A Serious Topic

[chonabot]

This makes me laugh. You must be lying to yourself here. EVEN your own people in the UK will give you a dirty look or a sneer when you are walking with your wife - unless you try to ignore it at your best. Why???

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

After 8 years of marriage , in the UK, I have yet to see a sneer , and believe me, I look peple in the eye.

Of course the fact I look a hard bastad may help , but that's what my experience has told me.

You suppose a lot , yet offer little.

You remain , a Troll. ( With hygiene problems , no doubt )

[chonabot]

Do you think your relatives sleeping with 10 men before settling down is acceptable?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I f my relative was a man I would find this interesting , unacceptable ? Nah

[somtam mai-ped]

After 8 years of marriage , in the UK, I have yet to see a sneer , and believe me, I look peple in the eye.

Of course the fact I look a hard bastad may help , but that's what my experience has told me.

You suppose a lot , yet offer little.

You remain , a Troll. ( With hygiene problems , no doubt )

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

So you have to resort to name calling???? Typical working class

It shows that you cannot argue the points properly.

Your wife must be an ex bargirl that is why you are so angry.

Pathetic!!!!!!

[Doctor John]

Your wife must be an ex bargirl that is why you are so angry.

Pathetic!!!!!!

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

A definate Troll, I agree with Chonabot.

Edited February 13, 2005 by Doctor John

[MistaDorn]

Dorn,

many Thai women  - both who do "work" in that business catering for farangs and even those who doesn't, complain that Thai men aint' good. that's why many of them decide that they don't want to have Thai man as b/f or husband. that's why many young and beautifull gals can be seen on the streets of Thailand with old farangs, who looks like "dried up lizards" as one my friend said, or as one taxi driver commented to me: "puying dek dek - farang khek khek" (or khet?)  - "girl loosk like almost a child - and her companion as very old". BECAUSE this young girls prefer to sacrifice their youth to be with such old men than with young irresponsible Thai boys, who are "butterflies" (yes - not only farangs!) and have few other g/fs anyway. and in many cases, what is funny and ridiculous - if not sad - that many thai b/fs or husbands  are BEING MAINTAINED by their g/fs  or wives ! and my wife told me that some thai men even tell their wives of g/fs to do this business..... young thai girls surely would prefer to have nice and romantic relations with young Thai and handsome boy instead of old farter, BUT - they choose that old farang instead because they hope that at least he will take good care of them, especially financially.

for example, many Isaan gals come to Bkk to work as bar gals. why? they say that their man are drunkards, not responsible and don't care of them. my Italian friend who married Isaan gal told me that he was amazed  - after 5pm in Isaan one can't find ANY SINGLE man who isn't drunk. and when I asked some taxi driver, from Isaan, is it true - he agreed with that laughing.

so, it is not only fault of farangs who come for sex here. Thai men should take better care of their women if they don't like and don't like them be taken away by "dry lizards".

and I don't agree that all women doing this sex "work"  are all uneducated. in fact many of them have University degree, some even Master. and many quit their jobs, or do have jobs at the same time - and go to Nana (or plenty other places) at night. because they say they get salary not enough.

so, here is another reason: if all these women were helped with / given better education and jobs, surely they won't choose to go "spread legs" for some drunk and old farangs.....

I agree with you though that many farangs should change their behaviour and try to understand Thai culture. yes, sure prostitution or sex trade is one of the most ancient one in human society, not only in Thailand. but those farangs who generalise and think that all thai ppl think favorably towards it or that all thai women are prostitutes  eagerly waiting to "spread their legs"  - are definetely wrong.

thank you for raising this topic. but be carefull about all those who would sooner lable you as troll or whatever esle rather than trying to understand your concern and worry. you seems to be educated enough and intelligent man - don't waste your precious time on such useless comments.

and don't be intimidated by all those who would shout you donw because of your English. I bet 1000% that most of them won't fair even that much if you had this conversation with them in Thai ! so, don't be shy or afraid - speak out your mind. at least for me it is interesting to see the developement of your thread here and I appreatiate your endeavours for positive understanding of all these issues.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I am diffinitly want to tell to all farang about this too. this is the very best comments I've read. thank you for you. as you said above old farang "farang kae kae" phuying dek-dek" Farang kae kae got money to pay the phuying dek-dek" I have told before that some thai woman are don't care what farang will do. but phuying dek-dek need money to support life. so she have to do everything to have income to themselves to helps her mother, her brother, her food, her school, and many other reasonalble thing. I have one thai friend who worked in Citybank. she have a good job, but she's got a kids. and she dressing prostitude everynight near nana road. she said the money is not enough for her family. her husband left her. She do not likes to do this. but she have to do. Some farang being fooled that think the woman really likes him, but deeply thai woman love his money. so "woman who have no money combine farang who have a money" this one, please think. what real FARANG think about the woman that you treat? do farang think "I've got money, I'll pay you, come to papa and have a beautiful feeling with me"? or "you found thai woman and you fall in love to her but the gird did not love you, just wants your money. what will you do if you experience on this. if the thai woman left you after she gets your money? what happened to your feeling? will you let this pass away?

dear aaaaa and a

I love to read this a lot:

so, here is another reason: if all these women were helped with / given better education and jobs, surely they won't choose to go "spread legs" for some drunk and old farangs.....

I agree with you though that many farangs should change their behaviour and try to understand Thai culture. yes, sure prostitution or sex trade is one of the most ancient one in human society, not only in Thailand. but those farangs who generalise and think that all thai ppl think favorably towards it or that all thai women are prostitutes eagerly waiting to "spread their legs" - are definetely wrong.

I wants farang to watch thai old tradition movie. Thai Women cannot be touch by a men trully. you can ask your wife if this true or not? she will answer that this is true. Thai woman also should not speak out loud. but in this generation in Bangkok some thai woman are so inpolite and they are looks westerner which used to be not. I believe Farang already meet this type of thai woman. a little like westener "drinking, spliting, shouting...etc" but that also happened in Farang country. but When farang saw Thai woman are treating them good and show up that she's so nice heart then you fall into a trap. they will suck up your money. ACCEPT IF FARANG AND THAI WOMAN falling inlove to each other. there is many thing that happened between farang and thai woman. for example:

1. farang fooled thai woman for money and sex

2. thai woman fooled farang for money "when farang fall in love to thai girl"

3. thai woman supporting farang "give money to farang when they don't have"

4. farang and thai woman having sex and need no paying "just for fun"

5. Farang and Thai woman fall into each other

6. Farang wants to have sex with Thai woman to recording the video and show up to other farang friends in their country and or for sale or shared on the internet" which agreed from thai woman with high payment to the girl.

7. Thai woman likes farang bodies and look. wants to have sex with.

and many other thing.

Yours,

Dorn

[kat]

As a researcher, I much rather discover the facts. And the more facts you uncover, the more perspective you gain, in my experience.

But do you ever wonder if you are really discovering the facts or is just what you think are the facts? Do you ask yourself if you have tried hard enough to understand the facts?

As to my double-standards, just read my posts. I don't let Westerners or Western countries off the hook. But when we are discussing sexual abuse and human trafficking, there is absolutely no double-standard in my comments. I look at present conditions as they are, not as how I think they should be.

Would you agree if I say you were not answering my question?

As to what I am doing here, I don't need to answer to you simply because you don't like my statements.

Why can't you just simply say 'I don't want to tell you' for such a simple question?

But I can assure you, that my stay here has not been to frequent girly bars, full moon parties, or to find a Thai wife.

Are you implying that my stay in Thailand has been to frequent girly bars, full moon parties, or to find a Thai wife? I have done none of the above.

I have researched every statement that I make concerning human trafficking and child sexual abuse. If you don't like it, then why don't you channel your anger into changing it, rather than shouting down the messenger? I will gladly supply you or anyone else with a list of books, sources, and research material, as I have offered numerous times on this forum. But don't berate me because I've already been there and done it and have something to say about it. The humans and children that are victimized by trafficking are largely girls, so don't turn this into a love/hate Thailand thing.

I agree that my post showed disapproval with your opinion. But what makes you think there is anger in me? I got this feeling that whenever someone's opinion differs from yours, you think it is personal. I sincerely asked you a few questions hoping to make things more clearly but.... Not sure if it was done on purpose or you really did not know what I was asking, you hardly answered any of them. You can't even say if you like or hate Thailand!

Surely you don't need to answer my post.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Meemia: I am too tired to answer all of these questions sufficiently at the moment, but I will try. I thought they were

*(initially) mostly rhetorical questions anyway, and wasn't sure if you genuinely wanted an answer. I mean, why is it important for you to know whether or not I like Thailand?

1. Facts: I don't decide what they are or make them up. I look at a lot of different research and material from a variety of sources over time. I never stop trying to understand. It is a full-time preoccupation. If you want to enlighten me further on the topic, please feel free to do so.

2. No, I don't think I have a double-standard. Believe it or not, when I first arrived in Thailand I pretty much thought like most other Westerners who know nothing about Thailand or the sex industry (i.e. - it is all the fault of the evil sex tourists). I think the biggest double-standards are those that blame the West for all of Thailand's social problems. But more importantly, these double-standards have absolutely NOTHING to do with reality or the actual desire to change anything.

3. It's not that I don't want to tell you; I don't need to tell you. This is sort of a non-point of yours, don't you think?

4. No, my comment about girly bars, etc. was entirely general and directed at no one in particular.

5. Sorry if I give you the feeling that you can't disagree with me. But you will have to come up with more than personal opinion. I'll be happy to share information and sources with you.

Sorry to others if we have taken over the thread. You can PM me memiathai if you want to continue.

*edited

Edited February 13, 2005 by kat

[Doctor John]

I believe Farang already meet this type of thai woman. a little like westener "drinking, spliting, shouting...etc"

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Dorn,

It reminds them of the women from their own countries.

[Golf]

And she understands you?  I am also trying to explain some Thai-thinking to my wife.  It seems liikw we're on the same boat!  Some Thai thoughts are hard to explain though 'cause they don't exist in Western world.  For me, I think western thoughts are based on logic, not emotion.  Most Thai thoughts are based on cultures, tradition, and Thai values.

Ex of Thai thoughts:

1. being late is nothing wrong about it.

2. You can do good things, but don't be outstanding, because you will be in troble.

Western ones:

1. being late is rude and disrespect others' plan.

2. person who is doing good things shall be rewarded and being recognized.

HEHEHE.  Next?  

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

She tries to understand and I try to understand. At least we 'both' realize that we think differently.

Can you help me with this one: I just got fired from a well paying job here in Greece. I have $100,000 and she knows that. She also has several thousand of her own money. I am not worried in the slightest... I have always earned good money in my life, I have many talents I can fall back on or use. I am even excited about the prospects of a new challenge when I find one. I am not in a hurry or panicing. But... my poor wife is worried sick. And she does not know 'why', or 'what' it is that she is worried about? Just worried and a little bit afraid.

I try to explain to her, that I must stay positive. Worry will not sove our problem. She understands my thinking... but she cannot think that way, I know she is trying to think positive and not worry, but she cannot.

How can I help her?

Can I help her?

Any suggestions greatly appreciated. I hurt to see her like this. I want my smiling lady back.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Hi, Golf is back. Your question is not related to cultural differences, I think. All married women want family securities. May I guess? I think she used to be poor (sorry to say that). She doesn't want to be poor again. This feeling is making her worries about her family. Her instinct is telling her that her family is at risk, and she will still be worried until you've got a new job.

You tried to explain that there is nothing to worry, but women are always worried. It's their nature. I think you need to prove that there is nothing to worry. How long you think you will take this "vacation"? The shorter, the better for her. Giving her some security or assuring her that you will find a better job soon is the best way to solve this issue.

I hope my opinions are helpful. Please ask if you need anything.

Good luck,

Golf

[meemiathai]

Don't you agree that knowing how others think is important in discussions?

Anyway have some good sleep, kat. Hopefully we could discuss it further if we have the chance.

I find discussing things openly more meaningful than doing it with PMs. Other people can add their opinions.

Goodnight.

[bina]

moderators, golf is answering ravisher in a thread of ravisher maybe soon in bangkok, not this thread which is already long and confusing

before people start getting irate over golf's post for whatever obscure reason they can find, best to move it .....na?

kat nice to hear from u, almost pm'd you thinking you were very ill, but dont know the 'politeness rules' for member sthat suddenly disappear;

mistadorn, i emailed u and said i would help with your posts in english if you want, can pm me....

sorry for the personal messages here but everyone seems to be reading this thread so 'a few birds in hand'.....

mistadorn did you have a specific incident happen to you to make you ask your original question? or or you just curious as to the different attitudes we all have;

[Boon Mee]

WELL WELL WELL!!!!!!

Get it right!!

Most Thai women are married to Farangs are not Thai men's taste anyway.

They have dark skin the darker the better for farang it seems.

They tend to be low educated, so farangs can control them as most farangs here in Thailand are loosers at ther own home unable to find their own women. WHY???

They don't like women who can challange them......so TRUE!!

The girls just want your money but Thai men know the trick - let stupid farangs pay for them.

Thai men are not jealous of farangs marrying Thai women at all.

I must thank you guys here who are kindly enough to stupidly marry them.

Hey, somtam, mai arroy - hate to break it to you but...you're out to lunch!

You ain't from Hua Hin are 'ya?

Mai Pen Zaparote!

[Golf]

Khun Golf,

I was wondering if you plan on returning to Thailand (if you are not there already)?. My partner who is in your position has alot to offer the continuing development of Thailand yet the decision to return is a hard one given how much she has changed and how little her family and society have changed with her.

Will.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Dear Will:

I am already in Thailand and I am afraid to say that I can't wait to go back to the States! It's true that your partner and I are able to contribute to Thai society, but we both have changed. Things she used to see and experience are not the same. In fact, she will never see them the same way. When I got back here on 2003, I found myself disturbed. Things aren't the same after I came back. I can see Thai cultures much clearer and better. I am not telling you that there is nothing good left. I am still proud to be Thai, but things that most of the Thai people here are doing is bothering me. The way I think about doing things are turned upside-down. I feel I am not belong here. I once talked to my best friend whom I know for more than 30 years. I said, "why most Thais are doing things this way?" He replied, "If you don't like it, just go back to the States." That were the words from my best friend. Thanks for your comment! I am going back with my wife and my baby for sure.

Your partner will probably feel like an outsider, lonely and confused. She may feel better if she stays longer, but there are lots of annoying feelings she has to go through. At least she got her family in Thailand. They can help her blends in easier.

Thanks,

Golf

[chonabot]

After 8 years of marriage , in the UK, I have yet to see a sneer , and believe me, I look peple in the eye.

Of course the fact I look a hard bastad may help , but that's what my experience has told me.

You suppose a lot , yet offer little.

You remain , a Troll. ( With hygiene problems , no doubt )

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

So you have to resort to name calling???? Typical working class

It shows that you cannot argue the points properly.

Your wife must be an ex bargirl that is why you are so angry.

Pathetic!!!!!!

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I'm proud to be working class , and at least I can use the quote box properly.

From which corner of the Earth did you spawn?

[somtam mai-ped]

WELL WELL WELL!!!!!!

Get it right!!

Most Thai women are married to Farangs are not Thai men's taste anyway.

They have dark skin the darker the better for farang it seems.

They tend to be low educated, so farangs can control them as most farangs here in Thailand are loosers at ther own home unable to find their own women. WHY???

They don't like women who can challange them......so TRUE!!

The girls just want your money but Thai men know the trick - let stupid farangs pay for them.

Thai men are not jealous of farangs marrying Thai women at all.

I must thank you guys here who are kindly enough to stupidly marry them.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Hey, somtam, mai arroy - hate to break it to you but...you're out to lunch!

You ain't from Hua Hin are 'ya?

I am not out to lunch but you cannot accept the fact.

You are another one marrying a bar girl aren't you?

If it is I feel sorry for you. It seems Farangs men can never be educated they like to think they know everything but they know nothing.

By the way I am not from Hua Hin. BORING PLACE!!!!!!!!!

[chonabot]

Somtam - mai mee kuay , your inane posts are cluttering up this thread , you have brought nothing to this discussion. You puport to know about everyone's wive's , everyone's business.

Tell me.

What is your story ?

[chonabot]

CHeck out this link to one of Somtam mai mee puan's posts.

It is evidence that he's euther a troll , a desperate idiot , or , most probably - both.

Enjoy!

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/index.php?ac...ndpost&p=222676

[somtam mai-ped]

LOL

Is it your kind of revenge? Chonabot

You must be so angry because I know your wife is an ex HOOGER

And I know where you live in the UK

[bina]

is a hooger like a booger????

what the h***? what happened to the thread??? before all this stupid baby stuff; what is this a kindergarten or football field..... ??? nu, really!! its a good thing some of these people dont sit down together for coffee it would turn into a blood bath.... typical men>>> (putting on the kevlar)

[Golf]

[Doctor John]

CHeck out this link to one of Somtam mai mee puan's posts.

It is evidence that he's euther a troll , a desperate idiot , or , most probably - both.

Enjoy!

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/index.php?ac...ndpost&p=222676

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

haha, Classic Post.

A troll for sure.

[somtam mai-ped]

[cdnvic]

 

somtam I hope you've had fun here because its time for you to say bye.

cv

[Boon Mee]

cdnvic - please put an end to this waste of time.

Thanks.

[cdnvic]

Ok, now that we've dealt with that, continue on if you want to discuss intelligently as most of you have been, but be advised this thread is on a very short leash.

Farungs can criticise Thailand, and Thais can do the same to the west. Trashing each other though, and cheap shots are not acceptable by either. Neither are defamatory comments about spouses who cannot defend themselves here.

cv

[Darknight]

Feel free to close this dragon of a thread , Cnvic

[mbkudu]

As a 'Farang' my Thai wife loves me and my money, however as the years get on

I seem to have less and less money so she has no choice but to love me more than my money.

[britmaveric]

11pages of rubbish!!! Put us out of our misery!!

[mbkudu]

Feel free to close this dragon of a thread , Cnvic

You little weaklings!

[cdnvic]

Feel free to close this dragon of a thread , Cnvic

I wanted to give it a chance without the troll... but ok

[dr_Pat_Pong]

11pages of rubbish!!!  Put us out of our misery!!

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

You picked it in one Brit