Vista Xp 7 Arrrgghhh

[sceadugenga]

The aging notebook is about to be replaced with a new desktop system, maybe sooner than expected.

Locally whatever I buy is going to come with Vista, and not only Vista but a dodgy version.

I always meant to delete it and put XP back on but now realise that there may not be the necessary drivers installed to run all of XP.

I hear good reports about Windows 7, but waiting for that and installing it will bring the same problems.

No, I don't want a Mac.

[H2oDunc]

Just buy a proper license for Vista ???? I have been running Vista now for around 18 months and am very happy with it. Far better than XP so why anybody would want to go backwards beats me. I have never had a blue screen of death and the way it handles my music, pictures etc is brillant. I have also found the people slagging Vista don't run it ? The laptop I bought had XP but when updating it using WGA I simply bought a license from Microsoft. Same with Vista. As long as you update regularly you will get few, if any problems. Most people I know with problems comes from the fact they do not update as they do not have WGA and as such are running a dodgy copy. All I would say is try it for yorself and dont rely on the Microsoft knockers

[Guest Reimar]

Many, includes my self, believing that Windows 7 is near to be released.

But that didn't means that Vista is bad: it isn't! I had run vista nearly 3 years, since the Beta time and I was really happy with it. Except on an few occasions I never had a real problem and never a BSOD! The speed and the outcome of Vista was beating XP in total.

Right now I using Windows 7 on all of my machines, on some in Dual Boot with Vista. XP is running on one machine together with Windows 2000 and even Windows 3.11 in virtual environment.

The Build of Windows 7 I run right now is 7077. Compare to Vista and even XP, it runs:

1. much faster;

2. much more stable;

3. even programs which were not able to run in Vista anymore, running;

4. no any driver problems with all hardware I use;

5.More secure;

and...and...and....................................

Windows 7 even runs on machines which couldn't run Vista. The need of performance (CPU, RAM pp) is less than in Vista. I even had installed Window 7 on an old 7 years old Laptop with just 512 MB memory and it runs much faster than XP on the same machine without BSOD while XP produced that every few hours!

So start to think about what you want to use but I suggest: Go for Windows 7

Cheers.

[Supernova]

Definitely go with Vista. It's not as bad as you think, not with Service Pack 1 and a few tweaks here and there. To install XP on a new modern system seems like a waste to me. Windows 7 won't be ready for at least 6 months, so you might as well use Vista to prepare yourself for Windows 7.

I have both WinXP and Vista installed, but find myself using Vista 90 percent of the time. My computer isn't what anybody would consider to be modern either (bought in 2006). If I can run Vista on this outdated box, I'm sure you can manage just fine with your new desktop computer.

[sceadugenga]

It appears Reimar is already running Windows 7, where did he get it from?

How do I buy a proper license for Vista? A legit copy would be almost unobtainable without making a special trip to Bangkok.

My overseas bank doesn't like me paying for stuff on the internet either.

[Supernova]

It appears Reimar is already running Windows 7, where did he get it from?

I can't tell you *how* to get it as it might be against forum rules... Do a google search and follow the trail... Better yet, just wait until May 5th, Windows 7 "Release Candidate" will be available for download from Microsoft at that time.

[sceadugenga]

Another query, what exactly is a "Release Candidate"?

From the Windows site....

The Windows 7 Release Candidate has been released and is available at the Microsoft Partner Program site which contains a short post and a download button for the release candidate.

[Supernova]

Another query, what exactly is a "Release Candidate"?

From the Windows site....

The Windows 7 Release Candidate has been released and is available at the Microsoft Partner Program site which contains a short post and a download button for the release candidate.

Release Candidate = Development on Windows 7 has ended. This is not the final version, but a public release so users can preview it for any 'show stopper' bugs before finalizing the code for RTM (Release To Manufacturing). RTM or final release is expected no earlier than October 30th.

[Guest Reimar]

The RC (Release Candidate) which can varies in RC1 or even RC2 is the latest before RTM (Ready to Manufacturing) which is the first Final. The RTM is used from OEM's to place on their machines before the public release.

The available RC has an "open" license for to use until March 2010 and is free for that time. So that is also a good grace period for to testing without to loose some money.

And as I wrote before in my post, I'm really happy with Windows 7 since build 6948 and now on 7077 wich is the RC Escrow.

Cheers.

[Guest Reimar]

Another query, what exactly is a "Release Candidate"?

From the Windows site....

The Windows 7 Release Candidate has been released and is available at the Microsoft Partner Program site which contains a short post and a download button for the release candidate.

Release Candidate = Development on Windows 7 has ended. This is not the final version, but a public release so users can preview it for any 'show stopper' bugs before finalizing the code for RTM (Release To Manufacturing). RTM or final release is expected no earlier than October 30th.

No offence but the with the RC the development hasn't finished at all, just moved to a more final stage!

[Supernova]

Another query, what exactly is a "Release Candidate"?

From the Windows site....

The Windows 7 Release Candidate has been released and is available at the Microsoft Partner Program site which contains a short post and a download button for the release candidate.

Release Candidate = Development on Windows 7 has ended. This is not the final version, but a public release so users can preview it for any 'show stopper' bugs before finalizing the code for RTM (Release To Manufacturing). RTM or final release is expected no earlier than October 30th.

No offence but the with the RC the development hasn't finished at all, just moved to a more final stage!

Yes it has, otherwise it wouldn't be labeled as a "Release Candidate". The product is more or less finished; with the focus now on finding bugs, streamlining the interface, code optimization. No new features are added in the RC stage.

[Guest Reimar]

Another query, what exactly is a "Release Candidate"?

From the Windows site....

The Windows 7 Release Candidate has been released and is available at the Microsoft Partner Program site which contains a short post and a download button for the release candidate.

Release Candidate = Development on Windows 7 has ended. This is not the final version, but a public release so users can preview it for any 'show stopper' bugs before finalizing the code for RTM (Release To Manufacturing). RTM or final release is expected no earlier than October 30th.

No offence but the with the RC the development hasn't finished at all, just moved to a more final stage!

Yes it has, otherwise it wouldn't be labeled as a "Release Candidate". The product is more or less finished; with the focus now on finding bugs, streamlining the interface, code optimization. No new features are added in the RC stage.

That just means it's NOT finish! Right? And how many times there were more than 1 RC's? By Microsoft as well? Why that if they finish? Because they NOT and you wrote that by your self: is more or less finished!

So, Finish or NOT Finish? There is not more or less, just Yes or No!

You don't forget to mention that Microsoft is still in full development for some of the features of Windows 7 which maybe even not finish before RTM!

Again, no offence taken.

Cheers.

[sensei]

It appears Reimar is already running Windows 7, where did he get it from?

How do I buy a proper license for Vista? A legit copy would be almost unobtainable without making a special trip to Bangkok.

My overseas bank doesn't like me paying for stuff on the internet either.

Windows 7 is ready for testing.

Download HERE

[Supernova]

Yes it has, otherwise it wouldn't be labeled as a "Release Candidate". The product is more or less finished; with the focus now on finding bugs, streamlining the interface, code optimization. No new features are added in the RC stage.

That just means it's NOT finish! Right? And how many times there were more than 1 RC's? By Microsoft as well? Why that if they finish? Because they NOT and you wrote that by your self: is more or less finished!

So, Finish or NOT Finish? There is not more or less, just Yes or No!

You don't forget to mention that Microsoft is still in full development for some of the features of Windows 7 which maybe even not finish before RTM!

Again, no offence taken.

Cheers.

Reimar,

I'm not going to argue with you, lol. I used to be beta tester for Windows XP when it was in development. So I have a pretty good idea how it works.

When I say it's more or less finished, I don't mean 100% finished as in 'ready to go on sale'. What I mean is product development cycle is complete, but not yet ready for mass distribution. 1 RC or 3 RC's -- it doesn't matter. No features are added in the RC stage. If you don't believe me, go to any tech site (msfn.org, neowin.net) and post a question in the forums. They will tell you the same thing I'm telling you.

When a software product is under development, it means (1) new features are being added; (2) changes to the source code are ongoing... This isn't the case with RC.

Release Candidate @ WIKI:

The term release candidate (RC) refers to a version with potential to be a final product, ready to release unless fatal bugs emerge. In this stage of product stabilization (read QA cycle), all product features have been designed, coded and tested through one or more Beta cycles with no known showstopper-class bug.

[phaethon]

Vista has , more-or-less, had most of the wrinkles ironed out by now, or at least work-arounds found. DO NOT buy Win7 for at least 18 months after it's final release - let the geeks and the guinea pigs pick it over until it's ready for human beings to use.

[Guest Reimar]

As long as an product isn't finalised, it's NOT final. Period!

Release Candidates are NOT final and therefore NOT a finished product! Period!

RTM's are NOT final's as well and a product which may lack's some drivers pp, regarding it's a Software RTM.

Wiki's are made by users and didn't reflect the truth at all times! Period!

From: http://www.pcmag.com/encyclopedia_term/0,2...;i=50384,00.asp and http://dictionary.zdnet.com/definition/rel...+candidate.html

Definition of: release candidate

A pre-release version of software. Sometimes software vendors make one or two release candidates (RC1, RC2, etc.) available to select customers in advance of the official release. A release candidate is like a "sneak preview" of the final release with the added advantage that serious bugs may yet surface and be fixed before the general public uses it. Thus, there are alpha versions (internal), beta versions (external), release candidates (sometimes) and the final release of software. After that, there are countless updates that add features and fix bugs. See alpha version and beta version.

Regarding MS-Vista at the time between August 2006 (RC) and November 2006 (RTM) there were 2 changes in the Kernel and several other changes in systemfiles and even after RTM were min 1 change in the Kernel again. Changes like that wouldn't be according to what you wrote.

On the other hand, I didn't take Wiki's and the meaning others from other forum pp. as a holy speech!

Cheers.

[OxfordWill]

Another query, what exactly is a "Release Candidate"?

From the Windows site....

The Windows 7 Release Candidate has been released and is available at the Microsoft Partner Program site which contains a short post and a download button for the release candidate.

Release Candidate = Development on Windows 7 has ended. This is not the final version, but a public release so users can preview it for any 'show stopper' bugs before finalizing the code for RTM (Release To Manufacturing). RTM or final release is expected no earlier than October 30th.

No offence but the with the RC the development hasn't finished at all, just moved to a more final stage!

Yes it has, otherwise it wouldn't be labeled as a "Release Candidate". The product is more or less finished; with the focus now on finding bugs, streamlining the interface, code optimization. No new features are added in the RC stage.

actually I think both of you are right, just talking so loudly youre not realising youre saying the same thing

Edited April 19, 2009 by OxfordWill

[Wash]

I am also running Windows 7 RC1 build 7077 and it is working just great and in fact is the system I boot to and use all day. I also have Vista Ultimate as a dual boot and just yesterday installed Service pack 2, which also works just fine.

My main reason for keeping VISTA Ultimate is that when Windows 7 is past the RC and RTM stage it will become product and Microsoft has stated that it will be easy to upgrade from VISTA but not so easy to upgrade from other operating systems including XP and Windows 7 RC1 build 7077.

So my advice to the OP is go for VISTA on your new system and be confident that you will be easily upgraded to Windows 7 when it comes out. A further comment is I suggest waiting a couple months since Microsoft plans to offer a free upgrade to Vista purchasers to Windows 7 when it ships. So if you can hang on for a month or two you should be able to buy VISTA and get Windows 7 when it ships for the same price.

Good luck to you as you work out your best solution.

Edited for typo

Edited April 19, 2009 by Wash

[dttk0009]

I'm on Windows 7 7077 x64 as well, and it's probably the best Windows I've had in a while.

[fiddlehead]

I have Vista and although, admittedly, it doesn't crash and works ok on the internet, it doesn't run so many of my old software programs.

Some of these programs (like music multi track recording) i have been using for 5+ years and am so familiar with them that i really don't want to have to learn a new one. (and many others)

So, unfortunately, i use 2 computers. One for the internet, on Vista. And one for some of my work (Windows XP)

So, i saw one post above that said the Windows 7 would run programs that Vista would not.

I sure hope this is true as running 2 computers makes for lots of new problems like remembering which one has which file on it and tranferring all too often, etc.

Any input on this feature of Windows 7 (running everything that XP runs perhaps???) would be greatly appreciated. Thanks

[Supernova]

As long as an product isn't finalised, it's NOT final. Period!

Release Candidates are NOT final and therefore NOT a finished product! Period!

I never once mentioned anything about RC being the final. Please don't accuse me of something I did not say!! It seems you're missing the whole point -- which is, Windows 7 has reached RC; at this stage of development, no new features will be added. The RC branch are used as final tests before a stable release.

RTM's are NOT final's as well and a product which may lack's some drivers pp, regarding it's a Software RTM.

Wrong again!

RTM (Release To Manufacturing) is the FINAL or GOLD version released to OEM's (Original Equipment Manufactures) such as Asus, Dell, HP Compaq, Lenovo... This is the retail version sold in stores.

Wiki's are made by users and didn't reflect the truth at all times! Period!

I don't need to look up this information on Wiki. Having been an official beta tester for years, I have a pretty good idea on how the development cycle works. The reason I even mentioned Wiki was for YOUR benefit, since I don't know how else to explain it to you.

Regarding MS-Vista at the time between August 2006 (RC) and November 2006 (RTM) there were 2 changes in the Kernel and several other changes in systemfiles and even after RTM were min 1 change in the Kernel again. Changes like that wouldn't be according to what you wrote.

Yes, changes like this can happen, although it's very rare. Only important bugs will be fixed between release candidates. Last minute changes to the kernel are made only if a serious flaw is discovered. Again, one of the main purposes of the RC is to locate and fix bugs, among other things.

Reimar, I suggest you submit an application to the Microsoft beta testing program. If you do get accepted, thus, have the chance to test beta software, you will realize what I've been telling you is true.

This is my last comment on this matter. Having to repeat myself over and over, isn't doing either of us or other readers any good. Besides, I believe I've provided a very clear explanation of where things stand, so let's move on.

[Guest Reimar]

Ready to Manufacturing is telling what? Ready for all?

No, Ready for those Manufacturers which were working with MS and even had paying in advance for an contingent of licenses to get the new product forehand before other's: the public will getting it. But those Manufacturers are responsible for to deliever all required drivers in an working manner while the developer still is working on compatibility issues with products from other, non-OEM's!

The best example in this way was Vista.

An Release candidate is just that: A Release Candidate which is everything but complete/finish/final or whatsoever name you like to give them. A Release Candidate need to show that he's ready to do what is expected from an final product, very well known that those will happens in which percentage?! But never 100%! A release Candidate can easy fail the final Test and what is he than?

It is just irrealistic to tell on Board like TV that a software has reached the stage of finish development if the final but NOT finish test phase is just started at the moment the product reach the RC state!

Again, the best example was Vista! Vista was still in nearly full development up to the release of the SP1! And the same was happens for XP up to SP1!

[Supernova]

Well, after all the effort I've put in trying to explain things, one thing is very evident... You clearly lack the basic understanding of software development and the terms/phrases (RC, RTM) associated with it. You seem to be having difficulty comprehending what I've wrote. Whatever the case, I won't hold it against you.

Ready to Manufacturing is telling what? Ready for all?

No, Ready for those Manufacturers which were working with MS and even had paying in advance for an contingent of licenses to get the new product forehand before other's: the public will getting it. But those Manufacturers are responsible for to deliever all required drivers in an working manner while the developer still is working on compatibility issues with products from other, non-OEM's!

Actually, it's "Release To Manufacturing", not Ready To Manufacturing... Yes, it's 'ready for all' as you put it because if it's RTM, it's the final version.

When a major product such as Windows goes RTM, let alone RC, it gets released to OEM partners first. Shortly thereafter, TechNet and MSDN subscribers get the bits. This distribution method has been in place since the days of Windows 95. As a matter of fact, we are seeing this with Windows 7 RC right now. Let me explain to you briefly, why they do this...

Microsoft ships RC's and RTM code out to OEM's early so manufacturers get plenty of time to test the new OS and its feature set before the product is publicly released. This also gives third-party developers a chance to familiarize themselves with the new APIs (Application Programming Interfaces), which will aid in the development of other software and compatible device drivers following public debut of the product.

Several weeks after RTM, the software is released to retail outlets worldwide. Note: This is the same version shipped earlier to OEM's and paid subscribers. The only difference between OEM vs Retail is the licensing. Everything else is exactly the same. To everyone in the tech industry, including Microsoft, RTM is the final version.

An Release candidate is just that: A Release Candidate which is everything but complete/finish/final or whatsoever name you like to give them. A Release Candidate need to show that he's ready to do what is expected from an final product, very well known that those will happens in which percentage?! But never 100%! A release Candidate can easy fail the final Test and what is he than?

RC means development has ended. I never mentioned anything about the software being finished or complete. I didn't give it any special names either. Another misunderstanding on your part.

It is just irrealistic to tell on Board like TV that a software has reached the stage of finish development if the final but NOT finish test phase is just started at the moment the product reach the RC state!

What's so unrealistic? By letting people in on the facts? Common now, you may not have a clear understanding of how it works, but I'm sure many other readers do. If anything, you're the one that's confused here.

Let me clear it up for you, yet again. The end of a development cycle does not mean a product is finished or is ready for the red-carpet rollout in any way. It simply means no new features or technology will be added to software at the RC stage.

Case is closed. I'm going to shutup now and not comment anymore about this. You either get it or you don't. It's good we had this debate, discussion. Whoever reads this thread will likely learn something new.

News update:

Windows 7 "Release Candidate" making the headlines. Rumor has it that May 5th is RC day. Keep your eyes open.

[ThaiLife]

Well, after all the effort I've put in trying to explain things, one thing is very evident... You clearly lack the basic understanding of software development and the terms/phrases (RC, RTM) associated with it. You seem to be having difficulty comprehending what I've wrote. Whatever the case, I won't hold it against you.

Ready to Manufacturing is telling what? Ready for all?

No, Ready for those Manufacturers which were working with MS and even had paying in advance for an contingent of licenses to get the new product forehand before other's: the public will getting it. But those Manufacturers are responsible for to deliever all required drivers in an working manner while the developer still is working on compatibility issues with products from other, non-OEM's!

Actually, it's "Release To Manufacturing", not Ready To Manufacturing... Yes, it's 'ready for all' as you put it because if it's RTM, it's the final version.

When a major product such as Windows goes RTM, let alone RC, it gets released to OEM partners first. Shortly thereafter, TechNet and MSDN subscribers get the bits. This distribution method has been in place since the days of Windows 95. As a matter of fact, we are seeing this with Windows 7 RC right now. Let me explain to you briefly, why they do this...

Microsoft ships RC's and RTM code out to OEM's early so manufacturers get plenty of time to test the new OS and its feature set before the product is publicly released. This also gives third-party developers a chance to familiarize themselves with the new APIs (Application Programming Interfaces), which will aid in the development of other software and compatible device drivers following public debut of the product.

Several weeks after RTM, the software is released to retail outlets worldwide. Note: This is the same version shipped earlier to OEM's and paid subscribers. The only difference between OEM vs Retail is the licensing. Everything else is exactly the same. To everyone in the tech industry, including Microsoft, RTM is the final version.

An Release candidate is just that: A Release Candidate which is everything but complete/finish/final or whatsoever name you like to give them. A Release Candidate need to show that he's ready to do what is expected from an final product, very well known that those will happens in which percentage?! But never 100%! A release Candidate can easy fail the final Test and what is he than?

RC means development has ended. I never mentioned anything about the software being finished or complete. I didn't give it any special names either. Another misunderstanding on your part.

It is just irrealistic to tell on Board like TV that a software has reached the stage of finish development if the final but NOT finish test phase is just started at the moment the product reach the RC state!

What's so unrealistic? By letting people in on the facts? Common now, you may not have a clear understanding of how it works, but I'm sure many other readers do. If anything, you're the one that's confused here.

Let me clear it up for you, yet again. The end of a development cycle does not mean a product is finished or is ready for the red-carpet rollout in any way. It simply means no new features or technology will be added to software at the RC stage.

Case is closed. I'm going to shutup now and not comment anymore about this. You either get it or you don't. It's good we had this debate, discussion. Whoever reads this thread will likely learn something new.

News update:

Windows 7 "Release Candidate" making the headlines. Rumor has it that May 5th is RC day. Keep your eyes open.

I for one have learned some thing from you comments , and as for .. I'm going to shutup now and not comment anymore about this .

its a shame to feel you have to do this just because of some one's I know better than you syndrome .

please keep us up dated on the Windows 7 '' Release Candidate '' Rumor

TL