Financial Crisis

[midas]

The MF Global situation is very troubling and I am amazed it continues to go on without return of the cash accounts to clients. However, I don't see a one billion $ unresolved fraud killing trillions of dollars of market activity and life will go on.

I don't understand why people concentrate so much on Jim Puplava. He was only the interviewer -the messenger ?

I consider that Ann Barnhardt was the most relevant part of the interview not the background and credentials of the interviewer?

She was not a typical high roller broker she was in fact a cattle farmer turned broker.

It's not the amount that has gone missing that is of significance. It's the circumstances of how it went missing,and the relationship of this person to the government of the United States of America. Instead of being prosecuted for not having a securities industry's licence and if you believe Ann Barnhardt for literally stealing the money, Jon Corzine ends up hosting a $35,000 a plate dinner for Obama. What kind of message does that send to the markets? The symbolism is what is important and as Ann Barnhardt correctly says the unwillingness of the so-called regulatory authorities to do their job and consequently the drip drip drip destruction of trust for the markets in general.

Don't forget what Bernie Madoff said after he was caught " He also spoke with great intensity and fluency about his dealings with various banks and hedge funds, pointing to their “willful blindness” and their failure to examine discrepancies between his regulatory filings and other information available to them. “They had to know,” Mr. Madoff said. “But the attitude was sort of, ‘If you’re doing something wrong, we don’t want to know.’ ”

Edited December 5, 2011 by midas

[midas]

and life will go on.

it sure will :sleepy:

A Secret Scandal

The government and the big banks deceived the public about their $7 trillion secret loan program. They should be punished.

http://www.slate.com/articles/business/moneybox/2011/11/the_7_trillion_secret_loan_program_the_government_and_big_banks_should_be_punished_for_deceiving_the_public_about_their_hush_hush_bailout_scheme_.html?tid=sm_tw_button_chunky

[Naam]

literally stealing the money, Jon Corzine ends up hosting a $35,000 a plate dinner for Obama...

correct me if 'm wrong but my understanding is that this dinner was before the scandal was made public. that does however not explain why no legal action has been taken against Corzine.

[midas]

literally stealing the money, Jon Corzine ends up hosting a $35,000 a plate dinner for Obama...

correct me if 'm wrong but my understanding is that this dinner was before the scandal was made public. that does however not explain why no legal action has been taken against Corzine.

because JP Morgan's lawyers are " running the show and setting the agenda " !

Dracula in charge of the bloodbank !!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MZkjIIudN70&feature=player_embedded#!

[midas]

Britain has the highest total debt to GDP ratio (1,000%) of any G20 nation so it makes

sense it also has the worst wealth and income gaps (by design).

http://www.businessinsider.com/g10-countries-by-total-debt-to-gdp-2011-12

[ronz28]

Britain has the highest total debt to GDP ratio (1,000%) of any G20 nation so it makes

sense it also has the worst wealth and income gaps (by design).

http://www.businessi...-to-gdp-2011-12

Very interesting chart. I had no Idea of the relative size of the UK Financial sector debt. I wonder what assets they are financing with all that debt? Who are they lending to? How likely is that they will default on a chunk of that debt? I have some research to do now. However, I know the usual problem is disclosure isn't sufficient to really know if the debt is supported by real assets vs some flaky derivatives. UK not included in the latest credit watch for downgrade?

[Naam]

Very interesting chart. I had no Idea of the relative size of the UK Financial sector debt. I wonder what assets they are financing with all that debt? Who are they lending to? How likely is that they will default on a chunk of that debt? I have some research to do now. However, I know the usual problem is disclosure isn't sufficient to really know if the debt is supported by real assets vs some flaky derivatives. UK not included in the latest credit watch for downgrade?

don't waste your time on nutters like Joe Weisenthal. he's one of the doom&gloomers who, instead of doing their own homework, use facts and figures worked out by others and then twist, misinterprete and quite often even forge them to suit their agenda. just like the rainbow press they couldn't exist / make a living without presenting sensational rubbish.

[fritter1970]

Very interesting chart. I had no Idea of the relative size of the UK Financial sector debt. I wonder what assets they are financing with all that debt? Who are they lending to? How likely is that they will default on a chunk of that debt? I have some research to do now. However, I know the usual problem is disclosure isn't sufficient to really know if the debt is supported by real assets vs some flaky derivatives. UK not included in the latest credit watch for downgrade?

don't waste your time on nutters like Joe Weisenthal. he's one of the doom&gloomers who, instead of doing their own homework, use facts and figures worked out by others and then twist, misinterprete and quite often even forge them to suit their agenda. just like the rainbow press they couldn't exist / make a living without presenting sensational rubbish.

Stop criticising with every comment twerp and have the balls to actually tell us how things will pan out and where you are investing if you are so dam_n brilliant....... or are you just a mamma's boy?

[Naam]

Stop criticising with every comment twerp and have the balls to actually tell us how things will pan out and where you are investing if you are so dam_n brilliant....... or are you just a mamma's boy?

-i have no idea "how things will pan out". why not ask your acquaintances, the "guys in the trenches"?

-explaining my strategy of investing would be too tedious but even if i did beyond the grasp of "let's get rich fast" dreamers.

-where/when did i say i was brilliant? did i go short AUDUSD waiting for the gold price to collapse? who's the "twerp" here?

-i voice my views/opinions and criticise whenever i please.

any other questions?

an expert's forecast:

[fritter1970]

Stop criticising with every comment twerp and have the balls to actually tell us how things will pan out and where you are investing if you are so dam_n brilliant....... or are you just a mamma's boy?

-i have no idea "how things will pan out". why not ask your acquaintances, the "guys in the trenches"?

-explaining my strategy of investing would be too tedious but even if i did beyond the grasp of "let's get rich fast" dreamers.

-where/when did i say i was brilliant? did i go short AUDUSD waiting for the gold price to collapse? who's the "twerp" here?

-i voice my views/opinions and criticise whenever i please.

any other questions?

an expert's forecast:

http://www.thaivisa....ost__p__4846172

Yep. Questioned answered. You're a mamma's boy. Take your toys home to mummy. This area is only for the men who have the nuts to at least one time voice where they're putting their money. It's not for a boy who is too afraid to do so.

As for AUD/USD.... the trade is not over mummy's boy. Why quote a trade that's still in play? Ah, that's right, cause you only criticise cause your balls are in mummy's purse.

[lannarebirth]

Stop criticising with every comment twerp and have the balls to actually tell us how things will pan out and where you are investing if you are so dam_n brilliant....... or are you just a mamma's boy?

-i have no idea "how things will pan out". why not ask your acquaintances, the "guys in the trenches"?

-explaining my strategy of investing would be too tedious but even if i did beyond the grasp of "let's get rich fast" dreamers.

-where/when did i say i was brilliant? did i go short AUDUSD waiting for the gold price to collapse? who's the "twerp" here?

-i voice my views/opinions and criticise whenever i please.

any other questions?

an expert's forecast:

http://www.thaivisa....ost__p__4846172

Yep. Questioned answered. You're a mamma's boy. Take your toys home to mummy. This area is only for the men who have the nuts to at least one time voice where they're putting their money. It's not for a boy who is too afraid to do so.

As for AUD/USD.... the trade is not over mummy's boy. Why quote a trade that's still in play? Ah, that's right, cause you only criticise cause your balls are in mummy's purse.

My, that's a stinging rebuttal. You must have been captain of the debate team.

[midas]

Very interesting chart. I had no Idea of the relative size of the UK Financial sector debt. I wonder what assets they are financing with all that debt? Who are they lending to? How likely is that they will default on a chunk of that debt? I have some research to do now. However, I know the usual problem is disclosure isn't sufficient to really know if the debt is supported by real assets vs some flaky derivatives. UK not included in the latest credit watch for downgrade?

don't waste your time on nutters like Joe Weisenthal. he's one of the doom&gloomers who, instead of doing their own homework, use facts and figures worked out by others and then twist, misinterprete and quite often even forge them to suit their agenda. just like the rainbow press they couldn't exist / make a living without presenting sensational rubbish.

but these figures are simply based on the graph produced by Morgan Stanley research?

I will also do some more research regarding this aspect.

[Naam]

but these figures are simply based on the graph produced by Morgan Stanley research?

I will also do some more research regarding this aspect.

yes they are. but they are as presented without the definition of "financial debt" and the "credit side" of the latter. TV-member "Ronz" asked justified and relevant questions

I wonder what assets they are financing with all that debt? Who are they lending to? How likely is that they will default on a chunk of that debt?

Weisenthal is doing nothing else than presenting constructed fiction as fact similar to what is from time to time done by gloom&doomers when they mention the "horrendous and terrible $650 trillion debt" of global derivatives without taking into consideration that the counterpart is by (whatever percentage which is deliberately not mentioned) "tangibly" backed and therefore offsets the debt.

once in a while i move assets from one corporate portfolio to the other and due to accounting procedures one of the portfolios shows huge red figures. but does that mean that i'm indebted because the green figures in the other portfolio are balancing the red ones.

[Naam]

Stop criticising with every comment twerp and have the balls to actually tell us how things will pan out and where you are investing if you are so dam_n brilliant....... or are you just a mamma's boy?

-i have no idea "how things will pan out". why not ask your acquaintances, the "guys in the trenches"?

-explaining my strategy of investing would be too tedious but even if i did beyond the grasp of "let's get rich fast" dreamers.

-where/when did i say i was brilliant? did i go short AUDUSD waiting for the gold price to collapse? who's the "twerp" here?

-i voice my views/opinions and criticise whenever i please.

any other questions?

an expert's forecast:

http://www.thaivisa....ost__p__4846172

Yep. Questioned answered. You're a mamma's boy. Take your toys home to mummy. This area is only for the men who have the nuts to at least one time voice where they're putting their money. It's not for a boy who is too afraid to do so.

As for AUD/USD.... the trade is not over mummy's boy. Why quote a trade that's still in play? Ah, that's right, cause you only criticise cause your balls are in mummy's purse.

My, that's a stinging rebuttal. You must have been captain of the debate team.

bingo! it made me sit crying in a dark corner cursing my fate.

[fletchsmile]

Very interesting chart. I had no Idea of the relative size of the UK Financial sector debt. I wonder what assets they are financing with all that debt? Who are they lending to? How likely is that they will default on a chunk of that debt? I have some research to do now. However, I know the usual problem is disclosure isn't sufficient to really know if the debt is supported by real assets vs some flaky derivatives. UK not included in the latest credit watch for downgrade?

don't waste your time on nutters like Joe Weisenthal. he's one of the doom&gloomers who, instead of doing their own homework, use facts and figures worked out by others and then twist, misinterprete and quite often even forge them to suit their agenda. just like the rainbow press they couldn't exist / make a living without presenting sensational rubbish.

but these figures are simply based on the graph produced by Morgan Stanley research?

I will also do some more research regarding this aspect.

Would be interesting to see how they are made up. If legit, it shouldn't be difficult for anyone with access to MS research docs to find the original. I suspect that won't be the case tho'

They look like rubbish to me, as tho' someone has twisted a story or taken part of a picture. Really can't see how the UK financial system has more debt than the US financial system. Unless they're doing things like counting only one side of derivatives trades such as those on FX markets, where UK is the largest FX trading market in the world, and exceeds the US and then Japan - probably also explains Japan's second place. They've probably also done things like include foreign banks offices in London as Uk exposures. eg JPM London offices under UK financial system.

Edited December 6, 2011 by fletchsmile

[Naam]

Unless they're doing things like counting only one side of derivatives trades...

that's the only explanation i can think of. it gets even more ridiculous and misleading when using the figures (not only debt but others, e.g. GDP/capita and the like) of dwarf states which are financial centers such as Luxembourg or Liechtenstein.

[Naam]

Japan's second place

in the graph would cause an average intelligent German Shepherd or one of my super intelligent Dachshunde to roll on the floor roaring with laughter

Edited December 6, 2011 by Naam

[flying]

Bottom line.....For me anyway...

It is not hard to see with my eyes what the reality is & has been since 2007

I don't really need reports & opinions but do read them for entertainment value & also to see how others view things.

For me the mess has only gotten worse. They have shot their wad & it has had no impact in reality. It has only made what is to come harder while enriching the few who really had no right to being saved.

From my viewpoint I only see worse to come...I see no repair has been achieved in the least. I see folks who were on the bubble now underwater. I do not see housing/new home construction coming back for a long time to come. I do not see new business start ups as a viable alternative at this time in eh USA as more & more have less & less to spend.

While initially I had hopes that once values in the USA dropped to 2006 valuations things would start to improve I see now I was wrong. I now have no idea where the bottom will be nor do I have any idea of how things will turn even when prices bottom.

One thing I do remember Gerald Celente saying years ago is that the only new business will be those that offer quality & value.

That does make a bit of sense as more & more do with less & less.

I am glad I live debt free but feel for those that are not & being squeezed now with nowhere to turn

[cloudhopper]

A very deflationary picture there flying. And one I concur with.

[Naam]

A very deflationary picture there flying. And one I concur with.

my view is that on inflation/deflation the jury is still out deliberating. should Bernanke's procedure be followed (Merkel and Sarkozy are about to do that) then other countries or economic blocs might follow and kill two birds with one stone, namely monetise unsustainable debt via (not necessarily hyper-) "moderately high" inflation and "kicking the can not down the road but down a looooong highway".

[churchill]

A very deflationary picture there flying. And one I concur with.

my view is that on inflation/deflation the jury is still out deliberating. should Bernanke's procedure be followed (Merkel and Sarkozy are about to do that) then other countries or economic blocs might follow and kill two birds with one stone, namely monetise unsustainable debt via (not necessarily hyper-) "moderately high" inflation and "kicking the can not down the road but down a looooong highway".

sounds about right ...Nobody wants deflation .. a co-ordinated ( IMF Managed ? ) response " then other countries or economic blocs might follow'

[Naam]

A very deflationary picture there flying. And one I concur with.

my view is that on inflation/deflation the jury is still out deliberating. should Bernanke's procedure be followed (Merkel and Sarkozy are about to do that) then other countries or economic blocs might follow and kill two birds with one stone, namely monetise unsustainable debt via (not necessarily hyper-) "moderately high" inflation and "kicking the can not down the road but down a looooong highway".

sounds about right ...Nobody wants deflation .. a co-ordinated ( IMF Managed ? ) response " then other countries or economic blocs might follow'

not necessarily IMF managed Churchill because hard currency loans wouldn't enable specific countries to print their domestic currencies and generate debt monetising inflation.

[midas]

Jon Corzine paid Bill Clinton $50,000 per month to improve his image !!!

http://www.humanevents.com/article.php?id=47938

[ronz28]

Jon Corzine paid Bill Clinton $50,000 per month to improve his image !!!

http://www.humaneven...le.php?id=47938

Unsourced right wing rumor garbage with New Gingrich spam blocking the article. "Human Events- Powerful Conservative Voices" . No thanks Newt, I have to wade through enough of this Murdoch garbage to get business news from WSJ Fox News, etc. Sorry Midas, this rant is not directed at you.

[midas]

Anxious Greeks Emptying Their Bank Accounts

http://www.spiegel.de/international/europe/0,1518,802051,00.html

[midas]

there are zero standards in the business world now.....ZERO Even where it requires honesty to the judicial system

even I can remember when conflicts of interest were declared and respected

whereas the behaviour of these people will simply shine even more spotlights on this

unbelievably grubby affair

BOMBSHELL: Damning SEC OIG Audit of SIPC Raises Conflicts of Interest for MF Global Liquidation Trustee James. W. Giddens

http://mfgfacts.com/2011/12/01/questions-on-trustee-conflicts-increase-after-declaration-of-%E2%80%9Cdisinterestedness%E2%80%9D/

Edited December 7, 2011 by midas

[BlackJack]

Inflation is the only way to go!!

From the Hitch Hikers Guide - substitute leaf for fiat dollars

MANAGEMENT CONSULTANT:

Um listen, if we could, er, for a moment move on to the subject of fiscal policy -

FORD:

”Fiscal Policy”?!

MANAGEMENT CONSULTANT:

Yes.

FORD:

How can you have money if none of you actually produce anything? It doesn’t grow on trees you know!

MANAGEMENT CONSULTANT:

You know If you would allow me to continue!

CAPTAIN:

Yes let him to continue.

MANAGEMENT CONSULTANT:

Since we decided a few weeks ago to adopt leaves as legal tender, we have, of course all become immensely rich.

FORD:

No really? Really?

CROWD MEMBERS:

Yes, very good move…

MANAGEMENT CONSULTANT:

But, we have also run into a small inflation problem on account of the high level of leaf availability. Which means that I gather the current going rate has something like three major deciduous forests buying one ship’s peanut. So, um, in order to obviate this problem and effectively revalue the leaf, we are about to embark on an extensive defoliation campaign, and um, burn down all the forests. I think that’s a sensible move don’t you?

MARKETING GIRL:

That makes economic sense.

[ThapaeJim]

Stop criticising with every comment twerp and have the balls to actually tell us how things will pan out and where you are investing if you are so dam_n brilliant....... or are you just a mamma's boy?

-i have no idea "how things will pan out". why not ask your acquaintances, the "guys in the trenches"?

-explaining my strategy of investing would be too tedious but even if i did beyond the grasp of "let's get rich fast" dreamers.

-where/when did i say i was brilliant? did i go short AUDUSD waiting for the gold price to collapse? who's the "twerp" here?

-i voice my views/opinions and criticise whenever i please.

any other questions?

an expert's forecast:

http://www.thaivisa....ost__p__4846172

Yep. Questioned answered. You're a mamma's boy. Take your toys home to mummy. This area is only for the men who have the nuts to at least one time voice where they're putting their money. It's not for a boy who is too afraid to do so.

As for AUD/USD.... the trade is not over mummy's boy. Why quote a trade that's still in play? Ah, that's right, cause you only criticise cause your balls are in mummy's purse.

LOL. the only true comment i have read on this thread.

I have tried to learn from this thread about everything going on. not getting very far. is this naam character making entries from the mental hospitale? LOL

Anyway i hope the comments on here improve so they at least make some sense

[Naam]

LOL. the only true comment i have read on this thread.

I have tried to learn from this thread about everything going on. not getting very far. is this naam character making entries from the mental hospitale? LOL

Anyway i hope the comments on here improve so they at least make some sense

how did you know?

[Naam]

interesting graph: