Thailand Postal Theft

[udon]

Sorry, I should have qualified that I'm sending from SYD to Phuket and there will be a stupid fee, knowing Westpac.

Thanks J.D.

[Jai Dee]

Sorry, I should have qualified that I'm sending from SYD to Phuket and there will be a stupid fee, knowing Westpac.

Thanks J.D.

EMS might be your best option udon.

Good luck!

[Malenonsense]

I would much rather have had Bush invade the post office than Iraq. All I hear about postmen is bad. I'd bet that the psotmen in the west are worse than here. Postmen go postal and kill their fellow employees probably because they are arguing over who's stealing which package. When postmen die they usually find 10 bags of letters they were to lazy to deliver in their attics. They really need to catch the crooks in this department as tampering with the mail is a Federal offense or at least it is in the US. I don't trust these people. Too many of us have lost mail and packages. If they put all the corrupt postmen in jail think of all the people that would get jobs.

[Jai Dee]

I would much rather have had Bush invade the post office than Iraq. All I hear about postmen is bad. I'd bet that the psotmen in the west are worse than here. Postmen go postal and kill their fellow employees probably because they are arguing over who's stealing which package. When postmen die they usually find 10 bags of letters they were to lazy to deliver in their attics. They really need to catch the crooks in this department as tampering with the mail is a Federal offense or at least it is in the US. I don't trust these people. Too many of us have lost mail and packages. If they put all the corrupt postmen in jail think of all the people that would get jobs.

Ching ching?

[Ajarn]

First thing to remember is that incoming parcels are x-rayed for drugs and other types of contraband

Who told you that? Never heard of that in Thailand

[pautai]

First thing to remember is that incoming parcels are x-rayed for drugs and other types of contraband

Who told you that? Never heard of that in Thailand

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Its been reported in the Bangkok Post on numerous occasions ,when they did investigations on mail theft etc

[stats]

not only bangkok have this sort of problem...everywhere in this world have a post mail thef.....ive been around the globe so there much more worst then this

[astral]

Nothing new in this, unfortunately.

I suggest you escalate the problem to:

Head of Postal Services

General Post Office

New Road

Bangkok

That will ensure the matter does really get investigated.

[RDN]

I've found that small letters or packages are the ones that sometimes don't get through, the big (A4 or Foolscap) letters with company logos on them do. Now, I wonder why that is?

[udon]

How do you guys rate EMS from outside Thailand?

Thanks.

[Jai Dee]

How do you guys rate EMS from outside Thailand?

Thanks.

If you mean send from outside Thailand in...

then I can give you an example.

2 days ago (9 Feb) I received a package from EMS sent from my brother in Geeling, Victoria OZ. It was postmarked 27 Jan. 13 calendar days in transit.

[DJ Pat]

Whenever I post ANYTHING to anywhere from Thailand, I never expect it to reach its destination. From experience.

[joinme2leave]

talkin' about my "important" mail (valuable goods, credit cards, documents or such alike)...i have worked out a deal with my embassy and received all that letters so far without any problem or extra (embassy) charges. As about my incoming EMS/not insured airmail...there have been already 2 missing items (1 letter, 1 parcel) within 3 months...

[remmy]

I inserted 50 $ bill in the letter and sent to a friend , the letter reached and no sign of tampering but the $$ was lost. Now I use bank draft and sent by registered mail? Is it possible to steal bank draft and encash by person not named in the draft? I do not trust postal people at all, all the percel i sent are stolen and all my incoming parcel which are not EMS are always stolen. Last time I lost was a package of cosmetic from australia, all I wish is anyone who use that make up to have a very severe acne everytime they use it! hopefully that postal worker's wife!

[skynag]

My friend sent me a normal letter from New Zealand and it took 2 months and a half to get to Bangkok. Another friend sent me a parcel from France and it took 2 full months. Registered air mail at Thai Post Office is useless there is nothing to track your mail with a normal registered letter, no tracking no. Now I always spend a bit more and use EMS service so I can be able to trace the letters and packages myself!! It's Thailand....

[pautai]

I inserted 50 $ bill  in the letter and sent to a friend , the letter reached and no sign of tampering but the $$ was lost. Now I use bank draft and sent by registered mail? Is it possible to steal bank draft and encash by person not named in the draft? I do not trust postal people at all, all the percel i sent are stolen and all my incoming parcel which are not EMS are always stolen. Last time I lost was a package of cosmetic from australia, all I wish is anyone who use that make up to have a very severe acne everytime they use it! hopefully that postal worker's wife!

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

some thai banks wont cash drafts ! tried kasikorn and they dont cashem

dont ask me why its crazy .

[pautai]

from the archives >>>>

Compensation for stolen mail

It was recently reported that mail was tampered with and money stolen

from registered delivery envelopes. I have a tale to tell in this

regard.

I was sent a registered letter containing US$350 (13,748 baht) in

January. The letter arrived at the Patong Post Office, but I received

no notice that it had arrived.

I actually went and checked the registered mail log book once, just

days before it arrived. But because I received no notification of its

arrival, it was eventually returned to the USA marked "uncollected".

Needless to say, the cash was missing.

This is not the first time my mail has gone missing, but it is the

first registered letter and the most valuable.

As it is now known that an officer was caught on video stealing mail

during this period, were the people whose mail was tampered with

notified so that they could start legal proceedings or make some form

of claim?

Thursday, March 4, 2004 Sefton Hanley, Patong.

"Unlike in some other countries, the postal system in Thailand is not

required to take responsibility for items that goes missing from

letters or parcels – even registered ones. However, if you can supply

solid evidence that the theft occurred at the Patong Post office, you

will be reimbursed.

As for notifying all the victims of the mail thief, this is difficult

because it is impossible to know how many letters he tampered with

before getting caught.

Mail sent to Patong from abroad first arrives at the Central Post

Office in Bangkok. It then goes via Chumphon and the main post office

in Phuket City before arriving in Patong.

With so many steps, it's almost impossible to determine exactly where

a theft may have occurred or who was responsible – even with the new

video surveillance system. The theft may have occurred in your own

country.

If you want to pursue this case, please bring the letter in question

to our office on Prabaramee Rd and we will investigate.

Once again, we must ask everyone to refrain from sending cash or other

negotiables through the post. "

Thursday, March 4, 2004 Wirat Bunpetchkaew, Chief, Patong Post

Office.

**************************

Dec 19 1997, 12:00 am show options

From: "Lee Prince" <[email protected]> - Find messages by this author

Date: 1997/12/19

Subject: Mail Theft In Koh Samui!

Hello all,

My Thai-born wife from Ubon Ratchathani wishes to inform the world, but

especially the authorities in Koh Samui, about mail theft which regularly

occurs from the Chaweng Beach station.

She had occasion to send four packages from the United States to other

places in Thailand and one to Germany by air mail for the Christmas season.

Three of the packages, which contained inexpensive but nice clothes and

costume jewelry reached their target within 10 days. The one sent to her

sister in Koh Samui did not ever reach her sister.

She is certain that mail theft has occured. When she lived in Koh Samui

there were 2 occasions when she was told mail containing similar "small

values" (not enough to justify certifying the mail, but enough to take),

had been sent to her and had not arrived. This has happened to many people

on Chaweng Beach who are typically poor and cannot afford to press charges.

But many know this happens all the time.

She was also aware that on at least one occasion a postal employee on

Chaweng Beach had been arrested for stealing parcels sent from "farangs" to

Thai people living on Samui.

We are writing this letter to inform anyone living on Chaweng Beach that

this occurs. They probably know this already.

But it is also a plea for the postal and police authorities to investigate

the fairly small Bo Phut Chaweng Beach postal station. She is certain

she will still find corruption and theft among the few employees there.

Anyone having knowledge of this should please email me at

[email protected] or

[email protected]

**************************

Mail Theft In Thailand.

From AsiaWeek, Week of January 5, 1996

Thieves steal at least 27% of all postal parcels arriving in Thailand through

Bangkok's Don Muang Airport, according to the government, which also admits

the percentage grows larger if you include registered and insured letters. A

mail theft syndicate appears to be operating at the airport, which is outside

the jurisdiction of the postal police.

**********************************

Apr 16 2001, 2:20 am

From: [email protected] (Vagabond) -

Date: Mon, 16 Apr 2001 09:18:42 GMT

Local: Mon, Apr 16 2001 2:18 am

Subject: Trouble at the post office (from The Bangkok Post)

You had mail

Story By Onsiri Pravattiyagul

The Bangkok Post 16. April 2001

Where has all the mail gone? Some of it is lost, some stolen and most

remain a mystery.

That cheque still in the post? Waiting for something that never

arrives? As complaints about Thailand's postal service arrive thick

and fast, what options do the public have for a better, safer way to

get their mail?

The Thai postal system is slow and parcels often go astray. This can

lead to all sorts of trouble, from a favourite magazine taking far too

long to arrive, to problems with creditors who fail to receive

payments you sent weeks before.

Lost and delayed mail might have been grudgingly accepted in the past,

but in today's world of instant electronic communication, having to

rely on the postal service-so-called "snail mail"-can be most

frustrating.

Kanitha Kungsawanich should know-her June issue of National Geographic

arrived in September. To make matters worse, only three more issues

arrived at her door-all delivered in December-before they stopped

coming altogether.

"I am angry and frustrated. I paid good money for the magazine

subscription and I want to read the magazines. I emailed National

Geographic and they said they had already sent them," Kanitha said.

"So where are they?"

Then there's the case of Arthur Dawkins, a long-time resident of

Thailand. His friends and family feared he was dead since they did not

receive any word from him since he left England for Thailand five

years ago.

Dawkins was amazed. "At Christmas, two friends arrived unexpectedly.

They said, 'What a relief! We and a lot of people in England thought

you were dead! Not heard from you in ages!"'

In a letter of complaint to Outlook Consumer, Dawkins said he, too,

was surprised: He had sent mail to his family and friends but none of

it had been received.

"What a disgrace for the Thai postal service. Who is the big boss of

this lot? He should be ashamed. He and the rest of his cronies are not

doing their jobs," he said.

Dawkins believes his mail was stolen.

In another letter of complaint received by Outlook Consumer, David

Richardson, a 10-year Pattaya resident, concurred. He is certain that

some postal workers are thieves.

"Ten weeks ago, the two magazines I subscribe to-Aviation Week & Space

Technology and Airways-ceased being delivered," Richardson said. "It

has come to my attention that somebody in the postal system is selling

my magazines."

When such incidents arise and investigations follow, all fingers point

to the Communications Authority of Thailand (CAT) which oversees the

Thailand Post.

Woodtipong Moleechad, CAT vice-president for Postal System and

Development, admitted quite frankly to Outlook Consumer there was an

ongoing problem.

Last year alone, the CAT received 13,776 complaints on lost or delayed

domestic mail items; similar complaints on international mail packages

stood at 14,730. These included all types of mail from regular,

insured, certified and registered, to parcels and EMS.

The CAT handled approximately 1.5 billion pieces of mail last year.

The CAT reported there were 2,215 lost or delayed pieces, costing the

CAT about two million baht in compensation. (See graphic.)

The CAT staff and their procedures are themselves root causes for the

disappearance of mail, Woodtipong said.

Such theft usually occurs in the sorting rooms, he said.

"Our staff do steal. We normally have to sack about six to seven staff

members every month. We consider theft a serious offence, but you have

to understand that the 10,000-something staff can't all be as decent

as good monks."

He blames greed and extravagant living as major factors in staff

dishonesty.

"They often spend more than they earn. They don't grasp the concept of

'sufficient living', so they steal."

For security measures, the CAT has installed closed-circuit cameras to

prevent mail theft in the sorting rooms-to no avail.

"They [mail thieves] are well aware of where the cameras are, so they

know how to avoid them," Woodtipong said with a sigh.

"We also have supervisors who monitor the performance of the staff."

To assume that they work as a team to steal mail is an unproven

allegation, he adds, although many believe that such teamwork is quite

common at the Thailand Post.

Asked if there was any truth in reports of mafia involvement, with

members working internally to steal magazines, especially those that

are imported, or cutting out rare stamps and selling them, Woodtipong

simply nodded.

"Yes, there are organised gangs. We boot them out in bulk when we

catch them. Some cooperate with overseas criminals to steal credit

cards from envelopes. Our staff are naive. They sell the cards for

5,000 baht each while the foreign crooks fraudulently ring up five

million baht on them. It's our staff that suffers the consequences,"

Woodtipong said.

"There was also an incident with one of our mail carriers who got

drunk and failed to deliver all the mail under his responsibility on a

certain day. The next day, he felt overloaded with all the extra mail,

thinking he would be unable to distribute it all, so he sought an easy

way out-he burned all the letters."

He was fired.

It is crystal clear that more efficient and stringent recruitment is

crucial in bettering the overall service. But Woodtipong still doesn't

predict substantial improvement in mail handling even should the CAT

offer higher pay or extensive training, because greed persists.

To cope with these problems, the CAT has introduced the elaborate

technology of optical character recognition (OCR) which reads area

codes and separates mail accordingly. However, the technology is not

fool-proof as it requires standardised envelopes with addresses

printed clearly.

"Only 50 percent of mail can be processed with the OCR, the rest is

done manually."

"A sorting error will cause a delay. Delivery errors are also

responsible for missing mail since unintended recipients rarely inform

us that we've sent mail to the wrong address," Woodtipong explained.

He added that it was human nature to "snoop" in other people's mail,

even to tamper with it.

"Can you believe that people who live in a 20-million baht condominium

steal their neighbour's mail? ... Sometimes they do."

Against this corruption and mismanagement, and bizarre human

behaviour, stand various monitoring procedures.

A "monitor check", for example, is carried out a couple of days each

week to inspect post office work flow. Two persons are appointed to

pick apart every process, said Chanya Wacharapibul, CAT's senior

director for the Postal Quality Control Department.

Another procedure is the quality check, which determines how many

sorting errors have been made by double-checking every mail bag.

Post offices, both local and district, carry out these quality checks

on a routine basis, Chanya said.

There are similar problems on the international front, and the airport

is precisely where international mail problems either take off or

land.

Woodtipong says the "country of origin"-in this case, Thailand-isn't

always solely to blame.

"The customs departments of other countries are just as fussy as ever.

In one country in particular, mail from Thailand is singled out and

'neatly' piled up in a corner where it waits for a sniffer dog to

check it. By doing that, they are putting such mail at risk. Legally

speaking, our mail handling responsibility stops at Don Muang airport.

Once the mail hits the plane, it's out of our control."

Woodtipong and Chanya agree that the CAT is not solely to blame.

"We have traced some of the problems back to customers. Sometimes they

put the wrong address on the package or pack their stuff in

badly-sealed, breakable packages. We have issued a rule not to enclose

items such as bank notes or pornography, but customers do it anyway,"

said Woodtipong.

"For example, illegal Thai workers in foreign countries always sneak

money in their letters back home. Because of their illegal status,

they can't send money through the proper channels. Thus, their risk of

losing that money is high."

He insists that not all lost mail is actually stolen. Some gets lost

simply because the postman cannot determine the right destination. A

fundamental factor contributing to this problem is the increased

complexity of various communities across the country.

"The house-numbering system in Thailand is a big mess. New roads

appear here and there in an unorganised manner. Communities everywhere

keep on changing geographically and the mail senders have no clue as

to these changes," Woodtipong said.

To help postmen navigate the labyrinth that is Bangkok, Woodtipong

said the CAT has tried to work with other government agencies to allow

postmen to keep themselves updated on physical changes in the

metropolis.

As Bangkok expands, mail carriers find it even harder to deliver mail

to the recipient's door because of security measures.

"Our postmen often have to leave mail under the care of building

superintendents. Sometimes, these superintendents fail to pass the

mail on to the building's residents and thus, the real receivers never

see their mail," Chanya said.

Is there any hope for anxious consumers?

"EMS always helps since they have a tracking system and sorting is

done in a special room. Also, try not to sent valuable or illegal

items through the mail," Woodtipong said.

"Put the correct address and area code on all correspondence. Always

wrap your mail up nice and tight," Chanya added.

And if that's not enough?

"Then I think we will have to boot all the staff and put robots to

work!" Woodtipong said.

- The CAT has provided channels for public complaints about lost mail.

Investigations will follow. In the case of Arthur Dawkins, the CAT

confirmed, after an investigation, that there was no undelivered mail

in the post office at Nakhon Ratchasima where Mr Dawkins lives. As for

David Richardson's case, the CAT said his mail is regularly delivered

to his ...

[pautai]

from the archives>>>>>>>>>>>>

Nov 29 1998, 12:00 am

From: Anonymous <[email protected]> -

Date: 1998/11/29

Subject: Re: Lost Postcards bla bla bla

from an old Bangkok postbag article circa 1996

80 PERCENT OF MAIL PROBABLY STOLEN

Sir: According to your front page story of Dec24 1995, there is a 27%

loss of all registered mail entering Thailand.

This must surely be a world record. What i wonder are the statistics

for ordinary mail?

I estimate that i have not received 80 % of mail sent to me from

South America, England, South Korea, and Australia. As a keen

correspondant i find this most disturbing. I had no such problem

when i wokrd in Papua New Guinea, the UK and South Korea.

The director of my school , a Thai national ,has received only one of

four parcels posted from his sister in the US.

One of our Thai teachers recently returned from the UK to find that

none of his letters reached his family here.

Many Vietnamese refugees held in the the camp at Lam Takhong Dam

Sikhiu, have never received cheques and parcels posted to them from

overseas..

When i had my Pentax SLR camera stolen by baggage handlers, i was

told by an airline representative that Don Muang is one of the 3 most

notorious for theft of goods in transit.

There is obviously a conspiracy among airport workers at Don Muang

These people have no respect for the rights and property of others.

<snip> more of the same.............

David Morris

Nakhon Ratchasima

unfortunately the BKK POst archives dont go back this far

Online version.

(i have been told that mail theft takes place at night from postboxes,

and the kamoys steam off the stamps for resale.)

International mail has bigger value stamps so these areas are

targeted most)

Where possible use the main post office for safety.

Post in the daytime early ,and dont leave overnight in the box.

[chaladmak]

well, I never had theft case - but a few of delivery delayed and returned parcels

[sajal]

just last saturday our office in medan, indonesia sent some documents to us by EMS via th post office, we have been chasing up with the post office ever since.....just today we get the info that the documents have arrived to the big post office in hat yai which it immedietly dispatched to the smaller branch(abt 10 km from hat yai town).

now this smaller branch is closed all day today(tuesday).

they have 2 staff.

caling one on his mobile we find that he is out on holiday to another place and he suggests we wait for 3 to 4 days before the post office gets enough mails for delivery to that particular area???

&lt;deleted&gt;!!!!

what century is this????

i guess it leaves me no option other than to rent a post box in the hat yai town and check it daily....that would be 3 to 4 days faster than having the post man deliver the mails to us.

PS: does anyone know the personal email addresses of some of the big shots at thailand post? they need to get a piece of my mind.

[RDN]

I used to get my telephone bill on the 5th and my UBC bill on the 10th. This month they both came together on the 15th. I'm sure the postman/post office just saves them up until there's enough letters waiting for delivery to deem worthy of using his precious time to deliver them.

[sajal]

I used to get my telephone bill on the 5th and my UBC bill on the 10th. This month they both came  together on the 15th. I'm sure the postman/post office just saves them up until there's  enough letters waiting for delivery to deem worthy of using his precious time to deliver them.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

it turns out that our local post office is a franchise....

im not gonna let those a$$holes delay my mail nemore...first thing thursday morning, im gettin myself a post box in the big branch and have someone check them daily. this particular delay would cost me 3 days damaruge at the port....

[petedk]

A couple of years ago I used to receive a bank statement every month from my bank in Denmark.

One month it didn't come but I thought nothing of it. Next month it didn't come either. After this happened about 6 or 7 times I decided to I decided to call my bank and find out what had happened.

It seems that "someone" had changed the address and the mail was being being sent somewhere else in Thailand. I don't know how that happened as usually they are quite strict about change of address and follow a central register.

Anyway it was only my statements that were sent by regular post. Credit cards, pin codes were all sent with DHL.

[sajal]

its happened a couple of times that my Dtac bill arrived after the due date mentioned in the bill and my phoneline had been suspended due to non payment...then i gotta rush to the post office to recover the bill....it seems they didnt deliver the mail caus there wasnt enough mails collected for that particular area....&lt;deleted&gt;??? 7 days???

i guess the mailbox option is the only option i have...

PS: in my previous post i mentioned gettin a postbox, what i ment was a mailbox...

Edited February 23, 2005 by devil_dog

[johna]

I have had approximatly 10 registered envelopes stolen in the 1980s. All were

mailed from England and when inquiries were made at the UK post office

an official informed me that such things were common in Thailand. Why the UK post

office did not warn people of this before mailing is strange but I never use the Thai post office for anything valuable and if the envelope contains anything extra always clearly mark the envelope "photos" etc

[sajal]

reffer to my post number 50 above.

i got my package yesterday... stuck at smal;l post office for like 4 days!!!!@#!

on 22nd i had sent complaints to thailand post on the following email addresses:-

[email protected]

[email protected]

[email protected]

[email protected]

i was amazed to receive a call from thailandpost... that too from bangkok....good for her as i had already received the documents by yesterday and was calmed down by today....

i find it really ridiculous due to the laziness of one particular postman, i have to open a mailbox at the big post office.....now i have become the postman...