Degree Not Enough To Find Work In Thailand?

[rocketlad78]

Hi there,

I am English, living in the UK and am 30 years old. My girlfriend has secured a teaching job at an international school in Thailand - with work permit, flights, etc, all paid for by the school. We are looking to move abroad to do the things we won't be able to do when we start a family...which should be pretty soon!

I, on the other hand, am currently doing a TEFL course to find an ESL job out there. Ideally I would be looking to further my career in people management within a customer service environment, however, I am finding that more and more people on the net are saying that if you don't have a bachelor's degree (which I unfortunately don't) then you should forget getting ANY job in Thailand, TEFL or whatever.

I have a certificate of higher education and 3 A-Levels, one of them in English Language. I have been a team leader in a customer services department for almost a year managing 5 staff, having worked there for almost three. I am also currently obtaining an EDI Certificate in Business Management Level 2.

Obviously its harder in any country to compete against someone with a degree, but with my rather minimal qualifications/experience above would I be able to find any jobs at all in Thailand? Understand the competition is rife. I am looking to get a non immigrant multiple entry visa so I can search while I am there.

Please tell me my glasses aren't too 'rose tinted' and I need you to be brutally honest.

Thanks,

Rocketlad78

[Soutpeel]

RL78...first of all what your friends are telling you is complete horsesh*t.....you dont need a degree to get a job in Thailand.

To become an "English" teacher in Thailand, may or may not require a degree, dependent on who is employing you, but the general rule says for teaching.... a degree is required.

You talk about getting into customer services in Thailand....highly unlikely unless you are fluent in Thai and even then would the company be prepared to go through the hassle of getting a WP for you....

As regards getting a non-imm visa.....get married to your GF and you can come and live here as her dependent....ie you will be issued a Non-imm O on the the back of her Non-imm B and WP, will give you plenty of time to look around and if you find something, should be pretty straight forward for the company to get you a WP.

With all the above being said.....We are in an economic meltdown....jobs are being lost in Thailand, so competion is rife for jobs and a lot of companies are cutting back on costs (Work Permits... cost money)

I know a lot of long term expats who are getting the plug pulled by their companies in Thailand to cut costs....so wouldnt bode well for you...

Have I been brutally honest enough for you ??

[samran]

thats right, being unmarried the best visa you will get (without a job) is a 2 week tourist visa (after your first 30 day entry expires).

If you are in BKK that will involve making a 500km round trip to the Cambodian border town of Poipet every fortnight to legally leave thailand, pay $20 to get a Cambodian visa, enter cambodia momentarily, and then cross back into Thailand to get a whole other two weeks.

Takes the best part of a day to make that trip to a town in Cambodia the Lonely planet describes as the 'armpit' of Cambodia. That is being too kind by half....

[Briggsy]

Thais place great emphasis on the highest level of job applicants' educational qualifications.

With your qualifications, you would need to rely on 4 things to get you a job. Excellent experience, preferably with blue-chip comanies, contacts in Thailand, your ability to talk your way into a job and persistence.

For English teaching, anybody including your binman, can start tomorrow and if you're prepared to put in the hours, you should make 50,000 Baht a month. Hard yakka though.

[lannarebirth]

The upside to this economic slowdown is I can't think of a better time to get an education and qualifications for working when the crisis is past. Perhaps you could enroll in the Open University and get a degree online while here in Thailand.

[quiksilva]

My previous boss here, a Brit didnt have a degree, but what he did have was a vast amount of experience and expertise in his chosen specialist field, with an industry leader.

So as Briggsy says it is possible, but its not possible for everyone.

[skybluestu]

Hi Rocketlad78,

From my limited experience of living here now I think that Thailand is a country where you don't have many options without a degree whether a Thai or foreigner, they seem to think that anyone without a degree is only worthy of working in 7/11 or taking the local buffalo out for a walk. My background is very similar to yourself, I was actually doing a degree but after x2 years I got offered a good job with the same salary & potential to 'climb the ladder' that I would have received if I had completed the full x4 years! So I accepted the offer and left with only a 2yr Diploma. In the company I worked at, like many others in the UK but unlike here, people are not always employed just because they have a degree. If the degree is relative to the work you will be doing then that is different but that is not often the case back home or over here with many people working as English teachers and only being able to do so because they have a degree. And in the majority of cases that degree is in a subject that has nothing to do with English or education.

I applied for promotions within the company I worked at in the UK and was often more successful than those who had similar experience and a degree. I also had people working for me who had degrees which would never happen here, if you don't have a degree you are treated very differently and not given a chance to prove what you can do. And don't forget that this is Thailand, many students pass who should have failed which makes it even more laughable.

So overall I would say you would need a degree as it is a requirement at most schools now but I am teaching with only a diploma and a TEFL but I honestly think I have been lucky as I am working at a private school where they have a little bit more say in who they hire than government schools and they are more concerned with a teachers ability to teach, not just whether you have a degree or not. The x2 English teachers before me both had degrees but the director has told me that he is happier with my teaching ability and relationship with the students than he was with either of the previous x2. I think most people will say don't come without a degree which is good advice as you will find it harder to find work, but not impossible. Good luck, hope it all goes well for you.

[rocketlad78]

wow, can i just thank everyone for their advice - I half expected the content of the responses but just wanted to make sure. And thanks for being brutally honest.

Two things I'm going to throw into the mixer - 1) The international school my girlfriend will work at has offered me part time guitar teaching at their school, possibly extending to full time - I take it this could be a foot in the door and they have said I will get first choice if they offer me an ESL job there. 2) If this is the case, I understand them offering me the job is one thing - but the Thai government will have the final say and THEY are the party that would look for a degree.

I'm just hoping that these private international schools have 'good relations' with the immigration office for a chap with no degree in order to get a work permit. Looks like we'll be taking the risk - thanks for your help but any more thoughts re the above would be great.

[Soutpeel]

wow, can i just thank everyone for their advice - I half expected the content of the responses but just wanted to make sure. And thanks for being brutally honest.

Two things I'm going to throw into the mixer - 1) The international school my girlfriend will work at has offered me part time guitar teaching at their school, possibly extending to full time - I take it this could be a foot in the door and they have said I will get first choice if they offer me an ESL job there. 2) If this is the case, I understand them offering me the job is one thing - but the Thai government will have the final say and THEY are the party that would look for a degree.

I'm just hoping that these private international schools have 'good relations' with the immigration office for a chap with no degree in order to get a work permit. Looks like we'll be taking the risk - thanks for your help but any more thoughts re the above would be great.

Based on what you are saying here, I wouldnt be too worried about the degree thing then....if they take you on full time as a guitar teacher with a work permit, if the ESL job comes up...you just start teaching ESL, dont see the reason why you would need to apply for a new WP...you are with the same school

[wasabi]

I think you should think about finishing your degree you are still relatively young and on average those with degrees earn substantially more throughout their lives.

[bruceboy]

I have heard of some international schools making allowances for spouses of teachers. Good luck!

[Scott]

He said 'girlfriend'. Since their not married, he has limited options. If she is with an international school, it's probably in a rather populated area and jobs will be harder to get.

There are a lot of people looking for work these days.

[citizen33]

I would say that this makes more sense as an adventure for a few years than it does as a long term option for a couple with a family. If you go for it you need to think how you could get back to your home country and what you would gain from the couple of years invested. It might be that getting the degree is indeed the best option.

Edited February 4, 2009 by citizen33

[thaicbr]

Rocketlad. make sure you get an 'immB' visa from Hull. you will be able to get a 12mth multi entry without to much trouble.

Don't listen to Samran he's talking about entry permits not Visa's. PM me for details.

also about the job/ part time there are many ways around that. things are getting more difficult but still not impossible.

Have you been to Thailand before. one very unusual thing you said was that you would be starting a family soon. so that would mean the bread winner (girlfriend) would not work..................strange.

Allan

[sibeymai]

The biggest obstacle you will face coming from a Customer Service background/experience is that you don't speak Thai, so don't expect to work in your previous profession here. You age and experience precludes you from a higher position for which English alone is sufficient.

However, there is freedom in Thailand to pursue self employment opportunities which may not be available to you back in the UK. All it takes is some imagination. If it doesn't work out you've risked far less here than back home.

Definitely it will be a tough job market here in 2009 and for the next few years. Unless you're the very best at what you do you probably won't be considered, and if you are, you're competing world wide with anyone else who wants to come to Thailand.

Unfortunately, that's just the reality of Thailand. Best option in the short term, until you can establish a social network yourself, is to make use of contacts and offers through your girlfriend's school. It won't pay much, but you won't starve either. Gives you time to assess the opportunities and you're young enough that it shouldn't matter to your career.

[ShugNorris]

Have you got assets and/or pension or decent savings?

Could be shooting yourselves in the foot further down the line if you don't.

I just mean if you're from the UK and things don't work out in Thailand, what will you come back to?

Not trying to be negative and I'm sure you've thought it through, just mentioning it!

- Shug

[Soutpeel]

Rocketlad. make sure you get an 'immB' visa from Hull. you will be able to get a 12mth multi entry without to much trouble.

Don't listen to Samran he's talking about entry permits not Visa's. PM me for details.

Someone else who can read posts properly.. ....HTF can he get a Non-imm B. He hasnt got a job offer, he is not intending on opening a business....he wants to come here with with his GF and look for a job...

The best he will get is a Non O from Hull to visit friends...

[rocketlad78]

Ok!

Well, this isn't making it any easier which I suppose is a good thing.

We're in talks with her international school - they tend to help the long term partners of teachers find work in order to keep the teacher they want. In the meantime, the non imm 'O' is the best option, but I can get a 'B' if the school agree to help and can send me a sponsorship letter. Hull can issue these within 48 hours of application and we don't have to move until this July. This gives me 6 months to network, build on contacts, apply for work, etc. As she will be getting free accommodation and, quite frankly, a ridiculous wage in Thailand then I can afford to be a kept man for a couple months whilst looking out there.

Oh, did I mention I grew up in Bangkok as a child in the 80's??? Hopefully this could give me the edge over some others in my position (although all I can do now is count to ten - will definitely brush up on the Thai though).

With regards to starting a family - we're both the breadwinners in the UK and will most probably be returning to the UK after our 2 years abroad. We want to do this so we can travel around Thailand and neighbouring countries during her holidays (although I would have to use my 25 days holiday a year for this its a dam_n sight better then paying through the teeth to go anywhere decent from the UK). Oh, and a weekend break to Hua Hin is better then going to freezing Brighton! And yes, we have a nest egg to fall back on when we return - who knows what the economy will be like in 2011.

Look guys, I've really appreciated your help - you've helped us alot. We're leaving our friends and family behind to do something we've always wanted to do and I haven't slept in two days. If any of you are living there and know anyone thats looking for someone in my position then I am happy to PM you my CV! I'm also a guitar player and will be looking to start giving lessons when I'm there.

Thanks,

R78

[Soutpeel]

but I can get a 'B' if the school agree to help and can send me a sponsorship letter.

You are going to find its just not a sponsership letter you need, you will need a pile of documents about an inch thick from the school + the letter of intent + a receipt for your WP application.

As suggrested before, the simplest way for you is Non-imm O - Visiting friends, multi-entry and you can get almost 15 months on it...

[rocketlad78]

Ok, it just said sponsorship letter on the application pack - but the 'O' seems to be the one then, thanks Soutpeel.

[desertrat]

I believe that the main criteria for getting legal employment here, apart from teaching English, is to have skills and/or experience that are not available locally. I'm not sure if that overrides a degree requirement.

btw An International School teacher, has taken the penthouse where I live, about 45,000 pm. What are they paying them.?

[johnefallis]

Thais place great emphasis on the highest level of job applicants' educational qualifications.

With your qualifications, you would need to rely on 4 things to get you a job. Excellent experience, preferably with blue-chip comanies, contacts in Thailand, your ability to talk your way into a job and persistence.

For English teaching, anybody including your binman, can start tomorrow and if you're prepared to put in the hours, you should make 50,000 Baht a month. Hard yakka though.

Where's that job teaching English??? I want to start tomorrow.

[Soutpeel]

I believe that the main criteria for getting legal employment here, apart from teaching English, is to have skills and/or experience that are not available locally. I'm not sure if that overrides a degree requirement.

btw An International School teacher, has taken the penthouse where I live, about 45,000 pm. What are they paying them.?

There is no condition in Thai that requires you to have a a degree to get legal employment...some jobs, as is the case everywhere else in the world, will require a degree other not...

A real Expat teacher in Thailand gets paid pretty well in Thailand, as do other expat professions

45,000k month for rent is not that high, and think you will find the school is paying for it anyway

[tango]

Go for a Non-O. It can then be converted to a Non-B, provided you collect and collate the mountain of paperwork needed (the paper thickness you will not believe until you sit down collecting it all) as Soutpee says. If living in the LOS is a long term venture, best have a sizable pension from somewhere as Snug... suggests. I do not think the private schools provide this: you are meant to provide that yourself from your high salary; or, whatever, rent a $45K apartment with the money. In any event... even given a 'large' income, once tax is deducted, with no pension, plus health deductions and the ever changing visa rules, not to mention the recent forex mess, you really do have to balance appropriately to realize your expected 'retirement' income, let alone an appropriate daily lifestyle. But hey, it can be realized.