Govt: Foreigners Can't Farm Here

[marshbags]

Breakingnews » Breakingnews

-- Bangkok Post

-- Bangkok Post 22-06-09

Govt: Foreigners can't farm here

The Ministry of Commerce says the law is quite clear -- foreign developers cannot invest in the country's agricultural sector, especially the farm sector.

Department of Business Development director-general Kanissorn Navanugraha was respondng on Monday to reports the Gulf Cooperation Council (GCC) had expressed an interest in raising livestock and growing rice in Thailand,

He said the Alien Business Act B.E. 2542 (1999) forbids foreigners from owning businesses relating to farming and raising livestock.

Unquote

Full article

Ref url :- http://www.bangkokpost.com/breakingnews/14...-for-foreigners

I reckon certain mates in this area are not going to be to pleased with what this appears to imply re their investments.

Take note all would be investors who wish to invest in Thailand and in turn the failing economy.

Apologies for my pathetic attempt at using the new method of posting news items, i will try to do better.

marshbags

Edited June 22, 2009 by marshbags

[MJP]

Breakingnews » Breakingnews

-- Bangkok Post

-- Bangkok Post 22-06-09

Govt: Foreigners can't farm here

The Ministry of Commerce says the law is quite clear -- foreign developers cannot invest in the country's agricultural sector, especially the farm sector.

Department of Business Development director-general Kanissorn Navanugraha was respondng on Monday to reports the Gulf Cooperation Council (GCC) had expressed an interest in raising livestock and growing rice in Thailand,

He said the Alien Business Act B.E. 2542 (1999) forbids foreigners from owning businesses relating to farming and raising livestock.

Unquote

Full article

Ref url :- http://www.bangkokpost.com/breakingnews/14...-for-foreigners

But we're okay to shovel manure and stuff?

[jumnien]

Good news, indeed! Thanks for posting.

[Maizefarmer]

This subject has come up a few times on ThaiVisa - its not as straightforward as that guys.

There are "foreign" companies that are heavily involved in the Thai ag sector e.g. Thai Danish, Syngenta, Monsanto ... to name just 3 - the former in the production of milk/diary products, the latter 2 in crop/seed production and crop genetics.

The question is: what constitutes a foreign company or foreign person(?) - and in all 3 of the above cases, which have significant full time Thai based ex-pat staff compliments working in and for them, they are Thai companies in the sense that they are:

- registered in Thailand

- majority share held in/by Thai interests.

In short - despite their names, they are actually Thai companies, which have a minority of their shares held/controlled by the international brand name owners.

I havent studied what the Gulf Co-Op Council was intending to do, so I stand to be corrected on what I now say, but I would suspect that they are trying to do what they managed to do in Cambodia - which did indeed piss a load of people off quite badly.

GCC found a way to purchase/invest in huge tracts of land for rice production, in such a way as they were able to achieve to things:

1) distort local land prices (been willing to buy land at prices that the locals could never afford)

2) export the rice they produced back to the Mid-east (a potential threat to nationalfood stocks)

The GCC exercise was no small country farm project. It was on a huge scale - 10's of thousands of hectares - large enough to have an impact on a national scale.

... and what I have put in brackets above, is exactly what the law in Thailand was set out to prevent i.e. distortion of agriculture land values, foreign control over food production and stocks/reserves - both issues related to national security (you only have to look at how Thaksin got into power to understand the problem a bunch of grumpy peasents can present a government in power).

So -can the GCC participate in the Thai ag sector - yes, but it will have to be in accordance with Thai rules & regs - and that, i suspect will not suit them as their primary goal is production of food exclsuively for the Gulf market (rice - with complete control over production costs versus having to pay market prices.

As far as the "foreigners can't farm in Thailand" goes - meaning, ex-pats like you and me who want to grow a few rai of maize, rice, or keep a few rai of sheep or cows, or pig's in a piggery - there are ample ways for one to go about this kind of farming without upsetting officials or breaking the rules - its a whole subject in its self and I have written a number of articles about it a few years ago on the Thaivisa Farming in Thailand section of the forum. If anyone wants a practical insight to those comments (and the comments of others who contributed to those threads) - I'll be happy to post the links (just don't want to rehash some rather long notes here)

Edited June 22, 2009 by Maizefarmer

[Pierrot]

Agree with MF, "As far as the "foreigners can't farm in Thailand" goes - meaning, ex-pats like you and me who want to grow a few rai of maize, rice, or keep a few rai of sheep or cows, or pig's in a piggery - there are ample ways for one to go about this kind of farming without upsetting officials or breaking the rules"

The real risk for Thailand, and for other developing countries, is somewhere else :

Nov 2008 : Daewoo to cultivate Madagascar land for free

Daewoo Logistics of South Korea said it expected to pay nothing to farm maize and palm oil in an area of Madagascar half the size of Belgium, increasing concerns about the largest farmland investment of this kind. From The Financial Times

http://us.ft.com/ftgateway/superpage.ft?ne...920081227033091

March 2009 :

Madagascar's new leader has cancelled a controversial deal for a South Korean firm to lease a vast tract of land to grow food crops. Andry Rajoelina said he was axing the deal because the people should be consulted. Daewoo Logistics has reportedly expressed its frustration. The plan had helped fuel popular anger against President Marc Ravalomanana, who was forced from office on Tuesday. From the BBC

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/africa/7952628.stm

[george]

Govt: Foreigners can't farm here

The Ministry of Commerce says the law is quite clear -- foreign developers cannot invest in the country's agricultural sector, especially the farm sector.

Department of Business Development director-general Kanissorn Navanugraha was respondng on Monday to reports the Gulf Cooperation Council (GCC) had expressed an interest in raising livestock and growing rice in Thailand,

He said the Alien Business Act B.E. 2542 (1999) forbids foreigners from owning businesses relating to farming and raising livestock.

The GCC consists of Oman, Bahrain, Kuwait, Qatar, Saudi Arabia and the United Arab Emirates.

The Ministry of Foreign Affairs should understand the law, Mr Kanissorn said.

The Department of Business Development was not aware of any foreigners trying to invest in the farming sector, he said.

Foreigners could also hold no more than 49 per cent of the shares in agricultural firms.

He said there were more than 60,000 joint ventures in the country and 1,500 of them were associated with land dealings. None of them were related to agriculture.

-- Bangkok Post 2009-06-22

[jumnien]

This is excellent news for those of us who cultivate a few rai. We won't have middle east conglomerates to contend with!

[Just1Voice]

This news only adds to the belief that xenophobia is alive and well in Thailand. I could say more, but it would only get deleted, so why bother.

[givenall]

Good news, indeed! Thanks for posting.

I have decide not to incest any more money in Thailand, because of all these restrictions and unfriendliness to foreigners.

[MJP]

Good news, indeed! Thanks for posting.

I have decide not to invest any more money in Thailand, because of all these restrictions and unfriendliness to foreigners.

Fixed.

Yes. I wouldn't invest dime one in this place.

Ouim sharrrpenin' moi petchfarck!

[Absingjul]

Any farang that included a tractor in their sin sod will be refunded by the gov't

[Maizefarmer]

Your comments (Pierrot) show another side of an all to often missed argument i.e. just why couldn't Madagascar get its act together and undertake food production its self on the same scale?

Theres no doubt that these Far East (and Mid East) co's often come in to 3rd World/developing countries with skill levels that quickly show the local production levels to be far behind their potential

The argument applies to Thailand as well - and its rice production: why can't Thailand produce rice crops anywhere near the level that GCC has said it could achieve, increasing production per unit area by some 100% to 200% (comparing what they think they can achieve with what the Vietnamese and Chinese do achieve - crops 2 to 3 times heavier).

What is it about Thailands ag sector that has left it so hopelessly inefficient? I have no doubt that if GCC threw its weight into a rice production project, it would quickly be producing yields Thailand only dreams about. Despite its poor production levels, hopeless logistic infrastructure (right the way through harvesting/processing and storage - and not only in respect of rice, but in diary and sugarcane as well), Thailand is still the worlds largest rice producer! Ironic - what potential.

[Chunkton]

So I guess in the north those Chinese merchants that sell fertilizer etc with the farm as guarantee against the advance are not engaging in farming when they repossess those vast tacks of farmland?

Silly me I misunderstood what was going on. Hang on, no, those Chinese are regarded as Thai aren't they, at least by the Thais at any rate. Mind you they speak in Chinese, have Chinese writing all over their shops and trucks, go to Chinese temples and restaurants, yep, they are Thai all right.

Actually not really having a go at the Chinese, they have gotten on very well, but as we know double standards exist.

[Crushdepth]

According to a keynote lecture at an agricultural conference I went to today, Vietnam is the world's largest rice producer by volume. Maybe Thailand is the biggest exporter? (Or maybe he was wrong, he's not a details kind of guy and I haven't bothered to check the stats Anyway, the other point made in the same presentation was that nearly all Asian agriculture is small scale. So yes its inefficient, but on the other side of the coin it provides a huge amount of jobs, even if they are very low income.

I wish the government wasn't so pathological about foreigners doing/owning anything. But what the hel_l its their country and 10 years from now when the rest of the region (sans Myanmar) has left them for dead I have no doubt they'll change their mind. Of course, it'll be a bit late by then.

[imaneggspurt]

Good news, indeed! Thanks for posting.

Excellent,as you say, means ill never be a farmer in thailand, what a relief !

[robbiecia]

Good news, indeed! Thanks for posting.

I have decide not to incest any more money in Thailand, because of all these restrictions and unfriendliness to foreigners.

Sorry had to do that

[mrbojangles]

Thailand is still the worlds largest rice producer!

I thought China was the worlds biggest producer but they keep most of it to feed themselves. But Thailand is the world's biggest exporter of Rice.

If the latter is true, they have a huge say on what the market price is. Producing more could, in simplistic terms, decrease the value of the Rice it exports. Saudi, for instance, are nowhere near producing the amount of Oil per day, that they could do, as they don't want to sell Oil at $20 per barrel.

[RedBullHorn]

Govt: Foreigners can't farm here

The Ministry of Commerce says the law is quite clear -- foreign developers cannot invest in the country's agricultural sector, especially the farm sector.

Department of Business Development director-general Kanissorn Navanugraha was respondng on Monday to reports the Gulf Cooperation Council (GCC) had expressed an interest in raising livestock and growing rice in Thailand,

He said the Alien Business Act B.E. 2542 (1999) forbids foreigners from owning businesses relating to farming and raising livestock.

The GCC consists of Oman, Bahrain, Kuwait, Qatar, Saudi Arabia and the United Arab Emirates.

The Ministry of Foreign Affairs should understand the law, Mr Kanissorn said.

The Department of Business Development was not aware of any foreigners trying to invest in the farming sector, he said.

Foreigners could also hold no more than 49 per cent of the shares in agricultural firms.

He said there were more than 60,000 joint ventures in the country and 1,500 of them were associated with land dealings. None of them were related to agriculture.

-- Bangkok Post 2009-06-22

I'm employing worker NOW!!!.....I've enemies....people who're jealous/envy of my success ......dam_n piece of news!

Edited June 22, 2009 by RedBullHorn

[anothertorres]

thank god, i hate manual labor.

[givenall]

Good news, indeed! Thanks for posting.

I have decide not to incest any more money in Thailand, because of all these restrictions and unfriendliness to foreigners.

Sorry had to do that

[MJP]

Good news, indeed! Thanks for posting.

Excellent,as you say, means ill never be a farmer in thailand, what a relief !

I tried this tonight. Used this thread to try and get out of sh1t shovelling tomorrow.

Guess what . . .

[DP25]

According to a keynote lecture at an agricultural conference I went to today, Vietnam is the world's largest rice producer by volume. Maybe Thailand is the biggest exporter? (Or maybe he was wrong, he's not a details kind of guy and I haven't bothered to check the stats

China is the largest producer by far (six times more than Vietnam), followed by India, Indonesia, Bangladesh, and then Vietnam and Thailand. Thailand is the largest exporter, and Vietnam the second largest exporter.

[Zeid]

That GCC are going all over the place, they have thousands and thousands of hectors in the world, to make sure that they keep getting food, the way they look at it, is they can not plant and finding water is expensive, so buy where there is everything, they are now also in India, as well as africa.

but they way they are doing it is wrog wher ethey treat it as an extension to their country.

on teh other hand some very big Thai rice companies are buying land in nigeria, teaching the locals how to plant, and using this to export to africa, as to reducing shipping costs.

[bravingbangkok]

According to a keynote lecture at an agricultural conference I went to today, Vietnam is the world's largest rice producer by volume. Maybe Thailand is the biggest exporter? (Or maybe he was wrong, he's not a details kind of guy and I haven't bothered to check the stats

China is the largest producer by far (six times more than Vietnam), followed by India, Indonesia, Bangladesh, and then Vietnam and Thailand. Thailand is the largest exporter, and Vietnam the second largest exporter.

So your the one who has stolen my Economist pocket world in figures book

[farmerjo]

I think as it says,business,not much for us small timers to worry about as long as you can pass educated farming practises on to the locals.

When my wife started 5 years ago only 20 percent of the land around us was being utilized,in comes a farang and now i would say 80 percent is being used with the locals being prepared to have a go and change their theories to increase margins.

[Mai Krap]

Hope nobody figures out I planted a half dozen banana trees in the back yard. Maybe I should get right out there and dig them back up!

[Theyreallrubbish]

This news only adds to the belief that xenophobia is alive and well in Thailand. I could say more, but it would only get deleted, so why bother.

I'm not sure its xenophobia so much as the large wealthy families that bankroll local and national politicians not wanting their source of income disrupted by competition.

The lot of the Thai farmer is a rough one largely due to the exploitation by the supply and purchasing companies of their desperation and lack of education and de facto monopolies.

Most trade protectionism comes down to the established players influencing politicians to prevent new competition that could reduce their profits. Wrapping this up in the national flag is a global practice, not unique to Thailand.

[jackdanielsesq]

I have decide not to incest any more money in Thailand, because of all these restrictions and unfriendliness to foreigners.

I too resemble that remark :D :D

BR>Jack

[lannarebirth]

COMMENTARY

Our fear of the foreigner on the farm

By: Sanitsuda Ekachai

Published: 25/06/2009 at 12:00 AM

Newspaper section: NewsHands off! The back-breaking rice farming work is only for Thais. If you are a foreigner wanting to invest in farming here, our laws allow you to partake only in the more profitable business of food processing and other agriculture-related investments which require high capital and technology.

No, no, you foreigners cannot engage in contract-farming here, either. That would turn independent farmers into hired hands on their own land. That would be daylight robbery. Only Thai agro giants can do that and still call it agricultural development!

But if you still want to invest in farming, get a Thai front. The law says it is okay if the paperwork states that your Thai partners own up to 51%. Reality does not count.

http://www.bangkokpost.com/opinion/opinion...ner-on-the-farm

[RPCVguy]

Your comments (Pierrot) show another side of an all to often missed argument i.e. just why couldn't Madagascar get its act together and undertake food production its self on the same scale?

Theres no doubt that these Far East (and Mid East) co's often come in to 3rd World/developing countries with skill levels that quickly show the local production levels to be far behind their potential

The argument applies to Thailand as well - and its rice production: why can't Thailand produce rice crops anywhere near the level that GCC has said it could achieve, increasing production per unit area by some 100% to 200% (comparing what they think they can achieve with what the Vietnamese and Chinese do achieve - crops 2 to 3 times heavier).

What is it about Thailands ag sector that has left it so hopelessly inefficient? I have no doubt that if GCC threw its weight into a rice production project, it would quickly be producing yields Thailand only dreams about. Despite its poor production levels, hopeless logistic infrastructure (right the way through harvesting/processing and storage - and not only in respect of rice, but in diary and sugarcane as well), Thailand is still the worlds largest rice producer! Ironic - what potential.

What I've observed is that local farmers till their land in ways that are mostly sustainable. In the process they protect the health of their soil. Many lands in the west are not in such good shape. Chemical fertilizers add cost and salts that produce smaller results over time. Local farmers also practice community in helping each other through the planting and harvest cycles. Big industrial, mono-culture farms are a slower term "food-production-bubble" - a "get rich quick" scheme that has disastrous effects long term. Farmers in India Return To Organic Methods | TakePart Social Action Network™[/url]Source: http://www.takepart.com OR look for and watch the new movie "Food, Inc.)