Gold Up In 2008 , Where To In 2009 ?

[Naam]

Going to a gold or silver backed currency is not only not wise but quite impossible, hence whenever you see any central banker anywhere in the world interviewed about this topic they usually dismiss it out of hand

Dismiss it? Surprised?

And Yet they hold how much gold?

Why would they keep any gold at all?

Why do they hold so much? They could convert that

useless out dated metal for that valuable paper.....Why dont they?

your questions are besides the point Flying. what is so difficult to understand that there is not enough gold available to back up existing currencies? except of course if the wet dreams of the goldbugs come true that an ounce of gold will suffice to buy a bakery.

[Naam]

It might be wisdom given the state of the USA though.

Jim, Going to a gold or silver backed currency is not only not wise but quite impossible, hence whenever yopu see any central banker anywhere in the world interviewed about this topic they usually dismiss it out of hand

We've only been on Fiat for 39 years

The experiment has run it's course and is currently collapsing...a Sound currency is not only possible but it's required if you want any kind of stability

that is not correct. we have been on "fiat" much longer. that currencies are backed fully by gold was nothing but a pretension which was accepted because the bluff wasn't called till Charles de Gaulle bitched and Nixon admitted defeat.

[flying]

your questions are besides the point Flying. what is so difficult to understand that there is not enough gold available to back up existing currencies? except of course if the wet dreams of the goldbugs come true that an ounce of gold will suffice to buy a bakery.

This argument always sounds like arm twisting to me.

Like a spoiled child saying I have eaten the whole cake so there now you cannot tell me I cant have any.

I tend to think we can still bake a new cake.

This new cake does not have to be the same size or value as the old cake. We do not need to honor the size of the old cake which gave us all food poisoning.

Just because they have inflated paper to astronomical proportions we have to live with it?

It is not a wet dream of mine to become rich by holding gold nor buying bakeries because gold has appreciated.

It is my hope though that we can eventually get to some form of money that is not counterfeited & devalued at the whim of politicians & fat cats hiding in the shadows of those they appoint as politicians.

I tend to think I may not be alone in that hope.

Edited March 23, 2009 by flying

[Jake1]

Going to a gold or silver backed currency is not only not wise but quite impossible, hence whenever you see any central banker anywhere in the world interviewed about this topic they usually dismiss it out of hand

Dismiss it? Surprised?

And Yet they hold how much gold?

Why would they keep any gold at all?

Why do they hold so much? They could convert that

useless out dated metal for that valuable paper.....Why dont they?

your questions are besides the point Flying. what is so difficult to understand that there is not enough gold available to back up existing currencies? except of course if the wet dreams of the goldbugs come true that an ounce of gold will suffice to buy a bakery.

I can never figure out why people always bring this up

How isn't there enough Gold? And how do you value money?

This "Money" the Central banks are flooding the world with derives it's value from nothing, so in reality it is worth nothing. It's a piece of paper with a bunch of numbers on it that is used in trade. It doesn't give you anything if you return it, it can be printed at will, and it promises you absolutely nothing.

How isn't there enough gold and/or Silver in the world to back a pile of paper or digits on a computer?

regarding your Fiat comment..for the past 38(I miss typed earlier) years we have been free floating, backed by absolutely nothing, promising you nothing currency without any restraints..Fiat

We had a weak link to Gold before 71 and a stronger one prior to 33.

Edited March 23, 2009 by Jake1

[flying]

If they wanted to, they could. As precious metals have currency codes. I remember the day I found this out, it all became clear.

ISO 4217 includes codes not only for currencies, but also for precious metals (gold, silver, palladium and platinum; by definition expressed per one troy ounce, as compared to "1 USD")

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ISO_4217

That would be a nice start

[Naam]

1. How isn't there enough Gold?

2. And how do you value money?

3. This "Money" the Central banks are flooding the world with derives it's value from nothing, so in reality it is worth nothing. It's a piece of paper with a bunch of numbers on it that is used in trade. It doesn't give you anything if you return it, it can be printed at will, and it promises you absolutely nothing.

1. it's not rocket science to figure that out, basic arithmetic is sufficient. however i refuse to do your homework.

2. i value money exactly for the value it has rendered since i had the first Pfennigs (pennies) in my hand ~60 (SIXTY) years ago and still renders value EACH AND EVERY DAY. anybody who denies that is delirious.

3. money has given and does give a return to me. the vegetables, steaks, caviar, wine, soft drinks, TVs, cars, houses, land and you name it i bought and buy were paid and are still paid for with MONEY and NOTHING ELSE. if you think that this return is "nothing" then i refuse to discuss anything with you (not even the fact that it's darker at night than during daytime... which you might deny ).

if these (what you call pieces of paper) have no value, you are cordially invited to my home for a good dinner of your selection. our cookS [plural as the gardener cooks too] are able to prepare european, thai, indian, chinese, burmese and korean food according to your wishes, excellent wines (a few whores are optional on demand if Mrs Naam allows it) and in return you hand over all that worthless paper in your possession to me. i'll be glad to take that burden from your back when my wife goes shopping she does not need to promise anything to the cashier who gladly excepts pieces of paper for the goods which are in the shopping cart.

your answer please

[Naam]

your questions are besides the point Flying. what is so difficult to understand that there is not enough gold available to back up existing currencies? except of course if the wet dreams of the goldbugs come true that an ounce of gold will suffice to buy a bakery.

This argument always sounds like arm twisting to me.

Like a spoiled child saying I have eaten the whole cake so there now you cannot tell me I cant have any.

I tend to think we can still bake a new cake.

This new cake does not have to be the same size or value as the old cake. We do not need to honor the size of the old cake which gave us all food poisoning.

Just because they have inflated paper to astronomical proportions we have to live with it?

It is not a wet dream of mine to become rich by holding gold nor buying bakeries because gold has appreciated.

It is my hope though that we can eventually get to some form of money that is not counterfeited & devalued at the whim of politicians & fat cats hiding in the shadows of those they appoint as politicians. I tend to think I may not be alone in that hope.

basically i bloody <deleted> agree with you, your thinking and your hopes Flying. the only difference between the two of us is that i am a pragmatic thinker who does not expect the impossible to happen.

[Jake1]

1. How isn't there enough Gold?

2. And how do you value money?

3. This "Money" the Central banks are flooding the world with derives it's value from nothing, so in reality it is worth nothing. It's a piece of paper with a bunch of numbers on it that is used in trade. It doesn't give you anything if you return it, it can be printed at will, and it promises you absolutely nothing.

1. it's not rocket science to figure that out, basic arithmetic is sufficient. however i refuse to do your homework.

2. i value money exactly for the value it has rendered since i had the first Pfennigs (pennies) in my hand ~60 (SIXTY) years ago and still renders value EACH AND EVERY DAY. anybody who denies that is delirious.

3. money has given and does give a return to me. the vegetables, steaks, caviar, wine, soft drinks, TVs, cars, houses, land and you name it i bought and buy were paid and are still paid for with MONEY and NOTHING ELSE. if you think that this return is "nothing" then i refuse to discuss anything with you (not even the fact that it's darker at night than during daytime... which you might deny ).

if these (what you call pieces of paper) have no value, you are cordially invited to my home for a good dinner of your selection. our cookS [plural as the gardener cooks too] are able to prepare european, thai, indian, chinese, burmese and korean food according to your wishes, excellent wines (a few whores are optional on demand if Mrs Naam allows it) and in return you hand over all that worthless paper in your possession to me. i'll be glad to take that burden from your back when my wife goes shopping she does not need to promise anything to the cashier who gladly excepts pieces of paper for the goods which are in the shopping cart.

your answer please

1.) Our Monetary system was based on Gold..everything else was stacked on top like an inverted Pyramid. $4 Trillion in Gold at the bottom and $1.5 Quadrillion of Derivatives at the top, the house of cards was built too high and is currently collapsing.

2.) It's a debt instrument with Counter party risk. It does not hold it's value. You get for it what someone else will give you and as the Central Banks print it into oblivion it's going to become a game of hot-potato where everyone is trying to get rid of thier money as soon as it comes in.

3.) You can bring it to a store and get these things or you can give it to someone else in an exchange for goods but it is intrinsically worthless. You can not bring it back to the Central Bank and expect anything for it. They have an unlimited supply.

The U.S Government is Bankrupt, holding shares ($'s) in a Bankrupt company that constantly issues more shares is not a smart thing to do. The same could be said about many Governments and their currencies.

[churchill]

China calls for new reserve currency - From today's FT

http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/7851925a-17a2-11...00779fd2ac.html

Edited March 24, 2009 by churchill

[Naam]

1.) Our Monetary system was based on Gold..everything else was stacked on top like an inverted Pyramid. $4 Trillion in Gold at the bottom and $1.5 Quadrillion of Derivatives at the top, the house of cards was built too high and is currently collapsing.

you might be right but as of today is has not yet collapsed.

2.) It's a debt instrument with Counter party risk. It does not hold it's value. You get for it what someone else will give you and as the Central Banks print it into oblivion it's going to become a game of hot-potato where everyone is trying to get rid of thier money as soon as it comes in.

the same applies to gold. you only get for it what someone else will give you. the price fluctuations are evidence for my claim.

3.) You can bring it to a store and get these things or you can give it to someone else in an exchange for goods but it is intrinsically worthless. You can not bring it back to the Central Bank and expect anything for it. They have an unlimited supply.

i never thought of taking money to a central bank. no central bank has any goods which i need for a living. for the roof over my head, breakfast, lunch, dinner and other necessities the [NON]intrinsic value of fiat money was always sufficient in my life. nobody ever asked me for more "intrinsicacy". and of course i never had dinner in a central bank nor did i ever ask a central bank to build a house for me

The U.S Government is Bankrupt, holding shares ($'s) in a Bankrupt company that constantly issues more shares is not a smart thing to do. The same could be said about many Governments and their currencies.

i tend to agree!

[churchill]

Now that everything is Hunky Dory and green shoots are seen everywhere . How low will gold go ?

"Gloom about gold, except among the radical bugs"

http://www.marketwatch.com/news/story/gloo...=msr_1#comments

I cannot see how inflation is not building up , starting with commodities . Low prices in oil and foods are building up for a price surge once demand returns .

and Even if demand does not build - Government spending will cause a surge in prices ?

Edited April 20, 2009 by churchill

[flying]

Martin Armstrong On Gold

Is Gold Trying To Speak?

Gold has been the best performing investment on the board. It has continued to make new highs in all currencies but the dollar, but even there it is holding on like a politician in his right to control the lives of others. While production of gold was expanding dramatically going into the 1980 high of $875, today, South African production has been dropping like a stone. South Africa is no longer the leading producer in gold and just as demand is rising, the production is falling.

From a pure technical view, the breakout line from the 1999 low stood precisely at $718 last October, and provided the closing support. Once exceeded, it was penetrated 601 y during Sept/Oct of 2006 on a monthly closing basis and has held nicely for this '08 reaction low. This technical line moves up to about $810 by the end of 2010. Near-term, if we see a real Waterfall Effect in the Dow Jones Industrials going into June 2009 where a collapse takes place back to the 4,000 area, we may see a corresponding high or a major key turning point in gold also for June 2009. This does not appear to be the major or high, but we may see a shocking punch upward with a next thrust. If gold breaks out to new highs going into June 2009 as the now makes a major low, there could be a 5 month reaction low forming by November 2009, with a rally thereafter into about April 2011 for the intraday high, but leaving 2010 as the highest close annually. Gold would then reverse perhaps, but this may be due to Government intervention at that point in time.

Gold still appears to be headed to at least the $2,500 level by 2011. Exceeding that area before the end of 2009, would open the door to a potential rally even up to the $5,000 level. Please keep in mind, this is a relative forecast. That means the dollar would be little of its former self. What we are honestly talking about is the collapse of our Governmental infrastructure not so different from Russia. In plain words, Russia could no longer sustain its control of the economy because it was broke. We are approaching the same problem. Just because we have been always able to borrow and never worry about what would happen when the day comes that the well is dry, does not mean we have bottomless pit. A very minor technical projection shows resistance for gold scaling in from the 1 ,100 to 1,200 level for 2009. Breaking through this technical resistance area will signal that we are in a very serious economic implosion.

Taken from.............

http://www.contrahour.com/

Edited April 23, 2009 by flying

[Naam]

Gold still appears to be headed to at least the $2,500 level by 2011. Exceeding that area before the end of 2009, would open the door to a potential rally even up to the $5,000 level.

and once the $5k level is broken gold will go all the way to $ 69,786.29 / ounce. my dog thinks that will be around Christmas

[VegasVic]

Gold still appears to be headed to at least the $2,500 level by 2011. Exceeding that area before the end of 2009, would open the door to a potential rally even up to the $5,000 level.

and once the $5k level is broken gold will go all the way to $ 69,786.29 / ounce. my dog thinks that will be around Christmas

The bear market rally that I predicted is now getting a bit long in the tooth and I think a 10%+ pullback could happen as early as next week, so I gues that would be the opportune time for gold to make its assult on the $5000/ounce mark Of course back here on the planet earth gold will be fortunate to make a sustained run at $950/ounce

[flying]

and once the $5k level is broken gold will go all the way to $ 69,786.29 / ounce. my dog thinks that will be around Christmas

Your just lucky I gave your dog the crystal ball back.

That aside I do not agree or disagree with Mr. Armstrong.

He does have a good record & following though. As does your dog Im sure

[flying]

The bear market rally that I predicted is now getting a bit long in the tooth and I think a 10%+ pullback could happen as early as next week, so I gues that would be the opportune time for gold to make its assult on the $5000/ounce mark Of course back here on the planet earth gold will be fortunate to make a sustained run at $950/ounce

Yo !!! Swami VV

Swadee Pi Mai !!!!

We will file this new prediction of yours with the others like the one in January when you said Gold had made its high for the year & would be all down hill from there.

Or the one back in Oct last year where you said gold was headed for 450 when it was at 730.

Keep on Trucking

[VegasVic]

The bear market rally that I predicted is now getting a bit long in the tooth and I think a 10%+ pullback could happen as early as next week, so I gues that would be the opportune time for gold to make its assult on the $5000/ounce mark Of course back here on the planet earth gold will be fortunate to make a sustained run at $950/ounce

Yo !!! Swami VV

Swadee Pi Mai !!!!

We will file this new prediction of yours with the others like the one in January when you said Gold had made its high for the year & would be all down hill from there.

Or the one back in Oct last year where you said gold was headed for 450 when it was at 730.

Keep on Trucking

Of course I could be mistaken, but I believe that I said gold made its high for 2009 in Febuary not January, and I still stand by that prediction As I said a couple of months ago, I think that you have gone off the deep end my friend and are now a fullfledged goldbug, I guess I was correct Be careful flying the abyss in which these goldbugs reside is bottomless and very few who enter ever return to normal society

[flying]

Of course I could be mistaken, but I believe that I said gold made its high for 2009 in Febuary not January, and I still stand by that prediction As I said a couple of months ago, I think that you have gone off the deep end my friend and are now a fullfledged goldbug, I guess I was correct Be careful flying the abyss in which these goldbugs reside is bottomless and very few who enter ever return to normal society

Hey you know me..........Im just in it for the alternative.

I hope your still holding the AUY shares you bought back at Thanksgiving?

Im not into paper but I know it did well. Dipping now though but a good ride none the less eh?

PS: this was 1/13/09

I'll see you at $650 as well nouf biggrin.gif After golds $40 loss yesterday I expected a dead cat bounce to at least $835 today but gold only managed a 80 cent dead cat bounce to $821.80. You can pretty much stick a fork in gold for a while as it is done ohmy.gif Once gold breaks down below $810 it will be a freefall to the $770's where the next resistance level is, then the $730's and finally $682 will get taken out and gold will base in the $625-$650 area. Sorry flying the HUI chart says it all smile.gif

Edited April 23, 2009 by flying

[flying]

Of course back here on the planet earth gold will be fortunate to make a sustained run at $950/ounce

LOL.................

From your lips to golds ears.........

Thanks! your like a reverse cooler

[Naam]

and once the $5k level is broken gold will go all the way to $ 69,786.29 / ounce. my dog thinks that will be around Christmas

Your just lucky I gave your dog the crystal ball back. That aside I do not agree or disagree with Mr. Armstrong. He does have a good record & following though. As does your dog Im sure

my dog just bluffs Flying. his gold forecast has to be taken with a grain of salt. true, he specified Christmas but he refused to tell which century

[churchill]

China Added 454 Tons of Gold to Reserves Since 2003

http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=206...&refer=home

[churchill]

China says has 1,054 tonnes of gold

http://www.cnbc.com/id/30379882

"This is a trend." HOU HUIMIN, CHINA GOLD ASSOCIATION VICE GENERAL SECRETARY "My recommendation is that China's gold reserves should be at 5,000 tonnes. It's not a matter of a few hundred, or 1,000 tonnes. China should hold more because of its new international status, and because of the financial crisis." "The financial crisis means the U.S. dollar value is changing fast, and it may retreat from being the international reserve currency. If that happens, whoever holds gold will be at an advantage." ALBERT CHENG, WORLD GOLD COUNCIL MANAGING DIRECTOR FOR THE FAR EAST "This is very positive news for the gold market and for investors. It demonstrates that gold is a very good asset for their portfolios." "It is a very positive step in the right direction that they are now looking into a more balanced portfolio. In terms of the percentage of their total reserves, it is still a very small figure." "Analysts say Asian countries overall should look into diversifying US dollar denominated assets into a more diverse portfolio, including gold." REAN WANG, CHIEF ANALYST AT CGS CO LTD "The increasing Chinese gold reserves could spur similar purchases by other countries such as Japan, India and nations in Middle East. "Japan is the most likely to follow China. Both countries purchased many U.S. treasuries as a key part of their reserves and they also fear uncertainty on them, "

[churchill]

http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/1d23f80c-30aa-11...?nclick_check=1

"“This is probably the most significant central bank announcement since the Central Bank of Russia announced at the LBMA gold conference in Johannesburg in 2005 that it wanted to hold 10 per cent of its foreign exchange reserves in gold,” said John Reade of UBS. "

So gold prices will probably fall !