

[lopburi3]

You do need to crunch the numbers as you may have a lot of years ahead of you after an age 50 retirement so make sure you can keep up. Costs here are still relatively low for most things but how long will that last? Do you have other retirement income other than house sale/investment? Can you meet the retirement conditions in the future (we don't know what they will be). Would you be better working a few more years in the UK? When you say no ties in UK does this include no family? Remember medical costs here. And I would really advise having an escape plan for at least the first year as living here is not quite the same as vacation here.

If you are sure your 4 steps sound reasonable.

[Tom Kagai]

You do need to crunch the numbers as you may have a lot of years ahead of you after an age 50 retirement so make sure you can keep up. Costs here are still relatively low for most things but how long will that last? Do you have other retirement income other than house sale/investment? Can you meet the retirement conditions in the future (we don't know what they will be). Would you be better working a few more years in the UK? When you say no ties in UK does this include no family? Remember medical costs here. And I would really advise having an escape plan for at least the first year as living here is not quite the same as vacation here.

If you are sure your 4 steps sound reasonable.

Firstly, THANKS. You've straight away summarised what's keeping me awake at night!

I've so far crunched the numbers that i found in ajarn.com (3 monthly budgets of working teachers) and i think i can make it work. In that climate, and with that diet, there is the danger that i'll live to 102 though!

Costs are low and i would hope that day to day costs can't go wild for the sake of 98% of the population. I worry more about the specifics applicable to ex-pats.

Other income - I've contributed to a company run pension for 20 years. It's got to be looked into when I close up here.

More years in the UK? - Right now, I don't think I can hack it (and i've got a reasonable income!) The pound is very strong, but will weaken as we're now having to import oil. Property prices are at an all time high which says to me 'now's the time to cut and run'. I'm 6 yrs & 3 months off 50, I might JUST be able to stay that long, but they'll be miserable years.

I have 2 retired parents who are enjoying life, and like any loving parents they want me to do the same.

Medical Costs - A tuk tuk driver went way too fast with me onboard once. He piled into the side of a car and we both needed painkillers, x-rays and dressings etc. It cost me $24 and the care was far superior to anything available in the UK. The taxi that took me to hospital, refused to accept a fare. God, I love that place and (most) of it's people!

I know life won't be the same as a vacation but i don't stagger from bar to bar even when holidaying. In fact it was really encouraging to learn that i'll need to take my shirts and ties over to be 'ajarn dee'.

You indicated that i have the right plan, and gave me lots more food for thought. I can't thank you enough.

[lopburi3]

You will probably want (am sure parents would like) to visit on a regular basis so allow for that expense.

As for teachers budget remember that most of them are much younger than you, may have other "primary interests" and probably are not as "middle class". Those numbers may be below what you find comfortable.

Good luck but consider carefully.

[astral]

I've so far crunched the numbers that i found in ajarn.com (3 monthly budgets of working teachers) and i think i can make it work.

Costs are low and i would hope that day to day costs can't go wild for the sake of 98% of the population. I worry more about the specifics applicable to ex-pats.

More years in the UK? - Right now, I don't think I can hack it (and i've got a reasonable income!) The pound is very strong, but will weaken as we're now having to import oil. Property prices are at an all time high which says to me 'now's the time to cut and run'.

I have 2 retired parents who are enjoying life, and like any loving parents they want me to do the same.

Your own words, which I have italicised, suggest that it will not work for you.

You will also have to consider what happens if you parents are taken ill,

or one dies and the other cannot cope alone.......

I know the dilemma's as I have had to face them myself.

I don't know what work you do, but can you continue on a part-time or contract basis?

Living here in LOS and working overseas for a few months a year.

Probably better money that slaving as an English teacher here!!

I would not sell a house in the UK, rent it out, give you a steady income in addition

to everything else.

Don't worry about the pound diving, I am sure the baht will be there below it..........

Edited October 18, 2004 by astral

[kenkannif]

Go for it mate! You'll never know if you don't try! I was down to my last 500 Quid when I signed up for a TEFL course and started work. I'm now doing pretty well!

I know hundreds of teachers here, some can hack it and are here long term, some can't and go home! But surely it's better to get it out of your system rather than always thinking of what could have been!

TiT, where there's a will there's a way! You'll be okay if you want to do it and you commit yourself and work hard at doing it!

My parents visit me every year and if I needed to fly home (some schools pay a return flight for you each year) they'd either help me, or I'd borrow from the school and pay it back on my return. Teaching's not easy, but I'd far, far, far rather be here in Thailand earning so so wages, than being in England earning megabucks!

Astral's idea of renting out your house is a good one indeed!

Go for it!

Edited October 18, 2004 by kenkannif

[alanw]

As already mentioned - give it a try.

But do be aware that (already mentioned) living here it absolutely not like a holiday here.

In fact many schools have on-going problems with teachers who can't make up their minds whether they are here to work or here to holiday, which results in too many late nights, lack of preparation, lack of focus, absenteeism, etc.

I know several who have made the transition very well, and I know several who have become very angry when they realized that Thailand was not the vision of paradise and utopia which they had cunjured up on holiday visits. But of course Utopia doesn't exist.

I know one guy who prepared himself for many years (studied TEFL plus several other English language teaching qualifications, also studied and achieved an advanced level of Thai language). He lasted about 6 months, then a group of friends, realizing that the guy was about to have a nervous breakdown and that his growoig and strong anger was about to get him into some very serious trouble, gave him an ultimatum : either you buy a ticket and go home next week, or we (group of friends) will pool some money, buy you a ticket and take you to the airport.

He bought the ticket and was gone within a few days. He's never been back.

Give it a try.

[Tom Kagai]

Well, you've all been really helpful and given me much more than i was looking for. I only wrote in to make sure that, as a novice, i was understanding the way current visa procedures work and which fitted my scenario the best.

Out of interest though:

How variable has the retirement criteria been in subsequent years? (Astral)

Do some schools really offer an annual return air fare to see the folks? (Kenkannif)

(That seems incredibly generous)

Why Hull for the multi-entry non im.? I'll of course take your advice without question but is it because they are they more generous with granting them? (Dr P)

More generally, I really do know the difference between work & play (vacation). As long as there's a bit of time for both, we'll be fine won't we.

UK Property :

It is a great idea to rent out, not sell and it was my first consideration. But the UK's gone banana's in the last decade. i.e. Rent received would only just cover the outstanding mortgage yet, property values have gone up so much, that selling would release A LOT of equity (It's resale value is 3 times what i bought it for!)

(ALANW) - I was sorry to hear the story of your friends near-breakdown. If he was so out of cash that you had to fund his return, he can't have been aware of the need for an 'escape plan'. Can't believe he was so dedicated when preparing for work that he overlooked the fact that he may have to go home someday.

Once again, i'm very grateful to you all for sharing your experience & time.

[kenkannif]

Well not many of them give return flights to be honest, but it seems to me more and more are. But you'll need a degree and most likely a TEFL and possibly a little bit of experience to get in with them.

Hull are very easy to obtain Visas from is the reason Dr. PP is saying you should use them!

Edited October 19, 2004 by kenkannif

[alanw]

srh,

Note your observant and correct comment about the need for an escape plan / funds for same etc., and I should correct the impresion I've given in my previous post.

In fact the guy concerned is absolutely not short of a dollar.

The reason for the friends giving the option of 'we'll buy the ticket and take you to the airport' was to try to force him to take some action and leave, and nothing at all to do with his ability to pay for the ticket.

Said friends (including one doctor of medicine) were all very concerned that:

- The guy was about to either 'crash' mentally, or

- Would get himself into a serious police situation (the guy concerned has an impressive academic background and also has a quick and pretty savage temper, and several nasty incidents had already happened - driven by his anger and his perceived need to 'punish' Thais)

But I should also quickly say that this was an extreme case.

Again, why not give it a try.

[bkk_mike]

UK Property :

It is a great idea to rent out, not sell and it was my first consideration. But the UK's gone banana's in the last decade. i.e. Rent received would only just cover the outstanding mortgage yet, property values have gone up so much, that selling would release A LOT of equity (It's resale value is 3 times what i bought it for!)

Instead of selling - you could release some of the equity by doing a remortgage. (At 46 you should be able to get a 19 year mortgage still, which might even result in lower repayments if you've had the house for a while). - Just make sure the repayments are less than the rent you can get on it.

If you're in a good area for rentals, some agents may even guarantee a rent for you... - which you could use to work out how much to remortgage for. (and would get rid of the worry around the place possibly being empty and having to find the money for the mortgage yourself).

If things are going well - you can still sell the house in a couple of years time (or hold onto it - to add to your "pension" at 65).

That way, you have a way back into the UK if needed, while still releasing some equity to finance the move.