Poll: How do you rate PM Thaksin?

[buasaard]

Sorry, I was thinking of land ownership. With regards with your post which I read now better, you can't take one single item as an example, because as I said beer has its own peculiarities.

I do not think that business owned by foreigners would rise prices, because they would have local competition, and if they charge high prices, they wouldn't sell their products, while instead I believe that foreign land ownership would rise price of land.

And let's face it, a lot of thai business is already in foreign's hands, as most supermarkets (Carrefour, Tesco Lotus etc..).

[plachon]

Regarding racism, you had not much experience (only two years while my wife has lived here for 16 years), also the first years were not bad only recently racism has come out in Italy.

Also England does not seem racism-free considering for instance the two years ago's Bradford clashes.

What I meant is that thais are much more friendly with "farangs" than europeans with thais, at least nothing racism-wife.

For medical system, I don't see much difference between 500 hundred bath a year and 30 bath every time go to hospital.

And we have different experiences, for instance my wife's uncle which is a poor farmer in Petchaboon province, last year had a worm under the skin on the arm (one of those that spread to heart and brain). He went to the hospital and paid 30 bath. They gave him the medicines and cured him. With 500 bath scheme surely he wouldn't have had the money to pay the health card, and would have probably died.

Of course the health system should be improved, but how do you say? Rome wasn't built in a day.

Buasaard, if you'd taken the trouble to read my posting, I very carefully said twice "my wife's experience" is that she didn't come across racism in Britain. I wasn't for a minute trying to say that racism does not exist in UK, as I am very aware that it does, and entirely condemn it. But my purpose was not defend Britain's record, just say it wasn't an issue for my wife viz your wife. So you come out here each year for 5 months and get treated like a gent. That's great for you, but I can assure you racism is very much a part of everyday life in Thailand, though it is less directed towards Westerners (by the general population), than darker skin races. I have seen many instances of racism towards south Asians, and have read about some on this board including one not so long ago by a man who took his family to Pattaya and got refused entry to a hotel pool, which I guess your wife could empathise with. Anyway, this is getting off the point. Please just read my earlier emails more carefully, as I respectfully suggested back near the start of the thread.

Similarly, for the 30 baht scheme vs. the old 500 baht family card, again you seem to be ignoring the underlying message of the bigger picture I've been attempting to put across, but zeroing in on little things,that by your own admission, you're not very familiar with.  But I'll try to briefly compare the pros and cons in a nutshell.

30 baht scheme - sounds like a good pro-poor idea, wins votes at last election. However, causes more adminstrative hassles for hospitals, who take longer to see any money back from the govt., and encourages doctors to drain to the private sector. Similarly, diverts much needed funds from the public to the private sector, to a few selected private hospitals, who's skins are saved by a murky system and further demoralises the over-worked under-payed state sector. Poor are not better served and there is a general decline in service.

500 baht scheme - a long running scheme, more decentralised and not introduced just to be a vote winner by past administration. Village headman writes list of low income families in viillage and gives to health authorities. They pay just 500 baht for all the family for all the year. If you never visited the hospital, maybe not such a good deal, but then you're blessed in other ways and are still contributing to society. But if you're sick often and need treatment, probably a better deal than lots of 30 bahts, which can soon add up for a 10 person family unit (not uncommon). And in any case, the standard of service and doctor: patient ratio were better under the old system, esp. in rural areas.

Take your pick as to which is better. One other point not mentioned is that there are always huge admin costs in changing over any given system, and the 30 baht scheme was no exception. Why can politicians never  remember the old maxim: "If it ain't broke, then don't try and fix it". Lastly, Rome wasn't built in a day, neither was it destroyed in a day either. By the time it was sacked by the Vandals, it had been on a long, slow and steady decline for several hundred years, if my history serves me right. The present decline I anticipate being considerably faster.

[buasaard]

I think Plachon, we are at a dead point. I have my opinion and can't change yours, you have yours and can't change mine.

I know thais are racist against dark skinned people. I argued once with my mother-in-law.Thais are far to be perfect people.But this has little to do with Taksin's policy, infact this attitude was present far before Taksin election.

I want to clear that at beginning I was (and in some aspect I'm still) suspicious on Taksin (because he seemed much alike Berlusconi). I don't like his methods but at least people begin to discuss the problems.

Farangs I see are upset for immigration rules. Some of them might be unfair, for instance is unfair the rule of minimum income for thais spouses. Everybody has the right to live with his family no matter the income, but the problems to cope with (terrorism, immigration from neighbouring countries, mafia from various countries...) are not easy to solve.  

Farangs are upset for the closing of sex related entertainments, but sooner or later Thailand will have to regulate this. Why do not start now? People must not forget that this kind of "entertainment" presently is illegal.

Farangs are upset for the police rallies on fake items. But this is required by the international agencies.Why do not complain with them?

Alcohol is a major plague in Thailand, at least Taksin prohibited ads at a certain time. It's little, but noone dared doing such a little thing before.

Corruption was something people was used to. Everybody in every class of thai society was ready to pay bribes to solve little problems. Now is more difficult, as I said in previous posts you can't buy a driving license in Phuket(I don't know in other provinces), you must pass the test. It's little but is something and people know that corruption is not something "normal".

Someone said, he is "westernizing" Thailand too much. Did they realize that every country of the world is "westernizing", and also that in the "West", cultures are everyday "Americanizing".

You can't blame Taksin for this.

Lots of people would like to have forever the chance to see "different cultures" and ways of life. They want to go and take pictures to the giraffe-women and show when they are back home. I hope this is the last generation of giraffe-women, I hope their daughters will have a life without rings on the neck.

I want all thai people will have comfortable houses and not miserable huts on the river, that people can film and show home.

Taksin is a populist? Probably. But in my opinion for Thailand it's worth running the risk of this populist government.We will know in the future.

I think we both care poor's people needs, only we have different views on how to cope with their needs.

[plachon]

I'm afraid we are talking at cross-purposes and you're just not getting the bigger picture. don't take that personally, it's probably due to millions of factors, which would take too long to even start to go into here. But at the end of the day (I really hate that phrase!), we'll just have to wait and see what transpires in Thailand and let history be the judge.

Enjoy the rest of your stay in the south and hope the poor are allowed back on the streets of Phuket again to scratch a living. Pity the homeless, poor and street dogs of BKK, as they get pushed aside for the Assembly of the Rich.

[sriracha john]

Interesting that so many members saw the writing on the wall a long time ago.

[kayo]

I'm afraid to vote!

[jdinasia]

Big #'s against Thaksin 3 years ago!

[teepruksa]

The Toxic-Hubbit never quite reached his goals of turning Thailand into the Hub-of-Hubs, the creme-de-la-creme of Hubs if you will.

He was set to proclaim himself as Master Hubbit, the Ultimate Hub Connection.

Too bad he has to now play hubbitipoloy in his London apartment with his only remaining friend - his daughter. Wonder when his english visa is up?

[Pakboong]

Like Thaksin or not, he saw a bigger picture than most. He understood macro-economics and how keeping the balance of wealth at 80-20. The methods he chose to insure the poor had their 20% were controversial but he was able to pull them off and secure the vote. He was not in love with anyone, he was a professional politician playing serious game.

I don't understand how farangs can blame him for the recent shake-ups in housing, visas, super-stores, etc... these are likely issues of the current regime not TRT. Note the timing, as TRT was seeing the need near the end to same themselves and their jobs, they attempted to catch up on the opposition adjenda. It didn't work however and they were ousted. Logically, if these programs were not those of the new regime, they would have been quickly reversed. They were not reversed and there are more coming.

In the past 30 years or so, the urban professional (call them whatever you like) make up perhaps 10% of the population but shoulder over 90% of the tax burden. The rural and urban poor pay little or no taxes and many have only paid taxes on a motor bike in their entire lives. The poor did not care that Thaksin didn't pay taxes when he sold Shin Corp., but the urban professionals may have seen this as the straw that broke the camels back.

We farangs spend most of our money on the poor and we pay very little in taxes. The educated Thai professional is tired of this scenario and have done everything possible to return control of their county to them and put the poor back in their place. One of the most class conscious nations on the earth.

I didn't really like the guy personally but he was smarter and more capable than most.

[kmart]

This thread is reading like an obituary. He's not out of the game yet.

Personally speaking, I quite admired him at first for trying to break the status quo and the monopoly of power of the Bkk elites. (They're usually only seen marrying into each other's fields of influence in the society pages).

But wrapping it all up in the flag just shows how much of a scoundrel he is. He eventually turned into everything he professed to despise; corrupt; power-mad; unable to listen or explain decisions even surrounded by a massive spin machine. 24 carat ######.

[Pakboong]

A perhaps more interesting survey could be: If you had to choose among Thaksin, Bush or Blair to run your family business, which one would you choose? A no brainer for me.

[sriracha john]

nor for me... as Thaksin would loot my business dry..

D. None of the Above