Bangkok Post Wine Writer Whines About Wine!

[Plus]

I was told that a group of Thai wineries (monsoon valley, and the other purveyors of boones farm type garbage wines) lobbied some of the Thai senators,

and got them to pass the anti import wine bill. It was supposedly to "protect" the Thai wine industry.

I think this is incorrect.

The prices of local and imported wines are roughly the same - ridiculously high. Import duty itself doesn't make much difference, certainly not a crucial one when people choose what form of alcohol to buy.

After 1997 crisis there was a push for buying local and cheap, all luxury items were taxed through the roof, including locally made ones.

[jfchandler]

A few months back, the TGF and I, and another mixed couple who are wine lovers, took a driving tour to Khao Yai, and spent a couple days there, including touring/tasting the local wineries... including PB and Granmonte...

I'm no expert on these things, but I know the difference between wine and vinegar... In general, they had some local bottles/varities in the 500+ baht range, but they tasted like vinegar to me (more or less). It wasn't until we got into the 900 to 1,000 baht ($30 U.S.) per bottle range that anything tasted halfway decent... And even then, the U.S. $2-bottle Charles Shaw wines from California (Trader Joes) struck me as being better...

That said, I did see at one of the wineries some small bottles of fresh, 100% grape juice, and bought a six-pack of those to take home. Those were DELICIOUS...wonderful... tasty...and expensive... Nothing even remotely similar to the Tipco grape juices found in the markets...

That said #2... lately, the GF has been drinking glasses of house wines when we've been going out for dinner, usually in the 100 to 120 baht per glass range. Last night, there was a decent house wine Cabernet served at Bourbon Street, Australian I believe. Likewise, Molly Malone's IMHO serves a decent red house wine, maybe Goiya brand...

That said #3... since moving to Thailand/BKK, I've resumed baking my own bread, because most of the local stuff is junk. I'm considering making my own homemade peanut butter, now that Mission brand is gone... So what's next.... perhaps homemade wine!!!!! I believe, you can buy kits for making your own wine... Just need the grapes...

[jfchandler]

Also, here is a recent, informative blog entry on the GranMonte winery and a bit on the economics of it...

[bkkjames]

A few months back, the TGF and I, and another mixed couple who are wine lovers, took a driving tour to Khao Yai, and spent a couple days there, including touring/tasting the local wineries... including PB and Granmonte...

I'm no expert on these things, but I know the difference between wine and vinegar... In general, they had some local bottles/varities in the 500+ baht range, but they tasted like vinegar to me (more or less). It wasn't until we got into the 900 to 1,000 baht ($30 U.S.) per bottle range that anything tasted halfway decent... And even then, the U.S. $2-bottle Charles Shaw wines from California (Trader Joes) struck me as being better...

That said, I did see at one of the wineries some small bottles of fresh, 100% grape juice, and bought a six-pack of those to take home. Those were DELICIOUS...wonderful... tasty...and expensive... Nothing even remotely similar to the Tipco grape juices found in the markets...

That said #2... lately, the GF has been drinking glasses of house wines when we've been going out for dinner, usually in the 100 to 120 baht per glass range. Last night, there was a decent house wine Cabernet served at Bourbon Street, Australian I believe. Likewise, Molly Malone's IMHO serves a decent red house wine, maybe Goiya brand...

That said #3... since moving to Thailand/BKK, I've resumed baking my own bread, because most of the local stuff is junk. I'm considering making my own homemade peanut butter, now that Mission brand is gone... So what's next.... perhaps homemade wine!!!!! I believe, you can buy kits for making your own wine... Just need the grapes...

John, we know you are a tight SOB, don't try to veil it under the coat of poor quality.

[sabaijai]

Here's the truth: I just listed 4 good Thai wines. And no one's interested.

Is it just easier to go along with the cliche that wine here sucks?

The Monsoon Valley 2003 Premiere Shiraz was also quite good. Gran Monte probably has the most consistent reds. Either of these placed unmarked on your table could pass for Italian or French table wines IMO.

[sabaijai]

Back on topic (which was WINE TAXES if you need reminding): does anyone know specifically how the TAX on local Thai wine (which is obviously very high) compares with the tax on Australian imports (which nows gets a slight break) and for example French imports?

The biggest wine distributor in Thailand told me the total taxes on on imported wine runs around 400%, for domestic around 200%.

[jfchandler]

James, my homemade bread is better than almost anything you'll find in the local markets... Likewise, making my own hummus as well, which is quite good and easy. Saving money and enjoying the fruits of my labor... You should try it sometime!!!

But, you're right... I am a tight SOB when it comes to (not) paying $30+ for a bottle of Thai wine that's no better, and maybe worse, than what I'd buy for $2-a-bottle in the U.S.

Just in case, if you don't know the story about Charles Shaw and "2 Buck Chuck," it's actually quite good (and popular) wine... If there was a way to smuggle it here into Thailand, someone would make a fortune...

[bkkjames]

James, my homemade bread is better than almost anything you'll find in the local markets... Likewise, making my own hummus as well, which is quite good and easy. Saving money and enjoying the fruits of my labor... You should try it sometime!!!

But, you're right... I am a tight SOB when it comes to (not) paying $30+ for a bottle of Thai wine that's no better, and maybe worse, than what I'd buy for $2-a-bottle in the U.S.

Just in case, if you don't know the story about Charles Shaw and "2 Buck Chuck," it's actually quite good (and popular) wine... If there was a way to smuggle it here into Thailand, someone would make a fortune...

Your bread must be pretty good because the stuff i buy from Tops (yes Tops) is the best I have had here.

I also find that making my own food is generally better than most places i would buy it from, however, using top quality imported ingredients does not make it cheaper.

[sabaijai]

One could make wine from imported wine grape must (concentrate), the import duty for which is only 10%. For personal consumption it's legal. Once you have the kit, the average cost is around USD1-2 a bottle. And it's a lot better than TJ's 2-buck chuck when done properly.

[tomwct]

Thai wines are not only disgusting, but expensive!!! The beer companies, two (2), control the flow of booze in Thailand and they do not want any other industry to take part of their market share!!! There is hope with Australia signing a free trade agreement last year, which requires the tax on wine will be reduced to zero (0) in ten (10) years!!! So, idf your alive then, you'll be able to enjoy a drinkable bottle of wine starting at 100 baht per litre or bottle!!!

When we have eatable beef in Thailand, at a good price and good wine, my retirement will be complete in Thailand!!! These are the only two (2) items I miss from the states!!!

[sabaijai]

The better Thai wineries such as Gran Monte and Monsoon Valley can make wines that stand their own against similarly priced (ie, post-tax) Australian wines, IMO. And without adding oak shavings or Mega Purple.

[THAILIBAN]

since quite some time I was thinking to do a day- or overnight-trip to visit one or several of the Thai wineries (not whineries) that are located not too far from BKK (means: Prachuap or KhaoYai areas).

are there any takers ?