Subway Crash In Bangkok

[Crushdepth]

And you feel safe on a bus????

Hahahahahaha !!!

[p_brownstone]

and will the safety aspect of those outer platform doors (the hong kong subway uses a similar system) be questioned now. if the train doors and the platform doors dont line up when a train stops then exiting the train is impossible ?

Yes, in so many countries and cities there are no doors at all: Paris, Amsterdam, Stockholm and more . all high tech, no doors

And the people in those countries are not as well-behaving in public as in Thailand!

Seems to me like a security measure that surpassed the real safety issues and becomes dangerous in itself.

I don't think the Platform Doors are meant as a safety measure - rather, they are there to preserve the airconditioned atmosphere in the station.

Patrick

Edited January 18, 2005 by p_brownstone

[Rinrada]

The control center said, "unlock the brake. The train operator assumed it was ALL air brakes!?! Why didn't he ask the control center back what brake they are talking about. He assumed and went on unlock all 6 of them. In fact, he must ask them back, "Unlock the brake? Are you crazy?" But that never happened.

And if the Control Center says open all the valves...what then.....The Chao P. river is just above.......lots of water

I don't think the Platform Doors are meant as a safety measure - rather, they are there to preserve the airconditioned atmosphere in the station.

Also helps to keep nutters from committing suicide.......really buggers up the tracks and causes delays.

[meemiathai]

I don't think the Platform Doors are meant as a safety measure - rather, they are there to preserve the airconditioned atmosphere in the station.

Patrick

I don't think so. They are there to prevent people from falling off when the train comes, well at least in the case of HK, I guess. For only the busiest stations have platform doors here in HK. (I might be wrong)

[WilliamIV]

I cannot figure out why they don't have a barrier stop in the Maintenance facility to prevent wayward trains from going to the main tracks!!!!!!!!

Secondly if the train was being repaired, what in the heck is the person doing inside the controls, unless he accidently released it's brakes. Third under such conditions, that train should have had its wheels locked down to prevent any movement in case such strange behavior does take place. By having that barrier across the tracks, that itself would have prevented it from going any further.

So if anyone should be laying the blame, the Subway administration safety board should be getting the blame and also the Maintenance facility for not putting up the darn safety barriers in the first place. They have such barriers in USA, and by the way, for such to pass from maintenance to main track they have to put codes into the computers to get clearance similar to Airport procedures. Not to mention that the track switches itself (should it pass that barrier), should be pointing into a different direction which is a dead end wall to stop it completely should such breach occur.

In my opinion all this could have been avoided had somebody used their coo-coo brains if they have any and set the system up correctly and thought safety first and then money and not the other way around to appease Toxin and others.

Daveyo

Ah at last, the voice of reason in a world gone mad.

Dave please keep the words of wisdom coming.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Well as usual - Dave Yo has shouted off his mouth without reference to the facts.

According to the Report in Tuesdays Bangkok Post - The RunawayTrain was not in the Maintenance Depot.

It had broken down between the Thailand Cultural Centre Station and the Depot.

A Locmotive had been sent to bring it into the Depot but could not get connected to the Broken down Train - it was then that a (cotroversial?) order was apparently issued by the Control Centre to the Driver to release the Brake.

Someone here has suggested the Driver should have questioned that order

- surely a most unlikely event in ultra polite Thai Society.

Bill

[WilliamIV]

i still honestly believe that there was sabotage involved

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

wellllll.... the government did want to buy it and merge it with BTS and the owner didn't want to sell..... so stranger things have happened here.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I do NOT think it was Sabotage ...

But there was the Report of the New Low Price Airline who had its Aircraft on a

Military protected Airport - where the Wiring of the Aircraft was sabotaged so badly it rendered the Aircraft useless

Bill

[sriracha john]

The control center said, "unlock the brake. The train operator assumed it was ALL air brakes!?! Why didn't he ask the control center back what brake they are talking about. He assumed and went on unlock all 6 of them. In fact, he must ask them back, "Unlock the brake? Are you crazy?" But that never happened.

And if the Control Center says open all the valves...what then.....The Chao P. river is just above.......lots of water

I don't think the Platform Doors are meant as a safety measure - rather, they are there to preserve the airconditioned atmosphere in the station.

Also helps to keep nutters from committing suicide.......really buggers up the tracks and causes delays.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Actually, during construction of the subway, that WAS the official explanation by MRT. They are suicide prevention measures.

[sriracha john]

Well as usual - Dave Yo has shouted off his mouth without reference to the facts.

Hahahahahahahaha

[lional6]

The control center said, "unlock the brake. The train operator assumed it was ALL air brakes!?! Why didn't he ask the control center back what brake they are talking about. He assumed and went on unlock all 6 of them. In fact, he must ask them back, "Unlock the brake? Are you crazy?" But that never happened.

And if the Control Center says open all the valves...what then.....The Chao P. river is just above.......lots of water

I don't think the Platform Doors are meant as a safety measure - rather, they are there to preserve the airconditioned atmosphere in the station.

Also helps to keep nutters from committing suicide.......really buggers up the tracks and causes delays.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Actually, during construction of the subway, that WAS the official explanation by MRT. They are suicide prevention measures.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

The platform doors are for suicide prevention, is better than saying they are to stop being drowned like rats. I have seen Rachadaphisek Road under a meter of flood water.

[kreon]

And now the systems shut for a week.

Thats great. Not too sure how it works o/seas but to close for an entire week.

Thank god it has only added an xtra 20mintues to my day. Feel sorry for peeps going say from Bang Sue to Silom etc.

Thank god no one was hurt too badly.

Nomad

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

in london, paris some of the underground lines get shut down for weeks, because of systems failures nothing new there

i still thinks there is something smelly going on here

[Axel]

Latest news this morning, 19/1, closed indefinitely, which can take weeks.

Want to train staff, run trial periods etc.

Seems to me a bit of a decision taken under pressure or overreacting.

[Golf]

I am back. Golf is NOT runing for parliment for sure! I want to be far and far away from those pr**ks. As long as this country is still ran by these people, I'll be watching them

I've got a feeling that someone who is important were in the control center at the time the train crashed. Someone whose the PM and the elites don't want to give out the name. He might be the one gave an order to unlock the brakes. Why I feel that? Until now, we know the drivers' names, victims' names, but NOT the one at control center. Thai media call him, "the one at control center". I smell something here. My best bet is that this guy could be one of the top decision makers of the transportation agency.

[sriracha john]

awwww...... that's disappointing to hear Golf. I was hoping you might try to unseat some of those pr**ks in Parliment....

[Golf]

Hi,

I've got to be a billionaire to fight with them, Sriracha John. Politics here are deadly and ugly. I need to be willing to die, or super rich to make sure that I will survive the bullets, political backslashes, an all kind of dirty tricks to make a dream comes true.

For now, let's keep an eye on them...

Golf

Edited January 19, 2005 by Golf

[p_brownstone]

Latest news this morning, 19/1, closed indefinitely, which can take weeks.

Want to train staff, run trial periods etc.

Seems to me a bit of a decision taken under pressure or overreacting.

I can forsee this incident being used as an excuse to pressurise the concession holder into selling out to the Thai Government - or well connected private Companies. Effectively holding them to ransom by closing the system for "checks" is an ideal way of forcing them to concede.

The BTS concessionaire is already being crippled by the Governments' refusal to authorise extensions of the system, with the aim of getting them to sell out and I imagine they are already looking for ways to take over the Subway system too, now that someone else has invested in the infrastucture etc..

Patrick

Edited January 19, 2005 by p_brownstone

[Sphere]

I've got a feeling that someone who is important were in the control center at the time the train crashed.  Someone whose the PM and the elites don't want to give out the name. 

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

You could be very right there Golf - maybe a son / daughter / niece / nephew / brother / sister / cousin with a famous surname who couldn't get admission to that university in the US or Australia and decided to kill some time playing trains.

[sriracha john]

Hi,

I've got to be a billionaire to fight with them, Sriracha John.  Politics here are deadly and ugly.  I need to be willing to die, or super rich to make sure that I will survive the bullets, political backslashes, an all kind of dirty tricks to make a dream comes true.

For now, let's keep an eye on them...

Golf

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

of course all your points are valid.... I was just trying to be more hopeful for Thailand's future.

Also hoping that it doesn't follow the USA and elect the same fool twice.

[Golf]

Thanks! Bad news, though, I think this same fool will win again

[joinme2leave]

closing "indefintely" ???? maybe weeks or months or years or what? can I expect to get my purchased and no longer usable ticket to be refunded at some time in the future? leavin' LOS for a while by march. just wonder but wouldn't be surprised at all if they say ...sorry, cannot...

[DaveYo]

Really William the Fourth. Wonder why it is so. When you read up in the initial part of this so called news mind you, on T.V. it showed them working inside a building, and also the clippings indicated coming from the Maintenance center. Now they say it was outside of some Michael Jackson Never Never Land.

Talk to me about not having facts. Come on I will talk to you about facts any time any place and any spit for tat. It is you that don't read up correctly or it is you that provide the most misinformed news in this forsaken planet.

[stumonster]

Subway workers face crash charges

From correspondents in Bangkok

January 21, 2005

FOUR Bangkok subway workers face criminal charges over the collision that injured 200 people and shuttered the city's six-month-old underground, police said today.

Two subway control room operators who wrongly ordered an automatic brake unlocked, as well as two conductors who carried out the order, will be charged with negligence causing serious injury to others, the city's deputy police commander, Lieutenant General Parnsiri Prapawat said.

No top officials at the subway authority faced charges, he said.

"Based on the investigation and evidence found so far, police are confident that only four people should be charged with negligence causing injury to other people," Lt-Gen Parnsiri said.

If convicted, the four could face up to three years in prison and a 6000 baht ($200) fine.

The two conductors remain in critical condition at a Bangkok hospital after releasing the brake that sent their empty carriages careering into a rush-hour train loaded with 700 people, Lt-Gen Parnsiri said.

The accident prompted the subway authorities to close the underground for at least a week while they investigated the crash.

The $US3.5 billion ($4.5bn) subway opened in July to bypass the city's notoriously gridlocked streets, but the 20km network was already struggling to attract passengers and had offered discounted fares.

The accident has not affected Bangkok's elevated SkyTrain rail system.

http://www.theaustralian.news.com.au/commo...55E1702,00.html

[kat]

Thanks!  Bad news, though, I think this same fool will win again 

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

"No top officials at the subway authority faced charges, he said."

Yeah, this is strikingly similar to another administration I know that was caught in an international torture scandal.

[sriracha john]

Thanks!  Bad news, though, I think this same fool will win again 

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

"No top officials at the subway authority faced charges, he said."

Yeah, this is strikingly similar to another administration I know that was caught in an international torture scandal.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Idi Amin??

[george]

Govt wants German train drivers, staff trainers for subway

BANGKOK: -- Specialists from Germany are likely to be put in charge of subway operations when services are resumed to ensure safety, said Transport Minister Suriya Jungrungreangkit.

The Mass Rapid Transit Authority of Thailand (MRTA), owner of the subway concession, has been told to consider hiring German drivers, he said.

Train-maker Siemens has been contacted to help recruit German specialists who will also re-train Thai staff, including drivers, he said.

The minister said services will be resumed once the inquiry into the Jan 17 collision is complete and the safety of the system has been confirmed.

Subway services have been ordered suspended for seven days for safety inspections after an empty train smashed into another train carrying about 700 passengers at the Thailand Cultural Centre station mid-morning last Monday.

The empty train was waiting to be towed to the maintenance centre. When a rescue train failed to connect to the empty train the driver was told to release the brake and the empty train began to roll backwards and crashed into the other train at the station.

It is reported that Bangkok Metro Co Ltd (BMCL), the subway service operator, may extend the closure period for a few more days to complete test runs.

Police investigators, meanwhile, have concluded their crash probe, singling out four subway staff members for negligence.

They are Kulachart Lao-asoke, subway operation chief controller, Rangsan Sawasdimongkol, a subway operation controller, Thawatchai Kanya, driver of the rescue train, and Thanapol Nithichotiyanon, driver of the empty train.

However, the police request for warrants for their arrests has been turned down by a district court which found the four, including Mr Thanapol who is in hospital, have shown no intent to escape.

Samart Yolphak, deputy transport permanent secretary who heads the ministry's investigation into the subway crash, said the panel had also concluded the collision was caused by human error.

Mr Samart said staff had encountered similar problems a few times before the Jan 17 accident.

''In this case the control system itself is fine. So, we'll have to find out next if the staff have enough training or not,'' Mr Samart said.

Findings will be submitted to the transport minister on Monday.

MRTA governor Prapat Chongsanguan said the agency will seek changes to the contract with BMCL so it can supervise train services and boost the confidence of passengers in the system's safety.

MRTA is currently not in charge of subway services.

He said it was still unknown when the subway services would be resumed and it would depend on safety assurances from the system operator.

It has been reported that services might be resumed on certain routes.

Prime Minister Thaksin Shinawatra yesterday emphasised services would be resumed when staff were ready.

--Bangkok Post 2005-01-22

[Axel]

Why Germans? The supplier was Siemens Austria?

More serious, the training is fine but should be adjusted to the Thai - way.

What I mean, the trainees must made to understand why a rule is so and so. Otherwise they might think 'farang'-way and implement their own.

This actually was my first experience in Japan, years ago. Their subways have (had?) 1 driver in front and 1 assistant in the last carriage. Both had to point out each signal on the way and loudly confirm they saw it. Looked funny to me but later I understood, talking aloud to themselves make them aware.

Now this was Japan. How to do it in LoS?

[kreon]

MRTA governor Prapat Chongsanguan said the agency will seek changes to the contract with BMCL so it can supervise train services and boost the confidence of passengers in the system's safety.

MRTA is currently not in charge of subway services.

what i always suspected, here's proof, that was the main reason for the crash

and of course nobody from management got charged

It has been reported that services might be resumed on certain routes.

as far as i know there was only one route :blush:

[Golf]

One of the police investigators said, "It was a system, not men that caused the Monday accident. There is a coverup attempt to protect the system by blaming to those people."

PM was in rage, saying that the police investigator "know nothing about the technical terms". From now on they have to shut up. "It's a perfect system!", PM said.

I think:

1. The subway system is NOT perfect. The way the corruption is going on here, it will be an imperfect system. Since the company, agency, government officers had to get their bribe, the system had to be degraded to meet the reduced budget.

2. The train operators in general are inept to do anything right.

3. The government has to protect its investment so that blame only to the men is the safest way.

3. Combin these three major factors, we can predict the final result.

Golf

Edited January 23, 2005 by Golf

[lional6]

I said back in 1999 it was a death trap, my wife told me I was wrong, at least, I get a final word.

[RDN]

I said back in 1999 it was a death trap, my wife told me I was wrong, at least, I get a final word.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Why??? Did you kill your wife?

[The_Eye_Of_Sauron]

The subway needs tourists more than ever now.

The platforms are empty - now is a perfect time to return to the uderground train.