Biogas Assistance Scheme For Smes

[IsaanAussie]

From todays Bangkok Post.

ENERGY

Energy Ministry scheme to widen uptake of biogas YUTHANA PRAIWAN

Small and medium-sized firms can cut 80% from the cost of installing biogas technology by joining a new Energy Ministry programme. The Energy Policy and Planning Office (EPPO) is sponsoring the project as part of the government's five-billion-baht five-year biogas promotion scheme ending in 2012, said EPPO secretary-general Viraphol Jirapraditkul.

He said the new biogas investment sponsorship initiative has a budget of 180 million baht and has a target at least 300 business operators applying before the programme ends in 2010.

This year's successful applicants will gain financial support as high as 80% of their total costs. Support will be reduced to 60% for businesses applying next year and to 40% for those applying in 2010.

''To convince business operators to help the country develop renewable fuel, we have to provide financial support,'' Mr Viraphol said. ''Initial expenses such as consultants' fees, construction and equipment design fees would discourage them from [adopting] new technology.''

Authorities have already has success in persuading companies with high amounts of solid waste _ over 10,000 cubic metres a day _ to turn solid waste and waste water from production into methane gas or liquefied petroleum gas.

Typical large-scale biogas producers are in the poultry, agro-industry and food processing sectors. The new programme is aimed at smaller-scale operators such as restaurants, food courts, hotels and resorts, which produce only around 50 cubic metres per day.

EPPO believes biogas from the new scheme could substitute 3,250 tonnes of LPG worth 58.5 million baht each year. The project should also cut budgets for eliminating waste in the community.

Solid waste that can be turned into methane includes waste from palm oil, cassava, rubber and poultry. Waste water from ethanol and food processing plants is also suitable for producing biogas.

[farmerjo]

From todays Bangkok Post.

ENERGY

Energy Ministry scheme to widen uptake of biogas YUTHANA PRAIWAN

Small and medium-sized firms can cut 80% from the cost of installing biogas technology by joining a new Energy Ministry programme. The Energy Policy and Planning Office (EPPO) is sponsoring the project as part of the government's five-billion-baht five-year biogas promotion scheme ending in 2012, said EPPO secretary-general Viraphol Jirapraditkul.

He said the new biogas investment sponsorship initiative has a budget of 180 million baht and has a target at least 300 business operators applying before the programme ends in 2010.

This year's successful applicants will gain financial support as high as 80% of their total costs. Support will be reduced to 60% for businesses applying next year and to 40% for those applying in 2010.

''To convince business operators to help the country develop renewable fuel, we have to provide financial support,'' Mr Viraphol said. ''Initial expenses such as consultants' fees, construction and equipment design fees would discourage them from [adopting] new technology.''

Authorities have already has success in persuading companies with high amounts of solid waste _ over 10,000 cubic metres a day _ to turn solid waste and waste water from production into methane gas or liquefied petroleum gas.

Typical large-scale biogas producers are in the poultry, agro-industry and food processing sectors. The new programme is aimed at smaller-scale operators such as restaurants, food courts, hotels and resorts, which produce only around 50 cubic metres per day.

EPPO believes biogas from the new scheme could substitute 3,250 tonnes of LPG worth 58.5 million baht each year. The project should also cut budgets for eliminating waste in the community.

Solid waste that can be turned into methane includes waste from palm oil, cassava, rubber and poultry. Waste water from ethanol and food processing plants is also suitable for producing biogas.

Do you think they would recover there spending I/A?

[farmerjo]

Thats it,sell the farm,buy a resturant,spend 30 mil and sell the power to the pea for 180 mil.

[IsaanAussie]

Thats it,sell the farm,buy a resturant,spend 30 mil and sell the power to the pea for 180 mil.

Jo Jo,

No, open a restaurant at the farm. Government pays to install your biodigester..... Doesnt say anything about success of the restaurant business but the gas would be handy.

Isaanaussie

[farmerjo]

Thats it,sell the farm,buy a resturant,spend 30 mil and sell the power to the pea for 180 mil.

Jo Jo,

No, open a restaurant at the farm. Government pays to install your biodigester..... Doesnt say anything about success of the restaurant business but the gas would be handy.

Isaanaussie

Alright,you design it,maizefarmer can be the consultant and i will construct it!

[IsaanAussie]

Thats it,sell the farm,buy a resturant,spend 30 mil and sell the power to the pea for 180 mil.

Jo Jo,

No, open a restaurant at the farm. Government pays to install your biodigester..... Doesnt say anything about success of the restaurant business but the gas would be handy.

Isaanaussie

Alright,you design it,maizefarmer can be the consultant and i will construct it!

OK,

I have the design for a range of dome digesters and even how to do sheets (yes in English). My part done. You get Maizefarmer to consult and I will prepare the site. Let me know when you can start building.

[IsaanAussie]

Here is the site photo as it stands. The grassed area in the foreground is where we will build the digester. The posts behind are for the pig sty.

[Lickey]

Hi IssAus,

Good luck with your project and using the methane gas to your benifit, me. being an ex-truck driver/diesel engineer and now a fruit farmer in Thailand, please could you explain something for me.

I see you will have dome tanks, part of which is underground? the pig slurry goes in and you collect the gas ect, so what happens when the tanks are full?is it possible to bag it and flog by the roadside or does it need to be pumped out and broadcast onto farming land, or other uses?

Thanks, Lickey.

[IsaanAussie]

Hi IssAus,

Good luck with your project and using the methane gas to your benifit, me. being an ex-truck driver/diesel engineer and now a fruit farmer in Thailand, please could you explain something for me.

I see you will have dome tanks, part of which is underground? the pig slurry goes in and you collect the gas ect, so what happens when the tanks are full?is it possible to bag it and flog by the roadside or does it need to be pumped out and broadcast onto farming land, or other uses?

Thanks, Lickey.

Lickey,

The attached diagram shows the two domed tanks.

First the digester where the gas is produced, and an expansion chamber to the left. As unused gas collects in the digester the slurry is forced up into the expansion chamber, as gas is expended or vented the slurry returns to the digester. The digester is sized to hold the influent for 40 to 60 days in which time all the nasties are eliminated. After that time processed effluent slurry then flows out of the expansion chamber and into a holding tank or pit as shown to the left. In my case I am planning to use 2 sand filters to seperate solids for the liquid component.

So no you do not have to pump out the tanks the material flows through all by itself.

I plan to use the dries solids for vermicomposting, after that bag those results as fast as I can if there is a market as worm castings make great potting mix and mushroom base. Use it myself probably. The worms go into the chicken coup, pig feed and the fish pond.

The liquid effluent will go straight onto the garden, and perhaps into a hydropondic shed at some later stage

Hope that provides you with your answers.

Now my question for a diesel engineer, and parked up truck driver. How much do you know about gas replacement ratios in diesel engines? I am looking for some information to prepare for the methane usage. Plan to use it for electricity generation, and also for drying.

Isaanaussie

Edited October 16, 2008 by IsaanAussie

[Lickey]

Thanks for the explanation IA, its clear what happens after the gas is extracted and the nasties that its ok to use on the land ect,

Ive read on this forum somewhere that fisheries use slurry as food, but sureley not in its raw state? I remeber in the UK about 20 years ago a pig farmer let his neat slurry into a local river, killed everything downsteam for about 7 miles, even grass and weeds on the bank before local council found the source.

I cant help you much on the gas powered engine bit, but the engines i did work on had an extra oil feed into the intake manifold to make up for the lack of lubrication by gas for upper cyl lubricant,

If you know the type and model of Gennie you will be using, my older brother in the UK is a designer of pumping stations,gen set applications [from 1cyl Lister Petter to V16 perkins/cummins/komatshu engines] Post the info on the engine and if he can help you he will, He will need everything off the engine ID plate if posible.

Cheers, Lickey.

[IsaanAussie]

Thanks for the explanation IA, its clear what happens after the gas is extracted and the nasties that its ok to use on the land ect,

Ive read on this forum somewhere that fisheries use slurry as food, but sureley not in its raw state? I remeber in the UK about 20 years ago a pig farmer let his neat slurry into a local river, killed everything downsteam for about 7 miles, even grass and weeds on the bank before local council found the source.

I cant help you much on the gas powered engine bit, but the engines i did work on had an extra oil feed into the intake manifold to make up for the lack of lubrication by gas for upper cyl lubricant,

If you know the type and model of Gennie you will be using, my older brother in the UK is a designer of pumping stations,gen set applications [from 1cyl Lister Petter to V16 perkins/cummins/komatshu engines] Post the info on the engine and if he can help you he will, He will need everything off the engine ID plate if posible.

Cheers, Lickey.

Lickey,

I would hazard a guess that your UK polution problem was the result of detergent/disinfectant released by the farm and not the pig manure. Here washing the raw sewage into a pond is common practice and Pla nin etc flourish.

I am intending to use a pickup engine, type unknown as yet but it will be an older model for three reasons. Firstly no common rail technology, secondly the gas has traces of hydrogen sulphide in it and will probably be quite corrosive, and thirdly the AUD is getting a thumping at the moment. The gas technology I am basing my system on is a simple mixing valve system prior to injection.

I am thinking that a Mazda engine is probably the way to go as it develops higher torque at low revs than most, interested to hear what your brother has to say on that subject. Thanks for the offer.

Isaanaussie

[IsaanAussie]

Thanks for the explanation IA, its clear what happens after the gas is extracted and the nasties that its ok to use on the land ect,

Ive read on this forum somewhere that fisheries use slurry as food, but sureley not in its raw state? I remeber in the UK about 20 years ago a pig farmer let his neat slurry into a local river, killed everything downsteam for about 7 miles, even grass and weeds on the bank before local council found the source.

I cant help you much on the gas powered engine bit, but the engines i did work on had an extra oil feed into the intake manifold to make up for the lack of lubrication by gas for upper cyl lubricant,

If you know the type and model of Gennie you will be using, my older brother in the UK is a designer of pumping stations,gen set applications [from 1cyl Lister Petter to V16 perkins/cummins/komatshu engines] Post the info on the engine and if he can help you he will, He will need everything off the engine ID plate if posible.

Cheers, Lickey.

Lickey,

I wonder if your brother knows much about straight vegetable oil conversions for diesels. I am told there is an English company that markets kits for less than a thousand quid to suit the Ford Ranger. Next time you are talking to him, could you ask if he knows the company or the technology? Lister single cylinder, love to get my hands on one of those, burn almost anything, bit flat belts slapping around, great stuff...

By the way, I believe you owe me a joke in your humour thread.....

Isaanaussie

Edited October 16, 2008 by IsaanAussie

[Offroadlanna]

Now my question for a diesel engineer, and parked up truck driver. How much do you know about gas replacement ratios in diesel engines? I am looking for some information to prepare for the methane usage. Plan to use it for electricity generation, and also for drying.

Isaanaussie

Depends a bit on how you set it up. If dual-fuelled, you can go for about 80% biogas and 20% diesel oil and the engine will run without much of a problem. In practice the replacement rate is lower and a pig farm in Chiangrai manages a 62% replacement rate (62% gas and 38% diesel).

What you can also do (and what quite a few of the large pig farmers do here around Chiangmai) is to buy either secondhand petrol engines or converted diesel engines and run the engine on 100% biogas. In all cases you will require more maintenane due to the hydrogen sulphide in the gas and you will need to overhaul the engine in 3-5 years time.

[IsaanAussie]

Depends a bit on how you set it up. If dual-fuelled, you can go for about 80% biogas and 20% diesel oil and the engine will run without much of a problem. In practice the replacement rate is lower and a pig farm in Chiangrai manages a 62% replacement rate (62% gas and 38% diesel).

What you can also do (and what quite a few of the large pig farmers do here around Chiangmai) is to buy either secondhand petrol engines or converted diesel engines and run the engine on 100% biogas. In all cases you will require more maintenane due to the hydrogen sulphide in the gas and you will need to overhaul the engine in 3-5 years time.

ORL,

Thanks for your notes. I have some experience at 70-30% with NGV installations here, and since the NG here is low methane thought that those figures should be about the same as biogas would yield, 60-40% yeah not so bad. Hadn't actually considered using a petrol engine but its a good alternative as you dont have to have the diesel on site.

Any idea on the engine type and usage on ChiangMai pig farms?

Isaanaussie

[Lickey]

Just to clarify things a bit, it was the pig farmers slurry lagoon that overfilled and killed the river an fish,weeds ect, so that was fermented shit, not fresh,

Cheers, Lickey.

[IsaanAussie]

Just to clarify things a bit, it was the pig farmers slurry lagoon that overfilled and killed the river an fish,weeds ect, so that was fermented shit, not fresh,

Cheers, Lickey.

OK, thats different. The issue is the concentration levels. I'm no scientist but I do know that the slurry depletes the oxygen level in the water. In a storage pond there are no fish or weeds for that reason.

Thanks for the clarification.

[IsaanAussie]

I have just read an article where pig manure has been thermochemically treated to produce oil. Fancy that, not only can I grow their food with their shit, but if I can teach them to drive they can take themselves to market. Amazing...

Edited October 28, 2008 by IsaanAussie

[Lickey]

Sounds good, but i think we have enough road hogs already!!

I posted this blog to brother and he sent me this one, very interesting read, not so far from where i used to live, cheers. Lickey.

http://www.suffolkcoastal.gov.uk/yourdistr...sit/default.htm