Tv Members And Political Correctness

[garro]

For those of you that don't know the UK newspaper scene very well during the 1930s the Daily Mail and its proprietor Lord Rothermere were staunch supporters of Hitler and the Nazis. Quoting from it is a bit of an own goal.

I had not read this before submitting my last post.

I find your above statement very insulting and would like you to retract it.

For your information I'm not British and I don't care about the reputation of a British tabloid, but I do resent your implication that I'm a staunch supporter of Hitler and the Nazis.

2 family members of mine have been killed fighting the Germans, and another one was executed by the Gestapo because of being a member of the Belgian resistance, so don't you dare telling me what you just said.

If that's your way of being PC then I'm glad I don't belong to that group.

onzestan

Isn't it a bit ironic that somebody against too much PC would now turn out to be against free speech if it concerns himself.

You, my friend, are an absolute genius. Just about everything you've ever said about those that are distrustful of PC could equally be applied to yourself.

There you go again. Keep on attacking by throwing mud in the hope that some of it will stick. Doesn't matter that there is nothing behind what you are saying. I am still waiting for an explanation though about how you bullied the PC lot at school, yet you were a 'rapid PCer' in your youth. You admit to being a bully, but then you accuse the PC crowd of being the bullies. Can you explain the contradictions in your posts? I expect you will follow your previous habit of evading the question through meaningless insults just like some of the other posters here.

[garro]

I think that this thread has taught me a lot. It has shown me that discussions in this type of format is fairly fruitless. At least for me anyway. The fact that some posters choose to follow me from thread to thread in order to launch personal attacks makes me ask, what is the point? These people do not seem to have any interest in what I have written, but more in what they think of me personally. I am a big boy and can take being called names, but spending time answering these personal attacks just seems a waste of time. Of course, there is always the option of ignoring them, but in my experience this just leads to escalating abuse. The moderators tend to do a good job, but they don't always get there fast enough. Some of the more abusive posts on this thread have been removed but often the damage is already done. For example, as well as been called a Nazi and 'full of hatred' in this thread I have previously been accused of being a junkie. A completely baseless accusation and one which the poster later apologised for saying, but one that is damaging if read by employers and work colleagues. I fully agree with attacking a post or idea if it seems wrong, but the constant personal attacks are a bit too much. Life is too short. I will not be storming off this forum in a hissy-fit like other posters, but I will certainly be avoiding threads like this one. I don't see this so much as letting my attackers win so much as I can't be bothered defending myself against them anymore.

[Huey]

Well garro, I doubt that my support will win ya over any new friends(LOL) but if it means anything too ya, I feel what your saying. And while I admit I didn't read EVERYone of your posts I think your feelings generaly match my own on the subject of PC and I appreciate the time it took you to elaborate on it as you have

[GuestHouse]

Garro, in an earlier response to Bonobo's (?) question on what I was looking for in this thread I referred him to my opening post and suggested I might also be asking "Speak that I might know thee"

Put asside the insults and rest assured that we all can only be judged on our own words. Prejudicial views may cause some to twist what is said into supporting their own negative views of others, but the person you are remains in what you have said, not in what others wish to think you have said or what others might want to say of you.

Onzetan, I do not believe I have adopted a condescending attitude to you or posts, I believe my responses are broadly in keeping with your own.

Super Hans, you ask how can you discuss, for example Muslim integration into British Society with Political Correctness. - With respect and without abusive language or preconcieved negativity would be a good starting point.. especially if you wished to engage Mulsims in the converstation (Engainging those you wish to integrate might be a good idea) Political Correctnes will remove the obsticals to that converstation.

What's all this nonsense about banning Christmas? I'm back in the UK now (my arguments seemingly rid of the influence of Saudi Arabia.. what a difference a short flight makes). I'm here to celebrate Christmas with my family. The village hall is decked with Christmas Lights, the Village Green has a splendid Christmas tree. My children have been out with friends singing Christmas Carrols (They've collected over a hundred pounds which is being donated to the charity - It seems nobody has put an end to Christmas Carols yet, or indeed Christmas Charity. We've not decked out our own tree yet, it's a family tradition that we do this on Christmas eve, I'm much looking forward to it.

GH, PC, Christmas. Before responding to that consider for a moment the gap between what is known and what is assumed.

Endure, thanks for your example. It is, like many of the examples given on the positive contribution of Political Correctness difficult to make a case against.

[Ijustwannateach]

Egalitarian social policies- I won't collude with the racist game by using their 'pc' term- also gave women and racial minorities the vote; have meant that women were no longer the property of men; meant that women who are potentially your wives, sisters, mothers, and daughters will no longer legally be unprotected if their bosses put sexual pressures on them to keep their jobs; have meant that it is no longer illegal in most modern states (as it was even up to the late part of the 20th c.) for multi-racial relationships and families to exist (you know, the kind that might often exist in Thailand between expats and their partners).

It's an amazing demonstration of self-delusion and hypocrisy that anyone who's ever had an 'interracial' relationship with a Thai person (as it would have been previously labelled) would question the value of liberal social policies.

"S"

[Super Hans]

For those of you that don't know the UK newspaper scene very well during the 1930s the Daily Mail and its proprietor Lord Rothermere were staunch supporters of Hitler and the Nazis. Quoting from it is a bit of an own goal.

I had not read this before submitting my last post.

I find your above statement very insulting and would like you to retract it.

For your information I'm not British and I don't care about the reputation of a British tabloid, but I do resent your implication that I'm a staunch supporter of Hitler and the Nazis.

2 family members of mine have been killed fighting the Germans, and another one was executed by the Gestapo because of being a member of the Belgian resistance, so don't you dare telling me what you just said.

If that's your way of being PC then I'm glad I don't belong to that group.

onzestan

Isn't it a bit ironic that somebody against too much PC would now turn out to be against free speech if it concerns himself.

You, my friend, are an absolute genius. Just about everything you've ever said about those that are distrustful of PC could equally be applied to yourself.

There you go again. Keep on attacking by throwing mud in the hope that some of it will stick. Doesn't matter that there is nothing behind what you are saying. I am still waiting for an explanation though about how you bullied the PC lot at school, yet you were a 'rapid PCer' in your youth. You admit to being a bully, but then you accuse the PC crowd of being the bullies. Can you explain the contradictions in your posts? I expect you will follow your previous habit of evading the question through meaningless insults just like some of the other posters here.

You do have a wonderful penchant for hypocrisy. Anyway...

I was a rabid PCer, that's RABID. I meant like you. Only I've seen the light. I've seen how those with an agenda to push have exploited the very obvious loopholes PC presents.

For me, this all boils down to human beings as animals. In very simplistic terms, it is the natural order of things for the strong to bully the weak. PC sought to redress the balance and add a little fairness to proceedings. All well and good. It achieved its goals around a decade ago. Since then, PC has become a device for people to use to further their own agendas. It has gone too far and is a monster that is out of control. How can it be stopped? Where is its logical conclusion?

Political correctness is propagated by the guilt-ridden middleclasses, who are playing 'fantasy politics'. You are detached from reality enough to think this will actually work.

[Ulysses G.]

I was a rabid PCer, that's RABID. I meant like you. Only I've seen the light. I've seen how those with an agenda to push have exploited the very obvious loopholes PC presents.

Edited December 21, 2008 by Ulysses G.

[Super Hans]

Super Hans, you ask how can you discuss, for example Muslim integration into British Society with Political Correctness. - With respect and without abusive language or preconcieved negativity would be a good starting point.. especially if you wished to engage Mulsims in the converstation (Engainging those you wish to integrate might be a good idea) Political Correctnes will remove the obsticals to that converstation.

Er, this is rather the point. PC drowns that conversation. We are NOT ALLOWED to discuss this any more. Garro seems to spend all day actively trying to find racism in other people. Who the hel_l wants to do that? McCarthyism is alive and well, just under a different label. The result of uberPC? Our society is still split: just under different faultlines, is all.

The fact of the matter is, political correctness in its current form does not tolerate any discussion whatsoever. This is extremely worrying.

So, Guesthouse, prove to me I'm wrong. How successful do you feel Muslim integration has been in 20th Century Britain? I'm sure there must be lots of Muslims in your picture postcard village, so what's your personal opinion? Maybe you have a few as servants?

[Super Hans]

It's an amazing demonstration of self-delusion and hypocrisy that anyone who's ever had an 'interracial' relationship with a Thai person (as it would have been previously labelled) would question the value of liberal social policies.

"S"

It would also be an amazing example of self-delusion to think hard won civil liberties cannot be taken away in an instant. Keep tying us all up in a PC web and see what happens. Noble words will not save you from a baying mob.

Political correctness has done its job. It should now quietly go away.

[Super Hans]

I think that this thread has taught me a lot. It has shown me that discussions in this type of format is fairly fruitless. At least for me anyway. The fact that some posters choose to follow me from thread to thread in order to launch personal attacks makes me ask, what is the point? These people do not seem to have any interest in what I have written, but more in what they think of me personally. I am a big boy and can take being called names, but spending time answering these personal attacks just seems a waste of time. Of course, there is always the option of ignoring them, but in my experience this just leads to escalating abuse. The moderators tend to do a good job, but they don't always get there fast enough. Some of the more abusive posts on this thread have been removed but often the damage is already done. For example, as well as been called a Nazi and 'full of hatred' in this thread I have previously been accused of being a junkie. A completely baseless accusation and one which the poster later apologised for saying, but one that is damaging if read by employers and work colleagues. I fully agree with attacking a post or idea if it seems wrong, but the constant personal attacks are a bit too much. Life is too short. I will not be storming off this forum in a hissy-fit like other posters, but I will certainly be avoiding threads like this one. I don't see this so much as letting my attackers win so much as I can't be bothered defending myself against them anymore.

Oh boo hoo. He objects to being labeled a nazi, but wants all dissent forcibly removed? You could not make it up.

[Super Hans]

I grew up in a largely black neighborhood in America. Many if not most of my friends were black. I was on a basketball team and baseball team where I was theo only white kid, and I really had noproblems. Then there was all the racial problems of the sixties and things changed. There were black gangs and white gangs. I joined the white gang, for self preservation mainly. I was interviewed on tv as I was leader of the white gang following a big race riot at my high school which made the national news. I only relate this in order to explain the background in which my character was formed.When I got older and went to work, I met this big black guy who every day said to me, "Hello, Honkie", until I got sick of it and one day said, "Hello, N-----." This led to a big fight, of course. And numerous big fights after that, one being in the lobby of the Plaza Hotel in New York. This guy became my best friend.

One time he saved my life, as there was a crowd of about 200 brothers in a parking lot who wanted to

lynch me, until he showed up and told them, "If you want to kill that white boy, you got to kill this n----- first."

f As he was huge and carried a .45, and was highly respected they left me alone. Years later I saved his wife, who was white, from a gang of punks. The point of this story is that this guy and I became best friends but the PC types would still be all outraged at this relationship. I am not saying the N word is okay,because it isn't. But black people call each other this all the time. The point of this is that my relationship with Jimmy was my business and his and nobody else's. Neither of us wanted or would allow other people to dictate how we dealt with each other, and I love the guy like a brother. And likewise I don't need somebody, PC or otherwise, trying to tell me how to talk, feel or live my life.

I don't know if this is true, but I get the feeling that garo wishes to decide what other people are allowed to say or think. This is I think the whole point of the issue with Nazis. My personal feeling is if someone wished to be politically correct, then that is their right. If someone does not, then this is also their right. I for one have never been politically correct. I never have and I never will. But this is my right.

Thanks for that. It was a good read.

A lot of the posters on here are so removed from reality its untrue. They live in a middleclass guilt-ridden bubble, with little or no grasp on real life. I find their 6th form philosophy thoroughly embarrassing.

[Super Hans]

For those of you that don't know the UK newspaper scene very well during the 1930s the Daily Mail and its proprietor Lord Rothermere were staunch supporters of Hitler and the Nazis. Quoting from it is a bit of an own goal.

The own goals just keep on coming. A few pages ago another anti-pc poster used a quote from a Nazi appologist as evidence of how PC was destroying the world. Then these people have the gall to accuse those who favour respect between groups of being Nazis.

No, again you fail to grasp the connection. You and your kind - who I'll call uberPCs from now on - can be compared to the nazis because;

* You want to impose your ideology on other people.

* You don't want this ideology to be challenged.

* You don't believe in free speech

* You advocate censorship

* You don't believe people are able to make their own minds up

* You think you know best

And I've absolutely no doubt whatsoever you'd just love to get dressed up in a tight fitting uniform and frogmarch all you deem unworthy into a, ahem, 'correctional facility'.

Do you understand now?

[Super Hans]

You people, lol get over yourself luv!!!. That one council or the odd office have said they wont put up Christmas decorations is hardly mass oppression of peoples rights to celebrate Christmas or oppression of speech due to those pc devils . But besides, it was later proven that the article given was crap anyway, the Christmas tree, decorations & celebrations are going on in Oxford as usual just under a different name & including other festivals too. Presumably inclusion is ok or is that too pc as well

There is no legal restriction on anyone putting up decorations & no legal recourse to those who don't afaics, same with the festivals, nativity in schools etc. Sounds pretty fair to me. But then some people need little excuse to make mountains out of mole hills.

Don't the uberPC thought police constantly make mountains out of molehills? Can't we get our own back from time to time?

[garro]

I think that this thread has taught me a lot. It has shown me that discussions in this type of format is fairly fruitless. At least for me anyway. The fact that some posters choose to follow me from thread to thread in order to launch personal attacks makes me ask, what is the point? These people do not seem to have any interest in what I have written, but more in what they think of me personally. I am a big boy and can take being called names, but spending time answering these personal attacks just seems a waste of time. Of course, there is always the option of ignoring them, but in my experience this just leads to escalating abuse. The moderators tend to do a good job, but they don't always get there fast enough. Some of the more abusive posts on this thread have been removed but often the damage is already done. For example, as well as been called a Nazi and 'full of hatred' in this thread I have previously been accused of being a junkie. A completely baseless accusation and one which the poster later apologised for saying, but one that is damaging if read by employers and work colleagues. I fully agree with attacking a post or idea if it seems wrong, but the constant personal attacks are a bit too much. Life is too short. I will not be storming off this forum in a hissy-fit like other posters, but I will certainly be avoiding threads like this one. I don't see this so much as letting my attackers win so much as I can't be bothered defending myself against them anymore.

Oh boo hoo. He objects to being labeled a nazi, but wants all dissent forcibly removed? You could not make it up.

You just keep on knocking out the insults if it gives you pleasure. Twist my words as much as you want. If anybody can find in any of my posts where I said that dissent should be forcibly removed I will spend the rest of my days saying sorry, but I know you won't and I'm sure you know you won't because this is just another one of your attempts to shut people up by attacking their character. Your posts are full of contradictions and once you take the insults out they don't contain much more. So you just concentrate on any typos I might make because your argument needs all the help it can get.

Edited December 21, 2008 by garro

[Super Hans]

That looks to be a decision of a council to not hold a Christmas festival only, not a statement of law or demand that the whole of the UK to stop celebrating Christmas is it?

My local council has funded to put up street lights & trees,same as every year, the local schools have done their nativities & plays, same as every year & their are decorations up, the local mall has a giant tree & Santas grotto, shops have the decorations up, national television is showing Christmas adverts & Christmas shows.

So, not quite country wide & again, the choice of a few councils only.

So it's gone from "no one" to "a few"?

I just love you people!

The school next to where I used to live has also just announced it's abandoning festivities, presumable because most pupils are non christian. My old Regional Director - the most powerful civil servant in the region - abandoned christmas decorations etc in the office the other year, yet had the full bunting out for Divali and numerous other non christian festivals throughout the year. There really are zealots out there in public service - a frightening number. People ought to actually see this at first hand before commenting on whether it is "hyperbole" or not.

[For the record, I couldn't give a stuff about superfluous fluff like this. Not interested at all. What I am interested in is PC used as a tool of social control]

Super Hans,

dont know if this is any use to you or not.

There is an organization called Common Purpose which is bedeviling UK life. It was started by a Fabian called Julia Middleton and many believe Common Purpose is a euphemism for Communist Party.

This organization has infiltrated every public service and many people believe it has encouraged bullying in the workplace and in society generally.

It meets behind closed doors where meetings are not minuted and members names are unrecorded.

Check it out on the web and YouTube.

It has expanded into Europe, and many believe it is deliberately ensuring public services fail, bully and become democratically unaccountable to a disillusioned electorate, in the way that communism does wherever it gets a hold.

You may also wish to read a book entitled, Captive State by George Monbiot, which condemned governmental and public organizations deliberately ignoring peoples wishes and either side stepping or subverting the democratic process out of a sense of, we know better.

Sound familiar? maybe we should go to the other end of the political spectrum and call the pc brigade Stalinists seeing as some object to being referred to as Nazis, not much difference between them both though.

Wasnt it Uncle Joe who said , you cant make an omelette without cracking eggs?

I generally don't refer to them as stalinists as I suspect they'd rather like that...

Interesting about Common Purpose. It is certainly true to say you don't stand a chance in public service unless you are of a certain type. The only way for progression through the system is to out "diversify" your opponents. This in itself is discriminatory and leads to resentment. Neither are good in any workforce IMO, particularly not one that has a one trillion pound budget. I believe there needs to be a time to reflect on what PC has achieved, and think things though a little clearer for how to proceed in the future. PC has achieved its goals and needs replacing.

[garro]

For those of you that don't know the UK newspaper scene very well during the 1930s the Daily Mail and its proprietor Lord Rothermere were staunch supporters of Hitler and the Nazis. Quoting from it is a bit of an own goal.

The own goals just keep on coming. A few pages ago another anti-pc poster used a quote from a Nazi appologist as evidence of how PC was destroying the world. Then these people have the gall to accuse those who favour respect between groups of being Nazis.

No, again you fail to grasp the connection. You and your kind - who I'll call uberPCs from now on - can be compared to the nazis because;

* You want to impose your ideology on other people.

* You don't want this ideology to be challenged.

* You don't believe in free speech

* You advocate censorship

* You don't believe people are able to make their own minds up

* You think you know best

And I've absolutely no doubt whatsoever you'd just love to get dressed up in a tight fitting uniform and frogmarch all you deem unworthy into a, ahem, 'correctional facility'.

Do you understand now?

Could you please provide proof for these accusations. Can you point to any post that I have written where I have suggested these things? Where are you getting this information about me from? I know. You are just making it up aren't you? Your posts are just redundant - sorry.

[Super Hans]

I think that this thread has taught me a lot. It has shown me that discussions in this type of format is fairly fruitless. At least for me anyway. The fact that some posters choose to follow me from thread to thread in order to launch personal attacks makes me ask, what is the point? These people do not seem to have any interest in what I have written, but more in what they think of me personally. I am a big boy and can take being called names, but spending time answering these personal attacks just seems a waste of time. Of course, there is always the option of ignoring them, but in my experience this just leads to escalating abuse. The moderators tend to do a good job, but they don't always get there fast enough. Some of the more abusive posts on this thread have been removed but often the damage is already done. For example, as well as been called a Nazi and 'full of hatred' in this thread I have previously been accused of being a junkie. A completely baseless accusation and one which the poster later apologised for saying, but one that is damaging if read by employers and work colleagues. I fully agree with attacking a post or idea if it seems wrong, but the constant personal attacks are a bit too much. Life is too short. I will not be storming off this forum in a hissy-fit like other posters, but I will certainly be avoiding threads like this one. I don't see this so much as letting my attackers win so much as I can't be bothered defending myself against them anymore.

Oh boo hoo. He objects to being labeled a nazi, but wants all dissent forcibly removed? You could not make it up.

You just keep on knocking out the insults if it gives you pleasure. Twist my words as much as you want. If anybody can find in any of my posts where I said that dissent should be forcibly removed I will spend the rest of my days saying sorry, but I know you won't and I'm sure you know you won't because this is just another one of your attempts to shut people up by attacking their character. Your posts are full of contradictions and once you take the insults out they don't contain much more. So you just concentrate on any typos I might make because your argument needs all the help it can get.

I am a big boy and can take being called names

Yup, you've certainly proved that one...

there is always the option of ignoring them, but in my experience this just leads to escalating abuse. The moderators tend to do a good job, but they don't always get there fast enough. Some of the more abusive posts on this thread have been removed but often the damage is already done. For example...

It's a good job your not calling for dissent to be removed there. Phew! I'm not sure I could take you spending the rest of your days apologising.

[garro]

I think that this thread has taught me a lot. It has shown me that discussions in this type of format is fairly fruitless. At least for me anyway. The fact that some posters choose to follow me from thread to thread in order to launch personal attacks makes me ask, what is the point? These people do not seem to have any interest in what I have written, but more in what they think of me personally. I am a big boy and can take being called names, but spending time answering these personal attacks just seems a waste of time. Of course, there is always the option of ignoring them, but in my experience this just leads to escalating abuse. The moderators tend to do a good job, but they don't always get there fast enough. Some of the more abusive posts on this thread have been removed but often the damage is already done. For example, as well as been called a Nazi and 'full of hatred' in this thread I have previously been accused of being a junkie. A completely baseless accusation and one which the poster later apologised for saying, but one that is damaging if read by employers and work colleagues. I fully agree with attacking a post or idea if it seems wrong, but the constant personal attacks are a bit too much. Life is too short. I will not be storming off this forum in a hissy-fit like other posters, but I will certainly be avoiding threads like this one. I don't see this so much as letting my attackers win so much as I can't be bothered defending myself against them anymore.

Oh boo hoo. He objects to being labeled a nazi, but wants all dissent forcibly removed? You could not make it up.

You just keep on knocking out the insults if it gives you pleasure. Twist my words as much as you want. If anybody can find in any of my posts where I said that dissent should be forcibly removed I will spend the rest of my days saying sorry, but I know you won't and I'm sure you know you won't because this is just another one of your attempts to shut people up by attacking their character. Your posts are full of contradictions and once you take the insults out they don't contain much more. So you just concentrate on any typos I might make because your argument needs all the help it can get.

I am a big boy and can take being called names

Yup, you've certainly proved that one...

there is always the option of ignoring them, but in my experience this just leads to escalating abuse. The moderators tend to do a good job, but they don't always get there fast enough. Some of the more abusive posts on this thread have been removed but often the damage is already done. For example...

It's a good job your not calling for dissent to be removed there. Phew! I'm not sure I could take you spending the rest of your days apologising.

SuperHans, my insult comment wasn't actually directed at you. I don't remember ever having dealt with you in the past on this forum and your insults are fairly harmless. Anybody who paid any attention to your posts would easily spot that there is no logic to them. You do a fantastic job of destroying your own arguments and you have actually been the bright spot on an otherwise dull thread. No that post was directed at others who follow me from thread to thread to make disparaging remarks about me. It is not the insults themselves that I mind, but the fact that spending time defending against them ruins the thread and seems pointless.

Edited December 21, 2008 by garro

[rgs2001uk]

That looks to be a decision of a council to not hold a Christmas festival only, not a statement of law or demand that the whole of the UK to stop celebrating Christmas is it?

My local council has funded to put up street lights & trees,same as every year, the local schools have done their nativities & plays, same as every year & their are decorations up, the local mall has a giant tree & Santas grotto, shops have the decorations up, national television is showing Christmas adverts & Christmas shows.

So, not quite country wide & again, the choice of a few councils only.

So it's gone from "no one" to "a few"?

I just love you people!

The school next to where I used to live has also just announced it's abandoning festivities, presumable because most pupils are non christian. My old Regional Director - the most powerful civil servant in the region - abandoned christmas decorations etc in the office the other year, yet had the full bunting out for Divali and numerous other non christian festivals throughout the year. There really are zealots out there in public service - a frightening number. People ought to actually see this at first hand before commenting on whether it is "hyperbole" or not.

[For the record, I couldn't give a stuff about superfluous fluff like this. Not interested at all. What I am interested in is PC used as a tool of social control]

Super Hans,

dont know if this is any use to you or not.

There is an organization called Common Purpose which is bedeviling UK life. It was started by a Fabian called Julia Middleton and many believe Common Purpose is a euphemism for Communist Party.

This organization has infiltrated every public service and many people believe it has encouraged bullying in the workplace and in society generally.

It meets behind closed doors where meetings are not minuted and members names are unrecorded.

Check it out on the web and YouTube.

It has expanded into Europe, and many believe it is deliberately ensuring public services fail, bully and become democratically unaccountable to a disillusioned electorate, in the way that communism does wherever it gets a hold.

You may also wish to read a book entitled, Captive State by George Monbiot, which condemned governmental and public organizations deliberately ignoring peoples wishes and either side stepping or subverting the democratic process out of a sense of, we know better.

Sound familiar? maybe we should go to the other end of the political spectrum and call the pc brigade Stalinists seeing as some object to being referred to as Nazis, not much difference between them both though.

Wasnt it Uncle Joe who said , you cant make an omelette without cracking eggs?

I generally don't refer to them as stalinists as I suspect they'd rather like that...

Interesting about Common Purpose. It is certainly true to say you don't stand a chance in public service unless you are of a certain type. The only way for progression through the system is to out "diversify" your opponents. This in itself is discriminatory and leads to resentment. Neither are good in any workforce IMO, particularly not one that has a one trillion pound budget. I believe there needs to be a time to reflect on what PC has achieved, and think things though a little clearer for how to proceed in the future. PC has achieved its goals and needs replacing.

Aint that the the truth!!!!!!

Yet again the intellectually challenged ( apologies if this isnt the correct pc term to use , it wasnt my intention to offend ) petit bourgeosis return to the table empty handed.Its a bit like trying to explain the meaning of life to a cockroach, sooner or later you give up, why should I bang my head against your wall.

Divide and conquer, these people cant see the bigger picture, they are so wrapped up in their own little world of personal guilt/suffering, they either cant see or refuse to recognize the fact that they themselves are just being used.

The innocence of youth or the indifference of apathy?

[Super Hans]

For those of you that don't know the UK newspaper scene very well during the 1930s the Daily Mail and its proprietor Lord Rothermere were staunch supporters of Hitler and the Nazis. Quoting from it is a bit of an own goal.

The own goals just keep on coming. A few pages ago another anti-pc poster used a quote from a Nazi appologist as evidence of how PC was destroying the world. Then these people have the gall to accuse those who favour respect between groups of being Nazis.

No, again you fail to grasp the connection. You and your kind - who I'll call uberPCs from now on - can be compared to the nazis because;

* You want to impose your ideology on other people.

* You don't want this ideology to be challenged.

* You don't believe in free speech

* You advocate censorship

* You don't believe people are able to make their own minds up

* You think you know best

And I've absolutely no doubt whatsoever you'd just love to get dressed up in a tight fitting uniform and frogmarch all you deem unworthy into a, ahem, 'correctional facility'.

Do you understand now?

Could you please provide proof for these accusations. Can you point to any post that I have written where I have suggested these things? Where are you getting this information about me from? I know. You are just making it up aren't you? Your posts are just redundant - sorry.

Au contraire. Does this little beauty not prove my assertion?

Of course you hear the argument that free-speech must be protected and that allowing the hate-mongers a platform will eventually lead to them realising the error of their ways as they see reason. This is not my belief.

Innnnnnnn one: you don't like free speech.

Innnnnnnn two: you don't believe people are able to make their own minds up.

Innnnnnnn three: you think you know what's best for them.

[garro]

For those of you that don't know the UK newspaper scene very well during the 1930s the Daily Mail and its proprietor Lord Rothermere were staunch supporters of Hitler and the Nazis. Quoting from it is a bit of an own goal.

The own goals just keep on coming. A few pages ago another anti-pc poster used a quote from a Nazi appologist as evidence of how PC was destroying the world. Then these people have the gall to accuse those who favour respect between groups of being Nazis.

No, again you fail to grasp the connection. You and your kind - who I'll call uberPCs from now on - can be compared to the nazis because;

* You want to impose your ideology on other people.

* You don't want this ideology to be challenged.

* You don't believe in free speech

* You advocate censorship

* You don't believe people are able to make their own minds up

* You think you know best

And I've absolutely no doubt whatsoever you'd just love to get dressed up in a tight fitting uniform and frogmarch all you deem unworthy into a, ahem, 'correctional facility'.

Do you understand now?

Could you please provide proof for these accusations. Can you point to any post that I have written where I have suggested these things? Where are you getting this information about me from? I know. You are just making it up aren't you? Your posts are just redundant - sorry.

Au contraire. Does this little beauty not prove my assertion?

Of course you hear the argument that free-speech must be protected and that allowing the hate-mongers a platform will eventually lead to them realising the error of their ways as they see reason. This is not my belief.

Innnnnnnn one: you don't like free speech.

Innnnnnnn two: you don't believe people are able to make their own minds up.

Innnnnnnn three: you think you know what's best for them.

I'm not quite sure if you have completely grasped the meaning of the term 'allowing the hate-mongers a platform".

Have you?

Edited December 21, 2008 by garro

[Super Hans]

That looks to be a decision of a council to not hold a Christmas festival only, not a statement of law or demand that the whole of the UK to stop celebrating Christmas is it?

My local council has funded to put up street lights & trees,same as every year, the local schools have done their nativities & plays, same as every year & their are decorations up, the local mall has a giant tree & Santas grotto, shops have the decorations up, national television is showing Christmas adverts & Christmas shows.

So, not quite country wide & again, the choice of a few councils only.

So it's gone from "no one" to "a few"?

I just love you people!

The school next to where I used to live has also just announced it's abandoning festivities, presumable because most pupils are non christian. My old Regional Director - the most powerful civil servant in the region - abandoned christmas decorations etc in the office the other year, yet had the full bunting out for Divali and numerous other non christian festivals throughout the year. There really are zealots out there in public service - a frightening number. People ought to actually see this at first hand before commenting on whether it is "hyperbole" or not.

[For the record, I couldn't give a stuff about superfluous fluff like this. Not interested at all. What I am interested in is PC used as a tool of social control]

Super Hans,

dont know if this is any use to you or not.

There is an organization called Common Purpose which is bedeviling UK life. It was started by a Fabian called Julia Middleton and many believe Common Purpose is a euphemism for Communist Party.

This organization has infiltrated every public service and many people believe it has encouraged bullying in the workplace and in society generally.

It meets behind closed doors where meetings are not minuted and members names are unrecorded.

Check it out on the web and YouTube.

It has expanded into Europe, and many believe it is deliberately ensuring public services fail, bully and become democratically unaccountable to a disillusioned electorate, in the way that communism does wherever it gets a hold.

You may also wish to read a book entitled, Captive State by George Monbiot, which condemned governmental and public organizations deliberately ignoring peoples wishes and either side stepping or subverting the democratic process out of a sense of, we know better.

Sound familiar? maybe we should go to the other end of the political spectrum and call the pc brigade Stalinists seeing as some object to being referred to as Nazis, not much difference between them both though.

Wasnt it Uncle Joe who said , you cant make an omelette without cracking eggs?

I generally don't refer to them as stalinists as I suspect they'd rather like that...

Interesting about Common Purpose. It is certainly true to say you don't stand a chance in public service unless you are of a certain type. The only way for progression through the system is to out "diversify" your opponents. This in itself is discriminatory and leads to resentment. Neither are good in any workforce IMO, particularly not one that has a one trillion pound budget. I believe there needs to be a time to reflect on what PC has achieved, and think things though a little clearer for how to proceed in the future. PC has achieved its goals and needs replacing.

Aint that the the truth!!!!!!

Yet again the intellectually challenged ( apologies if this isnt the correct pc term to use , it wasnt my intention to offend ) petit bourgeosis return to the table empty handed.Its a bit like trying to explain the meaning of life to a cockroach, sooner or later you give up, why should I bang my head against your wall.

Divide and conquer, these people cant see the bigger picture, they are so wrapped up in their own little world of personal guilt/suffering, they either cant see or refuse to recognize the fact that they themselves are just being used.

The innocence of youth or the indifference of apathy?

Yup. I'm not sure that this is the case anymore, at least it's not what concerns me. The likes of Garro and most of the dreamers on this thread are merely well intentioned foot soldiers - I have no problem with them, or their intentions, which are good, I'm sure. My beef with the "movement", in the public sector at least, is with the shiny-suited shysters that have hijacked PC goals as a means of enhancing their own careers. I lost count of the number of consultants, legal experts and the like that would come to our office and give us the most unbelievably patronising lectures on how we should behave towards each other. I mean, duh. But they realised there's BIG money to be made in this. The government is so paranoid about how it is perceived my minorities, it has just thrown money at the issue, money which has largely gone to shysters and snakeoil salesmen.

What you say about the hard left is also true. They have formed a very powerful alliance with other minority groups in order to promote their own agendas. The civil service had a fair and open recruitment policy (sic) until recently - now you HAVE to be female, preferably black, to get ahead. It is true enough the service was previously dominated by white men, but I'm not sure 'two wrongs make a right' politics is the way to go.

One of the gauling things about UberPCness is shrill, populist sensationalism merchants like the Mail's odious Richard LittleJohn actually has a point about it.

[rgs2001uk]

Its only an internet forum, its not the real world, no need to take it personally.

I was going to say my Thai friends, but some might allow their own personal prejudices and preconceived opinions to stand in the way.

Its only an illusion.

I know I am a wanke_r, its just sometimes I forget it, so thanks to all those who remind me from time to time.

[Super Hans]

For those of you that don't know the UK newspaper scene very well during the 1930s the Daily Mail and its proprietor Lord Rothermere were staunch supporters of Hitler and the Nazis. Quoting from it is a bit of an own goal.

The own goals just keep on coming. A few pages ago another anti-pc poster used a quote from a Nazi appologist as evidence of how PC was destroying the world. Then these people have the gall to accuse those who favour respect between groups of being Nazis.

No, again you fail to grasp the connection. You and your kind - who I'll call uberPCs from now on - can be compared to the nazis because;

* You want to impose your ideology on other people.

* You don't want this ideology to be challenged.

* You don't believe in free speech

* You advocate censorship

* You don't believe people are able to make their own minds up

* You think you know best

And I've absolutely no doubt whatsoever you'd just love to get dressed up in a tight fitting uniform and frogmarch all you deem unworthy into a, ahem, 'correctional facility'.

Do you understand now?

Could you please provide proof for these accusations. Can you point to any post that I have written where I have suggested these things? Where are you getting this information about me from? I know. You are just making it up aren't you? Your posts are just redundant - sorry.

Au contraire. Does this little beauty not prove my assertion?

Of course you hear the argument that free-speech must be protected and that allowing the hate-mongers a platform will eventually lead to them realising the error of their ways as they see reason. This is not my belief.

Innnnnnnn one: you don't like free speech.

Innnnnnnn two: you don't believe people are able to make their own minds up.

Innnnnnnn three: you think you know what's best for them.

I'm not quite sure if you have completely grasped the meaning of the term 'allowing the hate-mongers a platform".

Have you?

I'm not quite sure if you have completely grasped the meaning of the term "freedom of speech".

Have you?

[garro]

For those of you that don't know the UK newspaper scene very well during the 1930s the Daily Mail and its proprietor Lord Rothermere were staunch supporters of Hitler and the Nazis. Quoting from it is a bit of an own goal.

The own goals just keep on coming. A few pages ago another anti-pc poster used a quote from a Nazi appologist as evidence of how PC was destroying the world. Then these people have the gall to accuse those who favour respect between groups of being Nazis.

No, again you fail to grasp the connection. You and your kind - who I'll call uberPCs from now on - can be compared to the nazis because;

* You want to impose your ideology on other people.

* You don't want this ideology to be challenged.

* You don't believe in free speech

* You advocate censorship

* You don't believe people are able to make their own minds up

* You think you know best

And I've absolutely no doubt whatsoever you'd just love to get dressed up in a tight fitting uniform and frogmarch all you deem unworthy into a, ahem, 'correctional facility'.

Do you understand now?

Could you please provide proof for these accusations. Can you point to any post that I have written where I have suggested these things? Where are you getting this information about me from? I know. You are just making it up aren't you? Your posts are just redundant - sorry.

Au contraire. Does this little beauty not prove my assertion?

Of course you hear the argument that free-speech must be protected and that allowing the hate-mongers a platform will eventually lead to them realising the error of their ways as they see reason. This is not my belief.

Innnnnnnn one: you don't like free speech.

Innnnnnnn two: you don't believe people are able to make their own minds up.

Innnnnnnn three: you think you know what's best for them.

I'm not quite sure if you have completely grasped the meaning of the term 'allowing the hate-mongers a platform".

Have you?

I'm not quite sure if you have completely grasped the meaning of the term "freedom of speech".

Have you?

Well freedom can be a difficult concept to grasp at the best of time.

It is late now, so time for bed. Your last post was probably your best so far with its tale of the uber-pc people and the mysterious men in charge. I think I will check out now though before you begin talking about how we are all controlled by the lizard people who are harvesting us as food.

[rgs2001uk]

You canrt do this you cant do that

you cant go forward and you cant go back.

In the event of sonic attack, its every man for himself.

Why would someone need the moderators to moderate replies.

If you dont have the courage of your convictions to stand up and be counted, dont post on an open forum.

Can someone please explain to me why a post , by a man I might not always agree with, was removed.

A man who gave the, bleeding heart liberals, the right to have their point of view expressed here, but to whom the same bleeding heart heart liberals would not extend the same courtesy.

I am your nemesis.

I also asked a few questions, which of late the pc brigade havent answered.

So let me try again.

Under what circumstances is it acceptable for a mother to inflict corporal punishment on HER child?

[Super Hans]

Here in UK no one has stopped putting up trees, wishing each other merry Christmas, putting up decorations, singing the carols, doing the nativity in schools etc so I wonder what countries the anti-pc folks claim they have been restricted?

Sorry to disappoint you Boo : http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-10...t-festival.html

cheers

onzestan

That's funny, Karma from the vicious history of colonialism coming back to haunt England. After centuries of subjugating other peoples beliefs and cultures around the world, the world finaly comes back home to the English and dilutes what they once considered traddional and sacred.

Sum num na.

The funny thing is..Its the English that do it too themselves.

Wha???

No country in history has contributed more to the development of the planet than the English. We sacrificed ourselves tackling REAL evil. Maybe the Americans will join this fight 3 years too late as well, then double cross their allies to help themselves to the spoils. Again.

In terms of colonialism, you only have to look at Zimbabwe for how well countries fare by booting us out. There is no better nation for solving the world's ills than England. Our diplomatic service is peerless, not least in clearing up the blundering cack-handed buffoonery of the Americans.

The rest of the free world should be falling over themselves to repay their debts to us in this time of UK hardship.

[F1fanatic]

You canrt do this you cant do that

you cant go forward and you cant go back.

In the event of sonic attack, its every man for himself.

Why would someone need the moderators to moderate replies.

If you dont have the courage of your convictions to stand up and be counted, dont post on an open forum.

Can someone please explain to me why a post , by a man I might not always agree with, was removed.

A man who gave the, bleeding heart liberals, the right to have their point of view expressed here, but to whom the same bleeding heart heart liberals would not extend the same courtesy.

I am your nemesis.

I also asked a few questions, which of late the pc brigade havent answered.

So let me try again.

Under what circumstances is it acceptable for a mother to inflict corporal punishment on HER child?

I tried to find your previous posts, but couldn't find anything that made sense!

As a card-carrying member of the PC brigade (but only my version of it!) I'm trying to understand the question on corporal punishment on someone's child.

Is it relevent?

PC is about trying to do the right thing, but so many people have a problem with that!

Having said that I agree - the departments set up to ensure equality are there to do nothing other than to give outrageous salaries to friends of politicians!

Who can disagree with doing the right thing?

[Super Hans]

I do not think Onzestan was so concerned about free speach or PC in his rhetorical response , a quote or reference was made to historical happenings that gave him recall on the terrible happenings to members of his family .

Personaly I feel PC has reaped more harm than good due to the fact it tends to headline things or happenings no one would normally get excited or upset about , but whatever , none of it is realy worth a Tinkers cuss when it all boils down to the nitty-gritty of every day life and living ..

I don't. PC has made it so that people no longer think it's ok to call me a f**king poof and beat me severely enough to put me into hospital. It's all very well moaning about PCism when you're a part of the controlling majority. It's a different matter when you're a member of a minority. And yes - there are idiots who take it too far but, by and large, it's been a good thing.

Out of interest - and to prove GH's point that PC allows free speech - what would you say the "average" TV moderator's background is? How many white hetrosexual males are there who are not leftwingers?

[Super Hans]

You canrt do this you cant do that

you cant go forward and you cant go back.

In the event of sonic attack, its every man for himself.

Why would someone need the moderators to moderate replies.

If you dont have the courage of your convictions to stand up and be counted, dont post on an open forum.

Can someone please explain to me why a post , by a man I might not always agree with, was removed.

A man who gave the, bleeding heart liberals, the right to have their point of view expressed here, but to whom the same bleeding heart heart liberals would not extend the same courtesy.

I am your nemesis.

I also asked a few questions, which of late the pc brigade havent answered.

So let me try again.

Under what circumstances is it acceptable for a mother to inflict corporal punishment on HER child?

I tried to find your previous posts, but couldn't find anything that made sense!

As a card-carrying member of the PC brigade (but only my version of it!) I'm trying to understand the question on corporal punishment on someone's child.

Is it relevent?

PC is about trying to do the right thing, but so many people have a problem with that!

Having said that I agree - the departments set up to ensure equality are there to do nothing other than to give outrageous salaries to friends of politicians!

Who can disagree with doing the right thing?

No one. I think the point here is there's a very real fear that PC, in its current form, is too big brotherish.

There are those of us that value our personal freedoms and are fearful of further state intervention in our day to day lives. Political correctness in schools has lead to a ban on disciplining children, something which the PC fascists want to extend to all homes as well. I want them to educate my children then stay the hel_l away from how I bring them up.