Motorcycle Accident In Nakhonsawon

[yabaaaa]

What are you on? Oh yeah, yabaaaa...

Where are you from? Oh yeah, Uranus...

[ILOOKFORWORK]

C

Do you know if any investigation was done to determine whether or not drugs or alcohol were involved with the motorcyclist's accidental death from this crash? If so, what was the conclusion? Being an accident, his blood should have already been checked by the medical examiner. Ask for the results of the toxicology report from the autopsy. Though you may or may not be given the right to see the autopsy entirely, or even the toxicology results; you should be allowed to know the results (blood alcohol level, etc.) and/or should be allowed to have them considered or reviewed inside or outside of court. Get a lawyer that is going to "turn up the heat" on these people and they may back down significantly. If your lawyer seems evasive or isn't really giving you a direct answer about these things, then find somebody else. It's very clear these people are trying to get as much money out of this as they can. The fact that they're suffering from the death of their family member is probably being entirely overshadowed now. This may also be their own way of trying to deal with the loss. For people in these types of situations, money sometimes seems like a "fix" for their suffering, denial, or loss. So keep in mind, these people may be acting irrationally because of their anger, sadness, grief, etc. It's exacerbated by the fact that you may be perceived as the person through which they can get significantly more compensation (because you are "farang"). Getting a good lawyer is dam_n well worth your money in this case I think. And even if it's not cheap, it will be much less that you have to pay in the end (rather than 14.5 million baht or whatever that ridiculous number is that they threw out at you). In addition, by getting a good lawyer, you're discouraging this kind of corrupt behavior to keep happening in the future. If you were not the cause of this person's accidental death, don't play their game. You're probably going to be paying some money in the end and since this is Thailand, you may be viewed as "at fault" because the person was on a motorcycle. But you don't have to play their games in terms of the amount compensation if you get the best lawyer you can find. I say get the best one and even if it's expensive, you're going to be much better off in the end; and you're going to send a clear message that you won't tolerate their little "con game". Good luck with everything.

[pukkagent]

Reading this thread makes me want to leave Thailand. I don't ever read any happy news on this website.

One piece of advice. Learn Thai as well as you can so you can follow proceedings as much as possible. If you're determined to stay here and not run off to Australia (I'd never have come back), then it'll be an asset. I don't like Thailand anymore, but Thai people are nice enough and they appreciate it if you make an effort.

At the end of the day, we're foreigners and it's a different law for us and them. The happy stories - they're great to hear - but they're not what I've seen or experienced, but then maybe I live in a very corrupt part of Thailand. You won't pay the ridiculous amount they're asking surely. That's just an absurd amount they've come up with. If they're not picketing your house, they're not immediately dangerous to you, so let the system do its thing, and I'm sure thing will turn out fine if you heed the advice given to you in this post. Be respectful to the judges. If you can, read 'The do's and don'ts of Thailand' and 'Thai Law'.

I wish I could wave a magic wand and make your insurance problems and this awful accident go away, but you've got a long way to go yet my friend. My thoughts are truly with you.

[sharecropper]

Is there any update on this worrying an appalling tale?

Many thanks,

Sharecropper

[Baxer]

Is there any update on this worrying an appalling tale?

Many thanks,

Sharecropper

I waiting for a update to, maybe he is in the Thai monkeyhouse.

[rana391]

I am back in Oz and avoiding Thailand at the moment.

Basically I skipped bail and left the country as soon as I could. Any faith I had in the legal system dissapeared rapidly after my brief holiday in government supplied accommodation.

My wife and another new lawyer are still trying to negotiate to get me back into Thailand but I do not hold out much hope.

Some highlights of what has happened since my last post.

When things started going pear shaped in court my lawyer at the time apparently told the Judge he was only there to translate and was not acting as my lawyer.

The second lawyer we hired to negotiate with the family and liaise with the courts sent many bills and gave regular updates. However it now appears he never contacted anyone and all feed back he gave was fictitious! No contact was made with either the family, the court or the police.

The new lawyer (I have lost count now) has spoken to the dead mans wife. She apparently would have been happy with 50,000 Baht but the rest of the deceased mans family and lawyer are the ones looking for the multi million amount.

One of the strange things I do not understand is the lack of any blood alcohol results! There was a full medical done to prove that the dead man was in perfect health with no tumors, heart disease or cancers of any kind therefore allowing him to work till he was 75 years old. But despite many requests we have been unable to establish if any blood alcohol tests were done.

I will update if there is any progress

Rana

[Briggsy]

Many thanks for the update.

Your experiences are very useful for all of us who drive here.

[Maizefarmer]

Is the deceaseds wife the legal next of kin? My lawyer reckons that if she is, then it's her wishes that count and getting her to accept and sign for a full a final settlement should deal with that part of the matter.

Of course there remains the issue of skipping bail, but quite frankly if I was in your position I wouldn't worry to much about it under the circumstances - if you've an agreement sorted out and paid up with the next of kin then the primary reason for wanting you back in Thailand has been deal't with, and it weakens the extradition case of all these other "hangers on", which raises a question: just what are your chances of been extradited back to Thailand if a formal request is made?

[rana391]

Hi

She is the legal next of kin, however she seems to be influenced by the other members of the family and will not make any decision till she has consulted with them and their Lawyer.

There appears to be no extradition in place between Thailand and Australia at the moment. Again I am no expert but I think it would be highly unlikely. In Australia I doubt I would have been charged at all!

Rana

[wintermute]

When is your book going to come out? This was an excellent story worth of any significant piece of fiction. I hope you do find a publisher and are able to tell the world all the trials and tribulations you had in the land o' smiles!

Edited December 20, 2009 by wintermute

[hegenious]

I'm confused...

the OP stated at least 2 times that the amount of money the family want from him is 14,500.000, not 14,500,000

it makes a huge difference where you place the dot and the comma's, and which notation you use.

I would have paid the fourteen and half K, as it seems the price for life lost in LOS

[Maizefarmer]

I'm confused...

the OP stated at least 2 times that the amount of money the family want from him is 14,500.000, not 14,500,000

it makes a huge difference where you place the dot and the comma's, and which notation you use.

I would have paid the fourteen and half K, as it seems the price for life lost in LOS

Typo error ..........correct, there is no extradition treaty between Thailand and Aus - David McMillan (who escaped from Bang Kwang) is now based in Aus for that very reason.

[rana391]

Oops.

Typo for sure. Make it $14.5 million Baht. Don't know how good a book would be. It has certainly been an experience though (one I could have done without).

Rana

[poldebol]

"The fact that you are a farang is neither here nor there in the court's eyes. You will be treated as any other person will be treated."

Soundman, I know you want to think you know alot about Thailand, and maybe you usually do, but in this case you are horribly wrong and giving out terrible advice. There are entire websites set up to document and report ridiculous rulings by Thai judges that favor Thai vs Farang in cases where the judge states "I am ruling in favor of the defendant as he is Thai and you are foreigner and this is Thailand" YES THAT IS ALMOST A DIRECT QUOTE. They see nothing wrong with this.... its a travesty of justice, I would gladly find the links for you but THEY ARE BLOCKED IN THAILAND.

Can you give me the reference of a few court decisions where the judge uses the "this is Thailand" argument as the main argument?

I would also like to have the names of the sites you mention.

Thank you very much.

[rana391]

Time for an update.

I have received a letter from the widow. The tone of the letter is a lot less threatening than the attitude of the rest of the family and their lawyers.

Basically she is claiming to be USD $120.000.00 in debt to the bank and is now willing to settle for USD $150.000.00. If I settle she has promised to have all charges (pending or otherwise) removed.

There is a veiled threat to pursue me through the Australian embassy if I do not put the money in her bank this month.

Comments are welcome.

Thanks

Rana

[dumball]

What a sad , sad story indeed , I found many Thai to be on the greedy side thinking all Farang are millionares , but this scenario has gone from the sublime to the rediculous , how can these so called Buhddists be so callous to another human being ? At least a record of all of this should be written to national and international news agencies to enlighten the world on just how big some of the scammers in Thailand really are , for myself , I would be avidly writing and in the proccess of taking my Thai wife to Australia wanting to put it all behind me in the least aggravating manner .

[KunMatt]

This is really a disgusting, horrid story on behalf of the dead man's family but, as always, remember in Thailand "money number one".

Edited July 18, 2010 by UKMatt

[moe666]

This is really a disgusting, horrid story on behalf of the dead man's family but, as always, remember in Thailand "money number one".

Excuse me this kind of crap happens every were. A friend has been hassling with his neighbor for a couple of years now. The neighbor has lost in every appearance before people of authority; first he lost in district court then he recruited another neighbor to become involved and the case came before city council were he lost again. Now the neighbor is sueing my friend for fraud over the same case.

So please donot generalize about Thailand money grubbers are on the prowl in every country.

[thomo]

Just to butt in.

I believe the first thing to do in a case brought against you is to counter sue for any ridiculous thing that you can. A la Thai style.

It slows the process down which adds a lot of time for negotiations, and shows you're not some push over.

Best of luck with it. I would now write a letter to the family stating that if they had requested a reasonable amount, they would have recieved it. For being so greedy, they now get nothing, and will never get anything.

Edited July 18, 2010 by thomo

[FarangCravings]

I think more attention should be focused on his 1st class insurance company that is not doing what they are paid to do

Name and Shame them and let them know we Farangs are watching them and will boycott them as a business if you pay for 1st class insurance they should od there job

[Pacificperson]

This case seems to be centered on negotiations and leverage. From my reading of the posts, it seems that the Thai culture requires a payment and the primary question is "How much?"

While you were in Thailand, the dead man's family had considerable leverage over you as evidenced by the time in jail and the threats of more of the same. Now that you are no longer in Thailand, this leverage has been greatly reduced. Hence, the reduction in the settlement demand.

I think the first question that you have to ask is "How badly do I want to be able to return to Thailand?" If the answer is "I don't care if I ever go back", then kiss it off and see an Australian lawyer and evaluate your risks. I doubt that they are significant. The family could possibly file a civil suit, but from your posts, I doubt that they would win it.

If you do want to return, then I would advise you to stay out of Thailand until you have reached a settlement. The longer you can stay away the cheaper the settlement will be. At some point if you want to return, then it will most likely cost you. The question seems to be again "how much?" The cost of a good lawyer would probably be repaid several times over. Tell him to play hardball and that you will not be returning until everything is irrevocably settled.

Even then you may find the family protesting on your doorstep for being cheap, but you will not be facing jail time.

Edited July 18, 2010 by Pacificperson

[GarryP]

I agree with thomo. Even 150k $US is a ridiculous amount. However, you need to check whether jumping bail is a felony, which I would have thought it is. In such case the deceased's wife cannot have charges for jumping bail dropped. Good luck.

[inthepink]

To the OP: I've only just read through this thread but one thing is confusing me. The motorbike was in the wrong lane and the rider was not wearing a helmet...but how exaclty did you come to hit him? My apologies if you have already explained this but I couldn't see it anywhere.

Edited July 18, 2010 by inthepink

[Chunky1]

What is he supposed to counter sue for? Because they won't accept the amount of money that he wants to pay to have the charges dropped?

OP just has to decide whether or not he really wants to live in Thailand and how fearful he is of being extradited/harassed in the future.

Getting angry because the Thai family wants a large payment for the member of their family that you killed is very silly.

Edited July 18, 2010 by Chunky1

[Chunky1]

Don't forget your settlement with the BIB for jumping bail.

[KunMatt]

This is really a disgusting, horrid story on behalf of the dead man's family but, as always, remember in Thailand "money number one".

Excuse me this kind of crap happens every were. A friend has been hassling with his neighbor for a couple of years now. The neighbor has lost in every appearance before people of authority; first he lost in district court then he recruited another neighbor to become involved and the case came before city council were he lost again. Now the neighbor is sueing my friend for fraud over the same case.

So please donot generalize about Thailand money grubbers are on the prowl in every country.

I have no idea what relevance your little story has to do with the family of this dead man trying to become rich beyond their wildest dreams because he managed to get himself killed in a road accident involving a farang, but you can bet your ass that if he had been hit by a Thai they would not be claiming for 14.5 MILLION Baht plus the insurance money on top of that. The OP has already stated that the legal next of kin would settle for a more realistic amount of money but the greedy familly are hoping for the big steal just like there are literally thousands of accounts of on this forum alone.

Yes, money is important to everyone but very much more so here.

[Chunky1]

I drove once on an Thai Highway in Isaan, a two lane road with a Motorbike lane attached.

I drove a Pickup on the right lane of that two lane road and fast, about 140 km/h.

After i overtook a Truck I stayed on that lane, was nearly no traffic.

Suddenly, a lone Motorbike driver changed from his Motorbike lane very fast to my side.

Crossing the left lane in such a hurry, I could not stop fast enough.

We touched near my left front wheel and as I still was faster he scratched my car all the way to the back to the trunk.

He leaned on my car, so after my car was gone, he fell on to the road surface.

I saw it in the back mirror, he rolled more times and than was on his feet again.

As there where no other cars or motos around and he did not appear to be seriously injured, and as he was to blame,

in my opinion.

I accelerated.

My insurance had to pay the not small damage and new painting, no problem.

TIT.

Wow, you are a model citizen.

[way2muchcoffee]

What is he supposed to counter sue for? Because they won't accept the amount of money that he wants to pay to have the charges dropped?

OP just has to decide whether or not he really wants to live in Thailand and how fearful he is of being extradited/harassed in the future.

Getting angry because the Thai family wants a large payment for the member of their family that you killed is very silly.

Evidently you missed the part about the accident being solely the fault of the motorcycle driver. Wrong lane, no helmet, etc.

[Chunky1]

Next question is has any Farang here riding his/her bike been hit by a Thai in a car and what was the outcome of that?

Yes, me.

A pick-up truck ran a red light in Kampaeng Saen, Nakorn Pathom and knocked me off my motorbike.

Tons of witnesses, not one of whom did anything.

Pick-up truck did not stop leaving me and the bike on the ground.

Maybe it was Alfredo.

[KunMatt]

I drove once on an Thai Highway in Isaan, a two lane road with a Motorbike lane attached.

I drove a Pickup on the right lane of that two lane road and fast, about 140 km/h.

After i overtook a Truck I stayed on that lane, was nearly no traffic.

Suddenly, a lone Motorbike driver changed from his Motorbike lane very fast to my side.

Crossing the left lane in such a hurry, I could not stop fast enough.

We touched near my left front wheel and as I still was faster he scratched my car all the way to the back to the trunk.

He leaned on my car, so after my car was gone, he fell on to the road surface.

I saw it in the back mirror, he rolled more times and than was on his feet again.

As there where no other cars or motos around and he did not appear to be seriously injured, and as he was to blame,

in my opinion.

I accelerated.

My insurance had to pay the not small damage and new painting, no problem.

TIT.

Wow, you are a model citizen.

Yeah, it's not the right thing to do but after reading through this thread what was the alternative? Stop and get screwed by the motorcyclist, the police and the insurance company for something you know is not your fault?

In a country where you feel like justice and fairness will prevail I'm sure that he would have stopped and done the right thing, but trying to do what's right here you are gambling with your lifestyle and freedom.