10,000 Police, Soldiers, Security Officials Deployed To Keep Security At Government House

[sriracha john]

This is why Police are with the reds. Reds never harm police

For the benefit of those with fuzzy memories...

Can't imagine why the police would want to prosecute thugs for assaulting an injuring 200 policemen? It's not difficult.

July 22, 2007 UDD protest at Prem's house that resulted in 200 policemen getting injured.

And rather interesting that the courts have finally decided not to prosecute the leaders of the UDD for the events of that day. Maybe the UDD has been right in their claims that the aggression that day was actually initiated by the ones that gave the police the dispersal order, and UDD has defended itself.

Did the Court's comments reflect any accuracy in your idle speculation?

[justanothercybertosser]

The PAD was and is an alliance of a number of groups, most of which could not be described as fascist (though a minority were).However the PAD leadership did propagate a number of policies which can quite reasonably be described as fascist in nature.It is precisely because I have studied European history that I can make this assertion with great confidence.

Yes, and the number of groups ended up submitting their aims to the aims of the PAD leadership. Hence - it is to be defined a proto-fascist movement.

[justanothercybertosser]

Did the Court's comments reflect any accuracy in your idle speculation?

Who cares. The courts decided that there was no crime or offense worth prosecuting.

[sriracha john]

Did the Court's comments reflect any accuracy in your idle speculation?

Who cares. The courts decided that there was no crime or offense worth prosecuting.

In other words, No.

Thank you.

[h90]

To compare PAD with Fascists shows lack of any education in European history. If you call them monarchists it might be partially right, but Fascists? Either you don't know what Fascists look like or you watch ONLY DTV.

The only difference between European fascists and the PAD is that European fascists in general have mostly been distrustful of their monarchies, while the PAD claims of royal legitimacy is particular to Thailand's history. Nevertheless, their anti-democratic stand, their xenophobia, and their nationalist chauvinism as seen in the Viharn issue (and soon to come their stand on the autonomy question in the three southern provinces), including their exclusive ideology of national unity are clearly proto-fascist.

What Fascists "look like"? Don't judge the content of a package by its appearance. Just because PAD has long hair compared to the stereotype of the shaven skinhead does not mean that they are any less fascist (and that stereotype isn not even true in Europe - many skinheads are actually leftists, and the Neonazi black block looks exactly the same as the radical left - long hair, black dress, etc.)

come on, you aren't serious about that, or?

xenophobia of the yellow???

The only thing I recall is that the red one did not allow a lesbian and gay demonstration in Chiang Mai.

After PPP started that bad Viharn issue and several deads under PPP, I can't see any major problems with any foreign country with Kasit as foreign minister.

at the three southern provinces......I don't want to argue....just recall what Thaksin made there.....

at PAD I didn't saw long haired or skin heads, I saw middle age middle class men and women, as well many elderly people who don't have to work anymore, joined by their relatives every evening.

I recall two of the leaders are old lefties.....

[Journalist]

What Fascists "look like"? Don't judge the content of a package by its appearance. Just because PAD has long hair compared to the stereotype of the shaven skinhead does not mean that they are any less fascist (and that stereotype isn not even true in Europe - many skinheads are actually leftists, and the Neonazi black block looks exactly the same as the radical left - long hair, black dress, etc.)

Plus has said that his girlfriend has a few items of Third-Reich style garb. I'm assuming shiny boots and a military bustier, but he declines to show pix.

(In my fantasy, i'm also assuming that she's a svelte Thai minx-ess, and not a 200 kilo Bavarian called Brunnhilda)

[samgrowth]

It all seems to be getting a bit too much for Foreign minister Kasit , who even whilst in the govt. seems to be reverting back to the good old days on the stage at at Swampy

Manager

Partial translation at Bangkok Pundit

Please don't shoot the translator. I followed that link to manager.com and found this message interesting:

แต่ผมขอเปิดใจว่า วันนี้เป็นการต่อสู้ของ 2 อุดมการณ์ คือ เราต้องการมีประชาธิปไตย มีสถาบันพระมหากษัตริย์ มีรัฐธรรมนูญ แต่อีกฟากไม่ต้องการมีสิ่งเหล่านี้ ดังนั้น เราต้องถามตัวเอง ว่า เราต้องการให้มีสิ่งเหล่านี้หรือไม่ มันถึงเวลาที่เราต้องออกมาแล้ว เพราะวันนี้มันเป็นเรื่องความอยู่รอดของสิ่งที่เราอยู่กันมานายหลายร้อยปี เราต้องสู้แล้ว เพราะเรื่องนี้ไม่ใช่แค่เรื่องการชิงอำนาจทางการเมือง วันนี้ต้องบอกว่า เป็นเรื่องที่อันตรายอย่างใหญ่หลวงที่มีกลุ่มบุคคลที่พยายามดำเนินการบางอย่าง ก็ขอฝากประธานสาขาพรรคประชาธิปัตย์ในที่นี้ด้วยให้ช่วยกัน แต่วันนี้ผมพร้อมจะลุยเองในเรื่องนี้”

Kasit: "This is a fight between 2 groups of thinkings. We (I suppose PAD) want Democracy and Monachy. But the other group don't want these (I suppose he mean Democracy and Monachy). We have to ask ourselves if we want this or not (I suppose he mean Democracy and Monachy). It is time that we should step out. Becasue it is the survival of these (Democracy and Monachy) which we have lived with for many centuries. This is not a fight for political power. We are in great danger before the other group (I suppose UDD) is trying to do something (stop short of saying what?). I pass this matter the Democrate party chairman now, but I am ready to flight on this matter now.

[sriracha john]

Nuttawut said if the reds outside GH have not eaten rice yet, those inside GH cannot eat. He said these foods are from taxes of all Thais and those inside GH want to eat should wear red and come out to stay with reds outside, to fight with Abhisit government.

[justanothercybertosser]

I may have more sympathy with some red demands if they were not so directly and seemingly inextricably linked to Thaksin who at the end of the day is Thailands biggest human rights abuser in decades - as PM he is responsible for government policy under international standard. That link isnt just shameful to any organization claiming to be pro-democracy but directly undermines the claim of being pro-democracy. Democracy and democratic values are more than just elections. Why dont the red shiorts demand Thaksin is tried for his governments criminal drug war policy? Dont they believe in the democratic rights of the poor? That nobody seems to care about this issue speaks volumes about Thailand's democratic development. Even western media sources while trying to fit Thaksin into the democrat overthrown by military elite box fail to ever mention his death record which according to the numbers reproted in the Rettig report is not disimilar in scope to the actual death record of Pinochet.

On a different note as the economic situation deteriorates and the command economies are seen as being able to respond faster and to better see out the the recession the idea that western style democracy will be seen as the ideal role model will not necessarily remain especially in a region that is now under Chinese rather than US hegemony. That though probably suits both extremes in this power battle.

Your fallacy is that you view and judge Thailand and Thaksin from the position of a developed democracy. Thailand is an emerging democracy that has the potential to develop.

When you say that Thaksin is the worst Human Rights offender, you simplify his rule, and ignore the paronage systhem of Thailand. All the Human Rights violations have not been possible without is co-conspirators, some of them in the informal power structure far more powerful than Thaksin. And his most powerful co-collaborators are now on backing PAD. It would be more accurate to describe Thailand itself as a country in which the upholding of Human Rights is not very developed.

It clearly is proven that the human rights violations of the South have continued after Thaksin. Also the lack of investigation into the drug war deaths indicate that Thaksin's opponents are not interested in solving that offense against Human Rights.

And if you look into the many reasons for the coup - the Human Rights violations have had no role. The lacklustre response of the Abhsit governemt towards the Rohinya issue is another strong indicator.

The Human Rights violations are clearly no issue for both sides. That leaves us no other choice than taking them out of the equasion for the moment - no side is better than the other in this aspect (only the rhetorics differ). And when we do look at the other political and social aims, the picture becomes rather clear. PAD is representing a proto-fascist system of government, and Red represents what the aspirations that might one day lead Thailand into a democracy.

[samgrowth]

I don't see any red shirt in this photo. Only black shirt, no shirt and interesting "YELLOW" shirt. Photo do not lie.

[hammered]

The PAD was and is an alliance of a number of groups, most of which could not be described as fascist (though a minority were).However the PAD leadership did propagate a number of policies which can quite reasonably be described as fascist in nature.It is precisely because I have studied European history that I can make this assertion with great confidence.

Yes, and the number of groups ended up submitting their aims to the aims of the PAD leadership. Hence - it is to be defined a proto-fascist movement.

It does also depend on what era of PAD you look at. It changed in terms of aims form start to finish and as it changed so did the make up of its supporters and sympathisers.

Basically in the early days it was pretty much a movement protesting government excesses and had little politcal ideology. Now it is very different and it probably lacks the support it once had - many of especially its sympathisers just wanted a change of government and now they have it they have what they want.

As for the red shirts they clearly include pro-Thaksin and pro-democracy and republican elements. I would howver argue you cant be pro-democracy and pro-Thaksin as a tenet of democracy is everyone is innocent until proven guilty and protection under the law and Thaksin is a symbol of the worse kind of abuse of this. Actually his government had more than a few of the elements commonly found in facist governments too although I dont like to analyse things overly in European terms which carry their own emotive baggage for those of us from that continent.

[animatic]

Let them blather on till they peter out.

Didn't Marie Antoinette say something like this?

One of histories great french to english misquotes.

[justanothercybertosser]

The PAD was and is an alliance of a number of groups, most of which could not be described as fascist (though a minority were).However the PAD leadership did propagate a number of policies which can quite reasonably be described as fascist in nature.It is precisely because I have studied European history that I can make this assertion with great confidence.

Yes, and the number of groups ended up submitting their aims to the aims of the PAD leadership. Hence - it is to be defined a proto-fascist movement.

It does also depend on what era of PAD you look at. It changed in terms of aims form start to finish and as it changed so did the make up of its supporters and sympathisers.

Basically in the early days it was pretty much a movement protesting government excesses and had little politcal ideology. Now it is very different and it probably lacks the support it once had - many of especially its sympathisers just wanted a change of government and now they have it they have what they want.

As for the red shirts they clearly include pro-Thaksin and pro-democracy and republican elements. I would howver argue you cant be pro-democracy and pro-Thaksin as a tenet of democracy is everyone is innocent until proven guilty and protection under the law and Thaksin is a symbol of the worse kind of abuse of this. Actually his government had more than a few of the elements commonly found in facist governments too although I dont like to analyse things overly in European terms which carry their own emotive baggage for those of us from that continent.

Sorry to disagree.

From the beginning PAD had a clear right wing nationalist stand. Thongchai Winichakul has already in 2005, before the formation of the PAD, criticised Sondhi Limthongkul's admiration for Pramuan's book "Royal Power" which has proposed those ideas already then. The radicalization of PAD is a logical consequence of it's beginning. That is why you have now many early PAD supporters in the Red Shirt movement - people who may have shared their criticism against Thaksin, but not the extreme right wing position of PAD that was only later more in the open.

In the context of a developed democracy you cannot be pro-Thaksin and pro-democracy at the same time. However - Thailand is unfortunately not a developed democracy. Democracy is all about compromises from avalaible options. The options in Thailand are unfortunately mostly very distasteful. However - the compromise between what the Reds describe as "Amartayapatai" is clearly more distasteful than the compromise with Thaksin. If you take demonisation and polemics out of the equasion, Thaksin is nothing but the aspirations of common people. He admittedly is not the best representative for those aspirations, but compared to Abhisit and the democrats (and their extra-constitutional allies) who represent the aspirations of the rich and powerful in Thailand - the question of what may be the lesser evil is rather clear. And that is all we have for the foreseeable future, the choice of the lesser evil.

The "mai aow song" position you seem to have, is honorable, though completely inconsequential, and actually does play into the hands of the PAD and the forces they represent.

Edited March 30, 2009 by justanothercybertosser

[hammered]

I may have more sympathy with some red demands if they were not so directly and seemingly inextricably linked to Thaksin who at the end of the day is Thailands biggest human rights abuser in decades - as PM he is responsible for government policy under international standard. That link isnt just shameful to any organization claiming to be pro-democracy but directly undermines the claim of being pro-democracy. Democracy and democratic values are more than just elections. Why dont the red shiorts demand Thaksin is tried for his governments criminal drug war policy? Dont they believe in the democratic rights of the poor? That nobody seems to care about this issue speaks volumes about Thailand's democratic development. Even western media sources while trying to fit Thaksin into the democrat overthrown by military elite box fail to ever mention his death record which according to the numbers reproted in the Rettig report is not disimilar in scope to the actual death record of Pinochet.

On a different note as the economic situation deteriorates and the command economies are seen as being able to respond faster and to better see out the the recession the idea that western style democracy will be seen as the ideal role model will not necessarily remain especially in a region that is now under Chinese rather than US hegemony. That though probably suits both extremes in this power battle.

Your fallacy is that you view and judge Thailand and Thaksin from the position of a developed democracy. Thailand is an emerging democracy that has the potential to develop.

When you say that Thaksin is the worst Human Rights offender, you simplify his rule, and ignore the paronage systhem of Thailand. All the Human Rights violations have not been possible without is co-conspirators, some of them in the informal power structure far more powerful than Thaksin. And his most powerful co-collaborators are now on backing PAD. It would be more accurate to describe Thailand itself as a country in which the upholding of Human Rights is not very developed.

It clearly is proven that the human rights violations of the South have continued after Thaksin. Also the lack of investigation into the drug war deaths indicate that Thaksin's opponents are not interested in solving that offense against Human Rights.

And if you look into the many reasons for the coup - the Human Rights violations have had no role. The lacklustre response of the Abhsit governemt towards the Rohinya issue is another strong indicator.

The Human Rights violations are clearly no issue for both sides. That leaves us no other choice than taking them out of the equasion for the moment - no side is better than the other in this aspect (only the rhetorics differ). And when we do look at the other political and social aims, the picture becomes rather clear. PAD is representing a proto-fascist system of government, and Red represents what the aspirations that might one day lead Thailand into a democracy.

We dont have to support one side or the other. Support can be withheld from both. It is not an either or choice. If both are bad then there is a perfectly valid position to condemn both.

Personally, I dont think killings should ever be removed from the equation so the reds while supporting Thaksin are fatally flawed in terms of democratic values or as an instrument to achieve real positive change for society.

What you espouse is a fairly standard leftist position of ally with the dynamic force however flawed it is and then push for more once that flawed force has power or attempt to then overthrow the flawed entity you have helped install. It is not a position that I personally agree with or one that I think has ever worked.

Thailand will develop as a democracy provided that democracy remains the worlds premier politcla role model whatever any of the power cliques do anyway. That however does not mean that Thailand will become a people's paradise or even particularly fair, but that is another matter!

By the way reports that the police are going to break the demo up.

[h90]

I may have more sympathy with some red demands if they were not so directly and seemingly inextricably linked to Thaksin who at the end of the day is Thailands biggest human rights abuser in decades - as PM he is responsible for government policy under international standard. That link isnt just shameful to any organization claiming to be pro-democracy but directly undermines the claim of being pro-democracy. Democracy and democratic values are more than just elections. Why dont the red shiorts demand Thaksin is tried for his governments criminal drug war policy? Dont they believe in the democratic rights of the poor? That nobody seems to care about this issue speaks volumes about Thailand's democratic development. Even western media sources while trying to fit Thaksin into the democrat overthrown by military elite box fail to ever mention his death record which according to the numbers reproted in the Rettig report is not disimilar in scope to the actual death record of Pinochet.

On a different note as the economic situation deteriorates and the command economies are seen as being able to respond faster and to better see out the the recession the idea that western style democracy will be seen as the ideal role model will not necessarily remain especially in a region that is now under Chinese rather than US hegemony. That though probably suits both extremes in this power battle.

Your fallacy is that you view and judge Thailand and Thaksin from the position of a developed democracy. Thailand is an emerging democracy that has the potential to develop.

When you say that Thaksin is the worst Human Rights offender, you simplify his rule, and ignore the paronage systhem of Thailand. All the Human Rights violations have not been possible without is co-conspirators, some of them in the informal power structure far more powerful than Thaksin. And his most powerful co-collaborators are now on backing PAD. It would be more accurate to describe Thailand itself as a country in which the upholding of Human Rights is not very developed.

It clearly is proven that the human rights violations of the South have continued after Thaksin. Also the lack of investigation into the drug war deaths indicate that Thaksin's opponents are not interested in solving that offense against Human Rights.

And if you look into the many reasons for the coup - the Human Rights violations have had no role. The lacklustre response of the Abhsit governemt towards the Rohinya issue is another strong indicator.

The Human Rights violations are clearly no issue for both sides. That leaves us no other choice than taking them out of the equasion for the moment - no side is better than the other in this aspect (only the rhetorics differ). And when we do look at the other political and social aims, the picture becomes rather clear. PAD is representing a proto-fascist system of government, and Red represents what the aspirations that might one day lead Thailand into a democracy.

PAD demanded investigations several times! For the war on drugs Thaksin was respondsible and no other invisible hands.

that there are no investigations under the Surayud government is disturbing, Abhisit government didn't show any fast investigations, yet. And PAD is starting to criticize the Democrats.

But I can't recall similar human right violations from the Chuan government so I hope it gets better. There is progress in the three southern provinces but it will need years to cool that down (these conflicts came with Thaksin, before there was almost nothing).

[justanothercybertosser]

Did the Court's comments reflect any accuracy in your idle speculation?

Who cares. The courts decided that there was no crime or offense worth prosecuting.

In other words, No.

Thank you.

Wrong - there was no crime where you see one.

[hammered]

The PAD was and is an alliance of a number of groups, most of which could not be described as fascist (though a minority were).However the PAD leadership did propagate a number of policies which can quite reasonably be described as fascist in nature.It is precisely because I have studied European history that I can make this assertion with great confidence.

Yes, and the number of groups ended up submitting their aims to the aims of the PAD leadership. Hence - it is to be defined a proto-fascist movement.

It does also depend on what era of PAD you look at. It changed in terms of aims form start to finish and as it changed so did the make up of its supporters and sympathisers.

Basically in the early days it was pretty much a movement protesting government excesses and had little politcal ideology. Now it is very different and it probably lacks the support it once had - many of especially its sympathisers just wanted a change of government and now they have it they have what they want.

As for the red shirts they clearly include pro-Thaksin and pro-democracy and republican elements. I would howver argue you cant be pro-democracy and pro-Thaksin as a tenet of democracy is everyone is innocent until proven guilty and protection under the law and Thaksin is a symbol of the worse kind of abuse of this. Actually his government had more than a few of the elements commonly found in facist governments too although I dont like to analyse things overly in European terms which carry their own emotive baggage for those of us from that continent.

Sorry to disagree.

From the beginning PAD had a clear right wing nationalist stand. Thongchai Winichakul has already in 2005, before the formation of the PAD, criticised Sondhi Limthongkul's admiration for Pramuan's book "Royal Power" which has proposed those ideas already then. The radicalization of PAD is a logical consequence of it's beginning. That is why you have now many early PAD supporters in the Red Shirt movement - people who may have shared their criticism against Thaksin, but not the extreme right wing position of PAD that was only later more in the open.

In the context of a developed democracy you cannot be pro-Thaksin and pro-democracy at the same time. However - Thailand is unfortunately not a developed democracy. Democracy is all about compromises from avalaible options. The options in Thailand are unfortunately mostly very distasteful. However - the compromise between what the Reds describe as "Amartayapatai" is clearly more distasteful than the compromise with Thaksin. If you take demonisation and polemics out of the equasion, Thaksin is nothing but the aspirations of common people. He admittedly is not the best representative for those aspirations, but compared to Abhisit and the democrats (and their extra-constitutional allies) who represent the aspirations of the rich and powerful in Thailand - the question of what may be the lesser evil is rather clear. And that is all we have for the foreseeable future, the choice of the lesser evil.

The "mai aow song" position you seem to have, is honorable, though completely inconsequential, and actually does play into the hands of the PAD and the forces they represent.

The choice of the lesser evil (if there is one) inevitably leads to violence possibly civil war and possibly a break up of the country considering the regional divide.

[sriracha john]

I don't see any red shirt in this photo. Only black shirt, no shirt and interesting "YELLOW" shirt. Photo do not lie.

That's funny coming from a troll, but anyways.

The Reds weren't so adamant in July 2007 as they are nowadays about wearing red. In fact, many photos of the time showed them wearing yellow shirts...

But do you see the logo on his shirt in this particular photo? White Doves.

There's a whole thread on them and other thugs of the UDD rioting here:

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/Thousands-Pr...95.html&hl=

Edited March 30, 2009 by sriracha john

[Insight]

47-year-old woman in yellow shirt attacked by red-shirted protesters

A woman wearing yellow t-shirt was slapped and kicked by many red-shirted protesters outside the Government House Monday morning.

The woman was identified at Benjawan Butwong 47 from Udon Thani.

She was attacked while walking across the Orathai Bridge to the Government House at 9:30 am.

She was eventually rescued by police.

She said she worked as a masseuse at the Paton Beach in Phuket and she heard that many friends from Udon Thani joined the rally so she would like to visit them. She said she did not have any special intention when wearing the yellow shirt and thought the color did not matter.

Benjawan filed a complaint against her attackers at the Nanloeng police station.

The Nation

[hammered]

From the Nation:

47-year-old woman in yellow shirt attacked by red-shirted protesters

Story at:

http://www.nationmultimedia.com/breakingne...ttacked-by-red-

It seems from the story that wearing the wrong clour even if innocently can be dangerous right now

[sriracha john]

Who cares. The courts decided that there was no crime or offense worth prosecuting.

In other words, No.

Thank you.

Wrong - there was no crime where you see one.

It was a simple question. Is your idle speculation reflected in the Court's comments. Yes or No.

So now, your saying, in other words, Yes. Your idle speculation was accurate of the Court's comments.

Which is it?

and just as a reminder, your idle speculation was:

Maybe the UDD has been right in their claims that the aggression that day was actually initiated by the ones that gave the police the dispersal order, and UDD has defended itself.

Edited March 30, 2009 by sriracha john

[justanothercybertosser]

PAD demanded investigations several times! For the war on drugs Thaksin was respondsible and no other invisible hands.

that there are no investigations under the Surayud government is disturbing, Abhisit government didn't show any fast investigations, yet. And PAD is starting to criticize the Democrats.

But I can't recall similar human right violations from the Chuan government so I hope it gets better. There is progress in the three southern provinces but it will need years to cool that down (these conflicts came with Thaksin, before there was almost nothing).

The Chuan governments have been signified by inactivity and sitting out every single social problem. This inactivity was main contributor to the escalation of the drug problem.

The PAD has not criticized the Surayudh government because of its lack of investigations into Human Rights, but because they saw the Surayudh government as too lenient with Thaksin and his supporters. Now they do not criticise Abhisit because of lack of investigations into the Human Rights problems, but because in their view he is again too lenient against the Red Shirts, and too slow in the uptake of what they call "New Politics" eg. Thai style fascism.

There is no progress whatsoever in the three southern provinces. And if you state that "before there was almost nothing" you completely ignore the insurgency during the 70s and 80s, the wars of the last centuries, and the still regular trainbombings of the 90s. There is no doubt that the insurgency has been mishandled by Thaksin. But the insurgency would have come no matter what.

[h90]

47-year-old woman in yellow shirt attacked by red-shirted protesters

A woman wearing yellow t-shirt was slapped and kicked by many red-shirted protesters outside the Government House Monday morning.

The woman was identified at Benjawan Butwong 47 from Udon Thani.

She was attacked while walking across the Orathai Bridge to the Government House at 9:30 am.

She was eventually rescued by police.

She said she worked as a masseuse at the Paton Beach in Phuket and she heard that many friends from Udon Thani joined the rally so she would like to visit them. She said she did not have any special intention when wearing the yellow shirt and thought the color did not matter.

Benjawan filed a complaint against her attackers at the Nanloeng police station.

The Nation

http://www.nationmultimedia.com/breakingne...ttacked-by-red-

[justanothercybertosser]

The choice of the lesser evil (if there is one) inevitably leads to violence possibly civil war and possibly a break up of the country considering the regional divide.

The choice of the worse evil leads to the same. Unless the powers that are do not learn to compromise with the aspirations of the common people, there will be turmoil, no matter what. I do not see them ready to compromise.

Unfortunately social justice seems to only happen after many people have to die.

[justanothercybertosser]

From the Nation:

47-year-old woman in yellow shirt attacked by red-shirted protesters

Story at:

http://www.nationmultimedia.com/breakingne...ttacked-by-red-

It seems from the story that wearing the wrong clour even if innocently can be dangerous right now

As it has been for the whole past year. And it will continue to be so. Simple rule that all should observe - Don't wear either yellow or red, and especially not the wrong color in the wrong camp. Why that 47 year old woman has not known what almost all Thais know nowadays, baffles me.

[justanothercybertosser]

It was a simple question. Is your idle speculation reflected in the Court's comments. Yes or No.

So now, your saying, in other words, Yes. Your idle speculation was accurate of the Court's comments.

Which is it?

and just as a reminder, your idle speculation was:

Maybe the UDD has been right in their claims that the aggression that day was actually initiated by the ones that gave the police the dispersal order, and UDD has defended itself.

As i used the term "maybe" i have not presented this statement as fact, but openly as speculation. You are barking at the wrong tree.

Fact though is that the courts have not seen a crime where you see one.

[Wolfie]

47-year-old woman in yellow shirt attacked by red-shirted protesters

A woman wearing yellow t-shirt was slapped and kicked by many red-shirted protesters outside the Government House Monday morning.

The woman was identified at Benjawan Butwong 47 from Udon Thani.

She was attacked while walking across the Orathai Bridge to the Government House at 9:30 am.

She was eventually rescued by police.

She said she worked as a masseuse at the Paton Beach in Phuket and she heard that many friends from Udon Thani joined the rally so she would like to visit them. She said she did not have any special intention when wearing the yellow shirt and thought the color did not matter.

Benjawan filed a complaint against her attackers at the Nanloeng police station.

The Nation

So who was saying about the Red Shirts being peaceful and not using violence earlier?

[justanothercybertosser]

So who was saying about the Red Shirts being peaceful and not using violence earlier?

Not me.

[sriracha john]

It was a simple question. Is your idle speculation reflected in the Court's comments. Yes or No.

So now, your saying, in other words, Yes. Your idle speculation was accurate of the Court's comments.

Which is it?

and just as a reminder, your idle speculation was:

Maybe the UDD has been right in their claims that the aggression that day was actually initiated by the ones that gave the police the dispersal order, and UDD has defended itself.

As i used the term "maybe" i have not presented this statement as fact, but openly as speculation. You are barking at the wrong tree.

Fact though is that the courts have not seen a crime where you see one.

Even THAT is NO fact.

Maybe the UDD was completely wrong in their claims and the UDD leaders were on the verge of being issued 20 year prison sentence for their role in leading a riot....when the Court clerk noticed that the police had listed the date of the charges erroneously as July 21, 2007 instead of July 22, 2007 and thus the Court had no other option but to dismiss the charges.

Gee... isn't this idle speculation silliness fun?

Everyone can play along, too.

[h90]

So who was saying about the Red Shirts being peaceful and not using violence earlier?

Not me.

Koos I think