Why I'll Be Purchasing Linux Paid Support

[livinthailandos]

as many of you have maybe seen I've posted a few postings I've had all kinds of experience playing with linux. I am asking this question out of serious consideration for paying for full support. I do realize its about $250 USD. Please note I've gone through about 14 linux format magazines, Tim Oreilly Ubuntu book, Picked up quite a few ideas on how things work and some terminal commands which have also been very informative. How I've arrived at this point goes as follows

I've had to reinstall the Operating System all over again about 5 times or more already which I must admit im getting good at remindering all the gstreamer codecs, ubuntu-restricted-extras, medibuntu and all my applications I use

how did i get here

Labtop has a broken screen so i've hooked a desktop monitor to use as replacement for it

1. after using virtualbox and messing around with screen resolution sizes, I wind up making the screen so big that even when i tried to get it resize again it didn't work, after searching google for 3 days, a posting here and there no real basic idea how to fix, my solution reinstall the OS all over again and never mess with screen resolution sizes

2. You'll see on the toolbar, you get like a little icon for wireless or mini computer well I deleted the toolbar ok so its not a toolbar can't think of name sorry, anyways after getting most of my icons back on i could never figure out how to go and get my little wireless icon that allowed me to connect to my wireless network, again after postings and google for a few days no luck, solution reinstalled the OS all over again and learned never to delete my wireless icon again

3. on installing ubuntu netbook remix, i installed lxde, and i installed lxde network manager wireless and internet quite working i did try some of the recommendating listed by people on posting but didn't work, solution ( reinstall the OS all over again ) and never mess with lxde network manager

4. after using ubuntu i decided to put windows xp back on again of course this messed up the dual boot process MBR or something I can't remember, by the time I had everything going again on XP, when I went back to Ubuntu, it won't load ( I now know the reason why but I didn't at the time I didn't ) so what did I do basically wipe the entire hard drive empty or cleaned it, so no OS was on there, then put XP back on 1st then, installed Ubuntu again

I have some ideas and experiences and will continue to use linux even if it means reinstalling an OS a thousand times over, I simply find in my experience that the answers to my questions realistically are not either well done or must assume I know everything or realistically dont know how to help, I've barely been reading about X11 or xconf, I"ll keep reading, I know already about lspci, cd, mkdir, wget, sudo apt-get, and a few other commands, hopefully over time i'll know how to fix my problems until then it looks like paid support might be my best option though

any comments are welcome

Edited June 17, 2009 by livinthailandos

[Crushdepth]

I went through similar experiences a couple of years ago. I broke my system a number of times fooling around with it, couldn't fix it, got frustrated and went back to Windows, came back later for another try. I've found it useful to keep an image of the hard drive (Acronis from my dual boot). If I break anything badly, I can just restore the drive to its original unbroken state.

[RKASA]

Any time you re install windows you will have to repair the MBR if your dual booting.   Windows will over write it everytime with total disreguard for others as is the windows way of things..  Just drop in a live cd and redo MBR.  fixes it.  

In the beginning I did a few reinstall then started remastering. I don't use them anymore its just as a backup.  I now know that every reinstall I did in the past could have been fixed.

Unless the system is used as a business with the need to be online or something,  you would be money ahead to but a cheap PC to use and learn on and leave your main working system alone.

I am in front of two PC at a time each with six desktops.  I don't know how I ever got by with just the one before. 

[H2oDunc]

Windows Vista Ultimate 18 months trouble free from install to now All the free back up you require

[Plus]

Is this guy trolling? In a sense looking for a fight?

Why post the same, off-topic message in every linux thread?

[joncl]

Is this guy trolling? In a sense looking for a fight?

Why post the same, off-topic message in every linux thread?

the micro$oft messengers can not help themselves, so ignore it like I do.

RE the OP items;

#1. Use System:Preferences:Display app to sort it out

#2. The app is called - NetworkManager Applet 0.7.0.100 (under custom application launcher in the add to panels function)

#3. I just use the 904 release on my Asus notebook and it works out of the box

#4. already answered above by another poster.

Reading all this, you are well on the way to being a power user rather than an appliance operator, so good luck and save the $250 (smile)

[Plus]

I found out that screen resolution can be controlled in various places - the usual display tab in control center (or whatever it's called in your distro), in driver settings (not easily visible in Ubuntu, I admit, but it is there somewhere), and maybe in graphic card own settings manager, like "Nvidia display control".

On KDE desktops all of those are somewhere in the menu, under system or administration, but Ubuntu's Ghome menu looks a lot simpler, so you should either try to get GUI programs for these things or search for config files manually.

I believe Gnome's idea is that too many controls on KDE are confusing for users, but, if you managed to screw something up, then it's time to dig deeper into the system.

[Rawkus]

Windows Vista Ultimate 18 months trouble free from install to now All the free back up you require

Is that the version that comes with Solitaire included? Or do I have to buy Ultimate Media Super Gamer's Edition for that?

[siamshot]

:D :D :D

[Texpat]

I've had the same computer for several years.

Never had a problem with it.

Still using the same microsoft products that came in it.

Point, click. Perfect.

[RKASA]

I've had the same computer for several years.

Never had a problem with it.

Still using the same microsoft products that came in it.

Point, click. Perfect.

Yes I have few PC's they all came with windows and they all still work winpro and home versions.  When that version of windows stops working or being useful like the old 98se and 98 did I will still have a few working PC's.

Why not get a new PC with win7 that won't cost much.  Then put linux on one of the old boxes and surf the net, do the email and a server for your intranet and put your media on a network data base. It makes a great download device and can filter things before it gets to the win box.

You also won't have to depend on the linux box during any learning processes, which seems to be a problem for some windows users.  Why limit yourself if the other is free forever.

[Rawkus]

I've had the same computer for several years.

Never had a problem with it.

Still using the same microsoft products that came in it.

Point, click. Perfect.

An absolutely fascinating comment to be sure.

I genuinely believe that it is compelling and rational arguments like these, provided by an expert like Texpat with *several* years of point-and-click experience that will lead us out of this *nix wilderness and into the promised land of registry corruption, disk fragmentation and DLL rape that we have all been so tragically missing.

Verily, we are fortunate that a true guru of the Microsoft way of doing things has blessed us with his wisdom. I will burn my iMac and Slacktop tomorrow now that I have seen the light.

[jackdanielsesq]

Your problem is Ubuntu - reload XP and then say PCLOS 2009.1 or MDV 2009 Spring - I have 12 x O/S on my big NB and they all do different things very well. Dont go near M$ Virus or M$ Seven - you dont need any Linux support - join several forums - except Ubuntu anything and they will talk ya thru any problems within minutes, mostly. There are a lot of smart lonely cats out there who will give you their shirts.

I have had XP SP2 for eons - dont ever do the patch thingy - leave it stock. Use AVG 8.5 - update daily.

BR>Jack

[Plus]

Well, I can't get rid of "Task manager has been disabled" thingy that pops up every other day.

Clean with Spyboot, it repairs the registry and deletes a couple of files, then two days later it happens again.

Usual AV can't find anything, and I don't have time for deep virus scan either. So, come weekend, I'll boot into Ubuntu, install ClamAV and seriously clean that Windows partition.

Overall - yes, still the same XP, no reinstalls, and generally no problems.

[Rawkus]

Windows Vista Ultimate 18 months trouble free from install to now All the free back up you require

So what is it? 18 months trouble free or issues with wireless connectivity? If you want to troll then at least try to keep your story straight since you said in the Vista SP2 thread:

I have been running it for just over a month now and now issues at all with it. It seems to have addressed the wireless network problems as now my wireless never drops out any more.

(Bolding added by me for emphasis)

[tjansen]

Well, I can't get rid of "Task manager has been disabled" thingy that pops up every other day.

Clean with Spyboot, it repairs the registry and deletes a couple of files, then two days later it happens again.

Usual AV can't find anything, and I don't have time for deep virus scan either. So, come weekend, I'll boot into Ubuntu, install ClamAV and seriously clean that Windows partition.

Overall - yes, still the same XP, no reinstalls, and generally no problems.

My PC broke a few months ago, and I had to reluctantly buy a new one. I bought an Acer. After having to plead with a shop to take my 3500 baht to get a licensed copy of Windows so I could get support, I still can't get what I need. At one point I decided to go the Linux route but found that my lack of tech savvy left me overwhelmed just reading about how to do it.

Three questions:

1) What is the primary compelling reason that leads people to choose to go to Linux?

2) Is it possible for a relative neophyte to do it?

3) Since my primary issue right now is the desire to feel safe doing online purchasing, banking, etc, (I do none of this now), is the security available for Linux any more foolproof than that available for Windows. Right now I am using Eset Nod 32 and MalwareBytes.

Thanks, and interesting thread.

Tom

Edited June 18, 2009 by tjansen

[Texpat]

Never seem to see threads about people with reliable PC operating systems that don't have an irresistable urge to tinker with it...

[Thanh-BKK]

Hi.

I don't understand why someone would advise against Ubuntu..? Linux users don't necessarily have to be geeks and able to get a Slackware going...... i myself have tried PCLOS and was not happy with it, so Ubuntu it was. So far 14 months without major headaches (nothing that would render the computer useless).

A tip: Before messing with something such as the panels or the monitor resolution, open up a Firefox window and a terminal. So if playing with the panels (been there, done that....) leaves you with nothing to click, you can still use Firefox to google a solution (usually some CLI commands) and hack them into the terminal to get it back working.

When you accidentally (or on purpose) removed some icon from a panel and want it back, just right-click on the panel and select "add to panel". From the drop-down menu chose what you want and it will be there (i.e. "Network Manager"). You will also find that, for example, after removing the bottom panel in order to have an AWN or similar dock there, you won't have the task thingy anymore. You can add that to the top panel, too! But be aware that between different Ubuntu versions these may be differently named, as from my own experience 8.04 differs somewhat from 9.04 in naming those apps.

To restore the MBR all you need is a Live CD from which you can restore GRUB.

To restore the monitor resolution you can boot into some kind of "safe mode" similar to Windows ("safe graphics"..? Haven't used it yet) which allows you to make changes to the configuration.

And if the internet doesn't work..... it helps to have a second computer because i am not experienced enough to know the CLI commands to fix something like that "offline". But i DO have a second computer, which runs Ubuntu as well

Oh by the way, 14 months on Ubuntu now, Vista before it lasted 14 months as well. Ubuntu will overtake it any day now

Kind regards.....

Thanh

[jackdanielsesq]

Lets give it a shot. - security/peace/integrity/speed/stable/zero-reboots/easy 10min installs/yadda

Mandy rescued me from M$ merde a couple years back, after being messed around by Red Hat, Xandros, et al.

I really didnt like my CPU & O/S being hijacked by Symantec, etc, 24/7 and wanted something a little more bullet-proof.

Something that simply let me live on-line 24/7 - thats where all my businesses are. .

I discovered PCLOS 2007 & MM08 & 2009.1 - they all simply work, outa the box. Thats all we demand.

MDV 2009 Spring is good, but KDE4.xx sucks. I have 12 x O/S on my big Vaio NB - all work except Kubuntu 9.04 -

Shuttleworth never did anything right. Go looksee www.distrowatch.com - there's plenty of info.

Most are live distros, so you can try before ya sign that EULA - Install the one you like and simply dual-boot - now you have choice.

BR>Jack

1) What is the primary compelling reason that leads people to choose to go to Linux?

2) Is it possible for a relative neophyte to do it?

3) Since my primary issue right now is the desire to feel safe doing online purchasing, banking, etc, (I do none of this now), is the security available for Linux any more foolproof than that available for Windows. Right now I am using Eset Nod 32 and MalwareBytes.

[Rawkus]

My PC broke a few months ago, and I had to reluctantly buy a new one. I bought an Acer. After having to plead with a shop to take my 3500 baht to get a licensed copy of Windows so I could get support, I still can't get what I need. At one point I decided to go the Linux route but found that my lack of tech savvy left me overwhelmed just reading about how to do it.

Three questions:

1) What is the primary compelling reason that leads people to choose to go to Linux?

2) Is it possible for a relative neophyte to do it?

3) Since my primary issue right now is the desire to feel safe doing online purchasing, banking, etc, (I do none of this now), is the security available for Linux any more foolproof than that available for Windows. Right now I am using Eset Nod 32 and MalwareBytes.

Thanks, and interesting thread.

Tom

OK, I'll bite. This will be a Tolstoy post though

1) There are many reasons that people decide to use Linux. It could be price (or the lack thereof), it could be freedom of having a system with countless amounts of free and excellent software available, it could be getting bitten one time too many by some malware/virus/trojan on an MS system or it could be simple curiosity. For many it is the power that it gives the user to have complete control over almost everything the computer that you have bought does. If you like to get geeky almost all distributions will give you the option to get under the hood and fiddle with just about every setting imaginable for the fun of it. Other reasons include stability, security and simplicity (yeah, I went there!)

2) A relative neophyte to what? Computers in general, Linux or what..? Various flavours of Linux offer a myriad of options and choices and there is almost certainly one that will fit your requirements. Ubuntu is generally recommended for people who have not used a Linux based computer before but it does have its critics (and limitations) which hold some valid points. Ubuntu and some others (notably Knoppix) have the ability to run the full system off a CD without installing anything so you can try it and see how it feels before you commit to making any changes to your computer. If you decide to test a 'Live CD' of Knoppix or Ubuntu you will see that it comes with 2 or 3 office suites, a bunch of browsers and all sorts of other interesting and well tested software bundled in. Free.

3) This is the most controversial question! I would maintain that a well configured Linux system is infinetely less vulnurable to internet nastiness that a Windows system, mainly due to the differing philosophies underlying each system. Bear in mind that Windows was never meant to be multi-user, that was an added functionality bolted on late in its development whereas Linux was developed from the ground up to be a secure multi-user system.

Linux is not immune to trojans and rootkits but it is far less susceptible to them and to date none have successfully propagated in the wild without user assistance.

Most Windows users run their computers with an account that has full administrator privileges which allows anything unpleaseant that they pick up on the 'net to make system wide changes but most Linux users run with a separate user account (generally it is forced at install time to set up separate accounts) and thereby any naughtiness that they might encounter would have a hard time to corrupt the entire system without help (ie inputing an Admin, 'root' in the Unix world of thinking, password).

Windows has some severe security disadvantages in this regard such as the ability for a rogue ActiveX control that is run automatically by Internet Explorer to make system-wide changes and a central registry of all user and application settings that can likewise be quite easily corrupted. We have all heard of Windows IE being hijacked and systems being compromised but that is not actually a 'flaw' per se, but rather it was built in as a feature of Internet Explorer and Windows!

With regards to specific banking sites the answer is "it depends". If they rely on customers using IE and therefore ActiveX etc then you will be out of luck on a Linux (or even Apple) system, unless you want to jump through some hoops with emulation. If your bank has a web developer who is not completely clueless then you will be able to access your account using any operating system although you might need to use Java or something like that. Any newish Linux distro will be able to cope with that. I have done my offshore banking for 11 years with Lloyds and have never accessed them via a Windows machine. Likewise I shop with Amazon, Slackware, PayPal etc without issue.

Remember that whatever system you decide to use a good strong password that is not a dictionary word and contains a combination of letters, numbers and preferably punctuation marks is your best line of defense combined with not running as the administrator account/rights unless absolutely necessary.

Sorry again for the Tolstoy post.

[Crushdepth]

I think its a myth that Linux of any flavour is 'secure'. You can't just say any OS is secure because they aren't, especially after people have customised their machines by downloading whatever random apps they like and choosing weak passwords. Maybe Linux is (statistically speaking) 'better' than Windows, but there are zillions of exploits out there devoted to Linux machines and Linux apps.

It just happens that Windows is more convenient and profitable to exploit because of its huge market penetration. Certainly there is room for improvement - last week's Window's patch fixed more than 30 vulnerabilities. So much for Uncle Bill's 'trusted computing platform'. I'm still suprised that any government agency with half a brain uses it.

[joncl]

Your problem is Ubuntu - reload XP and then say PCLOS 2009.1

I have to say up to PClinuxOS 2007 they were doing well! then they dropped the ball BIG TIME, when they over wrote their 2007 repositories with PCLinuxOS 2009 they lost me for life! It totally screwed 20 sites we look after, which have now all have been changed to Ubuntu server ...

Where do these mandrake guys running PClinuxOS get off on doing this basic screwup (repository over-write) .. till then I was a lone voice for them, now I know why I was a lone voice much to my dismay.

Their distro sucks big time IMHO...

[RKASA]

I stopped both updating 2007 and the rsync of my local repo just before the changes.  Then when the changes were done I rsync'ed a copy of the repo to update with. I backed up data and installed 2009.1 fresh.  Once the new rsync was done the install and update of the 2009.1 only took 20 minutes to complete and not a problem just as good as it ever was.  After several years a rolling distro has to answer the call for a new livecd and that makes for some changes. But there are easy ways and hard ways of doing things.  

[jackdanielsesq]

PCLOS - Lordy - dont know why they did that either - they left a lot of folks out in the cold - 2007 & 2008 were very sweet.

They also blew out a lot of really good talent - I run all of them - but once I get an O/S locked down and hardened I dont upgrade or patch it.

Why?!

They could quite easily have run 2 x branches - 80% of their fan club was on 07/08.

Plus they had a lot - still do - of upgrade & syn probs anyway - so its not as if they achieved anything major.

They also appear to have a lot of angry people working there now - there is no dev work either.

BR>Jack

[tjansen]

PCLOS - Lordy - dont know why they did that either - they left a lot of folks out in the cold - 2007 & 2008 were very sweet.

They also blew out a lot of really good talent - I run all of them - but once I get an O/S locked down and hardened I dont upgrade or patch it.

Why?!

They could quite easily have run 2 x branches - 80% of their fan club was on 07/08.

Plus they had a lot - still do - of upgrade & syn probs anyway - so its not as if they achieved anything major.

They also appear to have a lot of angry people working there now - there is no dev work either.

BR>Jack

Thank you Jack Daniels and Rawkus for your response to 'why Linux'. Thanks also for the inferential taste of Tolstoy. Linux sounds like something I would like to play with in a while.

Tom

[Crushdepth]

It's definitely worth a play. From an administrative point of view its a dream. I'm not sure that its true that support for Windows is easier to get: There may be more Windows users out there but they are more incompetent and less pathologically determined than the average Linux user!!!

They just can't agree on what distro is best (mine is much better than yours, by the way).

[Plus]

1) What is the primary compelling reason that leads people to choose to go to Linux?

It wasn't a matter of choice for me - I installed it next to Windows, just to try and see what it is. I boot in and out of Linux/Windows, depening on my mood or whatever, they happily coexist.

2) Is it possible for a relative neophyte to do it?

Absolutely. Most basic stuff works straight out of the box. Ubuntu is very easy to use, once you get used to menu being at the top of the screen. PclinuxOs, often mentioned here, is more Windows like in that sense, but there are a bit more menu entries, sometimes apparently duplicating the same tasks.

3) Since my primary issue right now is the desire to feel safe doing online purchasing, banking, etc, (I do none of this now), is the security available for Linux any more foolproof than that available for Windows. Right now I am using Eset Nod 32 and MalwareBytes.

It could be that your online banking sites are Internet Explorer only. In that case Linux will be useless. On the other hand, you can always reboot into Windows when needed. Interestingly, if you site is IE only, it means it relies on very same features that are considered major security holes and the main entry point for all kinds of nasties.

[stub]

Hi.

I don't understand why someone would advise against Ubuntu..? Linux users don't necessarily have to be geeks and able to get a Slackware going...... i myself have tried PCLOS and was not happy with it, so Ubuntu it was. So far 14 months without major headaches (nothing that would render the computer useless).

Ubuntu is the tall poppy now (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tall_poppy), having become the most widely deployed Linux variant on the planet. Also, the sheer number of people who try it compared to the other variants means there are a lot more people out there with failure stories despite it probably having a higher 'success rate' per capita.

[stub]

Windows Vista Ultimate 18 months trouble free from install to now All the free back up you require

Free backup? An odd definition of free. Last I saw Vista Ultimate set you back around 7000 Baht.

[johnnynmonic]

as many of you have maybe seen I've posted a few postings I've had all kinds of experience playing with linux. I am asking this question out of serious consideration for paying for full support. I do realize its about $250 USD. Please note I've gone through about 14 linux format magazines, Tim Oreilly Ubuntu book, Picked up quite a few ideas on how things work and some terminal commands which have also been very informative. How I've arrived at this point goes as follows

I've had to reinstall the Operating System all over again about 5 times or more already which I must admit im getting good at remindering all the gstreamer codecs, ubuntu-restricted-extras, medibuntu and all my applications I use

how did i get here

Labtop has a broken screen so i've hooked a desktop monitor to use as replacement for it

1. after using virtualbox and messing around with screen resolution sizes, I wind up making the screen so big that even when i tried to get it resize again it didn't work, after searching google for 3 days, a posting here and there no real basic idea how to fix, my solution reinstall the OS all over again and never mess with screen resolution sizes

2. You'll see on the toolbar, you get like a little icon for wireless or mini computer well I deleted the toolbar ok so its not a toolbar can't think of name sorry, anyways after getting most of my icons back on i could never figure out how to go and get my little wireless icon that allowed me to connect to my wireless network, again after postings and google for a few days no luck, solution reinstalled the OS all over again and learned never to delete my wireless icon again

3. on installing ubuntu netbook remix, i installed lxde, and i installed lxde network manager wireless and internet quite working i did try some of the recommendating listed by people on posting but didn't work, solution ( reinstall the OS all over again ) and never mess with lxde network manager

4. after using ubuntu i decided to put windows xp back on again of course this messed up the dual boot process MBR or something I can't remember, by the time I had everything going again on XP, when I went back to Ubuntu, it won't load ( I now know the reason why but I didn't at the time I didn't ) so what did I do basically wipe the entire hard drive empty or cleaned it, so no OS was on there, then put XP back on 1st then, installed Ubuntu again

I have some ideas and experiences and will continue to use linux even if it means reinstalling an OS a thousand times over, I simply find in my experience that the answers to my questions realistically are not either well done or must assume I know everything or realistically dont know how to help, I've barely been reading about X11 or xconf, I"ll keep reading, I know already about lspci, cd, mkdir, wget, sudo apt-get, and a few other commands, hopefully over time i'll know how to fix my problems until then it looks like paid support might be my best option though

any comments are welcome

Here is my timesaver tip to you: remastersys

Once you get the "perfect" ubuntu install on your machine, install remastersys (it's a mint package, but google it, download it, and when you install it synaptic will resolve the dependencies from your regular Ubuntu repo). With this package you can take that perfectly working install and make an customized iso image. Burn taht image to a disc, then feel free to play around, learn how stuff works, and break stuff, because you are now never more than 20-30 minutes away from your machine working perfectly again. No more fiddling with wifi or downloading codecs, installing skype and your other favorite applications, the custom install disc you made will install a copy of Ubuntu that was exactly the same as your machine was when you ran remastersys.