Tourist Visa -> Non-o -> 1 Year Retirement Extension

[sunluvr]

A potential scenario for me is to enter Thailand (on November 26) with a 60 day double entry tourist visa, then within 39 days, apply for a non-O visa within Thailand, then 30 days or less before that expires, apply for a 1 year extension on a retirement basis. My questions are:

1) if I wanted to leave the country after getting the non-O visa and return before the 60th day (using the double entry allowance on the tourist visa), what effect would that have on the non-O visa, or is that even possible to do?

2) if I wanted to leave and re-enter after the 60th day but before applying for the 1-year extension ( I understand that can only be done in the last 30 days of the 90 day period) is there a multiple entry version of the non-O visa I would need to have, and if so, how much is that?

3) My total length of stay will be about 4 months, and on my final departure from Thailand, I would get a re-entry permit (about March 30, 2009) to allow me to return again later next year. Does the re-entry permit stop the clock on the 1-year extension period until I return or simply allow my return under that extension, providing I return within 1 year of the extension issue date?

4) When I return within the 1 year, is my 'permission to stay' date revised to 1 year from the re-entry date?

[Mario2008]

I understand you want to apply for a non-immigrant visa based on retirement, using the income of 65,000 a month. Why don't you just apply for a non-immigrant visa, possibly a multiple, to start with?

[Lite Beer]

A potential scenario for me is to enter Thailand (on November 26) with a 60 day double entry tourist visa, then within 39 days, apply for a non-O visa within Thailand, then 30 days or less before that expires, apply for a 1 year extension on a retirement basis. My questions are:

1) if I wanted to leave the country after getting the non-O visa and return before the 60th day (using the double entry allowance on the tourist visa), what effect would that have on the non-O visa, or is that even possible to do?

2) if I wanted to leave and re-enter after the 60th day but before applying for the 1-year extension ( I understand that can only be done in the last 30 days of the 90 day period) is there a multiple entry version of the non-O visa I would need to have, and if so, how much is that?

3) My total length of stay will be about 4 months, and on my final departure from Thailand, I would get a re-entry permit (about March 30, 2009) to allow me to return again later next year. Does the re-entry permit stop the clock on the 1-year extension period until I return or simply allow my return under that extension, providing I return within 1 year of the extension issue date?

4) When I return within the 1 year, is my 'permission to stay' date revised to 1 year from the re-entry date?

A Tourist Visa is for 60 days. This can be extended for another 30 days at Immigration.

At least 21 days before your stay finishes (either the 60 days or the 30 day extension) apply for the Non O upgrade.

If you need to exit during this period you need a Re Entry permit (1000 Baht)

About 3 weeks before the Non O finishes apply for the retirement extension.

When you exit Thailand you will again need a Re Entry permit. This keeps your current stay alive it does not extend the stay.

When you return you will be stamped until the original date of you Retirement Extension expiry.

I do not really understand why you think you need a double entry Tourist Visa.

As Mario said. Why not get a Non O Visa to enter Thailand in the beginning.

[sunluvr]

I understand you want to apply for a non-immigrant visa based on retirement, using the income of 65,000 a month. Why don't you just apply for a non-immigrant visa, possibly a multiple, to start with?

It's more complicated and time consuming - require medical exam, police check and notary public to confirm those PLUS verification of income... and my time is getting short... also, there's a chance I may end up applying for a non-B extension rather than a retirement one...

[ubonjoe]

A potential scenario for me is to enter Thailand (on November 26) with a 60 day double entry tourist visa, then within 39 days, apply for a non-O visa within Thailand, then 30 days or less before that expires, apply for a 1 year extension on a retirement basis. My questions are:

1) if I wanted to leave the country after getting the non-O visa and return before the 60th day (using the double entry allowance on the tourist visa), what effect would that have on the non-O visa, or is that even possible to do?

2) if I wanted to leave and re-enter after the 60th day but before applying for the 1-year extension ( I understand that can only be done in the last 30 days of the 90 day period) is there a multiple entry version of the non-O visa I would need to have, and if so, how much is that?

3) My total length of stay will be about 4 months, and on my final departure from Thailand, I would get a re-entry permit (about March 30, 2009) to allow me to return again later next year. Does the re-entry permit stop the clock on the 1-year extension period until I return or simply allow my return under that extension, providing I return within 1 year of the extension issue date?

4) When I return within the 1 year, is my 'permission to stay' date revised to 1 year from the re-entry date?

It would be a lot easier to do all the above on a 90 day non-o single entry visa that you can get at a consulate just based upon being over 50. This would make all the above easier.

You would have plenty of time to get all the documents together before you get down to the last 30 days of your entry. If you wanted to leave during the 60 period before applying you could get a re-entry permit that would allow you to leave and come back and stay until the original 90 day entry is over.

After getting your one year extension you could apply for multiple (3800 baht) or single (1000 baht) re-entry permit.

A re-entry permit does not change your permit to stay date. You would still have to apply for a 1 year extension before the original date.

Edited October 31, 2008 by ubonjoe

[Lite Beer]

I understand you want to apply for a non-immigrant visa based on retirement, using the income of 65,000 a month. Why don't you just apply for a non-immigrant visa, possibly a multiple, to start with?

It's more complicated and time consuming - require medical exam, police check and notary public to confirm those PLUS verification of income... and my time is getting short... also, there's a chance I may end up applying for a non-B extension rather than a retirement one...

No. You just need a Single Entry Non Imm Visa. (90 days) Takes the same time as a Tourist Visa and saves having to convert in Thailand. Reason for application? To explore retirement and extend in Thailand.

[Mario2008]

From consulate in Vancouver:

http://www.thaicongenvancouver.org/cms/ind...view&id=131

7. For the purpose of retirement in Thailand, the applicant must be at least 50 years of age, must submit documentation showing proof of retirement, and must include his or her bank statement indicating monthly/annual income along with the visa application. Follow this link for detailed information regarding "Non-Immigrant O-A Visas (one year visa)".

No need for police and health check.

[sunluvr]

I understand you want to apply for a non-immigrant visa based on retirement, using the income of 65,000 a month. Why don't you just apply for a non-immigrant visa, possibly a multiple, to start with?

It's more complicated and time consuming - require medical exam, police check and notary public to confirm those PLUS verification of income... and my time is getting short... also, there's a chance I may end up applying for a non-B extension rather than a retirement one...

No. You just need a Single Entry Non Imm Visa. (90 days) Takes the same time as a Tourist Visa and saves having to convert in Thailand. Reason for application? To explore retirement and extend in Thailand.

With a Single Entry Non Imm Visa, I can leave and re-enter Thailand within the 90 days with only a re-entry permit?

[Mario2008]

Yes, if you have a multiple non-immigrant visa you won't even need a re-entry permit.

[vagabond48]

From consulate in Vancouver:

http://www.thaicongenvancouver.org/cms/ind...view&id=131

7. For the purpose of retirement in Thailand, the applicant must be at least 50 years of age, must submit documentation showing proof of retirement, and must include his or her bank statement indicating monthly/annual income along with the visa application. Follow this link for detailed information regarding "Non-Immigrant O-A Visas (one year visa)".

No need for police and health check.

Even though, it has been discontinued since Oct 2006. You might check if they still give a type "O" non-immigrant visa based on the requirement of being over 50. No other requirement is needed but you do have to make a border run every 90 days. I still got mine last Oct 2007 in the US at an honorary consulate.

[Lite Beer]

From consulate in Vancouver:

http://www.thaicongenvancouver.org/cms/ind...view&id=131

7. For the purpose of retirement in Thailand, the applicant must be at least 50 years of age, must submit documentation showing proof of retirement, and must include his or her bank statement indicating monthly/annual income along with the visa application. Follow this link for detailed information regarding "Non-Immigrant O-A Visas (one year visa)".

No need for police and health check.

Sorry Mario but there is for the O-A Visa. I think that is what you meant. From the same Web Site.

[Mario2008]

Yes, but I thought that was only for a O A visa, not for a regular non-O.

[Lite Beer]

Yes, but I thought that was only for a O A visa, not for a regular non-O.

Quite correct. From your post it appeared that you were talking about the O-A.

They do seem a bit strict on issuing normal Non O Visas dont they?

As a Brit I am used to Hull where they just hand them out to anyone who wants one.

[sunluvr]

With a Single Entry Non Imm Visa, I can leave and re-enter Thailand within the 90 days with only a re-entry permit?

Yes, if you have a multiple non-immigrant visa you won't even need a re-entry permit.

I think that clinches it then... tomorrow I will send in the application for the 90 day single entry non O visa... I will likely make only one trip out of Thailand during my entire stay there - likely within the first 90 days... and can apply for the 1 year extension somewhere between day 60 and 70...

[Mario2008]

They sure are strict. But I heard that the consulate in Amsterdam is demanding bank staments now and one needs to show a balance of at least 1250 Euro to apply for a non-O based on retirement. Understood the consulate in Amsterdam was told to do so as of the new year, but don't know by who. But no need to show your income, as they do in Vancouver.

[Mario2008]

You can apply in the last 30 days. If necesarry you can do it sooner, so if you plan to stay abroad during the last 30 days you could apply for an extension earlier. Just make sure you don't forget the re-entry permit. The fee is 1,000 for a single re-entry and I beleive 3,600 for a multiple re-entry.

[Lite Beer]

. The fee is 1,000 for a single re-entry and I beleive 3,600 for a multiple re-entry.

A small point . 3,800 Baht

[ubonjoe]

With a Single Entry Non Imm Visa, I can leave and re-enter Thailand within the 90 days with only a re-entry permit?

Yes, if you have a multiple non-immigrant visa you won't even need a re-entry permit.

I think that clinches it then... tomorrow I will send in the application for the 90 day single entry non O visa... I will likely make only one trip out of Thailand during my entire stay there - likely within the first 90 days... and can apply for the 1 year extension somewhere between day 60 and 70...

Great

It looks like you have got things figured out.

If you go to the following page on the Ottawa embassy website you will find a list of consulates near the bottom of page. Vancouver and Ottawa appear to be official consulates. The remainder may be Honorary conulates. You might contact one of them and find that they are easier to deal with.

Link: http://www.magma.ca/~thaiott/visa3.htm

Edited October 31, 2008 by ubonjoe

[sunluvr]

With a Single Entry Non Imm Visa, I can leave and re-enter Thailand within the 90 days with only a re-entry permit?

Yes, if you have a multiple non-immigrant visa you won't even need a re-entry permit.

I think that clinches it then... tomorrow I will send in the application for the 90 day single entry non O visa... I will likely make only one trip out of Thailand during my entire stay there - likely within the first 90 days... and can apply for the 1 year extension somewhere between day 60 and 70...

Great

It looks like you have got things figured out.

If you go to the following page on the Ottawa embassy website you will find a list of consulates near the bottom of page. Vancouver and Ottawa appear to be official consulates. The remainder may be Honorary conulates. You might contact one of them and find that they are easier to deal with.

Link: http://www.magma.ca/~thaiott/visa3.htm

GRRRRRRR!!!!!! dam_n inconsistent bureaucrats!! Before sending off my application to Ottawa (150 kms away) I called them to confirm I was sending all that was required and was clearly told I cannot be issued a 90 day non-immigrant visa, after telling them the purpose of my visit was to 'explore possibility of retirement there'. They will only issue a 60 day tourist visa or the 1 year non O-A with all its added requirements. So now, I have to wait another 3 hours until the other embassy office in Vancouver opens and see if they're any more cooperative... *sigh*

[Mario2008]

Embassies are generaly more difficult to deal with. I think you won't have any problems with Vancouver. (Some consulates are not even allowed to issue a O-A visa). Try otherwise the link Ubonjoe gave you and look near the bottum of the page for other consulates.

[ubonjoe]

Check these two.

Montreal Consulate

1501 McGill College, Bureau 2240

Montréal, Québec H3A 3M8

Tel. (514) 878-4466 or Fax. (514) 878-2446

Email: [email protected]

Office hours: Tuesday and Thursday between 10:00 A.M. to 12:30 P.M.

Royal Thai Consulate-General

Scotia Plaza, 40 King St., West, 41st floor

Toronto, Ontario M5H EY4

Tel. (416) 367-6750 or Fax. (416) 367-7074

[JimGant]

Yes, if you have a multiple non-immigrant visa you won't even need a re-entry permit.

I think that clinches it then... tomorrow I will send in the application for the 90 day single entry non O visa... I will likely make only one trip out of Thailand during my entire stay there - likely within the first 90 days... and can apply for the 1 year extension somewhere between day 60 and 70...

Great

It looks like you have got things figured out.

Not quite. As Mario pointed out, you need a multi-entry Non Imm O -- not a single entry -- if you plan to travel before you get your retirement extension. Otherwise, you'll have to get a re-entry permit from Immigration -- as "single entry" means exactly what it says. Without that re-entry permit, you'll be stamped back into Thailand with a 30-day visa exempt stamp. The previous 90-stamp goes poof.

No big deal if you strike out trying to get a Non Imm O in Canada. Just get a Tourist visa, convert to a Non Imm O in Thailand, thereby getting a brand new permitted to stay stamp -- this time for 90 days. When you submit your TM.86 for conversion, also submit a TM.8 re-entry permit application, allowing you to travel without jeopardizing your new 90-day permitted to stay stamp. And, as you've already figured out, you'll probably have to wait at least 60 days before you can return to Immigration and apply for your retirement extension. But, who knows, they might grant it then and there. It's happened before (but not often).

There's another advantage of a Tourist Visa over a Non Imm O, besides ease of attainment. And that's for the folks going the bank-account-only route.

If you haven't deposited 800k in your Thai bank before you enter Thailand on your Non Imm O -- and since your 90-day permitted to stay clock starts ticking the day you enter Thailand -- you can't meet the 3-months on deposit requirement for the 800k before you have to leave Thailand (short term extensions of 90-day stamps are normally difficult, if impossible, to get). So, count a border run in your future.

But with a Tourist Visa, you can leisurely arrive, get stamped in for 60 days, open a bank account, and deposit 800k. Then, go to Immigration, convert to a Non Imm O, and get a brand new permitted to stay stamp of 90 days. Return to Immigration in the last 30 days, by which time your money has been on deposit for 3-months, and get your retirement extension. No border runs needed.

[Jingthing]

There is another way not mentioned here. I did it. It works.

Assuming you can get a single entry O (not O-a) visa.

Get the single entry O

Enter Thailand and get a 30 day stamp, do not write your visa number on your entry card, politely ask the officer not to use your visa because you will be traveling out soon and want to use it later (many reports including mine they will do this)

If you need to season money, move it in immediately upon arrival

Take your trip out

Next entry, use the visa

If timed right, money moved early enough, you should have time to season money 90 days, and apply for the full year retirement extension within the last 30 days of the O.

Note, if you are not using the 800K method, you do not need ANY money seasoning time in the bank. Just get an embassy letter or if using the combo method an embassy letter and bank account letter, the 90 day money seasoning rule does NOT apply for either.

Edited October 31, 2008 by Jingthing

[JimGant]

Get the single entry O

Take your trip out

It's that "trip out" that would bother me. Border runs are, quite simply (for me at least), a pain in the butt. And if I were arriving in Thailand to begin my long retirement journey, a border run would not be high on anything I'd want to do.

So, whether it's a 'single entry' or a 'multiple entry' Non Imm O visa, you've got border runs to confront -- if you're going the 800k-in-the-bank route (if it wasn't already seasoning in the bank before arrival, that is).

The Tourist Visa avoids this. Plus, like the Non Imm O visa, it precludes the airlines from bouncing you for not having an exit ticket, which is what they might do if you planned to go the TM.87 30-day stamp conversion route.

And Tourist Visas seem much easier to get, at least from Embassies and MFA Consulates. Even some Honorary Consulates (like Denver and Florida) -- and probably some others -- are making it harder to get Non Imm O's just based on 'wanting to retire' criteria.

[sunluvr]

With a Single Entry Non Imm Visa, I can leave and re-enter Thailand within the 90 days with only a re-entry permit?

Yes, if you have a multiple non-immigrant visa you won't even need a re-entry permit.

I think that clinches it then... tomorrow I will send in the application for the 90 day single entry non O visa... I will likely make only one trip out of Thailand during my entire stay there - likely within the first 90 days... and can apply for the 1 year extension somewhere between day 60 and 70...

Great

It looks like you have got things figured out.

If you go to the following page on the Ottawa embassy website you will find a list of consulates near the bottom of page. Vancouver and Ottawa appear to be official consulates. The remainder may be Honorary conulates. You might contact one of them and find that they are easier to deal with.

Link: http://www.magma.ca/~thaiott/visa3.htm

GRRRRRRR!!!!!! dam_n inconsistent bureaucrats!! Before sending off my application to Ottawa (150 kms away) I called them to confirm I was sending all that was required and was clearly told I cannot be issued a 90 day non-immigrant visa, after telling them the purpose of my visit was to 'explore possibility of retirement there'. They will only issue a 60 day tourist visa or the 1 year non O-A with all its added requirements. So now, I have to wait another 3 hours until the other embassy office in Vancouver opens and see if they're any more cooperative... *sigh*

I called the Vancouver consulate, they said no problem for a 90 day single entry non immigrant O visa - send application, copy of letter from pension org and $65 (~2000 bht), so it is on its way there now by courier... an extra day to get there than my first choice, but I should have it back in a week. *sigh of relief*

[JimGant]

copy of letter from pension org

Out of curiosity, how much do they want to see -- the equivalent of 65k baht/mo?

Anyway, if you can meet that, all the above discussion about 'border runs' is moot, as monthly income/embassy affidavit will do the trick for getting your retirement extension; and money-in-the-bank for 3-months is a non player.

However, with a 'single entry' Non Imm O -- and your desire to travel -- you'll still need to go to Immigration for that re-entry permit -- which will preserve the 90-day permission to stay you'll get when you enter Thailand with your good-for-one-time-only Non Imm O visa.

[sunluvr]

copy of letter from pension org

Out of curiosity, how much do they want to see -- the equivalent of 65k baht/mo?

Anyway, if you can meet that, all the above discussion about 'border runs' is moot, as monthly income/embassy affidavit will do the trick for getting your retirement extension; and money-in-the-bank for 3-months is a non player.

However, with a 'single entry' Non Imm O -- and your desire to travel -- you'll still need to go to Immigration for that re-entry permit -- which will preserve the 90-day permission to stay you'll get when you enter Thailand with your good-for-one-time-only Non Imm O visa.

yes - 65k per month is what they want to see.. and I have that, so no "seasoning money in the bank" issues for me - providing our dollar hangs in there... I see it going back up slightly in the last 2 days - hope it continues in that direction..

and with a single entry visa, yes I realize i need the re-entry permit when I leave which I don't see as a big deal at all.. I want to travel to Cambodia and maybe Vietnam while I'm there - maybe at the same time, so 1 or 2 re-entries in the 4 months that I will be there is not a problem..

[ubonjoe]

I called the Vancouver consulate, they said no problem for a 90 day single entry non immigrant O visa - send application, copy of letter from pension org and $65 (~2000 bht), so it is on its way there now by courier... an extra day to get there than my first choice, but I should have it back in a week. *sigh of relief*

Good

Did you check with any of the other consulates I suggested?

I think the single entry is best for you. Just don't forget to get the re-entry permit before you leave Thailand. A multiple entry non-o would be a waste of money since you can go out and come back on a single using the re-entry permit.

Don't forget my suggestion about opening a bank account as soon as you get here and transfer some money in just in case immigration asks for it when you apply for your extension.

Joe

Edit: Just read your most recent reply. What do you mean by the 4 months that you will be here? Visa is only good for 90 days and re-entry permit does not change that. Unless of course you are including some time after getting your one year extension.

Edited November 1, 2008 by ubonjoe

[Lite Beer]

and with a single entry visa, yes I realize i need the re-entry permit when I leave which I don't see as a big deal at all.. I want to travel to Cambodia and maybe Vietnam while I'm there - maybe at the same time, so 1 or 2 re-entries in the 4 months that I will be there is not a problem..

You can get a single Re Entry Permit 1,000 Baht. Or a Multi Re Entry Permit 3,800 Baht.

Out of interest. When you leave after 4 months how long are you staying away before you return?

[sunluvr]

and with a single entry visa, yes I realize i need the re-entry permit when I leave which I don't see as a big deal at all.. I want to travel to Cambodia and maybe Vietnam while I'm there - maybe at the same time, so 1 or 2 re-entries in the 4 months that I will be there is not a problem..

You can get a single Re Entry Permit 1,000 Baht. Or a Multi Re Entry Permit 3,800 Baht.

Out of interest. When you leave after 4 months how long are you staying away before you return?

Likely not for another 7-8 months, and then return then for another 4-5 months..