Usa Tax Question: Automatic Extensions For Expats

[Jingthing]

A few years back I called the IRS and asked them if I was qualified for the automatic filing extension for expats.

I explained my situation, that I live full time in Thailand and have a Thai address, but do not work here, do not own a business here, and do have income events happening only in the USA.

They told me I was NOT qualified for the automatic filing extension, that for that I would need a PLACE OF BUSINESS outside the USA.

I don't know if they were right about that, so I am asking again here.

BTW, by automatic filing extension I mean you get the extension WITHOUT having to file a formal extension request form to the IRS. Anyone can get that extension by filing that form, but qualified expats do not need to even to file that form.

Before someone says, you already got your answer, you called IRS. Well, studies have shown that about half the answers they give callers turn out to be wrong.

Edited February 21, 2009 by Jingthing

[lanny]

The automatic extension to file (and pay) your taxes is just that. It is available to ANYONE who lives outside the US, there is no requirement that you have a place of business. All that is necessary is that you attach a statement to your return stating that you are eligible for the extra 60 days.

[Thanyaburi Mac]

The automatic extension to file (and pay) your taxes is just that. It is available to ANYONE who lives outside the US, there is no requirement that you have a place of business. All that is necessary is that you attach a statement to your return stating that you are eligible for the extra 60 days.

I didn't even do that, attach a statement, that is, just filed before 15 June (?) and never a problem. My address on the form was listed as in Thailand and for the last lots of years IRS has even sent me to booklet and forms to the Thai address. And we use the IRS preprinted label on the 1040 when I sent it in.

Mac

[PeaceBlondie]

Very few IRS employees know the details of foreign issues. This is one of those specialty areas where you have to figure out if the responder knows what they are talking about. It usually requires a referral from the first person who answers, to a specialist. The SSA staff in the States is also ignorant of foreign issues, whereas the VA and SSA folks in Manila at the embassy are experts.

[dotcom]

If I'm not mistaken there is a form you need to file.

But yes the extension is automatic if you are abroad on April 15. No other strings attached.

Remember penalties & interest accrue from April 15 so it's best to be on time if posible.

[lanny]

If I'm not mistaken there is a form you need to file.

But yes the extension is automatic if you are abroad on April 15. No other strings attached.

Remember penalties & interest accrue from April 15 so it's best to be on time if posible.

No, that is not true! No form is required if you file by June 15; all that you need do is attach a statement that you are living abroad and are entitled to the automatic extension.

Unlike the normal extension, the automatic extension for expats is an extension of time to pay, as well as to file the return. Interest accrues from April 15 but there are no penalties.

This is only of importance if you owe money to IRS. If you have a refund, or a zero balance, IRS does not care when you file. Late filing and late payment penalties are a percentage of any balance due; if you don't owe anything, you have no penalty.

[PeaceBlondie]

And if I remember correctly, after your automatic extension which requires no form because you are abroad, if you want additional time to file, you do not file the same form as those who were still in the US and are asking for a second extension. But the form numbers finally escape me. 2868, 2848...

[lanny]

And if I remember correctly, after your automatic extension which requires no form because you are abroad, if you want additional time to file, you do not file the same form as those who were still in the US and are asking for a second extension. But the form numbers finally escape me. 2868, 2848...

No, you use the regular extension form (there is only one, now, Form 4868) but you must attach your statement. If you just send in the extension form in June, IRS will reject it.

[trajan]

did every one (Americans) get their fat booklet called "1040 Forms & Instructions for Overseas Filers 2009" in the mail? I didnt get one yet and have no idea where to get one...anyone know?

[taxout]

As to the original question, see post 11 in this thread, especially the advice in the final sentence:

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/Fyi-Retirees...th-t104451.html

[Thanyaburi Mac]

did every one (Americans) get their fat booklet called "1040 Forms & Instructions for Overseas Filers 2009" in the mail? I didnt get one yet and have no idea where to get one...anyone know?

Guess IRS still loves me as they sent me the package a couple months ago.

You might check the ACS [American Citizens Service] section at the U.S. Embassy. At least they used to have stacks of most of the forms available.

In any case, forms and instructions are available for downloading here:

http://www.irs.gov/formspubs/index.html

Have fun!

Mac