First Time Motorbike

[Minke]

I have been digging around for about an hour and haven't found the existing thread that helps me much.

I want to purchase a new motorbike. I am pretty sure I want a new one. I have been living here for a bit over a year and can't help but notice the way Thais treat their belongings.... let alone complex machinery that require some attention to maintenance. I wouldn't feel comfortable depending on or sinking money into a bike with an unknown history of treatment.

Some details:

I think I want a smaller automatic. I don't have a need for speed, and have only learned to drive a motorbike within the past few months(more comfortable with automatic). I am usually the one following the lady with 4 kids stacked on the back doing a modest 30-40km an hour. I am a small 31 year old female and don't need a gigantic crotch rocket of a machine. I just want some mobility.

I am on Koh Lanta Island. A few steep hills, but mostly a long dusty winding crater (up to a meter across and 10+cm deep)-filled tarmac road. There is a slight chance I might take the thing to Krabi occasionally once I am more experienced and confident.

I would like some suggestions on a sturdy little bike. So far the motorbike I have liked driving best has been the yamaha nouvo. The Mio seemed a bit lightweight and like it was going to shatter to bits every bump it took (though it was beat up and the suspension or some other parts important to handling were probably not in very good shape so not a fair showing). The Fino was pretty good, acceptable and the Nouvo was the sturdiest unit that felt like it was most stable on the road but was kind of a beast to maneuver around and park and handle when not cruising along. But I don't know a whole lot about these bikes but from the looks of things some of you folks are much more knowledgable on the topic. I haven't tried any Hondas incidentally (everyone I know well enough to borrow from has yamahas).

I apologize if this has been covered somewhere already. If so, please post the link. Cheers!

[longball53098]

You can't go wrong buying a Honda or Yamaha. They both have good quality machines. I do not favor the automatics as I think they make too much noise and have an awful thrashing sound.

Buy new whatever then you have a warranty in case of issues. Buy used only if you know the bikes history. As you say the Thais don't know what service is until it breaks and then they just fix what they can afford.

I would also say keep on renting until you get more experienced on the machines. Try the Honda or Yamaha machines that have the semi-automatic (no clutch). Typically a Honda Wave has the foot shifter on the left and foot brake on the right. My Honda 125 fuel injected wave is more than 3 years old now and runs great.

Automatics are very popular now. But they cost more and I'm sure they are more costly to maintain even though service work on a small bike here is cheap.

If you buy new, buy from a dealer in your area and go there for regular service. Don't use the small guy on the corner for service except for things like a flat tire.

I'm sure ohters will pipe in here with their opinion.

[TVmonitor]

As above you cant go wrong (touch wood) with Yamaha or Honda. for me it's the Nouvo every time. - these "automatics" have been around for years now (decades)and they are certainly not high maintenance. I've been riding and eve competing on bikes since I was a child and I really like the fully automatics. The Honda Wave is more powerful in some versions and can even have a proper clutch which is great for sporty driving and tearing up hills but I found that given enough "twist" on the throttle (accelerator) it is up to most climbs with a fairly heavy load.

It's about the largest of all the "step-through" bikes - has the same power/drive chain as the Mio which is VERY small especially if you intend to take a passenger.

I've driven around Koh Laan and it is hilly but very pleasant, not having to change down for the hills would be a bonus for the novice rider.

are you intending to DRIVE to Khrabi on it?? - If so there is a new Nouvo that has a larger more powerful engine. The current is 110 cc, i think the new one will be 125cc - this would make a long journey like that more tolerable.

please include a good crah helmet and protective clothing in your budget - a new Nouvo is over 50k.

If in the end you go for second-hand, you might get something that's OK s these bikes are made to be pretty "idiot proof" and can take a lot of mistreatment. Never believe te mileage - chtat is too easy to change. Don't look to see how clean a bike is - look for wear and tear.

Are the rubbers on the handle bar original?

Are the foot rests straight or worn, is the seat eupholstered?

Oil under the bike after it's been run for a bit?

Lights working...

starts OK? - from COLD and HOT (the early Nouvo had a design fault and wouldn't start - this could be fixed with a modified replacement part.)

run the vehicle until the engine is at normal operating temp (15 minutes ior so) -

check for exhaust smoke - blue/grey smoke is burning oil - leave the bike alone.

Black smoke is poor combustion and usually can be fixed quite cheaply.

BLUE BOOK - does it have one? - check the details...no book no sale - unless you jst want a cheapie to run around the island on with no legal paperwork.

THen you need to assertain you ae buying the bike from it's genuine owner and arrange to change over the docos.

by now you are probably thinking it's easier to buy new!

Edited May 1, 2009 by TVmonitor

[kennkate]

Honda Wave 100% Reliable

I know you want Twist and Go Dont wory too much about The Wave Semi Auto

Couple of days you will get used to it

Plus Larger Wheels cope with the bumps and Potholes better

100 baht for Oil change every 6 months Thats it. Worry Free

[TVmonitor]

THe Nouvo has full-size wheels!

[ballbreaker]

I have driven both the Yamaha Nouvo and Honda Click and would only go with one of these if you want an automatic. Don't even think about the Mio or Fino in my opinion

My choice would be the Honda Click because I feel it is a more reliable bike when starting a cold or hot engine. I also like the lighter feel for around town use and think it might just be the bike you are looking for.

Edited May 1, 2009 by ballbreaker

[Richard-BKK]

All 4-Japanese and the one Thai brand (Tiger) do all produce reliable motorcycles. If your quest for a motorcycle is more on reliability then I would say select the a motorcycle from the closest dealer. If that is a Honda buy a Honda, if it is Suzuki buy and Suzuki, even if it is a Tiger buy a Tiger.

The new Honda's with PGM-FI are remarkable reliable, but on the counter side some none Honda or part-time Honda dealers can get confused by this High tech fuel injection system. If you agree and want a none-fuel injection motorcycle, then my personal preference would go to the Kawasaki ZX130 or the Tiger 135cc's.

As you live on Koh Lanta I would also suggest that you stay away from full-automatic motorcycles, they will surely cost more in fuel consumption and service maintenance (a CVT motorcycle is V-belt is just not build for mountaineering)

[LivinLOS]

Honda nuovo elegance with the 136 LC engine..

More sturdy than any of the other autos..

Tho I would also say a honda wave if you could get used to the manual.

[Richard-BKK]

He LivinLOS,

I hardly call the Honda Wave a manual gear, it's more a 4-gear semi-automatic it has no clutch and gear change is as easy as braking... But then some people also have problems with that...

[LivinLOS]

Does it change gear for you ?? No ?? then its not an auto is it !!

Its a manual with a foot operated clutch. I could see it being called a clutchless manual I guess but try and twis and go on a wave and see how far that gets you.

The nuovo / airblade / mio / click etc are autos.. The wave is a manual.. No two ways about it in my mind.

[Richard-BKK]

Point taken... but I said 4-gear semi-automatic.... still the Honda Wave as family bike would be a very good choice...

[Bard]

Semi automatic? where did that come from, guns... Meaning it automatically reloads when you shoot one shot at the time.

On cars and bikes you have either automatic gears or manual gears, that the clutch is operated together with the foot pedal just has nothing to do with automatic gearing, call it automatic clutch if you want but auto and semi-auto?

Also for the post, you're obviously not looking for a motorcycle but a scooter... Buy a geared one, 110 to 125 cc Honda, bankers... The Honda's are based upon the Cub, which is called the greatest ever made, from reliability perspective.

Call a spade a spade for crying out load...

[Richard-BKK]

Hi Bard,

Honda calls its 4-gear a "Centrifugal clutch semi-automatic with 4 gears" for what it is worth. And yes the Honda Wave's are great bikes only the concept of fuel-injection is not known by all roadside mechanics.

[tavarich]

Honda nuovo elegance with the 136 LC engine..

More sturdy than any of the other autos..

Tho I would also say a honda wave if you could get used to the manual.

I think he should have said: Yamaha Nuovo Elegance, I bought one last month and it is a quick little machine. I did not think I was going to like the automatic but in BKK traffic you have a lot more things to think about than shifting. I shopped and read many articles here and I decided that the Yamaha was the one for me. Like the previous posts have said rent them all and make sure you buy from a big dealer.

[LivinLOS]

Honda nuovo elegance with the 136 LC engine..

More sturdy than any of the other autos..

Tho I would also say a honda wave if you could get used to the manual.

I think he should have said: Yamaha Nuovo Elegance, I bought one last month and it is a quick little machine. I did not think I was going to like the automatic but in BKK traffic you have a lot more things to think about than shifting. I shopped and read many articles here and I decided that the Yamaha was the one for me. Like the previous posts have said rent them all and make sure you buy from a big dealer.

Yeah I must have been having a senior moment.. yammy 135 LC elegance..

I can see why and auto is handy in a (flat) city... But a manual offers much better ride quality on a hilly island IMO, the engine braking downhill being a big one for control. But I also understand if someones not familiar with gears that its an additional fear, I can think its a fear they should overcome and learn to ride a geared one but everyones attitude is different.

[Kf6vci]

The Honda Wave would be a great first bike for the town. But if you like touring, look at the Tiger 250 for less than 80 k Baht. Soem folks upgrade the tires at the factory.

Good ergonomics. You would probably want to upgrade to a 250 cc anyhow within a few months

[katabeachbum]

Yamaha Nouvo Elegance 135 cc.

Automatic. Stronger up the hills than any Wave/Dream manual/footclutch. Long wheelbase (14cm longer than NouvoMX) gives comfortable ride. Only 10 kg more heavy than Mio/Fino.

Reliable. I got my first Nouvo auto 5 years ago, and it just needed automatic gear overhaul. 45.000 km at a cost of 990 baht in the yamaha shop.

And hey, the engine is braking downhill!!!!! and the larger front discbrake than Click, Fino/Mio never overheats.

My Nouvos cover like 10.000 km a year, while my 1.800cc chopper used to cover 1.000 km a year. To heavy at 380 kg and impossible to park most places

[LivinLOS]

The Honda Wave would be a great first bike for the town. But if you like touring, look at the Tiger 250 for less than 80 k Baht. Soem folks upgrade the tires at the factory.

Good ergonomics. You would probably want to upgrade to a 250 cc anyhow within a few months

Did you read the OP ??

Small female wants an auto scooter.. And you suggest a 250 tiger..

Dont let your own feelings over the tiger show.

[wrathfultalon]

During my time on Koh Samui we had several scooters. While the Fino/Mio are good for town riding they take a beating on the bigger roads and hate having a passenger while on mountain roads. We used a Honda Click 125 and that seemed the more appropriate for the region. I have to agree that the manuals are easy to learn as i had never riden a motorized bike till coming here. Used a manual Wave and it was much more fuel effecient and easily went up hills.

[Richard-BKK]

If you buy a motorcycle for the family, you need to set the priorities first before you start to look for a bike.

Things you need to think about is;

- Purchase budget

- Running Cost

- Reparability - can you do stuff yourself, etc...

- Location service center

For the budget of the motorcycle you will find that most motorcycles are similar prices, the only big difference in price is if you go shopping for a used motorcycle (but be aware that used is often abused in Thailand). The running cost makes the big difference, as you can read before, full-automatics can cost twice as much as having a transmission motorcycle. Also using a full-automatic under heavy conditions will ware on the V-belt.

A fuel-injection motorcycle is extremely good in saving on fuel consumption, the only downside is that the average Thai mechanic has no clue how to repair it or even knows how it works.

Personal I belief that a Kawasaki ZX130 would be a great bike for you, it is powerful, it has the same simple operations as a Honda Wave and it even has for the sporty teenagers a tachometer.

[aitch52]

I agree with a couple of posters here, go for the Honda Wave 125, once you get used to the gear change it's an easy bike to ride. After wifes son had a spill on her Wave 125, we put it into the repair shop, 2 new fairings, new headlight cover, new handle bars and crown bearing assy and brake lever. The footpegs were straightened out, 1400 Baht inluding labour, so they are cheap to repair too. I rode it back the 14Kms home from the shop and really enjoyed it, I usually ride a Phantom. It is a nippy little bike that is quite happy poodling along at slow speeds and the 125 has the power in reserve. Enjoy your biking and I hope this thread gives you the gen to make an informed choice.

Edited May 5, 2009 by aitch52

[katabeachbum]

I agree with a couple of posters here, go for the Honda Wave 125, once you get used to the gear change it's an easy bike to ride. After wifes son had a spill on her Wave 125, we put it into the repair shop, 2 new fairings, new headlight cover, new handle bars and crown bearing assy and brake lever. The footpegs were straightened out, 1400 Baht inluding labour, so they are cheap to repair too. I rode it back the 14Kms home from the shop and really enjoyed it, I usually ride a Phantom. It is a nippy little bike that is quite happy poodling along at slow speeds and the 125 has the power in reserve. Enjoy your biking and I hope this thread gives you the gen to make an informed choice.

How do you get used to the gearchange? Its opposite the gearchange on your Phantom and every other manual bike I v had. I v had to Waves, but really think the Yamaha Nouvo Elegance 135cc is so much better in all aspects. Even the repaircosts for automatic is cheaper than chain and sprockets for Wave.

[LivinLOS]

I agree with a couple of posters here, go for the Honda Wave 125, once you get used to the gear change it's an easy bike to ride. After wifes son had a spill on her Wave 125, we put it into the repair shop, 2 new fairings, new headlight cover, new handle bars and crown bearing assy and brake lever. The footpegs were straightened out, 1400 Baht inluding labour, so they are cheap to repair too. I rode it back the 14Kms home from the shop and really enjoyed it, I usually ride a Phantom. It is a nippy little bike that is quite happy poodling along at slow speeds and the 125 has the power in reserve. Enjoy your biking and I hope this thread gives you the gen to make an informed choice.

How do you get used to the gearchange? Its opposite the gearchange on your Phantom and every other manual bike I v had. I v had to Waves, but really think the Yamaha Nouvo Elegance 135cc is so much better in all aspects. Even the repaircosts for automatic is cheaper than chain and sprockets for Wave.

Well with the missus renting nuovos one of the big costs is CVT gearbox refurbs.. 4.5 if your lucky up to about 7 or 8 your not..

Whats a quality chain and sprokets cost on a wave ?? 1500 ?? 2k ??

[Richard-BKK]

Anyway if the OP, wants a CVT/full-automatic scooter/motorbike which is the most capable in the hills, I would say forget Yamaha and look at the latest Suzuki Skydrive 125.

It has fuel-injection, so it keeps the fuel consumption to a minimum (for a automatic) and it is currently the most powerful scooter in Thailand. It is clear that Suzuki has a winner with this Skydrive 125 with a fuel-injection system that has a direct relation with MotoGP racing. Other then the Honda PGM-FI, Suzuki uses a different concept, it uses a technology which overcomes the lean condition when you close the throttle.

[LivinLOS]

Agree the suzi has quite some pull (tho more than an 135 elegance ??) but would be quite leary of having it taken care of on Lanta.. FI and complexity on an island thats not got a dealership would all spell trouble.

[katabeachbum]

Agree the suzi has quite some pull (tho more than an 135 elegance ??) but would be quite leary of having it taken care of on Lanta.. FI and complexity on an island thats not got a dealership would all spell trouble.

Suzuki had quite some pull even before FI. Iv got one.

Fuel incection spells trouble even at authorized dealers, because not all of them have computers. And perhaps dont know how to use computers. Fuel injection is also much more sensitive to ethanol, wich is the 10-20% ingridient in gasohol. Gasohol may be the only available gas in Paradise soon.

Yamaha 135 Elegance has also a much larger cvt (actually 14 cm longer than previous Nouvo) than any suzuki, which should give better durabilty. And its liquidcooled. And there are unfortunately not many Suzuki dealer/servicepoints around.

[jackcorbett]

Had the 115 c.c. Nouvo air cooled model for three years with virtually no problems. I don't get where some of you guys think the automatics are high maintenance as a Honda dealership told me the Waves go through chains at least twice as often as an Air Blade goes through belts. In fact I don't have one friend who has an automatic who's had a belt change yet and as someone already mentioned here a belt costs less than 1000 baht.

Also, power wise remember this key figure. 115 c.c. Nouvo, 8.9 horsepower. 135 c.c. liquid cooled Elegance 11.2 horsepower. That's a 25 % increase in power.

Handling of the new Elegance is impeccable. If you like the quick steering of the Air Blade you are going to love the new Yamaha Elegance. The seat is 2 inches higher and 2 inches closer to the front wheel. This gives your butt more leverage at imparting body movement towards the steering of the bike. And the seat being closer cuts down the time it takes for your body to translate its movements to the bike. This new Nouvo Elegance turns much more quickly and precisely than the 115 c.c. Nouvo MX. And yet it has a longer wheel base and that gives you a better ride than more closely coupled bikes such as the Air Blade. As for Finos, Mios and Clicks they are nice little machines but they are not in the same league. They are undertired and they have just one shock. That might be fine in most situations but try putting a 250 pound guy behind you and you will be glad you have a Nouvo or an Air Blade.

I'm sure the Wave is an excellent bike but it has puny tires. Has only a 60 mm tire on the front. The Nouvo has a 70. That's about 15 % more rubber on the ground. Also....when one gets a Wave one typically puts a basket on it. And where does that basket go? Right over the front wheel. And sure you will get used to the handling but this is definitely not the way to go. Air Blades and nouvos have a relatively large compartment to put things right under the seat. That's right under your butt in the center of the bike so the weight distribution is not affected when you put weight in your main luggage compartment.

Sorry guys but chains are yesterday's technology. Sure I'd love a lot of bikes that have chain drives but these automatics represent state of the art. I did three years on a Nouvo MX and two months ago I bought the latest 135 c.c. Nouvo Elegance and this new Yamaha is quiet, smooth, and powerful for a 125 c.c. class scooter. Even the brakes are better and smoother than the 115 c.c. MX. One more thing.....the driving position on most of these automatics is excellent. The new Nouvo Elegance is right at the top. Today a friend of mine came over on his 125 C.C. Suzuki Hayate. The seat is visibly lower on it than on my new Elegance although it appears to be about 2 inches closer to the front tire than the seat is on the 115 c.c. Yamaha MX.

Edited May 6, 2009 by jackcorbett

[Richard-BKK]

The Suzuki Skydrive 125 is not a Suzuki Hayate.

The Suzuki Skydrive 125 is Suzuki's latest wonder two-wheeler, it has a fuel-injection system which is equipped with several sensors. Basically it doesn't matter what fuel you put in at the pump (as long it is no diesel).

I need to be honest, I never compared the Suzuki Skydrive 125 directly to a Yamaha Nouvo Elegance (135cc), but as the Yamaha Nouvo Elegance already has problems with a Honda Air Blade i (a 110cc fuel-injection model) it would be a sure thing that the Suzuki Skydrive would be impossible for a Yamaha Nouvo Elegance. A Suzuki Skydrive can put distance between itself and a Honda Air Blade i in just a few seconds. The Yamaha Nouvo Elegance is faster at the red light then the Honda Air Blade i but the Air Blade comes back fast to the Yamaha Nouvo Elegance.

"chains are yesterday's technology" you really should consider a act as stand-up comedian, I'm sure that most motorcycle factories will hire you for company parties and you can always do biker bars and Bike Weeks.... as you really funny...

[LivinLOS]

Had the 115 c.c. Nouvo air cooled model for three years with virtually no problems. I don't get where some of you guys think the automatics are high maintenance as a Honda dealership told me the Waves go through chains at least twice as often as an Air Blade goes through belts. In fact I don't have one friend who has an automatic who's had a belt change yet and as someone already mentioned here a belt costs less than 1000 baht.

Well as someone whose misses rents bikes to ham fisted tourists I am at the sharp end of seeing the maintenance that goes into autos.

I have an old clunker manual with 60k kms on the clock.. Runs stronger, harder, faster and cheaper than any of the autos. Pulls my 100 kg lump up over the hills with the GF on the back while the autos bog down and reduce to a crawl.

Also, power wise remember this key figure. 115 c.c. Nouvo, 8.9 horsepower. 135 c.c. liquid cooled Elegance 11.2 horsepower. That's a 25 % increase in power.

Before drivetrain loss, which is a good 20 - 25% on a small CVT..

I'm sure the Wave is an excellent bike but it has puny tires. Has only a 60 mm tire on the front. The Nouvo has a 70. That's about 15 % more rubber on the ground. Also....when one gets a Wave one typically puts a basket on it. And where does that basket go? Right over the front wheel. And sure you will get used to the handling but this is definitely not the way to go. Air Blades and nouvos have a relatively large compartment to put things right under the seat. That's right under your butt in the center of the bike so the weight distribution is not affected when you put weight in your main luggage compartment.

As does the wave.. AND a basket if fitted..

Sorry guys but chains are yesterday's technology. Sure I'd love a lot of bikes that have chain drives but these automatics represent state of the art. I did three years on a Nouvo MX and two months ago I bought the latest 135 c.c. Nouvo Elegance and this new Yamaha is quiet, smooth, and powerful for a 125 c.c. class scooter. Even the brakes are better and smoother than the 115 c.c. MX. One more thing.....the driving position on most of these automatics is excellent. The new Nouvo Elegance is right at the top. Today a friend of mine came over on his 125 C.C. Suzuki Hayate. The seat is visibly lower on it than on my new Elegance although it appears to be about 2 inches closer to the front tire than the seat is on the 115 c.c. Yamaha MX.

The one that no one looks at also suzuki models.. But Thais buy what they know, not the best tech.. Hence the Kwaker ZX130 hardly sells any units despite being one of the strongest / biggest manuals with plenty of storage etc.

[katabeachbum]

I have an old clunker manual with 60k kms on the clock.. Runs stronger, harder, faster and cheaper than any of the autos. Pulls my 100 kg lump up over the hills with the GF on the back while the autos bog down and reduce to a crawl.

I have a 5 year old 125 Wave with only 30k on it. Changed chains and sprockets of cours. At the same cost as changing belt on the Yamaha auto at 45.000 km, 990 baht at the dealer. The Wave has no chance to hang on the Yamaha Elegance 135cc up the hills, with same load. Wave runs cheaper though, you can save 2 baht pr 10 km. Thats 2.000 baht a year if you cover 10.000 km.