If You Had To To It All Again (retire To A Different Country)

[ThailandLovr]

I was thinking about that recent article in Forbes about the desirable retirement spots, #2 of which is Thailand, and began to wonder where I would go if I had to leave Thailand for some reason, like a dramatically devalued $USD. I thought about Panama (also on the list), but then started to think further about what I would do differently based on what I've learned by retiring and living here for a few years.

I would certainly avoid at all costs letting a woman get her hooks into me early, but to live an Ian Forbes type existence and maintain my freedom.

I would also travel the country thoroughly to sample the various locations, etc.

What would you do differently based on what you have learned/experienced?

Edited October 24, 2009 by ThailandLovr

[Ulysses G.]

Pretend I was here for the culture, instead of the nookie!

[dumball]

Stay where I was and appreciate the good life I already had , I had no complaints with my life or surroundings , just thought I could find a little more . In the overall picture , despite beng happy with my life , all I found was agravation of a different genre about which I can do sweet 'F' all , live and learn they say .

[wamberal]

My Thai wife and I have retired in Australia. We have no regrets. Our investments are in Australian dollars, we pay very little tax because dividends from Australian companies are heavily tax-advantaged here. The natural environment is good where we live, very little pollution. No political risks. No wars or other conflicts. No nuclear plants, no nuclear waste. Good security, we live in a high rise building. Good health care, we have full private cover.

Food is good and cheap, lots of fresh fruit and veges, seafood and of course great chicken and beef (we mostly buy organic).

Wonderful wine, good prices.

Australia is a great place to retire, the only disadvantage is that it is a lo-o-o-o-o-o-o-ong way when you travel to the rest of the world.

[samuibeachcomber]

I was thinking about that recent article in Forbes about the desirable retirement spots, #2 of which is Thailand, and began to wonder where I would go if I had to leave Thailand for some reason, like a dramatically devalued $USD. I thought about Panama (also on the list), but then started to think further about what I would do differently based on what I've learned by retiring and living here for a few years.

I would certainly avoid at all costs letting a woman get her hooks into me early, but to live an Ian Forbes type existence and maintain my freedom.

I would also travel the country thoroughly to sample the various locations, etc.

What would you do differently based on what you have learned/experienced?

like you i'd stay unattached for a long time,travel the country,otherwise nothing different.and not be like a kid in a candy shop.

Edited October 24, 2009 by samuibeachcomber

[givenall]

I was thinking about that recent article in Forbes about the desirable retirement spots, #2 of which is Thailand, and began to wonder where I would go if I had to leave Thailand for some reason, like a dramatically devalued $USD. I thought about Panama (also on the list), but then started to think further about what I would do differently based on what I've learned by retiring and living here for a few years.

I would certainly avoid at all costs letting a woman get her hooks into me early, but to live an Ian Forbes type existence and maintain my freedom.

I would also travel the country thoroughly to sample the various locations, etc.

What would you do differently based on what you have learned/experienced?

like you i'd stay unattached for a long time,travel the country,otherwise nothing different.and not be like a kid in a candy shop.

I do not have much experience yet. I have been here for couple years and so far so good. Sometime very frustrating but so was back home in US. I started a small business to keep busy and a hedge against inflation. I also teach a bit to keep my mind sharp. I learned early one the Thai lady want all your money and fast but learn to conserve and live like it is your last day in earth but plan to live till 100. Don’t waste

[lovelomsak]

I was thinking about that recent article in Forbes about the desirable retirement spots, #2 of which is Thailand, and began to wonder where I would go if I had to leave Thailand for some reason, like a dramatically devalued $USD. I thought about Panama (also on the list), but then started to think further about what I would do differently based on what I've learned by retiring and living here for a few years.

I would certainly avoid at all costs letting a woman get her hooks into me early, but to live an Ian Forbes type existence and maintain my freedom.

I would also travel the country thoroughly to sample the various locations, etc.

What would you do differently based on what you have learned/experienced?

Before retiring to Thailand I came every year for 2 months,for 17 years travelled all over the country, now live here single and free to so as I please. Cannot understand guys coming here, marrying, buying houses etc. Even now I think sometimes of trying somewhere else and know I can go in a matter of days or weeks, just sell the truck and motorcycle and give everything else away And there are many places out there with lots to offer also.If I go I will stay single there too,why give up retired freedoms for anything.

Many South America countries are great and language is must easier to speak.

So from my experiences I would change nothing. Life is good and at the moment I am in Thailand.

[siamamerican]

[

Before retiring to Thailand I came every year for 2 months,for 17 years travelled all over the country, now live here single and free to so as I please. Cannot understand guys coming here, marrying, buying houses etc. Even now I think sometimes of trying somewhere else and know I can go in a matter of days or weeks, just sell the truck and motorcycle and give everything else away And there are many places out there with lots to offer also.If I go I will stay single there too,why give up retired freedoms for anything.

Many South America countries are great and language is must easier to speak.

So from my experiences I would change nothing. Life is good and at the moment I am in Thailand.

Been where you're at and completely enjoyed the experience but never say never. Just takes, in your eyes, one beautiful women to alter your best laid out plans.

Edited October 25, 2009 by siamamerican

[sokal]

I was thinking about that recent article in Forbes about the desirable retirement spots, #2 of which is Thailand, and began to wonder where I would go if I had to leave Thailand for some reason, like a dramatically devalued $USD. I thought about Panama (also on the list), but then started to think further about what I would do differently based on what I've learned by retiring and living here for a few years.

I would certainly avoid at all costs letting a woman get her hooks into me early, but to live an Ian Forbes type existence and maintain my freedom.

I would also travel the country thoroughly to sample the various locations, etc.

What would you do differently based on what you have learned/experienced?

How early is too early for a woman?

Is it a big deal just to have some random girlfriend ?

[sokal]

My Thai wife and I have retired in Australia. We have no regrets. Our investments are in Australian dollars, we pay very little tax because dividends from Australian companies are heavily tax-advantaged here. The natural environment is good where we live, very little pollution. No political risks. No wars or other conflicts. No nuclear plants, no nuclear waste. Good security, we live in a high rise building. Good health care, we have full private cover.

Food is good and cheap, lots of fresh fruit and veges, seafood and of course great chicken and beef (we mostly buy organic).

Wonderful wine, good prices.

Australia is a great place to retire, the only disadvantage is that it is a lo-o-o-o-o-o-o-ong way when you travel to the rest of the world.

What about the trade wars and currency wars that aussyland is and will be fighting with China ?

Are those RioTinto executives still in jail in China ?

[a2396]

My Thai wife and I have retired in Australia. We have no regrets. Our investments are in Australian dollars, we pay very little tax because dividends from Australian companies are heavily tax-advantaged here. The natural environment is good where we live, very little pollution. No political risks. No wars or other conflicts. No nuclear plants, no nuclear waste. Good security, we live in a high rise building. Good health care, we have full private cover.

Food is good and cheap, lots of fresh fruit and veges, seafood and of course great chicken and beef (we mostly buy organic).

Wonderful wine, good prices.

Australia is a great place to retire, the only disadvantage is that it is a lo-o-o-o-o-o-o-ong way when you travel to the rest of the world.

I would think a major disadvantage is the cost of living in Australia. Could not possibly be as cheap as Thailand. How much do you have to put up to get a retirement visa there??

[ThaiPauly]

Stay where I was and appreciate the good life I already had , I had no complaints with my life or surroundings , just thought I could find a little more . In the overall picture , despite beng happy with my life , all I found was agravation of a different genre about which I can do sweet 'F' all , live and learn they say .

This would be exactly my response

Thanks for saving me time

[Donnyboy]

My Thai wife and I have retired in Australia. We have no regrets. Our investments are in Australian dollars, we pay very little tax because dividends from Australian companies are heavily tax-advantaged here. The natural environment is good where we live, very little pollution. No political risks. No wars or other conflicts. No nuclear plants, no nuclear waste. Good security, we live in a high rise building. Good health care, we have full private cover.

Food is good and cheap, lots of fresh fruit and veges, seafood and of course great chicken and beef (we mostly buy organic).

Wonderful wine, good prices.

Australia is a great place to retire, the only disadvantage is that it is a lo-o-o-o-o-o-o-ong way when you travel to the rest of the world.

nz would be a great place as well but the cost of living vs Thailand is so much higher

the govt just passed a bill where people can receive their full pension overseas now

[Ricardo]

Personally I would try to defer some of the expense involved, in building a new home here, until I was actually living here. We did our best, from several thousand miles away, to monitor the construction and ensure that we got reasonable value-for-money, using an architect to monitor the builder and send us pictures by email every week.

But with hindsight might have designed/built something slightly different, once we had the experience of living here for a few years, not just long-visits. On the other hand, this would have meant 2 moves, instead of 1, which would have been very trying.

However no regrets ... the decision to move here was definitely one of our better ones !

[JR Texas]

Personally I would try to defer some of the expense involved, in building a new home here, until I was actually living here. We did our best, from several thousand miles away, to monitor the construction and ensure that we got reasonable value-for-money, using an architect to monitor the builder and send us pictures by email every week.

But with hindsight might have designed/built something slightly different, once we had the experience of living here for a few years, not just long-visits. On the other hand, this would have meant 2 moves, instead of 1, which would have been very trying.

However no regrets ... the decision to move here was definitely one of our better ones !

I've been here 23 years (nice back then) and have seen way too many negative changes, especially over the past ten years (many if not most seem to be based on a rising tide of xenophobia).

If I could do it over again there is no way I would even remotely consider Thailand as a place to retire......no way in hel_l.

There is the Thailand myth and the Thailand reality..........the myth is much better.

If fascinated with a Thai woman.....marry her and leave the country (simple solution......and most want to leave).

If I could do it over, I would probably be living in a house on the coast of Chile or Panama or Costa Rica.

Closer to Thailand, I think all of the following places are better for retirement now: Bali, New Zealand, Australia, Cambodia, Vietnam, Malaysia.

If you insist on embracing the myth, my advice is that you don't invest in anything (e.g., real estate, business) or get seriously involved with a woman.........period!

That will make your life easier...........IMHO.

[ThaiPauly]

Personally I would try to defer some of the expense involved, in building a new home here, until I was actually living here. We did our best, from several thousand miles away, to monitor the construction and ensure that we got reasonable value-for-money, using an architect to monitor the builder and send us pictures by email every week.

But with hindsight might have designed/built something slightly different, once we had the experience of living here for a few years, not just long-visits. On the other hand, this would have meant 2 moves, instead of 1, which would have been very trying.

However no regrets ... the decision to move here was definitely one of our better ones !

I've been here 23 years (nice back then) and have seen way too many negative changes, especially over the past ten years (many if not most seem to be based on a rising tide of xenophobia).

If I could do it over again there is no way I would even remotely consider Thailand as a place to retire......no way in hel_l.

There is the Thailand myth and the Thailand reality..........the myth is much better.

If fascinated with a Thai woman.....marry her and leave the country (simple solution......and most want to leave).

If I could do it over, I would probably be living in a house on the coast of Chile or Panama or Costa Rica.

Closer to Thailand, I think all of the following places are better for retirement now: Bali, New Zealand, Australia, Cambodia, Vietnam, Malaysia.

If you insist on embracing the myth, my advice is that you don't invest in anything (e.g., real estate, business) or get seriously involved with a woman.........period!

That will make your life easier...........IMHO.

So why are you still here?

[JR Texas]

So why are you still here?

Answering that would not address the OPs question.........my situation is complicated, and I am not always here (fortunately).

[ThailandLovr]

So why are you still here?

Answering that would not address the OPs question.........my situation is complicated, and I am not always here (fortunately).

Never mind. I'm the OP. Please feel free to answer if you would sir. I know many others would like to know. Reasons for your discontent with Thailand may be useful for some people to know. Up to you of course, JR.

[Ulysses G.]

Personally I would try to defer some of the expense involved, in building a new home here, until I was actually living here. We did our best, from several thousand miles away, to monitor the construction and ensure that we got reasonable value-for-money, using an architect to monitor the builder and send us pictures by email every week.

But with hindsight might have designed/built something slightly different, once we had the experience of living here for a few years, not just long-visits. On the other hand, this would have meant 2 moves, instead of 1, which would have been very trying.

However no regrets ... the decision to move here was definitely one of our better ones !

I've been here 23 years (nice back then) and have seen way too many negative changes, especially over the past ten years (many if not most seem to be based on a rising tide of xenophobia).

If I could do it over again there is no way I would even remotely consider Thailand as a place to retire......no way in hel_l.

There is the Thailand myth and the Thailand reality..........the myth is much better.

If fascinated with a Thai woman.....marry her and leave the country (simple solution......and most want to leave).

If I could do it over, I would probably be living in a house on the coast of Chile or Panama or Costa Rica.

Closer to Thailand, I think all of the following places are better for retirement now: Bali, New Zealand, Australia, Cambodia, Vietnam, Malaysia.

If you insist on embracing the myth, my advice is that you don't invest in anything (e.g., real estate, business) or get seriously involved with a woman.........period!

That will make your life easier...........IMHO.

So why are you still here?

There is not enough to complain about in other countries.

[gmac]

I do not have much experience yet. I have been here for couple years and so far so good. Sometime very frustrating but so was back home in US. I started a small business to keep busy and a hedge against inflation. I also teach a bit to keep my mind sharp. I learned early one the Thai lady want all your money and fast but learn to conserve and live like it is your last day in earth but plan to live till 100. Don’t waste

Good theory about planning to live to 100! Unfortunately if you leave your assets outside Thailand you are at the mercy of exchange rates and interest rates wherever those assets may be...... .my 100 year plan is currently being hastily revised for the third time to get me past 65!!

[JR Texas]

So why are you still here?

Answering that would not address the OPs question.........my situation is complicated, and I am not always here (fortunately).

Never mind. I'm the OP. Please feel free to answer if you would sir. I know many others would like to know. Reasons for your discontent with Thailand may be useful for some people to know. Up to you of course, JR.

The place has changed, especially over the past ten years.

It used to be expat friendly....now it is not expat friendly (the visa and business rules reflect this). In fact, many of us have the impression they want us all to pack up and leave (many of my friends have already left and others are contemplating it).

The cost of living has gone way up (it is no longer the bargain it used to be).

Pollution--both air and people--has increased in Chiang Mai, Bangkok, Phuket, Hua Hin, and Pattaya-Jomtien (this has caused stress.........in the past it was far less stressful).

Corruption at all levels has increased.

Xenophobia has increased.......no question about it.

Sanook factor has diminished.

Nothing seems to work........again, stressful........I have never been around such incompetent people.

It is gaining a reputation, not as the land of smiles, but as the land of xenophobic thieves, liars, and cheats.

It is no longer mysterious and exotic........at least not for me.

I find other Asian women far more attractive and interesting than Thai women.

Other places surrounding Thailand have benefited greatly from Thailand's mistakes and are becoming more attractive as expat retirement destinations.

Need more?

[Ulysses G.]

I remember old timer expats complaining about all these same things when I first came here to live 20 years ago.

The only ones that I agree with is the bars don't have as many dirty shows as they used to and things are more expensive because there is a much bigger, better choice than before. All the great new restaurants and imported foods, music and books; computers and modern necessities add up.

All of my buddies that came here at the same time that I did think that Thailand keeps getting better and better and I agree.

[wamberal]

My Thai wife and I have retired in Australia. We have no regrets. Our investments are in Australian dollars, we pay very little tax because dividends from Australian companies are heavily tax-advantaged here. The natural environment is good where we live, very little pollution. No political risks. No wars or other conflicts. No nuclear plants, no nuclear waste. Good security, we live in a high rise building. Good health care, we have full private cover.

Food is good and cheap, lots of fresh fruit and veges, seafood and of course great chicken and beef (we mostly buy organic).

Wonderful wine, good prices.

Australia is a great place to retire, the only disadvantage is that it is a lo-o-o-o-o-o-o-ong way when you travel to the rest of the world.

What about the trade wars and currency wars that aussyland is and will be fighting with China ?

Are those RioTinto executives still in jail in China ?

The Rio Tinto execs are still in custody. I doubt that there are in a normal Chinese gaol, though.

Australia does not have either a trade war, or a currency war, with China. China would like to buy some of our strategic assets, but correctly in my opinion the Government has to approve major strategic acquisitions by overseas corporations - there would be little point in allowing our biggest customers to buy the Australian companies that own hugely valuable natural resources.

Our biggest trade war is probably with the US, we would like better access for our agricultural products there.

[wamberal]

My Thai wife and I have retired in Australia. We have no regrets. Our investments are in Australian dollars, we pay very little tax because dividends from Australian companies are heavily tax-advantaged here. The natural environment is good where we live, very little pollution. No political risks. No wars or other conflicts. No nuclear plants, no nuclear waste. Good security, we live in a high rise building. Good health care, we have full private cover.

Food is good and cheap, lots of fresh fruit and veges, seafood and of course great chicken and beef (we mostly buy organic).

Wonderful wine, good prices.

Australia is a great place to retire, the only disadvantage is that it is a lo-o-o-o-o-o-o-ong way when you travel to the rest of the world.

I would think a major disadvantage is the cost of living in Australia. Could not possibly be as cheap as Thailand. How much do you have to put up to get a retirement visa there??

The question of relative cost of living is an interesting one, far too complex to explore fully here. But we would probably have to spend something like the same for a home in Thailand to match what we have here. Of course the run of the mill household expenses would be lower, but we would have to employ some staff, which adds to the costs.

Money is not everything, quality counts as well. Frankly, we could not replicate some of the cafes and restaurants that we enjoy here in Australia if we lived in Thailand, no matter how much we spent. Conversely, there are plenty of superb Thai restaurants here, and the ingredients are mostly better quality in Oz.

I have not thought about the cost of a retirement visa in Oz, because we are citizens. There is a very big migration intake for people with the right qualifications/experience - it is worth exploring this for expats thinking about retirement options in the future.

[tmwke]

So why are you still here?

Answering that would not address the OPs question.........my situation is complicated, and I am not always here (fortunately).

Never mind. I'm the OP. Please feel free to answer if you would sir. I know many others would like to know. Reasons for your discontent with Thailand may be useful for some people to know. Up to you of course, JR.

The place has changed, especially over the past ten years.

It used to be expat friendly....now it is not expat friendly (the visa and business rules reflect this). In fact, many of us have the impression they want us all to pack up and leave (many of my friends have already left and others are contemplating it).

The cost of living has gone way up (it is no longer the bargain it used to be).

Pollution--both air and people--has increased in Chiang Mai, Bangkok, Phuket, Hua Hin, and Pattaya-Jomtien (this has caused stress.........in the past it was far less stressful).

Corruption at all levels has increased.

Xenophobia has increased.......no question about it.

Sanook factor has diminished.

Nothing seems to work........again, stressful........I have never been around such incompetent people.

It is gaining a reputation, not as the land of smiles, but as the land of xenophobic thieves, liars, and cheats.

It is no longer mysterious and exotic........at least not for me.

I find other Asian women far more attractive and interesting than Thai women.

Other places surrounding Thailand have benefited greatly from Thailand's mistakes and are becoming more attractive as expat retirement destinations.

Need more?

I am sorry to say you are correct !

[cecco]

I was thinking about that recent article in Forbes about the desirable retirement spots, #2 of which is Thailand, and began to wonder where I would go if I had to leave Thailand for some reason, like a dramatically devalued $USD. I thought about Panama (also on the list), but then started to think further about what I would do differently based on what I've learned by retiring and living here for a few years.

I would certainly avoid at all costs letting a woman get her hooks into me early, but to live an Ian Forbes type existence and maintain my freedom.

I would also travel the country thoroughly to sample the various locations, etc.

What would you do differently based on what you have learned/experienced?

If I had to do it all over again:

Well, firstly, I'd stay away from any of the "Bar, and sex" cities.

Secondly, my experiences and serious loss of discretionary revenues, have given me great wisdom. What wisdom ever comes without pain?

Thirdly, I love being retired here.

Fourthly, I live in Pai, which is beautiful and peaceful, like the view of the mountains and banana trees as I sit and type this letter. I love it here, except for the allergies.

Fifthly, Learn to think like a Thai and be offended like a Thai. The other day I was checking out of my hotel in a certain city, and I know the hotel is owned by a certain top Thai person. He owns more than 1 in the city. As I got to the door to check out, of a hotel I stay it every month, this security guy whom I do not know, walked up and rubbed my stomach, and giggled in my face. This is unthinkable behavior for a Thai and for a hotel which is owned by certain people in Thai society. As my driver was getting me and going to whisk me back to Pai, I pulled out my trusty Nokia, made a few phone calls, and sent a few emails to top level management. Have now been assured that the young man is no longer there, and indeed meeting very high level officials over this action. The economic aspect of the katote is awaiting me upon my return later this month.

Sixthly, Chantaburi is a good place. I have been to Burma, actually I love Burma, except for the currency problem. I do not think that investing here is a good idea, unless you are a bar owner in one of the lascivious cities. I prefer to live the way I am where I can live very well here, eat in restaurants every night without fear of the bill to come, and pay off a 30 year mortgage in the usa in 10 years, whilst the rest of the country (USA) is getting their homes repossessed.

Seventhly, I would avoid Lisu like the plague which comprise 40% + of Pai, no matter how BEAUTIFUL they are on the outside, which is often amazingly beautiful.

Khon paa (คนป่า) = the wild ones, people in jungle

Lastly, DOES ANYBODY KNOW WHERE, IN N. THAILAND, I CAN GO TO GET A GOOD PRICE AND SELECTION ON A SILVER NECKLACE AND BRACELET? IF SO CAN YOU MSG ME AND PM ME AS WELL? THANK YOU.

[Suiken]

The place has changed, especially over the past ten years.

It used to be expat friendly....now it is not expat friendly (the visa and business rules reflect this). In fact, many of us have the impression they want us all to pack up and leave (many of my friends have already left and others are contemplating it).

The cost of living has gone way up (it is no longer the bargain it used to be).

Pollution--both air and people--has increased in Chiang Mai, Bangkok, Phuket, Hua Hin, and Pattaya-Jomtien (this has caused stress.........in the past it was far less stressful).

Corruption at all levels has increased.

Xenophobia has increased.......no question about it.

Sanook factor has diminished.

Nothing seems to work........again, stressful........I have never been around such incompetent people.

It is gaining a reputation, not as the land of smiles, but as the land of xenophobic thieves, liars, and cheats.

It is no longer mysterious and exotic........at least not for me.

I find other Asian women far more attractive and interesting than Thai women.

Other places surrounding Thailand have benefited greatly from Thailand's mistakes and are becoming more attractive as expat retirement destinations.

Need more?

care to go into more detail about this? I would like to know, thinking about moving there soon

[Thakkar]

The place has changed, especially over the past ten years.

<snip>

It is no longer mysterious and exotic........at least not for me.

<snip>

After ten years, it souldn't be, unless one's never left the house.

Edited July 23, 2010 by Thakkar

[buddy]

Fifthly, Learn to think like a Thai and be offended like a Thai. The other day I was checking out of my hotel in a certain city, and I know the hotel is owned by a certain top Thai person. He owns more than 1 in the city. As I got to the door to check out, of a hotel I stay it every month, this security guy whom I do not know, walked up and rubbed my stomach, and giggled in my face. This is unthinkable behavior for a Thai and for a hotel which is owned by certain people in Thai society. As my driver was getting me and going to whisk me back to Pai, I pulled out my trusty Nokia, made a few phone calls, and sent a few emails to top level management. Have now been assured that the young man is no longer there, and indeed meeting very high level officials over this action. The economic aspect of the katote is awaiting me upon my return later this month.

You sound full of your own self importance.

Not man enough to complain to the Hotel Management about your displeasure, doing it that way the man would have learnt the error of his ways and probably still had a job.

[chriswatson]

I was thinking the same. Be a man, say it to the face, not behind the back. Sort of thing you learn to do in the playground in the west. Unless you're a coward.

Although, I guess technically speaking, this probably is the way a Thai would have dealt with it too - given the whole "face" excuse.

Wouldn't want to be that way myself though. Would find it difficult to live with myself if I cost a guy his job for something I could easily have sorted out with his immediate management. Might make me think I really should get back on that diet if my stomach is so noticable.

By using his "trusty Nokia" (Cripes, it's not a gun!) I think the poster just wanted to see if he could prove his own importance to himself.