The Mistress, Aka Number 2

[ernest1966]

This isn't a troll, its a genuine question.

I've seen this on soap operas, and also a couple of the extended family are number 2s.  I know it is prevalent all around the world but here it is far more prevalent and part of the culture.

In on of the general topic threads, a guy has got his second g/f pregnant...

As I said, two of the extended family are mistresses, to thais actually. Many thais have mistresses it seems, well, the rich ones, lol.

It's not just a affair either, some of these relationships last years, one I know of 6 years.The guy pays for her upkeep, she doesn't go out or anything, just sits at home waiting for her thai "bf" to come round.

The girls invariably are in total love with the guy, but he will never leave the wife and kids, yet she waits in vain, and if she makes to much of a fuss, she gets dumped for another girl.

What are your views, as I want to get a perspective from the ladies point of view.

Ernest

and personally, one lady is more than enough !

Edited April 6, 2009 by ernest1966

[eek]

To be honest I think you have got it wrong. Well...its not clear cut like that. I dont know a HUGE amount of this subject, but i am aware of some elements of it.

For example..Sometimes a second wife is even known to the first wife. Sometimes living in the same home. Sometimes because the first wife no longer wishes to have an intimate relationship with the husband, but wishes to still be in the care of her husband (doesnt want divorce). There are many reason for a man to take on a Mai noi. Not always negative ones. In some cases, it becomes a whole second family that he is responsible for, in the same was as the first wife. A lifetime commitment.

There are of course status reasons for some too.

But, really its not so black and white.

I believe that if a man (or woman) lies to their partner, then that is disrespectful. If a partner is loyal and loving to you and yet you go and get yourself a gik or "play" around, then that is disrespectful. Its betrayal of trust and commitment. I think no one enjoys being on the receiving end of that.

However, if there is a mutual decision that a husband can take on a new woman in his life, thats different.

I really dont think we have the right to judge anyones decisions on that without all the facts.

[sbk]

You want our perspective on being a mia noi or our perspective on our partners having mia nois?

[ernest1966]

eeek, i was not passing judgement, just asking for a viewpoint

sbk if there are mia noi on here, yes i would like there perspective on the matter

Ernest

[bina]

earnest, try the search function of thaivisa witht he word : mia noi... u never know what u might find from , say, about four years ago on til now....

bina

[BigSnake]

Poor girl needs to wise up and move on, a good and wise girl friend of hers could be a god send to her in this case, i.e., a little girl talk MIGHT enlighten her.

[Mossfinn]

Whenever I broach the subject, she starts playing around with sharp knives and makes a 'swishing' sound, a rather convincing argument

Moss

[Boo]

one of Mr Boo's bessie mates has a mia noi, first wife is aware but not overly impressed but sort of puts up with it in a "give her husband 10 shades of shit all the time" type of way. The mia noi is simpering & demanding (for money & trinkets) & Mr Boo & his other mates take the piss out of the guy all the time, so it isn't always all it is cracked up to be & we get the impression that he is waiting for the mia noi to find a better sponsor rather than dump her & leave her in he lurch. And who says Thai men don't do commitment

[sbk]

Mr sbk has a cousin who has about 4 wives, one mia leung and about 3 or 4 mia nois. They all get along and were all well aware of the conditions before entering the relationship with him. That said, according to Mr sbk, he is the only one he knows who is successful at having multiple mia nois and he can't imagine why in god's name anyone would want more than one wife

[ernest1966]

sbk

I don't know either. the closest i ever came to that situation was when i had a long distance relationship with a french girl and then started seeing an english girl, the french girl was driving me nuts after the last visit, so i dumped her and there was about 1 week of "crossed lines" so to speak, it was enough to drive me loopy.

don't know why any guy is nuts enough to do that to his mental health

bena, it's Ernest thanks :-)

Ernest

[Lite Beer]

bena, it's Ernest thanks :-)

Ernest

Ernest, It's Bina thanks

[neverdie]

bena, it's Ernest thanks :-)

Ernest

Ernest, It's Bina thanks

Personally I don't understand why guys do it.....imagine having to deal with 2 or 3 pains, all at once, surely only something for the brave at heart or the stupid.

[ernest1966]

nor do I, must be a masochistic thing

imagine being nagged to death every day by 2 or more woemn

take out the trash, why do you leave the lid up, can't you put your boxers in the laundry basket, do i look good in this... blah blah blah :D

scary eh

Ernest

[neverdie]

yeah ernest, I normally only hear blah blah blah, breakfast is ready, blah blah blah, lunch is ready, blah blah blah dinner is ready. Sometimes the blah blah blah bit can go on for hours on end, I normally head out to break up these dull moments .....ohh & I do recall hear her saying once, "Wait Im not on the bike yet" but I didnt stop, stop for what?

[samuibeachcomber]

yeah ernest, I normally only hear blah blah blah, breakfast is ready, blah blah blah, lunch is ready, blah blah blah dinner is ready. Sometimes the blah blah blah bit can go on for hours on end, I normally head out to break up these dull moments .....ohh & I do recall hear her saying once, "Wait Im not on the bike yet" but I didnt stop, stop for what?

bike or camel?

[sibeymai]

I know a Thai who has 3 wives. #1 is his legal wife and is in her 50s. #2 is in her 30s and #3 is about 20.

All 3 wives live in the same house. He seems happy and I've never heard him complain or speak of any problems at home.

The majority of other married Thais I know have girlfriends or mias which leads me to speculate that there must be a lot of guys who don't have a female partner at all, or a lot of ladies are doubling up or there simply wouldn't be enough to go around (might explain why there are so many katoeys...making up the numbers?).

[Sabum]

Are you kidding? There is a serious imbalance to the number of straight women for straight men in this country.

[neverdie]

yeah ernest, I normally only hear blah blah blah, breakfast is ready, blah blah blah, lunch is ready, blah blah blah dinner is ready. Sometimes the blah blah blah bit can go on for hours on end, I normally head out to break up these dull moments .....ohh & I do recall hear her saying once, "Wait Im not on the bike yet" but I didnt stop, stop for what?

bike or camel?

Yeah well SBC, I've been known to throw a leg over a few camels in my day. Best thing is, I'm about to jump an ek flight & head to Oz on my way to lovely down town far north queensland, just because I can

[VitalGirl]

I know a Thai who has 3 wives. #1 is his legal wife and is in her 50s. #2 is in her 30s and #3 is about 20.

All 3 wives live in the same house. He seems happy and I've never heard him complain or speak of any problems at home.

The majority of other married Thais I know have girlfriends or mias which leads me to speculate that there must be a lot of guys who don't have a female partner at all, or a lot of ladies are doubling up or there simply wouldn't be enough to go around (might explain why there are so many katoeys...making up the numbers?).

If you understand that whatever line gets spun publicly or during the courtship, the 1st wife in most developing economies (Thailand included) is largely an economic and status decision, then the whole Thai mia noi makes perfect sense from the guy's point of view. If you understand that for Thai women to be older and single is also a big social no-no, one understands why some Thai women might tolerate it. But I think we're being naive here too... western men play around every bit as much, possibly more, but we have different names for it and westerners generally don't stick with one mia noi. Maybe in some ways Thai men are better at commitment that western men?

[eek]

Interesting point VitalGirl. Hope people who may respond to your comment will do so reasonably as it might encourage a few trollish comments.

Taking on a mia noi instead of divorcing the wife may in fact be more admirable as he wishes to maintain the family unit and remain responsible for his first wife. People instantly think of the poor wife, "tolerating" her husbands second wife. But this is peoples assumptions. Maybe the husband may no longer have an intimate relationship with his first wife even(for whatever reason, may even be mutual), so taking on the second wife fulfills a need without breaking up the family. It also seems to be a better set up than a man going around picking up girls (imo). There are so many variables, no one can say if it is negative to the wife and family unit or not.

Of course, some may say the Thai man takes on a mia noi and still goes around with other girls/giks. I think a lot of these comments are probably hearsay and fed information. Along with that other classic that some men come out with here, that Thai Women prefer Western Men because "Thai Man no good". Some are not. Same as men everywhere. Depends on the person and situation.

[sbk]

I know many Thai women who will not tolerate a mia noi. I know less who will. Times are changing and younger women are realizing they have more options and are not required to stick with the man as the sole source of the support.

That said, some women don't mind, some women do. My neighbor had two wives, both about the same time, kids with both. Took care of both, separate houses tho. But, I often heard their arguments as the wife next door objected to the other wife. And no, she wasn't young at all.

Like anything and everything, it all depends on the individuals involved and while we can make generalizations based on cultural norms, there will always be exceptions to those rules, and in this particular case, the exceptions, IME, equal the number of ones that conform to the rule.

[Luxius]

I guess it is all about respect, whether you respect having multiple wives or not. Once you understand the matter of respect in Thailand, it all makes a bit more sense. That being said, I have no personal nor third person experiences with the topic being discussed. Here in Phuket infidelity is (seemingly) looked upon as we do in the Christian parts of the world.

And by the way, nobody likes a lie, but in Thailand you don't lie if you're not caught. This makes it very hard to have a Thai lady (or man, I assume) admit having lied, but it is possible and will often result in a "loss of face", which is a serious matter here. Many of my relationships, serious or not, have ended because of this - they are simply too embarrassed to be around me.

I can't wait to read your comments on my conclusions.

Sincerely,

Christen Stephansen

[Sabum]

nm

Edited April 12, 2009 by Sabum

[a2396]

This isn't a troll, its a genuine question.

I've seen this on soap operas, and also a couple of the extended family are number 2s.  I know it is prevalent all around the world but here it is far more prevalent and part of the culture.

In on of the general topic threads, a guy has got his second g/f pregnant...

As I said, two of the extended family are mistresses, to thais actually. Many thais have mistresses it seems, well, the rich ones, lol.

It's not just a affair either, some of these relationships last years, one I know of 6 years.The guy pays for her upkeep, she doesn't go out or anything, just sits at home waiting for her thai "bf" to come round.

The girls invariably are in total love with the guy, but he will never leave the wife and kids, yet she waits in vain, and if she makes to much of a fuss, she gets dumped for another girl.

What are your views, as I want to get a perspective from the ladies point of view.

Ernest

and personally, one lady is more than enough !

I posted this on a topic of my own that got deleted, because I inadvertently crossed the linein talking about money. But my current lady is in a relationship like you describe.

I have a lady friend (age 25) who I have known for about two years, who has become a regular companion to me. I hesitate to call her a girlfriend (even though she has used that term), because of the limits she has placed on the relationship. To me it is services for hire. She is currently finishing a B.S. Degree and until recently had a job in a restaurant. She says she was (and apparently still is) a mia noi to a wealthy Thai man in Bankok. He visits her once or twice per month she says. At first she said this relationship had ended, but recently admitted that it is ongoing. He supposedly pays her xxx per mo +or-. He apparently does not care what other liasons she is carrying on with. As for my situation, she sees me twice per week for "physical activities" and other times for lunch, dinner, etc. She seems quite intelligent, speaks acceptable English and is well mannered & "polished". The time I spend with her is "quality", but it does not go beyond her set limits. She says she doesn't care if I have other ladies and I presume she has other "local boys" for pay or free, when she so desires. In addition, she may be some sort of on-call escort, but I am not sure about this. She is quite inflexible about the times we meet and these are generally in the daytime. Dinners don't go past 8:30 PM. I think she is uite in love with the mia noi man as you mention and that is an inhibitor to her desire for further involvement with me. It is also possible she has a child with him, although she will not admit to such.

[Sabum]

I think we are talking about something completely different here man..... what you are describing is simply a prostitute (I don't care how polished she is). Even to the Thai guy who has her on salary for once or twice a month visits. We were talking about 2nd wives.

[sbk]

I agree, Sabum.

[songhklasid]

I saved my mia-noi from the demons of pattaya,she now lives happily with family in isaan, the family welcomed me, I explained my situation, #1 thai wife in australia,I visit #2 as much as I can,it's all good. albeit a bit of a balancing act, ah where's that lotto win.

regards songhklasid.

[Bahookie]

Not sure if it is so smart to be discussing adultery, especially around this very religious time of the year

[PattayaParent]

Mr sbk has a cousin who has about 4 wives, one mia leung and about 3 or 4 mia nois. They all get along and were all well aware of the conditions before entering the relationship with him. That said, according to Mr sbk, he is the only one he knows who is successful at having multiple mia nois and he can't imagine why in god's name anyone would want more than one wife

Muslim's do, but more to the point an Englishman might question why would you want more than one Mother in Law

But to get back on topic, I always thought that this practice was more related to the 'past times' when marriages were arranged between families and the couples maybe did not get on physically or emotionally so it was a 'convenience' to have a mia noi (and don't forget the women aslo have their gik's).

Otherwise with divorce there would be loss of face to both families and also the breakup of the 'arrangement' (possibly business or politically motivated?)

But as you said later sbk, times are changing and (some) women don't need the constant support of a man.

[PattayaParent]

I think we are talking about something completely different here man..... what you are describing is simply a prostitute (I don't care how polished she is). Even to the Thai guy who has her on salary for once or twice a month visits. We were talking about 2nd wives.

There was a famous guy that likened marriage to legalised prostitution.

So wouldn't it be even more so for a mia noi?