Lump Sum........

[damoinparadise]

Hi all,

I am very vey seriously looking to sell up and move to Thailand, can any one tell me what amount of money I would need in the bank to be able to live off the interest? I am workingg on a 5% interest rate just to get started. Its quite confusing, I've seen anything from £70,000 to £200,000. Anyones help would be appreciated!

[GungaDin]

If you are single, the minimum needed to live normally, would be around 70,000bt / month.

Others will disagree.

[harrry]

And if you are living on that you also have to earn a lot to cover inflation so my guess is 5% wouldnt be enough in the long term.

[OriginalPoster]

Hi all,

I am very vey seriously looking to sell up and move to Thailand, can any one tell me what amount of money I would need in the bank to be able to live off the interest? I am workingg on a 5% interest rate just to get started. Its quite confusing, I've seen anything from £70,000 to £200,000. Anyones help would be appreciated!

At what age?

I will be interesting to see what type of numbers people come up with. These threads come up now and again and there's never a firm answer, but the last time I saw that question come up in this forum the markets were still rising and people were poppoing up expressing confidence that they could make 15 to 20% annually on their money over the long term. Of course, if you can do that you don't need a lot of money to retire no matter what your age, but these days people seem to be more hoping that their money doesn't get wiped out raher than thinking that the can just sit around and get rich by pouring their money into the hot investment de jour.

Edited October 27, 2008 by OriginalPoster

[BEENTHEREDONETHAT]

This could help you in trying to come up with a reasonable amount.

http://inflationdata.com/inflation/Retirem..._Calculator.asp

[MetroGirl]

Don't forget the most important amount: the minimum to meet the visa requirement

[Gary A]

It's a simple thing. The first thing you need to know is how long you're going to live. Once you know that there are a few other simple details needed to come up with a number. For example, what will the currency exchange rates be, what will the inflation rate be and how are your investments going to do.

Many carefully worked out personal financial plans are now in ruins. What the future will bring is anyone's guess. AND, I stress GUESS.

Edited October 28, 2008 by Gary A

[chiang mai]

The number will vary based on interest rates and rates of return on your money and that will vary greatly but you should make the calculation based on a worst case scenario. For example, returns on GBP for example were easily in the 6.5% to 7% range a few months ago but in twelve months time they will almost certainly be much lower, say 4% to 5% - that makes a huge difference. Inflation is another important factor and based on events in Thailand over the past few months that should not be underestimated - using an 8% inflation figure is not unreasonable. The third and final component is exchange rate and as we are seeing presently that can also vary widely over time - using an exchange rate of 35 baht per pound would not be unreasonable either. So, when you figure out what your actually monthly spend rate is likely to be in Baht, say 80,000 baht a month all in, take that number and work backwards through all the factors described above and then project it forward over the next ten years and don't be surprised if you come up with a figure of greater than £500,000.

Actually did the math and using the criteria shown above (4% interest, 8% inflation, 80k baht spend per month and 35 baht per Pound), £400k will last you 13 years before you go broke.

Edited October 28, 2008 by chiang mai

[damoinparadise]

Hi all,

I am very vey seriously looking to sell up and move to Thailand, can any one tell me what amount of money I would need in the bank to be able to live off the interest? I am workingg on a 5% interest rate just to get started. Its quite confusing, I've seen anything from £70,000 to £200,000. Anyones help would be appreciated!

At what age?

I will be interesting to see what type of numbers people come up with. These threads come up now and again and there's never a firm answer, but the last time I saw that question come up in this forum the markets were still rising and people were poppoing up expressing confidence that they could make 15 to 20% annually on their money over the long term. Of course, if you can do that you don't need a lot of money to retire no matter what your age, but these days people seem to be more hoping that their money doesn't get wiped out raher than thinking that the can just sit around and get rich by pouring their money into the hot investment de jour.

Hi, thanks fo your reply. I am 39 and am basing it on the sale of my house which would give me about 100k. I have multiple sclerosis but my symptoms are mild and no-one notices there is anything wrong so I'm very lucky in that respect. After holidaying in Thailand this year and seeing how cheaply someone can live there, it has triggered thoughts of moving there as I think it would be good for me, no stress etc....

Are you living there permanent?

[kash]

Hi, thanks fo your reply. I am 39 and am basing it on the sale of my house which would give me about 100k. I have multiple sclerosis but my symptoms are mild and no-one notices there is anything wrong so I'm very lucky in that respect. After holidaying in Thailand this year and seeing how cheaply someone can live there, it has triggered thoughts of moving there as I think it would be good for me, no stress etc....

I did a pretty good budget last year, rented a two floor apartment in Chiang Mai - my cost was as follow (actual cost divided per month):

Rent: 2,700

Utilities: 1,000

Gasoline: 800

Food: 6,000

Health: 2,500 (savings account if not used)

Internet: 800

Cell: 500

Insurance: 1,500

Goods: 4,000

Total: 19,800

This was the basic costs just too live - in addition I spent in average 50k more on just crap (restaurants, drinks and travel). But this basic budget is a decent standard, Chiang Mai is cheap and you could live on much less if you tried too ... my neighbour which live in the same complex has a budget of 9000 per month and is happy and content.

Good luck!

[GuestHouse]

On what you have told us I think you should seriously reconsider selling up to move to Thailand full time, and consider other options: Renting your place and living off the income may be an alternative. As may be taking longer holidays in Thailand (you only pay the airfare once for longer in Thailand).

The reason I say this is based on your long term health needs. I have a cousin with MS who has just returned from the US to the UK, he wisely did not sell up when he moved to the US and hence maintained a permanent home in the UK that he could move into. Like Thailand, like the US has very limited health care for people who are unable to pay, giving up access to the NHS for anyone with serious long term health problems is not something to do lightly.

Thailand does of course have private health care, though this is not as cheap as it was, I believe I am right in saying that inflation in the Thai Health Sector is way way above that in the general economy.

On the subject of Inflation - I believe Thailand's inflation rate is currently around 8.5% (inflation for foreigners who have different spending patterns than do Thais is undoubtedly higher). Keep the 7:10 rule in mind - 7% inflation means prices will double in 10 years. 10% means they will double in 7 years.

Putting aside the current financial woes, inflation at 8.5% is eating away at spending power of anyone on a fixed income.

Sorry to hear your health news, and sorry if my response is cautionary.

[Super Hans]

I don't see inflation as being that big a deal, although this of course varies with individual needs. If someone is thinking of leaving the rat race and living a relatively frugal existence in Thailand, inflation is not that big an issue because they would be living life akin to a Thai. Basic housing/food costs aren't going to spiral as your average Thai on 6-10k isn't going to be able to afford them. Inflation may well eat into a westerner's budget if they want to live a western lifestyle, but if they eat and live as cheaply as a Thai, it's not going to be such a big deal IMO.

OP - are you able to claim UK benefits and still live in Thailand? There are many disabled people doing that, who live modestly but easily. DLA etc will bump up your lump sum and provide a monthly income until pension time. If you are thinking of renting rather selling, make sure you use a good agent and be extremely careful who you rent to - it can be a right nightmare.

[GungaDin]

Damon,

following on from Guesthouse's suggestion, how much monthly rental / income, do you think your property could generate?

Don't forget your outgoings, rates, repairs, etc.

BTW to the forum.

[damoinparadise]

Damon,

following on from Guesthouse's suggestion, how much monthly rental / income, do you think your property could generate?

Don't forget your outgoings, rates, repairs, etc.

BTW to the forum.

Thanks Gungadin for the welcome, unfortunately renting for an income would not be an option as there is not enough profit in it, my house loan to value ratio is about 50/50.

[damoinparadise]

Hi, thanks fo your reply. I am 39 and am basing it on the sale of my house which would give me about 100k. I have multiple sclerosis but my symptoms are mild and no-one notices there is anything wrong so I'm very lucky in that respect. After holidaying in Thailand this year and seeing how cheaply someone can live there, it has triggered thoughts of moving there as I think it would be good for me, no stress etc....

I did a pretty good budget last year, rented a two floor apartment in Chiang Mai - my cost was as follow (actual cost divided per month):

Rent: 2,700

Utilities: 1,000

Gasoline: 800

Food: 6,000

Health: 2,500 (savings account if not used)

Internet: 800

Cell: 500

Insurance: 1,500

Goods: 4,000

Total: 19,800

This was the basic costs just too live - in addition I spent in average 50k more on just crap (restaurants, drinks and travel). But this basic budget is a decent standard, Chiang Mai is cheap and you could live on much less if you tried too ... my neighbour which live in the same complex has a budget of 9000 per month and is happy and content.

Good luck!

Thanks Kash,

sounds like it is possible for me to do. Where would you say is cheaper to live, Chang Mai, Pattaya or Bangkok? Or somewhere else?

[damoinparadise]

Hi, thanks fo your reply. I am 39 and am basing it on the sale of my house which would give me about 100k. I have multiple sclerosis but my symptoms are mild and no-one notices there is anything wrong so I'm very lucky in that respect. After holidaying in Thailand this year and seeing how cheaply someone can live there, it has triggered thoughts of moving there as I think it would be good for me, no stress etc....

I did a pretty good budget last year, rented a two floor apartment in Chiang Mai - my cost was as follow (actual cost divided per month):

Rent: 2,700

Utilities: 1,000

Gasoline: 800

Food: 6,000

Health: 2,500 (savings account if not used)

Internet: 800

Cell: 500

Insurance: 1,500

Goods: 4,000

Total: 19,800

This was the basic costs just too live - in addition I spent in average 50k more on just crap (restaurants, drinks and travel). But this basic budget is a decent standard, Chiang Mai is cheap and you could live on much less if you tried too ... my neighbour which live in the same complex has a budget of 9000 per month and is happy and content.

Good luck!

Thanks Kash,

sounds like it is possible for me to do. Where would you say is cheaper to live, Chang Mai, Pattaya or Bangkok? Or somewhere else?

What do you get for 2,700 rent?

[damoinparadise]

On what you have told us I think you should seriously reconsider selling up to move to Thailand full time, and consider other options: Renting your place and living off the income may be an alternative. As may be taking longer holidays in Thailand (you only pay the airfare once for longer in Thailand).

The reason I say this is based on your long term health needs. I have a cousin with MS who has just returned from the US to the UK, he wisely did not sell up when he moved to the US and hence maintained a permanent home in the UK that he could move into. Like Thailand, like the US has very limited health care for people who are unable to pay, giving up access to the NHS for anyone with serious long term health problems is not something to do lightly.

Thailand does of course have private health care, though this is not as cheap as it was, I believe I am right in saying that inflation in the Thai Health Sector is way way above that in the general economy.

On the subject of Inflation - I believe Thailand's inflation rate is currently around 8.5% (inflation for foreigners who have different spending patterns than do Thais is undoubtedly higher). Keep the 7:10 rule in mind - 7% inflation means prices will double in 10 years. 10% means they will double in 7 years.

Putting aside the current financial woes, inflation at 8.5% is eating away at spending power of anyone on a fixed income.

Sorry to hear your health news, and sorry if my response is cautionary.

Thanks Guesthouse, I appreciate all you have said and your caution is very understandable.

I am throwing caution to the wind a little, mainly due to my MS. As I say, I am lucky in that I have only 'invisible symptoms' at present, and want to do something before or if things get worse. If I stay here and things get worse then the state will only end up taking what I have worked hard for and I don't want that...........

I joined this site to get honest and unbiased comments so thank you again.

Can I ask whereabouts you are in the world?

If only I could see into the future

[damoinparadise]

I don't see inflation as being that big a deal, although this of course varies with individual needs. If someone is thinking of leaving the rat race and living a relatively frugal existence in Thailand, inflation is not that big an issue because they would be living life akin to a Thai. Basic housing/food costs aren't going to spiral as your average Thai on 6-10k isn't going to be able to afford them. Inflation may well eat into a westerner's budget if they want to live a western lifestyle, but if they eat and live as cheaply as a Thai, it's not going to be such a big deal IMO.

OP - are you able to claim UK benefits and still live in Thailand? There are many disabled people doing that, who live modestly but easily. DLA etc will bump up your lump sum and provide a monthly income until pension time. If you are thinking of renting rather selling, make sure you use a good agent and be extremely careful who you rent to - it can be a right nightmare.

Thanks Hans,

I claim DLA but only the basic care rate and I wouldn't be able to claim it if I moved to Thailand..........

[GuestHouse]

Can I ask whereabouts you are in the world?

I'm in Jeddah, Saudi Arabia.

[GungaDin]

What do you get for 2,700 rent?

I'd like to know too.

[Super Hans]

What do you get for 2,700 rent?

I'd like to know too.

I'd imagine a very basic room. CM is very cheap though - have seen brand new places advertised for 3k, with pool etc etc.

[Super Hans]

Thanks Kash,

sounds like it is possible for me to do. Where would you say is cheaper to live, Chang Mai, Pattaya or Bangkok? Or somewhere else?

The order you have them in is correct, although it all depends on what you plan to spend your money on...If you plan to live a humble, simple lifestyle, you can live very cheaply. Go chasing girls and out on the piss all the time and you can go broke very quickly.

CM is dirt cheap and very nice. Maybe a little boring though.

Pattaya can be very cheap, but probably takes some getting used to. Not somewhere I could see myself settling. Those that live there tell me it's actually an ok place to live when you've learned to avoid the touristy areas. There is a race to the bottom when it comes to prices.

Bangkok is pretty expensive, but is the only place I'd live in Thailand.

Obviously the rural areas are going to be the cheapest places to live, but would you want to live in Issan?

This thread may help. http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/Live-Thai-t210190.html

I don't see inflation as being that big a deal, although this of course varies with individual needs. If someone is thinking of leaving the rat race and living a relatively frugal existence in Thailand, inflation is not that big an issue because they would be living life akin to a Thai. Basic housing/food costs aren't going to spiral as your average Thai on 6-10k isn't going to be able to afford them. Inflation may well eat into a westerner's budget if they want to live a western lifestyle, but if they eat and live as cheaply as a Thai, it's not going to be such a big deal IMO.

OP - are you able to claim UK benefits and still live in Thailand? There are many disabled people doing that, who live modestly but easily. DLA etc will bump up your lump sum and provide a monthly income until pension time. If you are thinking of renting rather selling, make sure you use a good agent and be extremely careful who you rent to - it can be a right nightmare.

Thanks Hans,

I claim DLA but only the basic care rate and I wouldn't be able to claim it if I moved to Thailand..........

Don't tell them...

[kash]

What do you get for 2,700 rent?

2 floor apartment, 2 bathrooms, kitchen and a 3x2 fenced outside area ... located just outside the city, but 5 min walk to the night bazar. pretty good deal, hard to find though, but get a local with you and search the area you would like to stay in and you'll find wonders ... if you wish to live outside the city you can get a house for 3-4k

Edited October 28, 2008 by kash

[GungaDin]

What do you get for 2,700 rent?

2 floor apartment, 2 bathrooms, kitchen and a 3x2 fenced outside area ... located just outside the city, but 5 min walk to the night bazar. pretty good deal, hard to find though, but get a local with you and search the area you would like to stay in and you'll find wonders ... if you wish to live outside the city you can get a house for 3-4k

Furnished, part furnished, unfurnished?

Air-conned?

Quiet?

[Naam]

Can I ask whereabouts you are in the world?

I'm in Jeddah, Saudi Arabia.

best place on this planet to live! worked and lived there for 5½ years. that was in "ancient" times. but visiting nearly every year. unfortunately Saudi Arabia has no retiree program and Portwine is rather hard to come by

[GuestHouse]

Can I ask whereabouts you are in the world?

I'm in Jeddah, Saudi Arabia.

best place on this planet to live! worked and lived there for 5½ years. that was in "ancient" times. but visiting nearly every year. unfortunately Saudi Arabia has no retiree program and Portwine is rather hard to come by

You know the first time that you mentioned how much you liked Jaddah I thought 'It's nice but I can't see myself singing the praises of the place'. A year on and I've come right around to your view, it is a very fine city to live in.

---------

Back to the OP's question.

I really do think it would be advisable to take the time to get some professional advice on the implications of moving to Thailand with a chronic and progressive health condition. Your GP will be able to arrange health counseling, while spending money getting your financial plan numbers crunched would be a worth while investment.

Advice here that you can find accommodation for Bht2700/month, the you can cover your health costs for Bht2500 a month and that inflation does not matter would be laughable if it did not risk leading you into a poverty trap.

And remember, the most misleading advice is of that which we wish to hear.

[lordofdelusion]

Wow, haven't seen one of these threads in a long time. The world economic picture has left many staying at home to work for another 10 years.

For my 2 cents.....it will cost more than you think. Your currency may devalue 20% and your investments stop producing any income. That's just my personal experience over the last year or so. As was posted earlier, if you just knew how long you were going to live, the rate of inflation, the markets,etc; it would be a snap. Knowing what I know now, would I have left work 2 years ago? Yes. There is more to life than work and money.

Asking yourself "why Thailand?" would help you to choose a location to live. If expense is a consideration, then I'd pass on Phuket. Have a look around before settling.

BTW, I worked with people with MS and they managed quite well for many years. Best of luck with your medication choices. They can make a great difference.

[chiang mai]

Hi all,

I am very vey seriously looking to sell up and move to Thailand, can any one tell me what amount of money I would need in the bank to be able to live off the interest? I am workingg on a 5% interest rate just to get started. Its quite confusing, I've seen anything from £70,000 to £200,000. Anyones help would be appreciated!

At what age?

I will be interesting to see what type of numbers people come up with. These threads come up now and again and there's never a firm answer, but the last time I saw that question come up in this forum the markets were still rising and people were poppoing up expressing confidence that they could make 15 to 20% annually on their money over the long term. Of course, if you can do that you don't need a lot of money to retire no matter what your age, but these days people seem to be more hoping that their money doesn't get wiped out raher than thinking that the can just sit around and get rich by pouring their money into the hot investment de jour.

Hi, thanks fo your reply. I am 39 and am basing it on the sale of my house which would give me about 100k. I have multiple sclerosis but my symptoms are mild and no-one notices there is anything wrong so I'm very lucky in that respect. After holidaying in Thailand this year and seeing how cheaply someone can live there, it has triggered thoughts of moving there as I think it would be good for me, no stress etc....

Are you living there permanent?

With all dues respect to Guesthouse whose comments are accurate and appropriate in one sense, there is another side to the coin. My sister was diagnosed with MS at age 20 and she is now 63, the effects of the disease progressed very slowly over the years and today she can still walk although not without use of a walking stick. Over the years we have discussed a range of possible treatments but she has usually followed the advice of her neurologist and decided to steer clear of beta interferon despite my offers to pay for private treatment. Her view on all of this is that a positive state of mind and living life as a happy person are key and vital at keeping the disease at bay. We've both also come to realize over the years that the UK health system really doesn't have that much to offer MS sufferers and as a general rule the system adds little value. With those thoughts in mind your decision to move to Thailand or not is a multi-threaded one where the financial picture is only a part of the answer and arguably the greater and more important part lies in finding the things that will make you happiest.

[GuestHouse]

chiang mai, I do not disagree that there are many factors to take into accout - I believe I am the only poster here who has actually mentioned the health and health care issues. We also need to keep a balanced view, you tell us your sister believes the NHS "doesn't offer much for MS sufferers" regardless of a definition of what 'Much' means it must be remembered that the Thai health system offers absolutely nothing to a foreigner who cannot pay.

Regardless of that, making an assessment of how one foreigner with MS would get by in Thailand based on the experiences of another person suffering with MS who is not in Thailand does not provide a useful guide. Hence my suggestion of health counselling.

But I think in a sense the OP is asking the wrong question - we can all make a calculation of what is a reasonable Lump Sum to live in Thailand, obtaining that Lump Sum is the difficult part.

I suggest a more informative approach (for anybody considering moving to Thailand) would be to determine the funds that are available and then examine if a move to Thailand is a practical reality based on those funds. Hence my suggestion to take professional advice on finances.

The OP is 39 years old, as you rightly point out, MS for very many people does not mean a shortened life span. Dropping out of employment and earnings with perhaps 30 or more years ahead of you to live on savings (Health Issues asside) requires serious capital.

You have stated that your sister decided to steer clear of a medication - a choice. Not being able to afford a medication is not a choice.

I simply advise careful thought and professional advice.

[thucydides]

I, too, was thinking of early retirement to Thailand ( from the UK) but the current exchange rate has proved a chastening experience and shows just how tenuous our economic plans for the future can be.

For the OP to consider migration based upon a lump sum of £100 k at the age of 39 is perhaps a dream too far. Current projected interest rates are premised upon 2% by next year and so the yield is unlikely to pay for anything very much except perhaps a trip home and monthly fripperies and that doesn't take into account the ravages of inflation.

Your proposed fund would probably last you no more than 10 years, and that would entail a frugal lifestyle probably based somewhere up country. That may suit an ageing grunter like me but a relatively young man such as yourself might find it just a tad tedious.

And of course there are the women........