Mexican Dancers

[Nordlys]

EOS 5D, EF24-105mm F4L IS, with Speedlite 430EX

1/5 sec, F5.0, ISO 400/500

in San Diego, Caifornia

Edited June 1, 2008 by Nordlys

[The Vulcan]

I wondered when we were going to see some shots from your recent trip!

Nice technique with the slow shutter fill-in. I guess No:2 is my favourite. Produces a very nice sense of action and atmosphere.

Well done old friend - are we to see some more?

[Nordlys]

Nice technique with the slow shutter fill-in.

Thanks for the compliment. Part of the reason for the slow shutter is not just to create the sense of action but because I can never get the white balance right without available light when using external flash, especially in a situation where there's no surface to reflect the strobe light but to face the flash directly to the subject (in this situation the glass roof ceiling of the hall is too high). It has never been an issue with film photography or compact digital but for some reason, with dSLR. I never use P mode when using flash with EOS 5D but manual exposure with shutter speed usually slower than 1/30.

Well done old friend - are we to see some more?

I do have my favorite photos from the trip but a lot of them have my wife in it, and mostly from places that are of sentimetal value to me and don't appeal too much to the general public. Many others are just nice post card quality photos that are neither creative nor dramatic... I have a feeling myself you are withholding some of your best shots from sharing with us.

One more...

Edited June 2, 2008 by Nordlys

[The Vulcan]

I can never get the white balance right without available light when using external flash, especially in a situation where there's no surface to reflect the strobe light but to face the flash directly to the subject (in this situation the glass roof ceiling of the hall is too high). It has never been an issue with film photography or compact digital but for some reason, with dSLR. I never use P mode when using flash with EOS 5D but manual exposure with shutter speed usually slower than 1/30.

Lost me on this one! If you're shooting RAW (and I hope you always do!) the issue of correct white balance, and indeed all other post processing matters, are attended to at a latter stage surely? Do you mean the balance of fill-in?

[Nordlys]

I can never get the white balance right without available light when using external flash, especially in a situation where there's no surface to reflect the strobe light but to face the flash directly to the subject (in this situation the glass roof ceiling of the hall is too high). It has never been an issue with film photography or compact digital but for some reason, with dSLR. I never use P mode when using flash with EOS 5D but manual exposure with shutter speed usually slower than 1/30.

Lost me on this one! If you're shooting RAW (and I hope you always do!) the issue of correct white balance, and indeed all other post processing matters, are attended to at a latter stage surely? Do you mean the balance of fill-in?

Yes, I only shoot RAW as you know and I often have problem correcting the white balance in the post procees using my RAW processing software when flash is employed (I'm not using Adobe Lightroom but free version of SilkyPix Deverlop Studio 3.0).

Edited June 2, 2008 by Nordlys

[The Vulcan]

I can never get the white balance right without available light when using external flash, especially in a situation where there's no surface to reflect the strobe light but to face the flash directly to the subject (in this situation the glass roof ceiling of the hall is too high). It has never been an issue with film photography or compact digital but for some reason, with dSLR. I never use P mode when using flash with EOS 5D but manual exposure with shutter speed usually slower than 1/30.

Lost me on this one! If you're shooting RAW (and I hope you always do!) the issue of correct white balance, and indeed all other post processing matters, are attended to at a latter stage surely? Do you mean the balance of fill-in?

Yes, I only shoot RAW as you know and I often have problem correcting the white balance in the post procees using my RAW processing software when flash is employed (I'm not using Adobe Lightroom but free version of SilkyPix Deverlop Studio 3.0).

2 things here I notice - 430 EX and Silkypix.

I've used the 430EX in the past and found it somewhat sub-standard. I currently use the 508 EX 11 which is quite simply superior. Married with a Stofen diffuser I can control the flash exactly to my likings.

Here's a shot (non artistic intent) from my 5D with 17-40 L@17, 580EX11 and Stofen diffuser. The flash gun was tilted at 60 degrees. Program mode and 1/200th@F8. I reduced the flash output by 1/3rd of a stop and also under exposed by 1/3rd of a stop. Metered from the exterior and FEB from the control panel.

I was intrigued to see how much I could control the flash in the glass bubble of the helicopter cockpit. You'll see no evidence of flash reflection in the shot, despite tons of glass and reflective objects. The balance with the outdoor light is accurate. The colour adjustment is to my taste from my Lightroom pre-sets.

On the bigger version I can read every single dial with absolute clarity due to the flash coverage

Silkypix is just not Lightroom. As a basic RAW processor it's ok but it just does not have the flexibility of Lightroom. Lash out and get lightroom and I'll send you all of my pre-sets (about 80 in total) - (if you want them!)

Edited June 2, 2008 by The Vulcan

[Nordlys]

I do have the Lightroom. I just haven't been able to install it as I only have 5GB of free HDD space left in my MBP. Either I have to replace the HDD or get a new iMac.

Is 580EX that good? I replaced 420EX with 430EX, thought it's the old generation E-TTL of 420EX that didn't quite support the newer 5D but the new flash released at the same time as 5D (430EX) didn't solve the problem. I would consider 580EX if it solves my flash woe but frankly I find it too expensive for a flash and too big for my camera bag.

That helicopter cockpit photo is a really nice one. Yes, no ugly glare and fill in flash makes it look really natural. But it's not so much of an issue with 430EX when there's so much available light. But it gets a lot more difficult when it's really dark and the flash is about the only source of lighting for 5D, with no wall or ceiling to reflect flash light for diffusion. That's when I can never really adjust the white balance right in the the RAW to JPEG conversion process.

Edited June 2, 2008 by Nordlys

[The Vulcan]

Why not consider an external H/D to your MBP? I've just acquired a 320GB for 3600 baht!

The 580 EX11 is truly THAT good. Yes, it's big , heavy and expensive and some say an overkill, but imho worth every dime. Built in diffuser, catch light panel and a Stofen diffuser to clip on. Dial in adjustments in 1/3rd increments etc etc.

BUT, it is NOT the answer to colour correction/white balance problem. Your problem here seems to lie in your post processing. Lightroom and it's many tutorials should help here.

However, I see you also refer to "pure flash" (i.e. not just fill-in) and difficulties you are experiencing in this area. AGAIN, the flash source is NOT the colour control source! The correct white balance is NOT a factor in a RAW file. Providing you've lit the scene/subject correctly (the 580 will do this) then ALL the subsequent white balance, colour correction etc is done in post processing.

Lightroom and CS2/3 may well be the answer

http://www.luminous-landscape.com/tutorials/workflow1.shtml

Hope this helps

[Nordlys]

I do have external hard disks, one of them 1TB. But shouldn't most softwares including Lightroom be installed on local disk? Or did you mean to say get a external HDD, install Mac OS and Lightroom on external HDD? That might work, but the speed will be compromised and I need to get a new packaged Mac OS, as the OS that came with the MBP can't be installed on HDD other than the machine that came with it (I believe).

I'll consider getting 580EX2. I think the weight shouldn't matter so much because most of its weight is attributed to the batteries, but I might have to give up the idea if I have to change my camera bag to accommodate 580EX2. Besides, as I already have 430EX, it should make a nice combination for master - slave configured multi lighting system.

Thanks for the tips.

[The Vulcan]

Attention potential 580EX11 owner!

Link that you may find of interest.

http://www.usa.canon.com/dlc/controller?ac...p;articleID=946

[Nordlys]

Bought it.

with LightSphere diffuser...

Can't tell much difference from 430EX2 from initial trial test.

Pretty much the same exposure trait.

Why does it always turn out underexposed with speedlite when used with EOS digital?

[The Vulcan]

You will note that you get a better light coverage with the diffuser tilted up. Then experiment with +/- stops. Make sure in-camera settings are what you want also.

[astral]

I have the 550EX which under exposes by at least one stop with my 40D.

Not a good advert for the TTL flash metering.

[Nordlys]

You will note that you get a better light coverage with the diffuser tilted up.

When you say diffuser do you mean built-in wide panel (or catchlight panel)?

I have the 550EX which under exposes by at least one stop with my 40D.

Not a good advert for the TTL flash metering.

I bet it worked OK with film EOS, didn't it?

[The Vulcan]

You will note that you get a better light coverage with the diffuser tilted up.

When you say diffuser do you mean built-in wide panel (or catchlight panel)?

I have the 550EX which under exposes by at least one stop with my 40D.

Not a good advert for the TTL flash metering.

I bet it worked OK with film EOS, didn't it?

ALL of the Canon flashguns I've used benefit from CORRECT configuring!

The diffuser I use is the Stofen diffuser - spreads the light a lot more evenly and covers my 17mm better than the Canon flip down diffuser with I now never use primarily because the light can be a little harsh. Use a Stofen for even and softer lighting. BUT, some increase in flash output is needed at times - trial and error here. I ALWAYS TILT THE GUN AT 60 DEGREES WITH THE STOFEN FITTED AND BOOST OUTPUT BY 2/3rds. For distance stuff obviously use the normal position. Hope you understand.

Here's a few examples from my 580EX11 and Stofen using various lenses

[Nordlys]

Nice example of good fill-in flash shots.

Did you use the diffuser on all of these shots? And all on E-TTL mode?

So it takes trial and errors... even for (ex) professional photographer.

[The Vulcan]

Nice example of good fill-in flash shots.

Thank You

Did you use the diffuser on all of these shots? And all on E-TTL mode?

Yes and Yes

So it takes trial and errors... even for (ex) professional photographer.

Been using a Stofen for c.20 years - ya get used to it!

[astral]

I have the 550EX which under exposes by at least one stop with my 40D.

Not a good advert for the TTL flash metering.

I bet it worked OK with film EOS, didn't it?

I am not sure I had the unit when I was using the film body........

Any thoughts on whether to make the compensation with the camera settings or the flash gun??

I have tried with the camera settings, but without much noticeable success.

[Nordlys]

I was wondering that too but the owner's manual of both 430EX and 580EX2 say "if flash exposure compensation has been set with both the camera and speedlite, the speedlite's flash exposure compensation amount will override camera's".

It does work for me. But I often compensate it by raising ISO too.

Just not very "fully automatic" "E-TTL" claims to be.

Like Vulcan said it takes trial and errors (and post process adjustment).

[Nordlys]

My friend's daughter joins Mexican dancers.

(magenta cast again)