Counterfeit 1,000 Baht Notes Concern Rises

[george]

Counterfeit Bt1,000 bills concern rises

Vendors prefer other notes amid increase in fakes

BANGKOK: -- Due to rampant forgery, Bt1,000 banknotes have literally lost their shine among small-scale vendors.

"I do my best to avoid accepting Bt1,000 banknotes in payment," says Suwut Kerdchai, a grocer in Chon Buri.

His common excuse is that he does not have enough money for change.

"I now request Bt100 banknotes or smaller denominations from my customers," Suwut admits, "I can't risk ruining my business. Grocery does not give much profit. If you get a fake banknote and have to give the change to the fake-banknote users too, that's too bad."

Recently, police reported finding fake banknotes being circulated near Suwut's hometown and many other areas.

"I am so worried. The fake ones look so similar to the authentic banknotes," Sopo Chaikul, a seafood-seller, laments.

She urges relevant authorities to crack down on the counterfeiting.

In Khon Kaen, the Bang Lamphu Market has found fake Bt100 and Bt1,000 banknotes on a daily basis. The market manager, Paspadorn Niampradit, now advises sellers about how to identify the fake money.

"We have urged the sellers to examine the banknotes before letting their customers take their goods away," Paspadorn said yesterday.

Somchai Setkornnukool, a senior director at the Bank of Thailand's Northeast Branch, explained that people would be able to distinguish fake from authentic banknotes based on proper guidelines.

"Feel the word 'Thai Government' [which is printed in Thai] and you will find it is embossed on the banknote if it is authentic," Somchai said.

He added that when the banknote was held against the light, a watermark of His Majesty the King's portrait would become clearly visible.

"Moreover, if you notice, you will see small translucent numerals and letters indicating the value of the banknotes on the metallic colour thread too," Somchai said.

When tilted, the numerals showing the values of each Bt500 and Bt1000 banknotes also change their colour when viewed at different angles.

Somchai said people should not panic about reports that fake banknotes were in the market.

"Counterfeiting has existed since the time banknotes were first introduced," he said. "And we have been trying to crack down on counterfeiting all along. If you have any useful information, please let us know and you will get some reward," he said.

Printers of fake banknotes are liable to life imprisonment. Deliberately using the fake banknotes, meanwhile, is punishable by a jail term ranging from one to 15 years.

But self-protective vendors will risk being punished too if they reject a Bt1,000 banknote without verifying whether it is real or fake.

"Banknotes are legal tender for all debts, public and private. If you are not allowed to use your banknotes, you can lodge a complaint with the police," Deputy Metropolitan Police Commissioner Maj-General Amnuay Nimmano said.

Meanwhile, Thai Bankers' Association secretary-general Thawatchai Yongkittikhun revealed that bank customers now asked for Bt500, Bt100, and Bt20 banknotes much more than usual.

"If such trend continues, we may have a shortage in smaller denominations," he said.

Thawatchai called on the authorities to urgently educate people about how to distinguish fake from authentic banknotes.

"People should stay calm. Any panic may upset the economy," he said. "Although the number of fake banknotes is higher now, the increase is not at a worrying level.

-- The Nation 2008-12-23

[sbk]

Posts and their responses have been deleted. Please do not post rumor and innuendo as if it were fact. Might I suggest a re-read of the forum rules to members?

[monkeytunes]

Hows the best way to check if a 1K THB note is real, is there a certain water mark to look out for? so we can keep an eye out for them.

[Tywais]

Hows the best way to check if a 1K THB note is real, is there a certain water mark to look out for? so we can keep an eye out for them.

You can see photos and what to look for in this topic.

[Scott]

I can hardly wait for the boss to decide not to pay us so we won't be bothered with any of those fake notes!

[Scott]

Actually, in some ways this is a good sign. A currency has to have some value to be worth counterfeiting.

[george]

Counterfeit banknote rings can face life imprisonment: Police

BANGKOK: -- Police have threatened counterfeit banknote gangs with life imprisonment if they are convicted, while those who knowingly use counterfeit banknotes can face a maximum 15 year jail term.

Pol Maj-Gen Amnuay Nimmano, deputy spokesman of the Metropolitan Police Bureau, warned counterfeit banknote rings of harsh punishment under the Criminal Law, Article 240.

He said if anyone received fake banknotes from an ATM, they could file a complaint with the police.

Some shops now refuse to accept a 1,000 baht banknote from customers, amid reports of widespread counterfeit banknote circulation. However, police said such an action was against the law.

According to the Bank of Thailand, nearly 19,000 counterfeit banknotes were found from January to November this year, or about five to seven out of one million banknotes. The most counterfeit banknotes or 61 per cent of all fake banknotes found were 1,000 baht banknotes.

-- TNA 2008-12-23

[markg]

Am i missing something here? As a consumer i dont see how it can affect me because i can never receive a 1000 baht note apart from at a bank ATM machine. As it's the highest denomination note, i can therefore never receive it in change from a shop. As i m not a counterfeiter, i can only receive one from the bank...................which could carry a prison sentence for them presumably !

I assume the banks have systems in place to check the notes they put in their ATM machines?

[silverhawk_usa]

Hows the best way to check if a 1K THB note is real, is there a certain water mark to look out for? so we can keep an eye out for them.

Didn't you read the article??

Somchai Setkornnukool, a senior director at the Bank of Thailand's Northeast Branch, explained that people would be able to distinguish fake from authentic banknotes based on proper guidelines.

"Feel the word 'Thai Government' [which is printed in Thai] and you will find it is embossed on the banknote if it is authentic," Somchai said.

He added that when the banknote was held against the light, a watermark of His Majesty the King's portrait would become clearly visible.

"Moreover, if you notice, you will see small translucent numerals and letters indicating the value of the banknotes on the metallic colour thread too," Somchai said.

When tilted, the numerals showing the values of each Bt500 and Bt1000 banknotes also change their colour when viewed at different angles.

[Farma]

Last night one of the Thai news programs was showing the different denomination fake notes. It wasn’t just the B1,000 notes. Some of the fakes were hard to tell and included 500, 100 and 50 notes.

If you have access to anything with a black light the embedded fluorescent flecks are easily seen in the real money. We’re using a bug zapper with a black light until we can find something less bulky.

[MyphuketLife]

I assume the banks have systems in place to check the notes they put in their ATM machines?

That is a good question.... do the banks have a system in place to check all currency proir to dispensing the currency? Or do we have to start carefully looking at all money we get from the bank/atm?

[animatic]

Hows the best way to check if a 1K THB note is real, is there a certain water mark to look out for? so we can keep an eye out for them.

Didn't you read the article??

Somchai Setkornnukool, a senior director at the Bank of Thailand's Northeast Branch, explained that people would be able to distinguish fake from authentic banknotes based on proper guidelines.

"Feel the word 'Thai Government' [which is printed in Thai] and you will find it is embossed on the banknote if it is authentic," Somchai said.

He added that when the banknote was held against the light, a watermark of His Majesty the King's portrait would become clearly visible.

"Moreover, if you notice, you will see small translucent numerals and letters indicating the value of the banknotes on the metallic colour thread too," Somchai said.

When tilted, the numerals showing the values of each Bt500 and Bt1000 banknotes also change their colour when viewed at different angles.

The metal thread is darned near impossible to reproduce the same,

The water marks quite hard, but not impossible.

The embossing of letters easy enough, but takes a very good press.

The directional ink printing of numbers is top end stuff. Very hard to do.

The hologram strip pretty much impossible.

The total in combination is beyond all but another governments abilities in general.

Which of course doesn't mean 'another regional government' isn't trying to by goods and services here

by under mining the Thai economy with higher end counterfeits.... supposition, not rumor here....

It would likely depend on the quality of the bills. and seems unlikely.

All in all, if you have a good bill questioned, a farang would have enough info from this

to get a proper comparison in front of many vendors.

In any case count your money takes on a new meaning.

[sangfroid]

An extensive report on TV a few minutes ago about these fake notes in circulation said that there are several groups of counterfeiters at work, and fake 50 baht and 20 baht notes are being done as well as the 100, 500 and 1000 baht notes.

[toybits]

Last week, I saw a bank teller reject a 1,000 bank note from a depositor at Chiang Rai.

[baabaabobo]

From The Phuket Gazette:

http://www.phuketgazette.net/dailynews/index.asp?id=6976

Thalang Police on Wednesday night arrested two men for passing counterfeit banknotes at local shops and restaurants.

Thalang Police Duty Inspector Anukul Nuket identified the suspects as 24-year-old Nikorn Raksapol from Nakhon Sri Thammarat and Pattipong Nuea-nan, 31, from Chiang Rai.

The pair were arrested at about 11 pm in the Fah Sai Restaurant in tambon Srisoonthorn Village 5 following an investigation by uniformed and plain-clothed officers.

Local merchants reported that people had been using fake 1,000 baht banknotes to make small purchases, then walking away with large amounts of real cash as change.

A formal complaint was filed at 9:30 pm on Wednesday by the owner of the Khrua Phan Laan Restaurant located at Srisoonthorn Village 1, where a man matching Nikorn’s description paid for a meal with one of the bogus bills earlier that day.

Police later found Nikorn enjoying a meal at the Fah Sai Restaurant with Mr Pattipong. The pair were arrested after they tried to pay the bill with another phony banknote. Mr Pattipong was also found in possession of another counterfeit 1,000 baht note.

All three notes collected as evidence in the case had the exact same serial number: 4 Jor 123395

Nikorn and Pattipong will be enjoying more free meals in upcoming days, courtesy of the Thalang Police. The pair will remain in custody at the station for next 12 days before their case is forwarded to the Phuket Provincial Prosecutor’s office.

Thailand has stiff anti-counterfeiting laws, with a minimum ten year prison sentence for those convicted of producing counterfeit currency.

Those found to knowingly pass counterfeit notes face sentences ranging from one to fifteen years and a fine of 2,000 to 20,000 baht.

Maj Anukul said merchants can spot fake banknotes by comparing them with real ones and looking for differences in size, color, paper quality and the image of the king.

Other telltale signs include identical serial numbers on different notes, a poor quality watermark and a lack of a reflective silver band, he said.

[anon467367354]

"All three notes collected as evidence in the case had the exact same serial number: 4 Jor 123395"

Does anyone have information about the serial numbers? I guess it's possible that all the fakes have the same serial number. That would be too easy, but there is hope.

[Boater]

the trouble with this, as like most people, the only time i ever get a 1,000 THB note is from the ATM........ as why would a shop give you a 1,000 Note change as it is the highest domanation?

thus the only people that need to be warned is the banks and shop keepers, as the general public will NOT BE AFFECTED ( unless of course they are selling something ect ect )

But with the above mentioned, i am not sure how trained the bank staff are for spoting fake bank notes, as if they let pass, it will go back into circulation.

But, what i would like to know is what happens if you withdraw say 5 K from an ATM an there are some fake notes inside????

[george]

Update:

Counterfeit Thai 1000 baht banknotes creating alarm

BANGKOK: -- The public can bring charges against shops that refuse to accept 1,000 baht banknotes for fear they might be counterfeit, police say.

Deputy Metropolitan Police chief Pol Maj-Gen Amnuay Nimmano said yesterday people who are issued counterfeit notes by ATMs can also file charges against banks with police.

Banknote forgers would be liable to life imprisonment and people who knowingly pass fake notes face one to 15 years in jail, he said.

The police chief spoke out after reports that many vendors were refusing to accept 1,000 baht banknotes from customers and that people were choosing to withdraw less than 1,000 baht from ATMs at each transaction, to avoid receiving 1,000 baht banknotes.

Twatchai Yongkittikul, secretary-general of the Thai Bankers Association (TBA), said the public should not panic about fake notes.

"There is no problem about receiving counterfeits from ATMs," he said. "All banks check banknotes before they put them in ATMs."

He said even though the number of forgeries had increased, there were still relatively few in circulation.

The TBA would monitor the situation and call a meeting with its members to develop a strategy if the problem became any worse, he said.

Bangkok Bank, the country's largest bank, said it was training counter tellers to check banknotes carefully, especially 1,000 baht notes. The number of counterfeits increased significantly over the festive season.

Giant retail stores report finding fake notes in many provinces. If there is doubt about a note's authenticity, clerks ask customers to pay with another note. Machines to check watermarks on notes have also been installed in toll booths.

Deputy national police chief Pol Gen Preawpan Damapong has ordered police to track down the forgers and distributors.

In Nakhon Si Thammarat, counterfeiters were arrested in two districts with phoney 500 and 1,000 baht notes.

In Nan's Chiang Klang district, Nim Ganpai, 50, went to make a 4,500 baht deposit to pay her bank loan, only to be told one of the 1,000 notes was counterfeit.

She said she received the note when she sold a cow two months ago.

In Tak, 1,000 baht notes were not being accepted at the border market in Mae Sot district after counterfeits were found. The fake notes were so similar to real notes that some were said to have been deposited at banks.

"I have changed my payment method and now use an ATM to transfer funds, or a cheque. It is so hard to check if the notes are real," said Tak chamber of commerce president Suchart Treeratwattana.

In Nakhon Ratchasima, Namphon Songklang, 40, a butcher at Mae Kim Heng market in Muang district, said when customers pay in 1,000 baht notes, vendors get together to help inspect them. If the note is deemed to be fake, they detain the person and alert police. Some vendors had earlier phoney notes.

In Trat, customs officers are watching for fakes, but because of staff constraints search people only if they look suspicious.

People are allowed to take no more than 200,000 baht out of the country at a time.

-- Bangkok Post 2008-12-23

[sbk]

A shopkeeper I know here had 2 banknotes rejected by the bank as being counterfeit.

[fire and ice]

Last week, I saw a bank teller reject a 1,000 bank note from a depositor at Chiang Rai.

Reject it? They should be calling the police!

Unless it was merely a case of "too worn out" - not sure what the laws are in Thailand regarding this, different in each country.

[Africanteacher]

I once accepted my salary in cash and had to give back Three 1,000 Bank notes When I went to the bank and they told me they were counterfeit.

I went to so much trouble trying to explain to the police how I came into possession of the notes. Luckily my boss was a few blocks away and came to my rescue. She had to trace the origin of the notes.

[sabai-dee-man]

...the only people that need to be warned is the banks and shop keepers, as the general public will NOT BE AFFECTED ( unless of course they are selling something ect ect )...

If you are a tourist, then you're likely to have never sold anything. If on the other hand, you spend a little more time in Thailand, then it's certainly not beyond the possibility you may sell a Honda Sonic, or a sofa, or an old laptop etc., maybe a car even, and certainly for over 1000 Baht!

It's not only shady Thais you should be wary of either!

Sabai Dee Man.

Edited December 23, 2008 by sabai-dee-man

[toybits]

I think what happens is that the bank Rejects the note - telling the depositor "Sorry sir/madam, this note is counterfeit.", promptly stamps counterfeit onto the note and then confiscates the note to keep it from circulation. Please correct me if I am wrong...

Last week, I saw a bank teller reject a 1,000 bank note from a depositor at Chiang Rai.

Reject it? They should be calling the police!

Unless it was merely a case of "too worn out" - not sure what the laws are in Thailand regarding this, different in each country.

[Thai at Heart]

Do the banks take them out of circulation or reject and return them.

If they are returning them, this is extremely stupid. Not sure what is common practice elsewhere, but I do remember in China there was a big problem with 100 rmb notes, I remember the banks honoured them since the depositor couldn't be proven to have done anything wrong.

[TAWP]

The sad thing is that it's mostly the smaller, struggling, sellers that will be most affected. A teller in Robinson might both have tools to their disposal and will most likely not be personally responsible for the full amount lost as a small food vendor is. So these people, as the two arrested above, specifically prey on the smallest [weakest] around. That is despicable.

[NBT TV Phuket]

item--4--- on VDO at http://thainews.prd.go.th/newsenglish/prev...php?news_id=863

Police in Phuket advise people to beware of fraudulent banknotes after cases were found in the area.

After a gang were arrested for bank note fraud case, the Thalang Police Superintendent Pol. Col. Thammanoon Faiju revealed that the gang used false 1,000 bank notes to pay at a restaurant. Police then warned members of the public to beware of such fraudulent documents, especially during the New Year holiday period. He further explained that the gangs worked as networks and were found in many locations. They usually use the illegal paper during night time, make it difficult to spot. According to Bank of Thailand data, the fraudulent bank notes are increasing compared to the previous years with 1,000 baht bank notes on top of the list. According to Thai law, the maximum penalty for bank note fraudsters are life imprisonment with maximum fine of 40,000 baht while people who possess or try to use them will face a maximum penalty of 15 years imprisonment or 35,000 baht maximum fine.

Andaman News NBT (VHF dial) + Radio Thailand FM90.5 at 8.30am & perhaps repeats on Phuket Cable TV channel 1 at 7pm & 1am, broadcast to Phang Nga, Krabi & Phuket provinces & maybe Mazz Radio FM108 at 7pm in Phuket, Friday 19 December 2008 & http://thainews.prd.go.th/newsenglish/

& www.YouTube.com/AndamanNews.com

[neverdie]

The article states, "There is no problem about receiving counterfeits from ATMs," he said. "All banks check banknotes before they put them in ATMs."

How confident could one be that 'every' note has been checked by the bank prior to putting it in the ATM. Or was this statement made to 'cover' the banks, thus if you get one out of an ATM, race inside to show them, then its back on you, they stamp ur note & ur on your way out the door minus a few quid.

[seancbk]

I can hardly wait for the boss to decide not to pay us so we won't be bothered with any of those fake notes!

I have a boss that this could apply to too.

Sean

[jasperguy]

I assume the banks have systems in place to check the notes they put in their ATM machines?

That is a good question.... do the banks have a system in place to check all currency proir to dispensing the currency? Or do we have to start carefully looking at all money we get from the bank/atm?

I think, they should install black lights on all the ATM's so anyone can check their notes.

[parryhandy]

The article states, "There is no problem about receiving counterfeits from ATMs," he said. "All banks check banknotes before they put them in ATMs."

How confident could one be that 'every' note has been checked by the bank prior to putting it in the ATM. Or was this statement made to 'cover' the banks, thus if you get one out of an ATM, race inside to show them, then its back on you, they stamp ur note & ur on your way out the door minus a few quid.

Ha HA no chance .Agree really wouldnt fancy my chances arguing with the bank if I pulled fake notes out of an ATM.

What does a branch manager do if he gets a load of the fake notes ? Accept the loss and being made a fool of or mix em in the ATM pile and try and get rid of them.

Edited December 23, 2008 by parryhandy