Drinking Water

[Dustoff]

after reading through the entire four pages of this thread i came to the conclusion that many of you are obsessed with your fears and should live in the bubble back home.as for me personally i will just stick to leo,with ice.from the tab.

Chug-a-lug dude!

Up to you, somebody's friend but safe drinking water is an issue worldwide and just because you don't care about yourself doesn't mean that everyone else should not take precautions.

[uptoyoumyfriend]

after reading through the entire four pages of this thread i came to the conclusion that many of you are obsessed with your fears and should live in the bubble back home.as for me personally i will just stick to leo,with ice.from the tab.

Chug-a-lug dude!

Up to you, somebody's friend but safe drinking water is an issue worldwide and just because you don't care about yourself doesn't mean that everyone else should not take precautions.

...of course and they should be.all i'm saying is not to overdo things. leaving a trail of empties behind wherever you live obviously doesn't improve the environ that has been polluted by just those petrochemical products to the point that the water is bad just about everywhere.the long term solution aside from croaking can only be a drastic reduction in consumerism/wether its plastic bottles or any other deposible items and of course in the number of participants.just trying to get the most out of it personally by shifting the problem to those without the means to pay for every whim and fancy means just that,passing the buck the shitty way.i worked for people once,but only very briefly that filled theit pool with poland springs water.20 000$ worth.that to me is obscene and intolerable.they own levi's .i haven't bought any since.not that that would change anything.i'm just saying you gotta keep the eye on the ball.

[Nongwahyay]

When I´m in Isaan with the wife, I drink the rain water, which the family collects in those huge pots they all have in their gardens. It doesn´t taste bad, I´ve never had any stomach problems from it............. and it costs nowt!!!!!! Anyone know a cheaper method????

[nokia]

When I´m in Isaan with the wife, I drink the rain water, which the family collects in those huge pots they all have in their gardens. It doesn´t taste bad, I´ve never had any stomach problems from it............. and it costs nowt!!!!!! Anyone know a cheaper method????

DO you boil the rain water before drinking?

As long as there is no factory causing pollution nearby, rainwater is fine.

[xwteee]

see below...

Edited September 2, 2008 by xwteee

[xwteee]

please see below...

Edited September 2, 2008 by xwteee

[xwteee]

Use a filter mounted under the sink. Little tap on the sink for drinking water is convenient. No worries about whether or not someone else is filtering it properly. You control it. No plastic bottles to transport and/or recycle. Filter is moveable or can be sold if you move.

Note: Repeated refilling of clear water bottles you buy water in is not recommended as stated on many of the labels.

Why's that ?

[Dustoff]

Use a filter mounted under the sink. Little tap on the sink for drinking water is convenient. No worries about whether or not someone else is filtering it properly. You control it. No plastic bottles to transport and/or recycle. Filter is moveable or can be sold if you move.

Note: Repeated refilling of clear water bottles you buy water in is not recommended as stated on many of the labels.

Why's that ?

It's not the bottles.

It is because people usually do not take proper precautions in sterilizing bottles and caps before refilling. Most will drink straight out of the bottle, introducing cooties (foreign fellows), and whatever possible bacterial or viral infestations that will then reproduce in the water. It took me a long time to teach my wife that you don't bring home an empty water bottle with a used drinking straw in it and refill it without proper sterilization. I do a chlorine bleach rinse and let the bottle competely dry if I have any doubts.

I know, I know, sounds overly cautious but how easy is it to pass on the common cold...?

Not to mention, I also know where my mouth has been...

Edited September 2, 2008 by Dustoff

[Bill97]

Use a filter mounted under the sink. Little tap on the sink for drinking water is convenient. No worries about whether or not someone else is filtering it properly. You control it. No plastic bottles to transport and/or recycle. Filter is moveable or can be sold if you move.

Note: Repeated refilling of clear water bottles you buy water in is not recommended as stated on many of the labels.

Why's that ?

Dustoff has made a good response.

I recall having read that the bottles start to deteriorate after repeated use causing the drinker to get a hit of plastic or at least some of its components which is not healthy. What repeated use means depends on the nature of the use but it is a relatively small number of uses, not thousands.

[nokia]

It's not the bottles.

It is because people usually do not take proper precautions in sterilizing bottles and caps before refilling. Most will drink straight out of the bottle, introducing cooties (foreign fellows), and whatever possible bacterial or viral infestations that will then reproduce in the water. It took me a long time to teach my wife that you don't bring home an empty water bottle with a used drinking straw in it and refill it without proper sterilization. I do a chlorine bleach rinse and let the bottle competely dry if I have any doubts.

I know, I know, sounds overly cautious but how easy is it to pass on the common cold...?

Not to mention, I also know where my mouth has been...

So it's not the bottles right?

As long as you dont put your mouth to the bottle, nor drink straight from it, it is unlikely to have bacteria. Of course, regular flushing with water helps.

btw, who drinks straight from a 5L/6L PEP bottle?

[xwteee]

Use a filter mounted under the sink. Little tap on the sink for drinking water is convenient. No worries about whether or not someone else is filtering it properly. You control it. No plastic bottles to transport and/or recycle. Filter is moveable or can be sold if you move.

Note: Repeated refilling of clear water bottles you buy water in is not recommended as stated on many of the labels.

Why's that ?

It's not the bottles.

It is because people usually do not take proper precautions in sterilizing bottles and caps before refilling. Most will drink straight out of the bottle, introducing cooties (foreign fellows), and whatever possible bacterial or viral infestations that will then reproduce in the water. It took me a long time to teach my wife that you don't bring home an empty water bottle with a used drinking straw in it and refill it without proper sterilization. I do a chlorine bleach rinse and let the bottle competely dry if I have any doubts.

I know, I know, sounds overly cautious but how easy is it to pass on the common cold...?

Not to mention, I also know where my mouth has been...

Sorry for my slowness in understanding, but are we talking about the small bottles which the drinking water companies deliver in crates to your home ? There are so many bottles...

[bggg]

Coming in to this discussion late and admittedly have not read every post so I don't know if anyone has brought up Atmospheric Water generators. We have a unit that produces water from the moisture in the air. At 35% humidity it will produce 30 liters a day. In Thailands higher humidity it produces a lot more, if I had to guess I would say we are getting 40 -50 liters a day. It has 6 filters including air filters, RO, UV.

Most (if not all) tap filters cannot remove many substances found in todays groundwater no matter where you live. Many bottled waters are tap water and the rest are ground water. We used to use a tap filter but when the powers that be decided the water was too dirty they simply dump more chlorine in it and the taste became horrific. After some research and finding that even in 1st world countries that is usually the solution add more chlorine if you have a problem. Then you read the headlines about pharmacuticals in drinking water in the US, prozac in the UK, desalinated water has become the choice in many areas and that provides you with enough sodium to give anyone a heart attack.

Our water tastes great. In fact I hate when I am out now and forced to buy bottled water as I don't like the taste. No bottles to store, carry. lift it just sits there and makes water quietly until its full and then shuts off until more is needed. It has a cold, hot and warm spiget on the front. Admittedly it is an import and more expensive than the simple (ineffective) RO units you can buy here, but I feel much better that my family is drinking this versus and unknown chemical ridden water. Other filters cannot remove things loke drugs and pesticides and we all know Thailand uses many pesticides long ago outlawed in 1st world countries. The WHO has not even written new standards for what is in ground water these days.

[klikster]

As with vegetarians who must suppliment things like many of the B-vitamins and Folic Acid that do not exist in vegetables, drinking distilled water presents it's own hazards in not giving us the mineralization that we need to survive..

I used to hear this myth quite a bit from fellow yachties who derived all of their water from onboard RO. In fact, however, it is not necessary to get essential minerals (some of which, like calcium, are required in rather substantial quantities) from drinking water. They are all in fact adequately present (just like the vitamins that are unnecessarily over-consumed) in the foods we eat. The real problem for some people (and their dogs) with pure water is lack of taste, and this is easily remedied using the "Waters" or other simple re-mineralizing systems if desired - but NOT necessary for health reasons, assuming one eats a wide variety of foods...SALUD!

I'm not sure, but I suspect that many of the RO systems commonly sold here actually uses ultrafiltration membranes, rather than "true" RO = dissolved solids rejection membranes. (true RO requires a lot of pressure to work at any reasonable level of efficiency). If that is the case, the UF will not remove dissolved solids. Taste is often enhanced by activated charcoal.

Edited September 5, 2008 by klikster

[nokia]

Coming in to this discussion late and admittedly have not read every post so I don't know if anyone has brought up Atmospheric Water generators. We have a unit that produces water from the moisture in the air. At 35% humidity it will produce 30 liters a day. In Thailands higher humidity it produces a lot more, if I had to guess I would say we are getting 40 -50 liters a day. It has 6 filters including air filters, RO, UV.

Most (if not all) tap filters cannot remove many substances found in todays groundwater no matter where you live. Many bottled waters are tap water and the rest are ground water. We used to use a tap filter but when the powers that be decided the water was too dirty they simply dump more chlorine in it and the taste became horrific. After some research and finding that even in 1st world countries that is usually the solution add more chlorine if you have a problem. Then you read the headlines about pharmacuticals in drinking water in the US, prozac in the UK, desalinated water has become the choice in many areas and that provides you with enough sodium to give anyone a heart attack.

Our water tastes great. In fact I hate when I am out now and forced to buy bottled water as I don't like the taste. No bottles to store, carry. lift it just sits there and makes water quietly until its full and then shuts off until more is needed. It has a cold, hot and warm spiget on the front. Admittedly it is an import and more expensive than the simple (ineffective) RO units you can buy here, but I feel much better that my family is drinking this versus and unknown chemical ridden water. Other filters cannot remove things loke drugs and pesticides and we all know Thailand uses many pesticides long ago outlawed in 1st world countries. The WHO has not even written new standards for what is in ground water these days.

Your unit sounds like a gd idea, except when there is a blackout. btw, what is the energy consumption(cost) like?

[cloudhopper]

This study from the US but would be interesting to see what's around here...

Testing prompted by an Associated Press story that revealed trace amounts of pharmaceuticals in drinking water supplies has shown that more Americans are affected by the problem than previously thought — at least 46 million.

That's up from 41 million people reported by the AP in March as part of an investigation into the presence of pharmaceuticals in the nation's waterways.

The AP stories prompted federal and local legislative hearings, brought about calls for mandatory testing and disclosure, and led officials in at least 27 additional metropolitan areas to analyze their drinking water. Positive tests were reported in 17 cases, including Reno, Nev., Savannah, Ga., Colorado Springs, Colo., and Huntsville, Ala. Results are pending in three others.

The test results, added to data from communities and water utilities that bowed to pressure to disclose earlier test results, produce the new total of Americans known to be exposed to drug-contaminated drinking water supplies.

The overwhelming majority of U.S. cities have not tested drinking water while eight cities — including Boston, Phoenix and Seattle — were relieved that tests showed no detections.

"We didn't think we'd find anything because our water comes from a pristine source, but after the AP stories we wanted to make sure and reassure our customers," said Andy Ryan, spokesman for Seattle Public Utilities.

The substances detected in the latest tests mirrored those cited in the earlier AP report.

Chicago, for example, found a cholesterol medication and a nicotine derivative. Many cities found the anti-convulsant carbamazepine. Officials in one of those communities, Colorado Springs, say they detected five pharmaceuticals in all, including a tranquilizer and a hormone.

"This is obviously an emerging issue and after the AP stories came out we felt it was the responsible thing for us to do, as a utility, to find out where we stand. We believe that at these levels, based on current science, that the water is completely safe for our customers," said Colorado Springs spokesman Steve Berry. "We don't want to create unnecessary alarm, but at the same time we have a responsibility as a municipal utility to communicate with our customers and let them know."

Fargo's water director, Bruce Grubb, said the concentrations of three drugs detected there were so incredibly minute — parts per trillion — that he sent them to the local health officer to figure out how to interpret the information for the community.

"We plan to put this into some kind of context other than just scientific nomenclature, so folks can get some level of understanding about what it means," said Grubb.

The drug residues detected in water supplies are generally flushed into sewers and waterways through human excretion. Many of the pharmaceuticals are known to slip through sewage and drinking water treatment plants.

While the comprehensive risks are still unclear, researchers are finding evidence that even extremely diluted concentrations of pharmaceutical residues harm fish, frogs and other aquatic species in the wild and impair the workings of human cells in the laboratory.

And while the new survey expands the known extent of the problem, the overwhelming majority of U.S. communities have yet to test, including the single largest water provider in the country, New York City's Department of Environmental Protection, which delivers water to 9 million people.

In April, New York City council members insisted during an emergency hearing that their drinking water be tested. But DEP officials subsequently declared that "the testing of finished tap water is not warranted at this time."

___

The AP National Investigative Team can be reached at investigate (at) ap.org

[londonthai]

almost exact 4 posts in a raw is a sp*m

[BigSnake]

Nestle deliver to my home, 6 pack 1.5lt bottles(Bt60). I buy 10 six packs for Bt600. They cost about 67 bahts per six pack at lotus/Big C. NO delivery charge, just call Nestle's main office and within an hour or so a delivery truck is at my front door. Great service, place where ever you want it in your home. No hassle lifting and loading/unloading myself after a shopping trip to Big C or Lotus. They also deliver the 5lt bottles or an side they sale.

Edited September 13, 2008 by BigSnake

[PeaceBlondie]

The 4 spam posts are gone.

Polestar has increased the price for 20 one-liter (quart, 950 cc) bottles from 30 to 35 baht. I do not trust klong water for drinking, even though we have a fancy filter system.

[nokia]

Nestle deliver to my home, 6 pack 1.5lt bottles(Bt60). I buy 10 six packs for Bt600. They cost about 67 bahts per six pack at lotus/Big C. NO delivery charge, just call Nestle's main office and within an hour or so a delivery truck is at my front door. Great service, place where ever you want it in your home. No hassle lifting and loading/unloading myself after a shopping trip to Big C or Lotus. They also deliver the 5lt bottles or an side they sale.

It's a good idea instead of the hassle of carrying them from Big C/Lotus which i have done so many times.

btw what do you do with the empty 5L bottles? Discard them at your rubbish bin or recycle?

Cheers!

[nokia]

The 4 spam posts are gone.

Polestar has increased the price for 20 one-liter (quart, 950 cc) bottles from 30 to 35 baht. I do not trust klong water for drinking, even though we have a fancy filter system.

Thanks for the price update. So it's now about 1.75baht/ one-litre.

hey, I do not trust ground water for drinking either, even though we have a simple filter system.

Well, unless 1 day there is a proper sewage system in CM. When will that be???

[cloudhopper]

If this is what's happening in the States it's happening here too...

Controlled drugs dumped uncontrolled into water

By JEFF DONN , AP National Writer, Space & Earth science / Environment

(AP) -- In a frustrating quirk in government policy, the most tightly controlled drugs - like painkilling narcotics prone to abuse - are the ones that most often elude environmental regulation when they become waste.

Federal narcotics regulators impose strict rules meant to keep controlled pharmaceuticals out of the wrong hands. Yet those rules also make these drugs nearly impossible to handle safely as waste, say hospital environmental administrators.

Many would like to send controlled substances to landfills or incinerators to keep them out of waterways as much as possible. Instead, they are nearly always dropped into sinks and toilets by hospitals, nursing homes and other long-term care facilities.

The problem is huge, because more than 365 medicines are controlled by the U.S. Drug Enforcement Administration - almost 12 percent of all prescriptions, the agency says. They include widely used narcotics, stimulants, depressants and steroids - drugs like codeine, morphine, oxycodone, diazepam (often sold as Valium) and methylphenidate (often sold as Ritalin).

At Abbott Northwestern Hospital here, nurse Keri Osborne recently was opening a locked room at a spine surgery unit, where a machine must check her fingerprints before she pours unused controlled drugs into the sink.

"Back pain, so there's a lot of narcotics here," she explains. Much of the waste consists of liquid in syringes that aren't completely emptied when used to treat patients.

Though a leader in incinerating drug waste, this hospital still puts four gallons of controlled substances down the drain each year, says hazardous waste manager Steven Waderich.

It would be very expensive to do otherwise. "Managing controlled substances, the cost goes up just through the roof," he says.

In nearby Robbinsdale, North Memorial Medical Center pours 50 gallons of controlled substances into its drains annually rather than pay $25,000 to handle and haul it away for safer disposal, says regulated waste coordinator Jerry Fink.

State waste regulators take their cue from federal law and regulations.

Thus, typical assisted-living centers, which are not registered with the DEA, cannot collect unused controlled drugs of residents for offsite disposal.

Even the destruction of controlled drugs must be meticulously documented, so they aren't diverted to addicts. Medical facilities typically send a second staffer to bear witness when controlled substances are poured into sinks or toilets.

Many waste experts now want to rewrite the rules so a broader range of professionals can handle leftover controlled drugs. "And DEA - truth be told - has not been very cooperative and responsive in that regard," says waste consultant Catherine Zimmer at the University of Minnesota.

That could change. The DEA declined requests for an on-the-record interview, but in a statement, spokeswoman Rogene Waite said: "DEA is currently developing regulations to allow for the safe and effective destruction of controlled substances."

Ben Grumbles, the Environmental Protection Agency's water administrator, confirmed his agency has participated in these discussions. He would not provide details, but called the talks productive.

[PeaceBlondie]

Polestar has increased the price for 20 one-liter (quart, 950 cc) bottles from 30 to 35 baht. I do not trust klong water for drinking, even though we have a fancy filter system.

Thanks for the price update. So it's now about 1.75baht/ one-litre.

hey, I do not trust ground water for drinking either, even though we have a simple filter system.

Well, unless 1 day there is a proper sewage system in CM. When will that be???

Since the Polestar containers are marked as quarts - 950 ml - the new total comes to 1.84 baht per liter. For you Brits, the Mark 1 Austin-Healey Sprite engine was roughly 950 cc.

[BigSnake]

Nestle deliver to my home, 6 pack 1.5lt bottles(Bt60). I buy 10 six packs for Bt600. They cost about 67 bahts per six pack at lotus/Big C. NO delivery charge, just call Nestle's main office and within an hour or so a delivery truck is at my front door. Great service, place where ever you want it in your home. No hassle lifting and loading/unloading myself after a shopping trip to Big C or Lotus. They also deliver the 5lt bottles or an side they sale.

It's a good idea instead of the hassle of carrying them from Big C/Lotus which i have done so many times.

btw what do you do with the empty 5L bottles? Discard them at your rubbish bin or recycle?

Cheers!

Recycle for sure. Have a big old bag in the back yard as we speak, will be off to sell them in the next day or so. . In addition I have about 20klo of News papers.

[nokia]

Recycle for sure. Have a big old bag in the back yard as we speak, will be off to sell them in the next day or so. . In addition I have about 20klo of News papers.

That's green! What's the going rate for plastics? I heard it was about 50-60baht per kg?

[elektrified]

I'm wondering what the consensus is, if there is one, as to the best-tasting and healthiest drinking water that can be delivered to the house short of BigSnake's choice of Nestle (which I like very much but the price is not practical). Currently we buy those 19.5 litre bottles from someone in our moobaan for 20 Baht each with an 85 Baht/bottle deposit, but it has become increasingly difficult to deal with them as they are not always there, sometimes can't deliver, often they forget us after we pay, etc. I think they come from the Ruangthip Company or something like that.

I see many different companies delivering water around the moobaan. I also did a search at http://www.yellow.co.th/YellowPages/Chiang...tion_map.1.html and there at least 11 different companies that deliver. I notice that number 8 on the above list advertises "Aura Mineral Water". If it is mineral water, its probably more than 20 Baht per 19.5 litres.

Just wondering if anyone has tried some different waters and has an opinion. Or, are they all pretty much the same?

Thanks in advance.

[tango]

Out of curiosity how many people here have got sick from drinking the tap/mains water?

Those who clean their teeth with tap water or rinse their mouth out under the shower can include themselves in this survey.

I have, years ago now, from rinsing my mouth with tap water: I never drank it, but regularly had sore throats and bouts of the flu. A Thai colleague recommended that I never use tap water to rinse my mouth but to use bottled water instead. I switched to bottled water and, anecdotally, have been relatively healthy since. Someone mentioned how the LA water system is healthy. City systems may look clean but their waters contain all manner of chemicals and detritus from medicinal drugs, blood and other body waste products. Many people are unconvinced that these are 100% removed. I do not use the local street laundries for basically the same reason, in that your clothes are churned in a vat containing the soiled clothing and used undergarments of others, and I have yet to see their use of even the tiniest amount of chlorine ('heiter'). For what it's worth....

[ianh68]

RO is the only way to go IMO regardless of the source.

Household filter systems are the most convenient and clean water is so important that the expense really ought to be secondary. I would avoid RO systems for these reasons.

[cloudhopper]

RO is the only way to go IMO regardless of the source.

Household filter systems are the most convenient and clean water is so important that the expense really ought to be secondary. I would avoid RO systems for these reasons.

Statements in the ad you link to that the molecular size of herb/pesticides are smaller than a water molecule are utter tripe, as is the allegation that pure (demineralized) water is unhealthy. You wouldn't perchance be selling water filters?

[drtreelove]

RO is the only way to go IMO regardless of the source.

Household filter systems are the most convenient and clean water is so important that the expense really ought to be secondary. I would avoid RO systems for these reasons.

That is an excellent, informative read; thanks so much. It took a year and 5 pages of posts to get here, but this was the best info so far IMO. don

http://www.historyofwaterfilters.com/

[Larry]

Everyone has their own taste in water. For me, however, there is only one company in Chiangmai with EXCELLENT water. Patcharee 053 471538. They deliver their big bottles to me every week for 20 baht for what seems to be 15 liters. Courteous service and great water....Ive tasted the other ones, most of which have they metallic taste. Get a Thai friend to arrange for a drop off.