Thieving Police

[thaihome]

In many countries around the world the there is a very good chance they would have taken you straight to the jail house and possibly roughed you up a bit. You are lucky to be in Thailand where that behavior by officials is no longer the norm. Outside of your own country, your western sense of justice is not admirable, it is just plain stupid and may one day get you in serious trouble.

TH

[lopburi3]

Perhaps some of you should check with your Thai neighbors who are being robbed on a daily basis by tinted helmet motorcycle riders (snatch/grab) before you make the judgment that it is not an issue. I have never seen such crime at the levels they are currently.

[JimmyTheMook]

In many countries around the world the there is a very good chance they would have taken you straight to the jail house and possibly roughed you up a bit. You are lucky to be in Thailand where that behavior by officials is no longer the norm. Outside of your own country, your western sense of justice is not admirable, it is just plain stupid and may one day get you in serious trouble.

TH

100 baht would have made the cockAroach go away.

Small price to pay.

[dekka007]

At the end of the day. You broke the law doesnt matter how petty. If you had paid the poxy fine he would have not infringed your private space.

200THB fine an issue worth arguing about? - Time to go home mate if cash is that tight. Just pay it. As stated before no hassle, no paperwork, no turning up at the police station, no points on your licence. I'll go with the Thai method but then again I am wise enough just to pay the coppers here.

Edited July 15, 2008 by dekka007

[sgunn65]

To those posters who say, "No big deal, pay up" I say as long as you continue to do this you help perpetuate a corrupt system and the Police will continue to steal. The small price to you is alot to others.

Evil triumphs when good men do nothing

Well done to the OP

[Tyke]

At the end of the day. You broke the law doesnt matter how petty. If you had paid the poxy fine he would have not infringed your private space.

200THB fine an issue worth arguing about? - Time to go home mate if cash is that tight. Just pay it. As stated before no hassle, no paperwork, no turning up at the police station, no points on your licence. I'll go with the Thai method but then again I am wise enough just to pay the coppers here.

You still haven't got it have you? The amount of money or trouble involved are not the issues.

And breaking the law? Well, by accepting the shitbag's cop's invitation to bribe him makes the punter a criminal. Don't ever let cops turn you into a criminal.

Ok, pay the scumbage 200 baht if that's the fine, but without a recipt then it's a crime.

[JerryPara]

<br />

The title of your thread is incorrect, you have no proof the Police were stealing.<br />The thread should be renamed to:<br />I was wrong; they caught me; but I didn't want to pay the fine on the spot"<br />TH

<br />Since there are no unreceipted on the spot fines for traffic infringements, what would you say the police were doing if not stealing? I feel there is more than adequate proof.<br />

<br /><br />When there are as many as 30 police stopping traffic they normally have a desk set up for 'on the spot' fines.<br /><br />Personally I would have paid the small amount asked for especially as you were in the wrong.<br />

<br /><br /><br />

I agree, I pay a small fine, I have paid as little as 60 baht, but I prepared my wallet ahead of time with just a few bills to show them I only had that much. I smile and respectfully ask them to help me(chew-oi noi, chew-oi noi Krabp?). the fine is negotiable and I normally pay 100, but the fine actually is 400 Baht if you pay at the station. In that case, they also take you license for a few days, they give you a receipt you can show other police (that stop you again) without getting another ticket. Arguing won't help and just makes them dislike us more. Talking on your hand Phone is a big, big deal now so buy a wire microphone/ear set or blue tooth, wear a clear visor, don't speed in the right lane on the highway and you will be pretty safe. Cheers

[dekka007]

You still haven't got it have you? The amount of money or trouble involved are not the issues.

And breaking the law? Well, by accepting the shitbag's cop's invitation to bribe him makes the punter a criminal. Don't ever let cops turn you into a criminal.

Ok, pay the scumbage 200 baht if that's the fine, but without a recipt then it's a crime.

No mate ive got it. And I understand the system - I'll pay it and continue to do so because I know thats the best thing to do in that particular situation.

All these idiots that think a couple of farangs battling the corrupt police force here "Good for you u OP" and "Yeah dont pay, stand up for your rights", "Stop Corruption in the Thai police"

Dreamers.......You boys carry on with your losing battle. Ill pay my 200 THB fine and carry on enjoying my day and life here.

[Tyke]

You still haven't got it have you? The amount of money or trouble involved are not the issues.

And breaking the law? Well, by accepting the shitbag's cop's invitation to bribe him makes the punter a criminal. Don't ever let cops turn you into a criminal.

Ok, pay the scumbage 200 baht if that's the fine, but without a recipt then it's a crime.

No mate ive got it. And I understand the system - I'll pay it and continue to do so because I know thats the best thing to do in that particular situation.

All these idiots that think a couple of farangs battling the corrupt police force here "Good for you u OP" and "Yeah dont pay, stand up for your rights", "Stop Corruption in the Thai police"

Dreamers.......You boys carry on with your losing battle. Ill pay my 200 THB fine and carry on enjoying my day and life here.

Well, hope you enjoy a good night's sleep too.

[snowflake]

Is it not just a bit faster to pay him 200B on the spot than to travel all the way down to Rama 4 and wait in a que till you can pay 400-1000 or whatever sum they wanted?

Sad thing to waste time... I would just have asked if 100 was enugh... I guess with the right presentation and 1 minute of haggeling he would say ok...

[HarryHacker]

Going back to the OP, in my time in Thailand I guess I have been stopped about 50 times plus, quite rightly I have been fined each time for various traffic misdemeanors, however I have never experienced a cop getting physical and I have never ever heard of a cop getting physical to a farang roadside.

I would hazard a guess that something is missing from the story.

[Briggsy]

Going back to the OP, in my time in Thailand I guess I have been stopped about 50 times plus, quite rightly I have been fined each time for various traffic misdemeanors, however I have never experienced a cop getting physical and I have never ever heard of a cop getting physical to a farang roadside.

I would hazard a guess that something is missing from the story.

Nothing missing. I have been stopped at least 50 times myself. Riding around Bangkok every day for 11 years, it is an occupational hazard. This is the first time I've had a police officer physically lean on me, in the literal sense of the word. I agree it was most unusual. It appeared as if he knew how to intimidate people and also absolutely wanted cash rather than to issue a ticket.

I reiterate I remained very polite throughout.

I could post 20 or so ridiculous and/or amusing conversations and incidents with traffic police that I have encountered over the years. Some jolly, some vindictive, some obviously corrupt, some seemingly straight as a dye. However, this one was an odd and unusual deviation from the norm in both his physically aggressive behaviour and repeated requests for cash.

I do hope it's not the way the future is going to be.

[meom]

Why in the world didn't you give him the 200 baht ?

Maybe because he's not a spineless b itch.

Some people seem to think that if you pay at the police station the amount doesn't get split.

[CelticBhoy]

You still haven't got it have you? The amount of money or trouble involved are not the issues.

And breaking the law? Well, by accepting the shitbag's cop's invitation to bribe him makes the punter a criminal. Don't ever let cops turn you into a criminal.

Ok, pay the scumbage 200 baht if that's the fine, but without a recipt then it's a crime.

No mate ive got it. And I understand the system - I'll pay it and continue to do so because I know thats the best thing to do in that particular situation.

All these idiots that think a couple of farangs battling the corrupt police force here "Good for you u OP" and "Yeah dont pay, stand up for your rights", "Stop Corruption in the Thai police"

Dreamers.......You boys carry on with your losing battle. Ill pay my 200 THB fine and carry on enjoying my day and life here.

What are you driving around in, dekka007?

I didn't think you had to pay a fine from the back seat of a taxi.

[dekka007]

What are you driving around in, dekka007?

Something a lot bigger and quicker than a taxi m8

[Tyke]

Why in the world didn't you give him the 200 baht ?

Maybe because he's not a spineless b itch.

Some people seem to think that if you pay at the police station the amount doesn't get split.

How do you know it does?

If an official receipt is provided I guess it doesn't end up in the cop's pocket. If so why do the police refuse to give receipts for bribes? And why don't they just let people pay at the station instead of getting them to pay on the spot (without a receipt?).

[scotwumman]

Two things to consider here:

1) A family member here in the u.k. has in the past two weeks incurred two offences using mobile phone whilst driving works van.

Once hard luck, twice stupidity for the want of buying a bluetooth. Police even gave him a demonstration of how they had

photographed him from their car. Verdict: 6 penalty points (has been driving 22years not been involved in any other road

offences) Not to give ideas to the powers that be the fines involved were also hefty and standard.

2) No different here to Thailand people who won't listen or conform set themselves up. I shouldn't I suppose presume to call

anyone stupid not being a driver myself and can imagine that considering the difference in population that laws or the everchanging

traffic ones anyway are not always publicised enough and can seem petty until the point of being caught out.

[tw25rw]

I smile and accept the officer's comments while handing him my licence and wait for the inevitable ticket. He tells me that the ticket has to be paid at Rama 4 as they are highway police. But I don't need to go there as he tells me I can pay him 200 Baht on the spot. I decline. He physically leans against me and asks me for cash now. I decline. He continues to lean heavily against me. I can't move away as I am sitting on the bike. His face is right in mine. He continues to demand cash now. He asked me for cash about 15 times leaning against me. It was intimidating. I had to keep an eye on my wallet as I was sure he was going to make a grab for it. This situation lasted for several minutes. Finally he issued a ticket but with the fine amount left blank. I thank him and drive away quickly. What the helll was that about?

Not sure whether to applaud you as brave and principled , or just kee niow in the extreme..

[meom]

Why in the world didn't you give him the 200 baht ?

Maybe because he's not a spineless b itch.

Some people seem to think that if you pay at the police station the amount doesn't get split.

How do you know it does?

If an official receipt is provided I guess it doesn't end up in the cop's pocket. If so why do the police refuse to give receipts for bribes? And why don't they just let people pay at the station instead of getting them to pay on the spot (without a receipt?).

Good questions Tyke and I don't have proof if that's what you're looking for. On the other hand it's a well known fact that the police force is basically corrupt from high through low so keeping that in mind I don't really believe an official receipt counts for much.

[HarryHacker]

Going back to the OP, in my time in Thailand I guess I have been stopped about 50 times plus, quite rightly I have been fined each time for various traffic misdemeanors, however I have never experienced a cop getting physical and I have never ever heard of a cop getting physical to a farang roadside.

I would hazard a guess that something is missing from the story.

Nothing missing. I have been stopped at least 50 times myself. Riding around Bangkok every day for 11 years, it is an occupational hazard. This is the first time I've had a police officer physically lean on me, in the literal sense of the word. I agree it was most unusual. It appeared as if he knew how to intimidate people and also absolutely wanted cash rather than to issue a ticket.

I reiterate I remained very polite throughout.

I could post 20 or so ridiculous and/or amusing conversations and incidents with traffic police that I have encountered over the years. Some jolly, some vindictive, some obviously corrupt, some seemingly straight as a dye. However, this one was an odd and unusual deviation from the norm in both his physically aggressive behaviour and repeated requests for cash.

I do hope it's not the way the future is going to be.

Well, sorry mate, I still don't get it, you should know better than most. Pay the fine for the law you had broken, smile and ride on as everyone else does.

[thaihome]

To those posters who say, "No big deal, pay up" I say as long as you continue to do this you help perpetuate a corrupt system and the Police will continue to steal. The small price to you is alot to others.

Evil triumphs when good men do nothing

Well done to the OP

You are so out of touch with living in a developing country it is hard to get my head around it. The police was not stealing. It is acknowledged he broke the law. The only issue is should he have paid a fine, without a receipt, on the spot, or gone down to the station and paid a likely higher fine and got a receipt. Do you think just because the fine is paid at the station and a receipt given it ends up in a different place? If so, you have no idea how the police actually work in this country (and virtually every other developing country).

Do you live in Thailand? How many developing countries have you lived and worked in? I suggest you keep your finely tuned sense of western judicial systems out of your opinion of situations such as this as you appear to not have a clue of the real world.

TH

[Ulysses G.]

Actually the tinted visor is an offence, they stated a few months back they would now fine people for wearing them. They are also illegal in many western countries.

I don't doubt that the law exists somewhere. I did not know about it. Having used the helmet for 3 years, I was surprised to be fined for that but as I said I'm sure a law says something somewhere. It is also surprising that an 'illegal product' was on sale for so long with no info about it being illegal.

However, demanding cash repeatedly in an intimidating fashion is most certainly not a law and was illegal.

10 out of 10 for not giving the &lt;deleted&gt; any money. The more people that do this the better as it frustrates them to hel_l. Yes i do know he gets a cut later, but that is later.

It was a shakedown. I would not have paid him either!

[seagull]

I would have gladly paid the &lt;deleted&gt; and be done with it. Think we could change their corrupt mentality ? Wishful thinking. Not in a hundred years.

[HarryHacker]

It was a shakedown. I would not have paid him either!

Oh &lt;deleted&gt;, how is it a shakedown? The dude broke the law, was stopped and fined!

[Bluelotus]

Jousting with windmills

[daxbr]

Thou shall not speak in language Thai Police understands.

[sgunn65]

To those posters who say, "No big deal, pay up" I say as long as you continue to do this you help perpetuate a corrupt system and the Police will continue to steal. The small price to you is alot to others.

Evil triumphs when good men do nothing

Well done to the OP

You are so out of touch with living in a developing country it is hard to get my head around it. The police was not stealing. It is acknowledged he broke the law. The only issue is should he have paid a fine, without a receipt, on the spot, or gone down to the station and paid a likely higher fine and got a receipt. Do you think just because the fine is paid at the station and a receipt given it ends up in a different place? If so, you have no idea how the police actually work in this country (and virtually every other developing country).

Do you live in Thailand? How many developing countries have you lived and worked in? I suggest you keep yourof situations such as this as you appear to not have a clue of the real world.

finely tuned sense of western judicial systems out of your opinion

TH

With opinions so narrow I fully understand your inability to get your head around the idea that maintaining the status quo is not going to further anything but further reinforcing a corrupt system.

As it happens I do live here and whilst I don't have the, obviously, important experience of living in more than one developing country I do understand that my finely tuned sense of western judicial systems is not relevant here. However how does a fair judical system come about? Not by accepting the status quo thats for sure. The British system of justice came about off the backs of people saying "this is wrong" and doing something about it in the knowledge that they may not see the change but their children might.

If the OP has broken the law so be it, pay the fine. But paying tea money is not paying a fine. Yes the money gets split later but if more farang resisted tea money eventually things might change. maybe not in our time here though.

But I am not so stupid as to think that this is the start of the revolution or that the majority of people will not opt for the easy life. Why should they? It is much easier to pay the equivalent of 3 pounds and go on their way.

My point, had you read it with a slightly less pompous mind was that what he did was a good thing, a small thing but a good thing. I did not expect to get insulted for saying well done. But thats democracy.

Edited July 16, 2008 by sgunn65

[thaihome]

I hardly think I am one being pompous or narrow minded here.

You continue to miss the entire point. This was not “tea money”. This was a fine for breaking a law. A law which also happens to have a real good reason for existing, and at least the police are enforcing it, even though their motivation is not traffic safety, but revenue production, it remains that it is being enforced. Is that not a much better thing for Thailand then worrying about if it was paid there or at the station and if the ticket was actually recorded?

TH

[percy2]

Two things to consider here:

1) A family member here in the u.k. has in the past two weeks incurred two offences using mobile phone whilst driving works van.

Once hard luck, twice stupidity for the want of buying a bluetooth. Police even gave him a demonstration of how they had

photographed him from their car. Verdict: 6 penalty points (has been driving 22years not been involved in any other road

offences) Not to give ideas to the powers that be the fines involved were also hefty and standard.

2) No different here to Thailand people who won't listen or conform set themselves up. I shouldn't I suppose presume to call

anyone stupid not being a driver myself and can imagine that considering the difference in population that laws or the everchanging

traffic ones anyway are not always publicised enough and can seem petty until the point of being caught out.

Its one of the niceties of living in Thailand that minor traffic offences can be sorted out with a small cash contribution.

I really do prefer it to the UK system. (bye the way I have never had any points there)

Cheers

[Ulysses G.]

It was a shakedown. I would not have paid him either!

Oh &lt;deleted&gt;, how is it a shakedown? The dude broke the law, was stopped and fined!

It is a shakedown because the cop tried to intimidate him into paying cash, so that he could pocket it. Most likely, he would not have been stopped otherwise!