A Change Of Governement But No Change

[Mobi]

If anyone though that the Abhisit government would whistle in a new era, then they had better think again.

A few selected excerpts from Sanitsuda Ekachai's article in today's Bangkok Post:

May we know their names? May we ask, who are the people that are trying to kill not only organic farming and herbal medicine in Thailand, but Thai food itself? We simply cannot let them get away with murder by hiding themselves behind the faceless entity of the Committee on Hazardous Substances, which has issued an outrageous regulation that labels our common herbs as "toxic substances". So the neem, fragrant lemongrass, ginger, galangal, turmeric, Chinese celery and chilli - all have suddenly become toxic substances. Are they crazy? Most probably not, because this announcement has the fingerprints of agro-chemical multinational corporations all over it......

Research shows that about 70 per cent of chemical pesticides used in Thailand are not allowed in the West. They are also categorised by the World Health Organisation as highly hazardous, if not extremely hazardous. In just two decades, Thailand's use of chemical fertiliser has increased four-fold and chemical pesticides six-fold.As a result, 81 per cent of all reservoir water is contaminated with DDT and other toxic substances, 17% of farmers have pesticides in their bloodstream, and nearly all fruit samples have residuals higher than safety standards, according to a study in 1994......

.......from individual use of herbal pesticides, the growing market for organic produce has led to commercial production of herbal pesticides as a cottage industry in many locales. Guess who is most unhappy about this? For the agro-chemical giants, their challenge is how to stop this green pest-control trend.....

......As if to avoid a storm of criticism - since these herbs are commonly used as food ingredients and herbal medicine - the announcement says these medicinal plants are only toxic when used as pesticides!.....

Apart from bullying organic farming, this crazy regulation also threatens Thai herbal medicine.... Those who enjoy Thai food might also think twice when common herbs in Thai kitchens are branded hazardous .......

The full article can be found HERE

Edited February 12, 2009 by Mobi

[jdinasia]

HUH? Where does it say it was the Abhisit Gov't that pushed through the nameless regulation?

Yes .. nameless regulation .....

and citing a 1994 study? has she not looked at the calendar lately? That was 15 years ago!

[londonthai]

ministry of agriculture, with it's Committee on Hazardous Substances, is part of the thai government. Probably the whole cabinet, if not only the minister of agriculture and vice ministers, did agree to this law.

the study about toxicity of thai fruits probably is the latest one on the subject - because it was very bad, most probably not conducted again or not published, as not to scare the population, who already shy from eating fruits and government has to run health campaigns remainding to eat more of them.

one can only suspect, that with the dramatic increase use of chemicals in thai agriculture 4-6 times, any study done now would show picture even worse than this 15 years ago

[jdinasia]

Sorry ... but the article is garbage and the rest is just supposition.

It COULD have been a well written piece had it either used simple logic and some recent and RELEVANT facts but ...

This thread is silly too ... "Thai Kleptocracy" is stated but nowhere was there a suggesting of where and how people were being robbed by the government.

I assume from the other thread (that actually IS relevant) that lobbyists pushed this through to their benefit ... but that isn't stated anywhere here either!

THIS thread has some info ---

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/Govt-Called-...-H-t242231.html

Edited February 12, 2009 by jdinasia

[Mobi]

Sorry ... but the article is garbage and the rest is just supposition.

It COULD have been a well written piece had it either used simple logic and some recent and RELEVANT facts but ...

This thread is silly too ... "Thai Kleptocracy" is stated but nowhere was there a suggesting of where and how people were being robbed by the government.

I assume from the other thread (that actually IS relevant) that lobbyists pushed this through to their benefit ... but that isn't stated anywhere here either!

THIS thread has some info ---

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/Govt-Called-...-H-t242231.html

If I didn';t know better, I'd say you must be in the pay of the agro chemical industry.

Sanitsuda Ekachai is a widely respected journalist of the highest integrity and has very bravely taken a stand against numerous injustices in Thailand, no matter which political cadre committed the offence. For you to accuse her of writing garbage only reflects very badly on you and your ill founded prejudices.

Ifyou had bothered to read the full article, instead of foaming at the mouth,as soon as you read my post, (because I dared to criticise your beloved Anhisit), you would have seen that the article went on to say:

"In the period 1988-93, pesticide-related illnesses also increased 17-fold. Given these statistics, the past decade has seen the growth of farmers' and consumers' green movements to reduce the use of toxic farm chemicals and to promote organic farming.

For the farmers, apart from a desire to restore their soil and their health, they have also realised that the extremely expensive farm chemicals are the reason why they cannot make ends meet.Hence their return to folk knowledge, to switch to herbal pesticides by using a variety of indigenous plants to get rid of dangerous pests while keeping the good insects safe.From individual use of herbal pesticides, the growing market for organic produce has led to commercial production of herbal pesticides as a cottage industry in many locales.

Guess who is most unhappy about this?"

You are a very strange apologist for a piece of legislation that is flagrantly disadvantaging the local farmers in order to enrich the ruling classes who peddle their destructive chemicals. If that isn't an example of kleptocracy,( which is a term applied to a government that extends the personal wealth and political power of government officials and the ruling class at the expense of the population.), then I don't know what is.

Even the government are now starting to back away from this piece of nonsense legislation.

Edited February 12, 2009 by Mobi

[londonthai]

Are they crazy? Most probably not, because this announcement has the fingerprints of agro-chemical multinational corporations all over it......

the article does state, and it's obvious to everybody in thailand, that's all about corruption and bribery of the government (if you don't understand why something happened in politics than think bribes).

governments do change frequently - endemic klekpocracy doesn't. Fish rots from the head down - the same polical class doesn't change in thailand, so the social problems are multiplying

[jdinasia]

Sorry ... but the article is garbage and the rest is just supposition.

It COULD have been a well written piece had it either used simple logic and some recent and RELEVANT facts but ...

This thread is silly too ... "Thai Kleptocracy" is stated but nowhere was there a suggesting of where and how people were being robbed by the government.

I assume from the other thread (that actually IS relevant) that lobbyists pushed this through to their benefit ... but that isn't stated anywhere here either!

THIS thread has some info ---

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/Govt-Called-...-H-t242231.html

If I didn';t know better, I'd say you must be in the pay of the agro chemical industry.

Sanitsuda Ekachai is a widely respected journalist of the highest integrity and has very bravely taken a stand against numerous injustices in Thailand, no matter which political cadre committed the offence. For you to accuse her of writing garbage only reflects very badly on you and your ill founded prejudices.

Ifyou had bothered to read the full article, instead of foaming at the mouth,as soon as you read my post, (because I dared to criticise your beloved Anhisit), you would have seen that the article went on to say:

"In the period 1988-93, pesticide-related illnesses also increased 17-fold. Given these statistics, the past decade has seen the growth of farmers' and consumers' green movements to reduce the use of toxic farm chemicals and to promote organic farming.

For the farmers, apart from a desire to restore their soil and their health, they have also realised that the extremely expensive farm chemicals are the reason why they cannot make ends meet.Hence their return to folk knowledge, to switch to herbal pesticides by using a variety of indigenous plants to get rid of dangerous pests while keeping the good insects safe.From individual use of herbal pesticides, the growing market for organic produce has led to commercial production of herbal pesticides as a cottage industry in many locales.

Guess who is most unhappy about this?"

You are a very strange apologist for a piece of legislation that is flagrantly disadvantaging the local farmers in order to enrich the ruling classes who peddle their destructive chemicals. If that isn't an example of kleptocracy,( which is a term applied to a government that extends the personal wealth and political power of government officials and the ruling class at the expense of the population.), then I don't know what is.

Even the government are now starting to back away from this piece of nonsense legislation.

Did you READ what I wrote?

It is obvious from what I wrote that I did read your letter (and indeed added a link to GOOD articles on the issue).

Nice that you point out the 1988-93 part though --- 21 years ago through 16 years ago.

Did I say I was in favor of the legislation? Does the article tell us anything about the legislation? Enrich the ruling classes? So this is a class struggle for you and not about the topic itself?

again .. the article was poorly written ... tells us very little and is garbage. The other articles about the topic seem to be better.

as for your 'kleptocracy' --- sorry but you fail to support that supposition with anything but innuendo

[Mobi]

Sorry ... but the article is garbage and the rest is just supposition.

It COULD have been a well written piece had it either used simple logic and some recent and RELEVANT facts but ...

This thread is silly too ... "Thai Kleptocracy" is stated but nowhere was there a suggesting of where and how people were being robbed by the government.

I assume from the other thread (that actually IS relevant) that lobbyists pushed this through to their benefit ... but that isn't stated anywhere here either!

THIS thread has some info ---

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/Govt-Called-...-H-t242231.html

If I didn';t know better, I'd say you must be in the pay of the agro chemical industry.

Sanitsuda Ekachai is a widely respected journalist of the highest integrity and has very bravely taken a stand against numerous injustices in Thailand, no matter which political cadre committed the offence. For you to accuse her of writing garbage only reflects very badly on you and your ill founded prejudices.

Ifyou had bothered to read the full article, instead of foaming at the mouth,as soon as you read my post, (because I dared to criticise your beloved Anhisit), you would have seen that the article went on to say:

"In the period 1988-93, pesticide-related illnesses also increased 17-fold. Given these statistics, the past decade has seen the growth of farmers' and consumers' green movements to reduce the use of toxic farm chemicals and to promote organic farming.

For the farmers, apart from a desire to restore their soil and their health, they have also realised that the extremely expensive farm chemicals are the reason why they cannot make ends meet.Hence their return to folk knowledge, to switch to herbal pesticides by using a variety of indigenous plants to get rid of dangerous pests while keeping the good insects safe.From individual use of herbal pesticides, the growing market for organic produce has led to commercial production of herbal pesticides as a cottage industry in many locales.

Guess who is most unhappy about this?"

You are a very strange apologist for a piece of legislation that is flagrantly disadvantaging the local farmers in order to enrich the ruling classes who peddle their destructive chemicals. If that isn't an example of kleptocracy,( which is a term applied to a government that extends the personal wealth and political power of government officials and the ruling class at the expense of the population.), then I don't know what is.

Even the government are now starting to back away from this piece of nonsense legislation.

Did you READ what I wrote?

It is obvious from what I wrote that I did read your letter (and indeed added a link to GOOD articles on the issue).

Nice that you point out the 1988-93 part though --- 21 years ago through 16 years ago.

Did I say I was in favor of the legislation? Does the article tell us anything about the legislation? Enrich the ruling classes? So this is a class struggle for you and not about the topic itself?

again .. the article was poorly written ... tells us very little and is garbage. The other articles about the topic seem to be better.

as for your 'kleptocracy' --- sorry but you fail to support that supposition with anything but innuendo

It really isn't worth arguing with you - I think you've totally lost the plot.

Where did I say it was a class struggle? I said the ruling class - in terms of the government and the industrialists are screwing the farmers - big time, no argument. Always have done , always will do. And if that's a class struggle, then so be it.

You just twist things to your own narrow point of view and try to justify having a go at one of the finest and bravest journalists in Thailand, because she dared to imply that the Abhisit led government may have something nasty on their hands.

It is not innuendo, as everyone knows who is not as blinkered as you - it is plain, common to garden fact.

Your words are empty of meaning and logic.

Have a cold shower and come back to reality mate.

[jdinasia]

LOL

Mobi --- it is an OPINION piece and not a NEWS article.

It doesn't contain anything really relevant and is a pretty crappy article for that very reason. I didn't "have a go" at anyone. I pointed out that it was a crappy article using EXTREMELY dated "facts".

You brought class into it ... and You are the one bringing Abhisit into it (sour grapes I guess) since from the crap she wrote we don't even know when that 'regulation' was passed

Good articles tell facts .... Who What When Where How etc ..... those are absent in that opinion piece.

[Mobi]

LOL

Mobi --- it is an OPINION piece and not a NEWS article.

It doesn't contain anything really relevant and is a pretty crappy article for that very reason. I didn't "have a go" at anyone. I pointed out that it was a crappy article using EXTREMELY dated "facts".

You brought class into it ... and You are the one bringing Abhisit into it (sour grapes I guess) since from the crap she wrote we don't even know when that 'regulation' was passed

Good articles tell facts .... Who What When Where How etc ..... those are absent in that opinion piece.

It's a commentary on facts.

Again - if you read the commentary, you wouldn't keep banging on about dated facts.

You really are blinkered. She explains very clearly why she goes back in time to explain how the development of organic, alternative fertilizers came about - namely that the agro chemical owners were poisoning the land and it's people, over a long period of time.

It is not a crappy article - it is you who just refuses to accept the facts.

The opinion piece is on the opposite side of the page and also condemns in no uncertain terms this disgraceful attempt by the agro chemical barons to make more money on the backs of the farmers.

Just shows how much you know or understand - I have always been an Abhisit supporter, and still am when I look at the alternative, but that doesn't mean I think he or his party are above criticism. This business is scandalous, and good for the Post for getting stuck into it.

With apologist farangs like you around, God help us all.

Goodnight - I'm off to bed.

Don't forget that cold shower

[Priceless]

LOL

Mobi --- it is an OPINION piece and not a NEWS article.

It doesn't contain anything really relevant and is a pretty crappy article for that very reason. I didn't "have a go" at anyone. I pointed out that it was a crappy article using EXTREMELY dated "facts".

You brought class into it ... and You are the one bringing Abhisit into it (sour grapes I guess) since from the crap she wrote we don't even know when that 'regulation' was passed

Good articles tell facts .... Who What When Where How etc ..... those are absent in that opinion piece.

If you go to the Bangkok Post homepage, you'll find that the header for the piece says 'COMMENTARY by Sanitsuda Ekachai', i.e. it is supposed to be an 'opinion piece'. If you move your gaze about 3" down, you'll find an editorial headlined 'Law on herbs bodes ill'. Here it states that the legislation has 'been in force since February 3, 2009'. I think that Ms Sanitsuda should be forgiven for not quoting everything from the editorial. She probably assumes that her readers can read

/ Priceless

Edited February 12, 2009 by Priceless

[jdinasia]

and if you go to the link provided for that piece of rubbish above .......

[Mobi]

and if you go to the link provided for that piece of rubbish above .......

I thought you'd given up.

Obviously the cold shower didn't work.

Do you get up in the morning and decide to see what you can trash today on ThaiVisa?