Water Canon Used Against Chiang Mai Redshirt’s - 14 Police Injured

[phupaman]

Hi All.

Korn the Minister of Finance giving a talk to a hall full of young Thai students in Chiang Mai.

Outside 300/400 red shirts most of them armed do their best to break through 1,000 Thai police to cause mayhem and injury to Korn and his young Thai audience, WHY? do the police not arrest these people en-masse and take them to a secure Army Barracks to be gaurded and fed for a few months until the police had time to prepare the evidence for the Court. The Barracks should be down the South of Thailand, less chance of more red shirts causing trouble as we know they only can cause trouble for money and the leaders of the gang have no stomach for a fight in the South.

I think the same solution for Udon Thani, but I doubt the leaders would show their face's.

phupaman.

[sriracha john]

i think this incident once again serves to show that thickskins followers are little more than a paid for gang of hoodlums

Warrants Sought for Red-shirt Local Leaders in Chiang Mai

Police in Chiang Mai Province are seeking arrest warrants for five local leaders of the anti-government Democratic Alliance against Dictatorship, for their alleged involvement in disturbances during the Finance Minister's visit earlier this month.

Police Lieutenant-General Somkid Boonthanom, the Provincial Police Region 5 Chief, said regarding red-shirt supporters surrounding Phuping Rajanives police station to disrupt Finance Minister Korn Jatikawanich's visit, that warrants for five local red-shirt leaders are expected to be issued within the next few days.

Five Democratic Alliance against Dictatorship or DAAD leaders will be charged with illegal assembly of more than 10 people, inciting chaos, and obstructing police operations.

Eighteen police personnel were injured during the clashes with the red-shirt protesters.

Somkid said charges against the red-shirt group would be based on evidence, adding that he is not worried that police might be pressured by the DAAD group.

He noted that the report on the case was submitted to Deputy Prime Minister Suthep Thaugsuban and added that the deputy PM has expressed concern and given some money to the injured officials for medical treatment fees.

-- Tan Network 2009-07-31

[dbrenn]

Even a peaceful movement has a right to defend itself from attackers by hiring a security force.

What rubbish. Hiring thugs to intimidate political opposition incites violence. Law enforcement is the job of the authorities, not the PAD.

[dbrenn]

Re. airport - one week, 2% of GDP. That's just ridiculous - the whole country of 65 million produces 2% of GDP in one week, not just one airport with a few thosand employees.

What? Now you are saying that the airport's income is it's only affect on GDP? Doesn't it occur to you that a disruption at the airport, as an important part of the national infrastructure, might have an affect on income elsewhwre in the country? You work for the government, right?

I'll bet that you are not working in the tourist industry. Ask anyone who is or was - not a good place to be right now.

Edited August 1, 2009 by dbrenn

[caf]

Even a peaceful movement has a right to defend itself from attackers by hiring a security force.

What rubbish. Hiring thugs to intimidate political opposition incites violence. Law enforcement is the job of the authorities, not the PAD.

That's the Western view.

[animatic]

Even a peaceful movement has a right to defend itself from attackers by hiring a security force.

What rubbish. Hiring thugs to intimidate political opposition incites violence. Law enforcement is the job of the authorities, not the PAD.

Au contraire. When the the police are NOT doing their job to keep two opposing protest groups apart,

then the one being attacked has the right top self-defense. The Red mobs were physically attacking

Democrat, PAD speakers and any opposing voices for some time by the time Samak wanted his S.O.Emergency,

and let the red mob off it's leash WITH PPP MP's instigating them from the stage before,

and tagging along on the way to the PAD encampment, this was ALSO BEFORE government house.

Where THEY attacked with slingshots, machetes, pipes, sticks and knives.

The Thugs hired to intimidate were CLEARLY on the RED / PPP side of the fence.

Attempting to re-write history is just so amateur... in this digital day and age of internet and TV phones.

Historically PAD increased it's self defense cordon in DIRECT RESPONSE to

repeated and escalating Red Mob attacks, often under cover of night Guerrilla style.

PAD security didn't ever venture to Red rallies to give beatings,

PAD guards stayed in close proximity to their lines, and waited the next assault.

As those assaults got more violent, they, not illogically,

got more nervous and MUCH less trusting of strangers.

If the police don't stop this, I suppose you suggest just get beaten or killed is a reasonable recourse?

But they disagree with me politically; they need a beating,

how can I let them talk when they disagree with the boss?

Oh yes, you will say:

Shouldn't they just go home, rather than peacefully gather, since they are being attacked?

Which is EXACTLY the point of the attacks ; make them go home.

Which is EXACTLY the reason they did NOT go home, because,

like them or not, PAD, and others, have the same right to be heard as the RED side

or the Green Side or the mass of gray peoples who choose not to speak much.

And still another clear example of the Reds shutting down dissenting speech,

even if the speech has NOTHING TO DO WITH POLITICS,

is this attack on Korn and students, just because he is in the government.

Edited August 1, 2009 by animatic

[hammered]

Interesting article on red (mostly) and yellow shirts here from A-Times:

http://www.atimes.com/atimes/Southeast_Asia/KG31Ae03.html

Not sure what thread to post it but this seems appropriate. It probably deserves a thread of its own in fact

[monoli87]

i think the red shirt supporter shall seek a lawyer rather than use a violence....

[dbrenn]

Even a peaceful movement has a right to defend itself from attackers by hiring a security force.

What rubbish. Hiring thugs to intimidate political opposition incites violence. Law enforcement is the job of the authorities, not the PAD.

Au contraire. When the the police are NOT doing their job to keep two opposing protest groups apart,

then the one being attacked has the right top self-defense. The Red mobs were physically attacking

Democrat, PAD speakers and any opposing voices for some time by the time Samak wanted his S.O.Emergency,

and let the red mob off it's leash WITH PPP MP's instigating them from the stage before,

and tagging along on the way to the PAD encampment, this was ALSO BEFORE government house.

Where THEY attacked with slingshots, machetes, pipes, sticks and knives.

The Thugs hired to intimidate were CLEARLY on the RED / PPP side of the fence.

Attempting to re-write history is just so amateur... in this digital day and age of internet and TV phones.

Historically PAD increased it's self defense cordon in DIRECT RESPONSE to

repeated and escalating Red Mob attacks, often under cover of night Guerrilla style.

PAD security didn't ever venture to Red rallies to give beatings,

PAD guards stayed in close proximity to their lines, and waited the next assault.

As those assaults got more violent, they, not illogically,

got more nervous and MUCH less trusting of strangers.

If the police don't stop this, I suppose you suggest just get beaten or killed is a reasonable recourse?

But they disagree with me politically; they need a beating,

how can I let them talk when they disagree with the boss?

Oh yes, you will say:

Shouldn't they just go home, rather than peacefully gather, since they are being attacked?

Which is EXACTLY the point of the attacks ; make them go home.

Which is EXACTLY the reason they did NOT go home, because,

like them or not, PAD, and others, have the same right to be heard as the RED side

or the Green Side or the mass of gray peoples who choose not to speak much.

And still another clear example of the Reds shutting down dissenting speech,

even if the speech has NOTHING TO DO WITH POLITICS,

is this attack on Korn and students, just because he is in the government.

Hang on a second and think about what you are saying. Anyone has the right to demonstrate peacefully, regardless of shirt colour. To say the one or the other side started violence is like asking what came first, the chicken or the egg.

Hiring thugs on both sides to participate in a peaceful demonstration is reprehensible, and perpetuates violence. People hired under the guise of self defence usually aren't satisfied with that and start picking fights.

Justification of arming up one side and not the other is akin to advocating the creation of a militia that operates outside the law. That's how civil wars start, and it's the last thing that Thailand needs.

[dbrenn]

Even a peaceful movement has a right to defend itself from attackers by hiring a security force.

What rubbish. Hiring thugs to intimidate political opposition incites violence. Law enforcement is the job of the authorities, not the PAD.

That's the Western view.

Where on earth did ypou get that idea? Thai law is specific, and you clearly have no understanding of it. Thais have the right to demonstate peacefully, but no right to take the law into their own hands.

Edited August 2, 2009 by dbrenn

[animatic]

Even a peaceful movement has a right to defend itself from attackers by hiring a security force.

What rubbish. Hiring thugs to intimidate political opposition incites violence. Law enforcement is the job of the authorities, not the PAD.

Au contraire. When the the police are NOT doing their job to keep two opposing protest groups apart,

then the one being attacked has the right top self-defense. The Red mobs were physically attacking

Democrat, PAD speakers and any opposing voices for some time by the time Samak wanted his S.O.Emergency,

and let the red mob off it's leash WITH PPP MP's instigating them from the stage before,

and tagging along on the way to the PAD encampment, this was ALSO BEFORE government house.

Where THEY attacked with slingshots, machetes, pipes, sticks and knives.

The Thugs hired to intimidate were CLEARLY on the RED / PPP side of the fence.

Attempting to re-write history is just so amateur... in this digital day and age of internet and TV phones.

Historically PAD increased it's self defense cordon in DIRECT RESPONSE to

repeated and escalating Red Mob attacks, often under cover of night Guerrilla style.

PAD security didn't ever venture to Red rallies to give beatings,

PAD guards stayed in close proximity to their lines, and waited the next assault.

As those assaults got more violent, they, not illogically,

got more nervous and MUCH less trusting of strangers.

If the police don't stop this, I suppose you suggest just get beaten or killed is a reasonable recourse?

But they disagree with me politically; they need a beating,

how can I let them talk when they disagree with the boss?

Oh yes, you will say:

Shouldn't they just go home, rather than peacefully gather, since they are being attacked?

Which is EXACTLY the point of the attacks ; make them go home.

Which is EXACTLY the reason they did NOT go home, because,

like them or not, PAD, and others, have the same right to be heard as the RED side

or the Green Side or the mass of gray peoples who choose not to speak much.

And still another clear example of the Reds shutting down dissenting speech,

even if the speech has NOTHING TO DO WITH POLITICS,

is this attack on Korn and students, just because he is in the government.

Hang on a second and think about what you are saying. Anyone has the right to demonstrate peacefully, regardless of shirt colour. To say the one or the other side started violence is like asking what came first, the chicken or the egg.

Hiring thugs on both sides to participate in a peaceful demonstration is reprehensible, and perpetuates violence. People hired under the guise of self defence usually aren't satisfied with that and start picking fights.

Justification of arming up one side and not the other is akin to advocating the creation of a militia that operates outside the law. That's how civil wars start, and it's the last thing that Thailand needs.

Well the Reds armed up and the yellows would be killed, maimed and injured had they not become defensive.

Who attacked who first. No chicken or egg obsfucations... sorry that dog don't hunt.

ALL media reports show the violence was STARTED BY THE RED SIDE EVERY TIME.

No yellow's at Chaing Mai University, but the Red 51 group attacked there too.

Violence to supprese alternate thought, Big Brother/Lenin/Trotsky/Stalin/Mao style.

And the police Oct 7 were controlled by the red sides uber-leaders,

and clearly had Red side 'Ringers' behind police lines reaping chaos too.

Your attempted equivocations are so much air and dust.

Edited August 2, 2009 by animatic

[dbrenn]

ALL media reports show the violence was STARTED BY THE RED SIDE EVERY TIME.

Your attempted equivocations are so much air and dust.

Oh, don't be so melodramatic - writing in big capital letters won't make me believe this nonsense. It's nothing more than the belicose propaganda that you read in the Nation

I mean, when you have a two different groups milling around, who on earth knows who started what? Were you, yourself, actually there? There were media reports levelling accusations at both sides - and we did see the PAD using guns in the street, or did you miss that news report? Does this mean that the PAD should set up its own private army of vigilantes? Of course it doesn't. What a recipe for utter anarchy.

Fact is, protests should be peaceful and neither side has any right to take the law into its own hands. Period.

Chicken and egg, my friend

[animatic]

ALL media reports show the violence was STARTED BY THE RED SIDE EVERY TIME.

Your attempted equivocations are so much air and dust.

Oh, don't be so melodramatic - writing in big capital letters won't make me believe this nonsense. It's nothing more than the belicose propaganda that you read in the Nation

I mean, when you have a two different groups milling around, who on earth knows who started what? Were you, yourself, actually there? There were media reports levelling accusations at both sides - and we did see the PAD using guns in the street, or did you miss that news report? Does this mean that the PAD should set up its own private army of vigilantes? Of course it doesn't. What a recipe for utter anarchy.

Fact is, protests should be peaceful and neither side has any right to take the law into its own hands. Period.

Chicken and egg, my friend

I would rather take the law into my own hands and live to get castigated by the likes of you,

then be dead, maimed or injured for not acting in self defense. There ARE laws to back that in

most countries. What is NORMALLY illeagal can be legal in life and death situations.

It's a no brainer, regardless of the theoretically correct law abiding stance,

Which i was not in disagreement with, but there is e a saying in USA

normally pertaining to giving right of way in traffic.

"He was in the right, Dead right."

Meaning it may be correct to let the law be followed,

but there are times doing your legal right will get you killed.

And it works in the inverse also.

PAD had no guns in the streets till Reds were shooting at them from pick up trucks that then sled off.

Each and every recorded PAD escalation was provoked by Red attacks.

And no amount of re-writing history will change that.

[Samuian]

Oh, don't be so melodramatic - writing in big capital letters won't make me believe this nonsense. It's nothing more than the belicose propaganda that you read in the Nation

I just love discussions where a differing opinion is targeted with belittling when there are not better Arguments at hand - say s a lot about the one who resorts to "argumentum ad hominem".

I mean, when you have a two different groups milling around, who on earth knows who started what?

it is pretty clear who is whjo... the PAD strarted the rallies against governments which they perceived as unjust and corrupt.

And remind the audience that Sondhi now he fiercest opponent, was befriedned with Thaksin, that Chalerm was his Advisors and that Thaksin once lead the phaland Dharma Part founded by Chamlong... and then also Chamlong became a fierce oppopnent- why - because they envy him his money, his power, that the "people love him so much"....?

Were you, yourself, actually there? There were media reports levelling accusations at both sides - and we did see the PAD using guns in the street, or did you miss that news report? Does this mean that the PAD should set up its own private army of vigilantes? Of course it doesn't. What a recipe for utter anarchy.

Fact is, protests should be peaceful and neither side has any right to take the law into its own hands. Period.

Chicken and egg, my friend

Yes, it's where the reds came in, why should the PAD allow people in their ranks get threatened from violent intruders?

Why has so far not much happened regarding the riff-raff police action from Oct. last year government hiouse- was itpolice or wasn't it - why was it first denied, lied about? ... where many people got baldy injured - one death - Songkran riots 2 deaths...but then counter claims by the reds that there have been many, many casualties... no ONE single evidence has ever turned up, not one - already this fact makes the red stand in a very bad light! Why lie... why produce false statements...

The argument that the PAD is as violent does not hold the water... it's an polemical excuse... you used "leveling"...that is what it is.... they are as bad too, that is why!

It's not a proper Argument, it's rhetorical merry-go-round!

The reds are there, chosen to oppose any movement of the PAD and Copy them in adverse fashion - a tool of the Thaksin trade! None else - it has been proven again, and again, through the "phone-ins" and his speeches to them, them holding him in high regards.. get the petition rollin' and oppose any move, anything the Government does - and it's "leggitimate" cause the actions of the PAD have been accepted as legitimate - he has drawn up some mean concept...!

And it doesn't prove as a very democratic concept at all - it's designed to "rock the boat" to cause unrest, insecureness in the population, so he can say "you see they aren't even able to keep the country in a stable condition" mean, evil and ruthless!

Certainly not democratic...!

[sriracha john]

Arrest Warrants Issued for 5 Red-shirt Protesters in Chiang Mai

The Chiang Mai provincial court has issued arrest warrants for 5 red-shirt protesters who blocked a police station and instigated chaos during a visit of the Finance Minister to the province in July.

Police Commander for Region 5, Police Lt-Gen Somkid Boontanom, revealed that investigators on red-shirt protests on July 16 and 17 have submitted the cases to the Chiang Mai provincial court to seek arrest warrant issuance for five red-shirt protesters.

Red-shirt protesters broke into the Phu Phing Rajanivej police station in Chiang Mai and clashed with police officers on July 16.

In addition, they also held a rally and blocked a road to voice their disapproval of the Finance Minister Korn Chatikavanich who visited Chiang Mai for a meeting at Chiang Mai University on July 17.

The five key leaders of the protests are charged with creating turmoil, gathering in a group of over ten people, and resisting police orders. The five who have arrest warrants issued against them are Aphichat Insorn, Somchai Kunacharatsakun, Sarayut Suyasak, and two others whose real names have not yet been identified.

Police officials said that the five should turn themselves in to police as soon as possible, adding that at present, police have been authorized to arrest people who act violently without the need to secure court warrants first.

-- Tan Network 2009-08-04

[clausewitz]

ALL media reports show the violence was STARTED BY THE RED SIDE EVERY TIME.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QbnFPhExOTw

watch this video of teh gentle pAD.

http://www.bangkokpost.com/021208_News/02Dec2008_news07.php

Call to stop violent attacks on journalists

Media organisations condemn harassment [by PAD}

Five media organisations have slammed several instances of violence and intimidation towards journalists.

Journalistsand photographers atDonMueang airport as they cover the People’s Alliance for Democracy protest after facing threats by the antigovernment group’s security guards.

The move follows the recent intimidation of reporters and photographers by guards at the People's Alliance for Democracy (PAD) rallies.

.

The Press Council of Thailand, the Confederation of Thai Journalists, the Thai Journalists Association, the Thai Broadcast Journalists Association and the Cable Television Association of Thailand yesterday issued a joint statement calling for an end to all forms of threats and intimidation of those working in all media fields. They condemned violent acts against reporters, cameramen and news crews.

Among those acts were a recent threat against a newspaper photographer who photographed clashes between supporters of the PAD and pro-government supporters on Vibhavadi Rangsit Soi 3, intimidation of reporters and cameramen covering a crime story in Chiang Mai, a gun attack on the ASTV television station in Bangkok, and a gun attack by PAD guards on a broadcast van belonging to the TNN news station at Suvarnabhumi airport.

'PAD guards' arrested with bombs

Police Sunday arrested two men, who confessed to be PAD guards, after a lot of bombs and other weapons were found on them.

The two - Thanit Khanurai, 28, and Watana Kijpithaksin, 22, were arrested while riding a motorcycle on the Ratchasima Road in Dusit district at 2:50 pm.

Police found a bag with 3 M67 grenades, 22 ping pong bombs, 1 homemade bomb, 4 shotgun ammunitions, a samurai sword, and three sling shots.

Police also found id cards of PAD guards on them.

Watana told police that he was hired by another PAD guard, identified only as Nok, to carry the bag from a spot under the Rajawat Bridge to put into a garbage bin in front of the Rajdamnone Boxing Stadium.

Source: The Nation - 10 November 2008

http://www.nationmultimedia.com/breakingne...newsid=30087406

Man injured in shooting with PAD guards

A man was shot and injured early Sunday after he and his friends drove to the Makkhawan Bridge and shouted abusive words at guards of the People's Alliance for Democracy.

The guards claimed that the group started firing at them first but the five men told police that one of them simply raised their middle finger and shouted abusive words against the PAD guards and they chased after them and fired at them.

The injured man was identified as Jaroon Deetour, 22. He was shot once on his right shoulder and rushed to the Vajira Hospital.

Four other men in the car were taken into custody by police from Nangloeng Police station

They told police that they went to drink on a pub on Khao San Road and they got lost while returning home in Samut Prakan and Jaroon later drove to the Makkhawan Bridge and Jaroon lowed the window and raised his middle finger to the PAD guards.

No PAD guards were arrested.

The Nation

[sriracha john]

Please post news articles according to Thaivisa's protocol for posting news articles.

Thank you.

[caf]

Even a peaceful movement has a right to defend itself from attackers by hiring a security force.

What rubbish. Hiring thugs to intimidate political opposition incites violence. Law enforcement is the job of the authorities, not the PAD.

That's the Western view.

Where on earth did ypou get that idea? Thai law is specific, and you clearly have no understanding of it. Thais have the right to demonstate peacefully, but no right to take the law into their own hands.

I am questioning whether the authorities are always trying to enforce the law. Not only in this case but genearlly. My observation is they are not

And if you think thai law is specific then i wonder where on earth you got that idea. not thailand for sure. the law is what they want it to be

[sriracha john]

Chiang Mai Red-Shirt Protesters Report to Police

Three red-shirt protesters in Chiang Mai wanted for last month's unruly protest report to police before they are released on bail guaranteed by an MP from the opposition Pheu Thai Party.

Three members of the red-shirt network in Chiang Mai, Apichart Insorn, Somchai Kunajarasdej and Sarayut Suyasak, turned themselves in to investigators at Puping Rajanives police station.

The three faced arrest warrants for besieging the police station and blocking the road around the auditorium of Chiang Mai University during a protest on July 17 against the Finance Minister's visit.

They were later released on bail guaranteed by a Chiang Mai Pheu Thai Party MP.

Two other red-shirt supporters who faced the same charges, Jack Pattaya and an unidentified man, have yet to report to the investigators.

Chief adviser to the pro-red-shirt Rak Chiang Mai 51 group, Petchawat Wattanapongsirikul, said his group has collected some 300,000 signatures to back the Royal Pardon campaign for ousted prime minister Thaksin Shinawatra and 30,000 of them will join the red-shirt rally to submit the petition in Bangkok on August 17.

Petchawat also said he is preparing to press charges against a high-profile Cabinet member but declined to give further details, claiming only that he has obtained solid evidence to prove a severe criminal offence by the minister.

-- Tan Network 2009-08-07

[sriracha john]

Two other red-shirt supporters who faced the same charges, Jack Pattaya and

Jack Pattaya?

Chief adviser to the pro-red-shirt Rak Chiang Mai 51 group, Petchawat Wattanapongsirikul, said his group has collected some 300,000 signatures to back the Royal Pardon campaign for ousted prime minister Thaksin Shinawatra

a violent gang of criminally-charged thugs is a wonderful association for the Reds petition attempt.

Edited August 7, 2009 by sriracha john

[sriracha john]

Three Chiang Mai Red Shirt leaders surrender to police

CHIANG MAI, Aug 7 (TNA) – Three anti-government United Front for Democracy against Dictatorship (UDD) leaders in the northern province of Chiang Mai turned themselves in to the police for their alleged involvement in clashes with the police last month.

Arrest warrants were issued for five local leaders of the UDD in connection with disturbances during the visit of Finance Minister Korn Chatikavanij to the province in July.

Apichat Insorn, Somchai Kunacharatdej, and Sarayuth Suyasak on Friday surrendered to police at Phupingrajanivej police station while two others are still at large.

The five local UDD leaders were charged with illegal assembly by more than 10 persons, inciting chaos, and obstructing police operations during the two-day visit of Finance Minister to Chiang Mai on July 16-17.

However, the trio later on Friday were released on Bt300,000 bail.

In mid-July, the UDD in Chiang Mai, supporters of convicted and on-the-run ex-prime minister Thaksin Shinawatra, protested near Chiang Mai University, where Mr Korn met government officials discussing policy implementation.

Some police were hurt during the clash as they tried to block protesters from entering the university.

Another clash between Thaksin supporters and the authorities occurred at a police station where a leading UDD member was detained after being arrested earlier for possession of a handgun and ammunition at Chiang Mai airport.

-- TNA 2009-08-07