UK to block Thai brides trade

[george]

London Sunday Times 10th August 03

Britain to block Thai brides trade

Eben Black, Chief Political Correspondent

THE government has ordered an end to the Thai brides trade which sees hundreds of British men “buying” wives from southeast Asia each year.

David Blunkett, the home secretary, has told immigration officials that women from Thailand, the Philippines and other countries in the region should be banned from entering Britain as tourists or students unless they first sign a pledge not to marry British men.

Under the rules, women who breach the conditions and marry after arriving could be instantly deported without the right of appeal.

The decision follows figures showing that in 2001 more than 25,000 student and tourist visas were issued for Thai nationals, many of whom then got married and stayed permanently.

By contrast only 1,000 fiancée visas — the type needed for people intending to marry British citizens — were issued.

The figures for the Philippines were similar with 20,000 student or visitor visas issued compared with 930 for wives or fiancées.

Blunkett, backed by Jack Straw, the foreign secretary, has declared that the women are effectively illegal immigrants. Many have signed up to agencies that advertise them to British and other western men in catalogues or on the internet.

One controversial “brides abroad” marriage was between Brian Clegg, the former Northern Gas chairman, 75, and Thai Banjit Sawaengdee, 23. They married in 1997 but she left him days after arriving in Britain.

Under the crackdown ordered by Blunkett and Straw, immigration officers in overseas embassies will have to make visa applicants sign a pledge not to marry in Britain.

Most visas given to Thais allow them to enter Britain for three months as a visitor or a student.

The undertaking they will have to sign promises: “I do not intend to remain longer in the United Kingdom and I guarantee that I will not marry during my visit nor apply for settlement nor seek to change the conditions of my stay, nor extend the period of my stay in the United Kingdom nor take employment.”

A senior government minister said: “The system has been open to widespread abuse. Women who have agreed to marry British men are not admitting that is what they are here for. Others come in with the hope of meeting someone they can persuade to marry them.”

The restrictions may also be applied to women from Russia and other parts of the former Soviet Union.

Colin Jarvis, of the Thai Arts Foundation, who is involved with Anglo-Thai groups in Britain and has business interests in Thailand, said most women coming here contributed to British society, but some were just bar-girls on the make.

Others, however, feel the new rules are oppressive. James MacDonald, 55, a retired BT manager from Nuneaton, Warwickshire, married Lemon, 28 — her real name is Prapaporn — in Britain last year.

He paid about £1,500 to Thai Professional Introductions to arrange the meeting, hotel and visas, then fell in love.

They had a Buddhist ceremony in Thailand first and then sought a fiancée visa so that she could enter Britain where they later married.

Lemon works in a Thai restaurant in Nuneaton. “Lemon had the right visa but she still had a grilling at the airport,” said MacDonald. “We had to go back to the Home Office six months later for a spouse’s visa, and that was another nightmare.

“I don’t mind them tightening the rules, but what I don’t agree with is that some guy turning up underneath a lorry gets treated better than my wife.”

Additional reporting: Robert Mayes

[wilson steer]

Personally, I think this proposed 'pledge' for S.E. Asians is outrageous. When Thais or Filipinas, come to the U.K. and marry, good for them! They don't cause trouble, many times they are good loyal wives, who just want to escape comparitive poverty, by becoming wives and having the opportunity to work for the minimum U.K. wage. In my experience, in London Filipina maids/nannies work hard and send their money back home. The same applies to most Thai women, although the younger ones might slip into prostitution.

Consider all the African/West Indian migrants, the Albanian mafia/ Eastern Block illegal immigrants.

The trouble makers; drugs, guns, violence are rarely the S.E Asian girls. As usual Blunkett/Straw have got it wrong. They are just jealous of the S.E. Asian flesh because they are stuck with ugly, dumpy, mouldy wives!!!

[LPCustom69]

It seems a bit ridiculous to me. There are enough problems in the world that need attention more than some bureaucratic BS.

:cool:

[buasaard]

I'm not British and I'm also already married, but are human rights considered recently?

British constitution allows this? Any rule about discrimination in regard of sex, race and religion?

If applied such rule should be applied regardless of nationality, so also say french or german or dutch people shouldn't be able to marry with british people.

What about a British and a thai student genuinely fall in love? In western europe I remember we were disgusted by the fact that women living in communist countries (when communism was still in power) couldn't marry western men.

Are we doing the same?

It seems to me that as the governments cannot stop the infamous trade of people, they make laws that hit also honest people, they take the easy way!

And this rule hits also British people, that if want to marry foreigner should spend money (if they have) to go to their proposed bride country, marry and return to UK.

I'm shivering!

[pubboy]

I agree with Wilson.

I think the British government have made a rod for its own back with the handling of so called "Political Refugees". Instead of dealing with the major cause of this country's immigration problem, they pick on the soft options to cover their own <deleted>.

Maybe this is why renewal of visas is taking over six months instead of the usual six weeks.

I agree that we have to tighten up our immigration but the problem is a little closer to home than those coming from the other side of the world.

[en184]

Its government regulations like this that give me no desire to return to live in the UK.

[wolf5370]

buasaard ,

British constitution? - nope don't have one of those.

This must be in contravention of human rights - Britain has signed up for these and as a member of the EU (albeit only just!) are bound by act of parliament (which is revokable of course) to accept EU counrts and law above British law. That is, this BS law will last just as long as it takes for someone to take out a writ in the Hague.

Also, I thought it was more likely with catalogue-brides that men go to Thailand and bring them back as fiances or wives - bypassing this law yet again.

And as said already, what is this saving the government or country - how likely is it that these girls are going to be a pull on the British state? Compared to assylum seekers coming and/or bringing their extended family over etc.  

Its just another BS move by the failed British government to try and win a few votes (left wing government? Hit the soft target. Could this be more right wing/facist?) in the wake of yet another scandle - IRAQ Report 'make-believe' and the Kelly inquiry!  

[Roger13]

Tony Blair made an undertaking to reduce Immigrants.

He is under pressure to meet a reduced quota by

September I beleive.

As others have pointed out - this category - that hurts no one - is a soft target

Last time I visited London - several years ago admittedly

- I always seemed to get Mini Cab (private Taxi) drivers

who came from Iran ...

[Edit - sorry not Iran - I meant Turkey]

Roger

[wolf5370]

Well, it would hardly be news for Tony Blair to miss an election/manifesto promise would it - he's yet to meet one. Indeed, he meets most coming the other way (U-turn Tony).

If he wants to reduce the illegal immigrants and their drain of the country's wealth, then introduce ID cards like the rest of Europe (and most of the world) - no ID card, no NHS, no DHS, and deportation.

The main objection from the media was that 9 out of 10 rejected assylum seekers are not deported. The state still supports then one way or another - such softness makes the UK their no 1 destination. Surely this is a softer target - appeals out of country. Also, Asylum seekers are supposed to stop at the first safe country and request assylum, but they come through the tunnel from France after crossing Europe! It took the UK a really stupid agreement (that actually increased the immigration population) with France to close Songat (spelt correctly?) which was positioned perfectly as a restcamp for Assylum seekers before making their dash through the tunnel - after discarding their passports of course.

[the scouser]

No one need worry. The fact that such a declaration has been made is uneforcable should a Thai woman subsequently decide to marry whilst in the UK. The UK used to get Libyans to sign similar declarations saying that they promise not to blow things up or shoot policewomen dead whilst in the country. Do you think that would stop 'em?

Scouse.

ps. Wolf - Sangatte.

[pubboy]

THE leader of an Albanian gang who ran a multi-million pound operation smuggling their countrymen into Britain has been jailed for eight years.

Mhill Sokoli, 35, was also fined £88,000. Another 24 gang members were jailed for between three and eight years.

The court in Dendermonde, north-west of Brussels, estimated that the gang had smuggled as many as 10,000 illegal immigrants from eastern Europe into Britain in 2001-2002 using boats and trucks from Zeebrugge.

The gang charged between £270 and £2,000 per person.

The prosecution said that for each night's "work" over about two years, Sokoli had earned several thousand pounds.

The court heard how he concealed his wealth by living in a small flat in Brussels.

But much of his money was invested in property in Albania.

The gang was made up of Albanians and Turks.

Most of the illegal immigrants - mainly Kosovo Albanians - went first to Italy by boat and then travelled by lorry into Britain.

In June, a Dutch court jailed seven members of a Chinese gang for up to six years for smuggling illegal immigrants into Britain.

Four of the suspects were charged in connection with the deaths of 58 Chinese migrants, who were found suffocated in a lorry in Dover in 2000.

And this is just one gang!

The British government cannot stop these, so they have to meet their quotas some how.

[RalphtheOgre]

With England having some of the most extremist Islamic groups in Europe, preparing for islamizing the rest of Europe, without doing anything about it, but instead stopping men from getting girlfriends and wives, who have not transformed into Women's Libs Half Men (also compared to an Asian girl with a PhD) - that indicates a somewhat clouded thinking.

Myself Swede, just preparing my fifth consecutive winter in Thailand and the countries around, I can somewhat compare with Sweden of course. It is different here from some other European countries - hardly anyone marries here anyway so they cannot force Swedish-Asian couples to do either. I do not think the "bride business" is rampant here, but 200.000 Swedes visited Thailand last year, and a considerate number were of course there to find a girlfriend (or could not avoid finding one...) who did not find it the most important thing in marriage that the paper on the refrigerator telling whose week it is to clean the dishes, was scrupulously followed - Thai girls have much more efficient ways to make the guys WANT to be nice.....

And yes, I like to find Thai girls on Internet, with good English and good education. It is rather easy to fill in the papers for a Thai girlfriend to come here for a 6-month visit, takes 2-3 months. Applying for a fiancee visa takes something like 10 months followed by an interview in the Swedish Embassy in Bangkok, still having nothing with marriage to do, and as far as I know, is hassle-free if the girl, during the interview in the embassy, seems honest, really knows and loves the guy, showing it is not something that just popped up in the head of her the day before. Come here, she has to go to the immigration with an interval of 6 months, to prove they are still living together in harmony, and after 2 years she gets a permanent residence permit.

European guys who bring in cute Asian girls only to force them to be whores, should be hanged.

[buasaard]

European guys who bring in cute Asian girls only to force them to be whores, should be hanged.

Well, I'm against death penalty but I agree with the general sense of the sentence.

Infact instead of jailing people involved in the infamous trading, they prefer to take a shortcut.

After all, asian brides do not vote, the traders do.

[ThaiPauly]

This is a very interesting and intellegent post.

Perhaps one of you guys could tell me how I could expect my personal situation to work out. I am British.

I maried my Thai Wife in Bangkok 9 months ago. If we wanted to (and I am not saying we do) move to the UK what sort of reaction could we expect to receive from immigration.?

I have heard a time frame of 2 years bandied about, but I am not sure if its true. Any of you learned Gentlemen have any facts on this matter.

Thank You Very Much

TP

[Dragonman]

It took me 7 weeks after we got married to have the visa. But in my opinion anyone wanting to return to UK other than at the end of a gun would be insane

Just look at the guy whose speech started this post, David Blunkett and his mate Jack Straw. Such honorable guys who never lied in their lives Blunkett didn't want a thai housekeeper obviously

Anyone non black or muslim in the UK can be discriminated against, and that includes us taffs

[gburns57au]

To look at it from another point of view.....it may stop some gullible guys like Mr Clegg from being taken in.....he is not an isolated case....

All this means is that IF you have a legitimate relationship you apply with the correct visa as at least 1000 Brits did.

[bkk_mike]

This is all crap - it's only "news" because there's an election campaign going on.

The rules changed in January saying that people on tourist or student visas couldn't get married in the UK anyway, without applying for a specific wedding visa (if they don't intend to reside in the UK). There is an exception - if they get married at an Anglican church, but most vicars would only willingly marry two Anglicans.

What's even weaker is the example given is actually someone who applied for a fiance visa, which means nothing changes anyway...

What's the fuss? - This is spin for an election campaign where the government is seen as being weak on immigration.

The Conservative opposition is led by a man whose father managed to immigrate from Romania only because of a labour MPs letter to the Home Secretary at the time after the father was refused entry... i.e. The sort of letter that could, in these politically correct times, result in an MP having to resign. Under current rules, the father wouldn't have got into the UK legally. (Although Romania and Bulgaria will get into the EU in 2007/8, which would, obviously, change things).

Tightening the rules for legal immigration simply makes more and more people think that illegal immigration becomes an option. (After all - if you get into the UK with no papers and ask for asylum, and can persuade immigration that sending you back to your named country of origin might be dangerous for you, you are on a fast track to a UK passport in 5-6 years. But since they have no documents, it's difficult to confirm where, exactly, an asylum seeker has come from. Undocumented Albanians used to say they were from Kosovo, etc.)

Edited April 19, 2005 by bkk_mike

[Rinrada]

To look at it from another point of view.....it may stop some gullible guys like Mr Clegg from being taken in.....he is not an isolated case....

All this means is that IF you have a legitimate relationship you apply with the correct visa as at least 1000 Brits did.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Agree...and from 1st February 2005....nung,song...song pan ha.....if you have legit relationship and apply for a Settlement do da and go to Blightly and talk to your local friendly nominated register Office with said do da ....then you WILL be OK.

[Joey Boy]

Blunkett and Straw are probably both just gettin pissed that com lights out there both laid up with nackered hags