Farang Bringing Their Children On Motorbike

[BlackWolf]

Now they are back on Samui again. The brave parents bringing their children (sometimes 2 ) unprotected and without helmet on their motorbikes.

I must say I admire them and look up to their currage as they dare to do this.

I for my self have lived here for some years and I feel like a chicken compared to thes

people, riding my motorbike wearing a helmet and back in my head always have in my mind I could easily have an accident. Because I have seen a lot of it on the roads here.

To be Serious; I wonder why these parents dont care more about the lives of their children, I am sure they would not behave like this in their homeland. Do they leave their brains back home when they go holiday and how will they feel if they have an accident and their child are badly hurt, or even die ???

On the behalf of all these children I have a pray to their parents:

TAKE BETTER CARE OF YOUR CHILD

[samuibeachbum]

I agree, same same with Thais, it's scares the hel_l out of me when I see children on bikes.

If I was to have an accident with them and the kiddy gets hurt I couldn't live with myself.

[samuiseagull]

It's the one thing (among a host of many!!!) that makes me shake my head in disbelief when i see young farang kids on the back of their parents motorbikes weaving in and out of the potholes, drains and other wannabe racers!!!

Just why would you allow your most valuable possession i.e your kids, to sit on the back of your bike travelling along some of Thailand's worst roads. Totally beats me!!! I think they are almost trying to act a 'little bit Thai' and 'hey look, we're cool' type of parents blending in with the locals. Very strange!!

[Mark Wolfe]

For Thais, it's their vehicle. It's how they get around. They have been brought up this way.

To be honest, I wonder if anyone actually has statistics proving that this is injuring children. I mean it appears to Westerners as reckless, but in fact, until I see some hard data, I will just file it under cultural differences.

A Thai in Germany must think that driving on the autobahn is madness and that people must crash all the time, driving at such speeds.

As for Westerners with kids in Samui, well, hard to say. I would guess that the thinking is that "it's just a little ways and we're not going too fast so it ought to be OK." Probably it is too.

[goldfish]

[BigC]

i get angry because if i accidently drove into a motor bike with a child who might be driving all over the place bacuase one of there many passenegers are moving around. i would be blamed. even so. a helmet would save most peoples lives out here. now i don't care what adults do because they no the risk but it is up to parents to protect the kids because they know none the wiser.

people only need to fall 2 ft and they can die hitting there head on hard concrete wearing a helmet they would not even have a scratch

[sbk]

More than tourists driving with kids on bikes with no helmets are the tourists who allow their children to drive. Saw one guy letting his 6 year old steer the motorbike while he sat on the bike. Amazing.

[OnTheSnap]

I just can't see being able to afford to travel to Thailand with a child (airline tickets/travel expenses alone for a family of three have to cost close to 100K r/t these days from Europe, Australia, or the States) without budgeting 700-1,000 baht per day for a jeep or car to transport everybody safely.

Helmet or not, small children have no place on a scooter when there is a viable financial alternative- locals do what they have to do for economic reasons- most of them would toss their scooter aside and nevert look back if they could afford cars- tourists are a different story.

[PeaceBlondie]

I agree it is terribly dangerous, and I do not need to be convinced by statistics. God or evolution did not design the human head to sustain unprotected crashes and falls.

Farang let their kids ride without helmets for much the same reason that many Thais do. They can get away with it, and they are stupid. Now, that is not an anti-Thai rant. It is a conclusion I made in 1962 after researching all the human crash research data available. Those people who do not wear seat belts or helmets are either ignorannt, stupid, or lazy. Anywhere in the world.

Oh wait, we are being lectured by our fine fellow farang not to criticize the way things are in Thailand. Maybe that genius student who died falling off his motorcycle without a helmet was supposed to die. Maybe karma wants all these crippled Thais so that somebody can sell lottery tickets from wheelchairs.

[tommyj4]

Suggestions on safer ways of transport on Samui for parents???...reasonably cost though

[JimmyTheMook]

I find it very disturbing whenever babies are seen being driven around on motorcycles and understand that yes for most this is the family vehicle and therefore OK to do so.

[Jimjim]

Seems they're just doing as the Romans do.

[Mark Wolfe]

God or evolution did not design the human head to sustain unprotected crashes and falls.... It is a conclusion I made in 1962 ...

My guess is that humans were aware of the difference in hardness between a road (or a rock) and one's cranium prior to 1962 BC.

So the people who take their kids on the bike are "stupid, ignorant or lazy"? This might be the same "wisdom" used for people who smoke cigarettes. They KNOW that they cause cancer, that they will die sooner than without smoking and may very well decline slowly and painfully, leaving medical bills and broken hearts of family and friends. But they smoke anyway. (And don't tell me about the addictive qualities making this a bad example -- I quit).

I rode in Taiwan for 11 years without a helmet, until they passed a law that was actually enforced making it manditory to wear one. I wore one for the next 9 years I was there.

Here in Samui, however, I don't wear one. I know I should, but I don't. Am I stupid? Ignorant? Lazy? I guess so.

Here is the thing: How many babies or young children are injured every (month/year) because they are taken on bikes in Samui? My guess is very, very few. Maybe an entire year or so could pass without an incident. Because it looks unsafe doesn't mean that people are ditching their bikes with the babies on board left and right.

Being under a coconut tree (that has coconuts) is dangerous, but have you ever heard of anyone actually being beaned by a falling coconut? And I don't mean rumor.

[smileplur]

It has been said, but it should be said again. That is just the way things go here. I am in Bangkok, but I often am put into a position where I must drive with my nieces on the motorbike. I don't particularly care for it. This is especially true when I have to navigate the big roads. On the small sois or upcountry, it doesn't even remotely present a problem. The children are quite adept with their balance. They refuse to wear a helmet. What is one to do?

[frenchFARANGbkk]

A baby on a motorbike, so crazy, and even if it is their only vehicle someone a bit smarter would use a bus or a public pick-up...

And about baby seats:

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/Expats-Kids-...18#entry2084418

[PaulAllen]

They refuse to wear a helmet. What is one to do?

It's called being a responsible adult and MAKING the child wear the helmet.

People have to teach their children that when on a motorbike, a helmet must be worn every single time. No, "ifs, ands or buts" about it.

Even these Thai's who can't afford a car can surely go to Tesco and afford a 200 baht helmet.

[mahtin]

They refuse to wear a helmet. What is one to do?

It's called being a responsible adult and MAKING the child wear the helmet.

People have to teach their children that when on a motorbike, a helmet must be worn every single time. No, "ifs, ands or buts" about it.

Even these Thai's who can't afford a car can surely go to Tesco and afford a 200 baht helmet.

I would be interested to know how to make a Thai child wear a helmet.

Please elaborate.

[Mark Wolfe]

I have to bring this up, and I am not being facetious. What is the big deal about children anyway? Anyone in an accident on the roads due to lack of wearing a helmet is unfortunate, be it a one-year-old or someone 85. You say the children have no choice? The way I see it, the result would be the same if the child did have a choice, based on the number of Thai youths old enough (legally or otherwise) to ride a bike themselves who wear a helmet (very, very few).

Why isn't there a thread about foreigner men taking Thai ladies on the back of their bikes and not providing the girls with a helmet? I don't see a difference; the girl might dearly want a helmet (given that at night, most men driving a lady home to the love nest is intoxicated), but she has no choice but to ride without one.

Anyway, driving with a toddler on the bike, as has been said, is the way it is done. More people get hurt on the roads from sand on the street. Let's all get out our leaf-blowers and start making this place SAFE!!! (That's facetious....)

Check out the baby seat in the photo. See? It's all good!

[tommyj4]

Suggestions on safer ways of transport on Samui for parents???...reasonably cost though

[scyriacus]

safety is a handy excuse for everything (like the war against terrorism). i suggest that everyone's car need to show pictures of torn & twisted traffic victims (like cigarette packs carry deterrent warnings). every day more people die in traffic than by traffickers! every military vehicle should be painted in bloodred, with pictures of mutilated civilians. then and only then i stop calling every politician (and religious leader!) hypocrites. until then i only feel terrorized by the self-styled watchdogs. i love thailand, coz it's less strict, less overregulated and the laws are sometimes simply not enforced at all. i am fed up with people who pretend to care more about others than those others would find acceptable.........ever heard about education & free will? ....ah, khao djai, luem laeo......amazing thailand

Edited July 13, 2008 by scyriacus

[ham]

safety is a handy excuse for everything (like the war against terrorism). i suggest that everyone's car need to show pictures of torn & twisted traffic victims (like cigarette packs carry deterrent warnings). every day more people die in traffic than by traffickers! every military vehicle should be painted in bloodred, with pictures of mutilated civilians. then and only then i stop calling every politician (and religious leader!) hypocrites. until then i only feel terrorized by the self-styled watchdogs. i love thailand, coz it's less strict, less overregulated and the laws are sometimes simply not enforced at all. i am fed up with people who pretend to care more about others than those others would find acceptable.........ever heard about education & free will? ....ah, khao djai, luem laeo......amazing thailand

YOU'RE SO RIGHT!

ham

p.s. it is not long ago I said the same thing about the cars and warning picture on it, just imagine it

[tommyj4]

Suggestions on safer ways of transport on Samui for parents???...reasonably cost though

[OnTheSnap]

You can't reasonably compare a car to a bike in this situation (especially on this island).

While there are people who drive at high speeds in both cars and bikes on Samui, most people drive in the 50-80km/h range on the main road- the consequences of an accident in a car are relatively minor at that speed, ESPECIALLY when it comes to a car/bike collision- how's the bike going to fare, however?

The fact is that even the lowest speed accident on a bike (even a parking lot tip-over) will result in some injury- minimal care needs to be taken- it has nothing to do with how "good" a rider you are- it has to do with others who might not possess adequate driving skills (meaning 90%+ of native drivers on Samui).

I'm for choice for an adult- if you don't want to wear a helmet, don't wear one- however, a child needs to be protected until they are old enough to protect themselves- it's the JOB of a parent or guardian to do their best in this regard- if you can afford to drive your child around in a car, by all means to so- if you can't, make sure your child is at least minimally protected in the event of an accident.

The "free will" argument is meaningless on this thread- it's about keeping kids safe, not adults.

[aka_jack]

Suggestions on safer ways of transport on Samui for parents???...reasonably cost though

150 - 200 baht motorcycle hire, 500 baht for suzuki jeep hire, not the best looking jeeps but still alot more protection than a bike!

[aka_jack]

oh yer motorcycle no insurance - most jeeps insurance!

[ham]

The "free will" argument is meaningless on this thread- it's about keeping kids safe, not adults.

If adults use their brain, not are driving like idiots and with 30-40 like the local, there is nearly no danger for any kid. Still then we will see accidents.

Making faster and better tools (bikes, cares, whatever) means also faster into an accident, because the car is fully safe (inside, they think) go one time in a hospital. No excuse for a wrong development! No need helmet at all, just a lobby and another tool to make money with.

no helmets.... BRAINS are needed; at least this is my opinion, same with the security belt!! Why this rush also here in Thailand! Did not the most came back here because it "was" so easy and cha cha? Maybe some people has forgotten that, while busy making a living for "our children"!? The children are always a good excuse! But I'm really not so sure if I see westerners putting their smallest children already under a helmet. Maybe it is very important to us to get hurt sometimes. Not remember? I would like to see how those soooo responsible parents would react if there would be a limit e.g. on this island for 30/40 km/h.

Yes a heart for children, give them the space they need and the experience to.

Have you ever had one of this helmet on your head when rent a bike? You really think this shitbox helps?? Yes it helps, the police guy's to rip you off with 500 Baht!

[OnTheSnap]

Well, the fact is that there IS a helmet law- just because it's rarely enforced doesn't mean it's wise not to wear one (there's also a speed limit).

Lax enforcement of a law is not an excuse to break it- if the police did their job more efficiently, you'd see pretty much everybody wearing one (for economic reasons and too avoid a constant hassle).

I agree that BRAINS are needed- I also agree that fragile young brains need to be protected.

I put sunscreen on my kid when he's out in the sun, I make sure he wears a helmet when he's on his bicycle, I hold his hand when he crosses the street, I avoid situations where he would be exposed to cigarette smoke, and he doesn't ride on a scooter ever (and won't until he's much older).

Is my kid more valuable to me than anyone else's kids are to them? In some cases, sure, but in general I doubt it.

Edited July 14, 2008 by OnTheSnap

[BlackWolf]

safety is a handy excuse for everything (like the war against terrorism). i suggest that everyone's car need to show pictures of torn & twisted traffic victims (like cigarette packs carry deterrent warnings). every day more people die in traffic than by traffickers! every military vehicle should be painted in bloodred, with pictures of mutilated civilians. then and only then i stop calling every politician (and religious leader!) hypocrites. until then i only feel terrorized by the self-styled watchdogs. i love thailand, coz it's less strict, less overregulated and the laws are sometimes simply not enforced at all. i am fed up with people who pretend to care more about others than those others would find acceptable.........ever heard about education & free will? ....ah, khao djai, luem laeo......amazing thailand

I could not less if adult people dont protect them self driving around Samui and get them selv into an accident.

And dont come around with this foolish thing that Thailand are less trafic-regulated then "civilian countries" According to the law both driver and passenger must wear a helmet and it not allowed to drive more than two people on a motorbike. The problem is that Thai people and thai-police dont care.

But if you have given birth to a child, its your duty to protect it. And the other problem is people like you who come to Thailand and belives they can do wathever they want. I have seen too many of you behave like idiotes on the roads here.

Besides I can refer to Samui Commununity Newspaper (it has sadly stopped last year) statistics from April 2007. This month 10 people were killed and 183 serious accident. Personally I know 5 of my friends here have been ran over by other motorbikes the last 4 years. Happy for them they did wear helmet and had only small injuries.

The last thing on my mind is when parents can afford to come here and bring their children, thei also can afford to rent a jeep for 5-600 bath a day instead of motorbike for 150-200 bath. It tells me the price of their children a nothing but small money.

[PoorSucker]

[mangostays]

Suggestions on safer ways of transport on Samui for parents???...reasonably cost though

Couple of things, first I don't live on Samui, I live on Koh Phangan. Here, and for no reason i can thathom, the majority of car/hilux drivers actually drive too slowly, often at less than 20 km/h. The dangerous drivers are the under 18s who have suked up honda dreams with skinny wheels and gold rims. These little sh*ts drive at top speed, weaving around pot holes and other vehicles, whilst on the phone and carrying three of their mates.

Second thing, when I go visit Samui (now that Tesco is on KPG, those visits are very infrequent) what strikes me is the sheer speed. urgency and volume of the traffic. Sawng Taos doing a ton on crappy broken up roads, motorbike's everywhere, 6' wheelers driven breakneck by yaba crazed long haul delivery men, and loads of scared and inexperienced tourists on scooters, two up, wearing flip flops and pointless open face helmet - and yes, often with a kid perched up front. Absolutely astonishes me and my wife.

Personally and yes, as a very experienced motorbike driver on the Islands, I'd never take my son on a motorbike on Samui because it is shear chaos and nobody cares if they run you off the road. Take a Sawng Tao, even if they do drive way too fast.

On Koh Phangan, watch out for the spoilt kids driving around on the spoils of granny's land sale, but on the west coast where I live it's still pretty quiet, the roads are new and wide and there is a proper motorbike culture here, where (with the exception of pre-pube kids) most people drive nice and steady. A solid knowledge of how to ride safely on sand and control a honda and I would say you're pretty safe. Take it steady, give the kid a helmet and don't get pissed up.