Have You Been To India?

[camerata]

I visited India on the Hippie Trail in 1971. Crossed the border from Pakistan a week before war broke out. Roadblocks and soldiers everywhere. Deafening air-raid siren testing in the mornings at 6am. During one nighttime blackout test in Bombay a photo shot from an overhead aircraft showed the city lit up like a Christmas tree!

Travelling alone and young at the time it sometimes got me down that huge crowds would sometimes gather around me and stand staring with their mouths open (I had very long hair at the time), but sometimes a middle-class Indian would rescue me and chase the crowd away. Middle-class Indians were generally friendly and helpful, and spoke English, but it was a different story in the small villages I passed through where English was understood but not spoken much. And I got irritated at the constant question: "Are you are tourist or a hippie?" It was as if these were the only two castes for foreigners and you had to belong to one of them.

I have fond memories of the "vegetable cutlets" I ate at railway station restaurants, samosas and masala dhosa. But I did get all kinds of nasty stomach ailments and a painful ear infection.

I tried to avoid places like Goa and Kashmir where there were a lot of hippies. I did get to go inside the Golden Temple of the Sikhs at Amritsar and visit the Taj Mahal though. Got stuck in Bombay for 3 weeks while I was sick, and discovered years later that Charles Sobhraj had been there at the same time.

On the whole I enjoyed Nepal more because it was so laid back and hassle-free. I can't remember why I didn't continue on to Thailand - I think there were rumours that you had to get a haircut to enter Thailand, Malaysia and Singapore. Also, I was short of cash.

In the end I left on a ship for Kuwait, sleeping on the deck, and sold my blood there before continuing overland through Iraq and Syria to southern Turkey.

If I went back to India now it would be to see the various sites associated with the Buddha.

[bannork]

For anyone who loves adventure, beautiful colours,( the saris) and a Monty Python sense of humour,India is a must. Holy men covered in ash and bound in chains, chanting on the pavement in Delhi for days on end; a holy man in Goa with long flowing silver locks and a gold painted staff, producing a coconut shell and asking for beer. Hundreds of men defecating on the railway line at dawn, etc.Passengers making a beeline to reserve the luggage racks for sleeping, not for luggage.

I spent a year in India, 6 months for 2 winters in the mid 1980s, went everywhere except Kashmir; the temples, colourful processions, wonderful driving rhythmic music, friendly people and vastness of the countryside leave a kaleidoscope of impressions on the mind

After a while however I realised it was difficult to talk to any Indian woman except for the occasional middle class one I met, Hindu or Muslim cultural mores saw to that, in the restaurants you would be served by a man in a filthy apron, men would stare at you asking,' where are you coming from?' Once you said England he would reply,' Ah, you are knowing my brother in Ealing, yes,sir?'

Amusing at first but ultimately wearing and wearying, in my view the Thais possess much more diplomacy in this field, they sense if you want to talk or not, เกรงใจ. Regarding train journeys, I've always found the Thais in the third class very friendly, whilst the second class seem more reserved,(no pun intended)!

The beaches in Thailand are far more spectacular, Ao Nang in Krabi for example. When I first came to Thailand I was disappointed with the western dress of the Thais, ( they should all be native, ###### it!), and I remembered how the village Indian women would walk so gracefully due to carrying water jars in their head, but for those living in Issan, Thailand isn't plastic or sanitised, there is still plenty of authentic living culture.

India for experiences, good and bad, to impress your friends, Thailand for a happy and contented life.

[Kerryd]

Well, I don't know too much about India, having only passed through Delhi twice now (in transit to Thailand !). I wasn't very impressed by what I saw there though. We have a large number of Indians working with us here, great guys individually, but most people here would trade them for Nepalese workers in a flash.

While the people (in Delhi) were friendly (for the most part), every where I stayed looked like it was on the verge of collapse. I couldn't afford 5 (or 7) star hotels, but even the Ashok Hotel, with it's uniformed valets, looked run-down (I have to go there each trip for business reasons). The "cheaper" (i.e. backpacker) hotels were worse than what you find in the slums of Vancouver, and way more expensive (55 US a night, broken air-conditioner, filthy fridge, worn out towels, 2 channel TV, and then there was the bathroom, ugh)

The food was great, though I had no idea what I was eating at times. The cows in the streets reminded me of the soi dogs in Thailand (scavenging for food, crapping every where, malnourished and mangy looking).

The area I stay in is near the railway station. According to some of the Indians here, it's not considered a good part of the city ( a lot of crime and unsavoury characters running around). Very confusing trying to get around without a map.

At one "guesthouse" I stayed in, the staff were reluctant to let me out of the place after I had checked in. I wanted to go to a restaraunt, they wouldn't tell me where any were close by, not even where they got their room service from. I wanted to go down the block to buy some ciggies, when I looked back over my shoulder, 3 of the staff were were watching me (in case I got mugged I guess, as I had already paid for the room so they didn't have to worry about me skipping on the bill). I guessed that after I noticed groups of people stopping and staring at me as I walked by. Felt like I had a target painted on my back.

I'll go back again some time in the future, as there are places I'd like to see (like Agra), and the areas near Nepal that Buddha started out in. I'll probably spend more time in Nepal though.

I should note that some of my fellow co-workers here have gone to India on holiday and had a great time (though for one guy, the highlight of his 3 week trip seemed to be going for an elephant ride around a market square).

Maybe I'm just too cynical to enjoy it, or I've been spoiled (rotten) by my experiences in Thailand. We'll see what happens when I go to Egypt in July (if I have the same attitude in a different place).

[Totster]

I've been to Sri Lanka ... does that count...?

totster

[bina]

tutsi, my folks just came back from india (with bronchitis due to pollution in nepal and new delhi) nepal and singapore; two new york jews (yekke types no less) and they loved every smelly minute of it....

they loved egypt

israel (my home) drives them bonkers , maybe cause here they're not really tourists but visitors to family and do daily stuff with us

they liked nepal but left the day of the last insurgencie (january)

they are now planning china.... go figure.... why not thailand,laos etc i asked?

myfather is deathly allergic to shellfish and every other sauce has crab shrimp etc... and they wont eat kosher cause its tastless...same in vietnam, etc

dad wanted malaysia, mom said: we're jews, theyre moslems... no go (egypt is not the same, after all moses lived there)

and they are almost 70... i was just told they are usuing up all their funds by having fun cause u cant take it with u and they've given us (their daughters) our inheritance when we got married and thats it...

they wished they'd gone to india when they were younger, for a longer period of time to really travel...they think i might even like it (i hate crowds, large amounts of people, etc)due to the colours smells and sounds, not to mention animals walking around....

[NextStationBangkok]

How are these Cabaret places?

Life Isn't a Cabaret

BOMBAY (Reuters) - Indian authorities have decided to close some 600 cabarets in the commercial capital Bombay, a government spokesman said Wednesday, robbing the country's entertainment hub of one of its major attractions.

The move by the western state of Maharashtra, of which Bombay is the capital, to shut down cabarets that employ girls to dance follows fears that they corrupt youth, threaten local culture and encourage prostitution, he said.

The move follows a decision last month to close nearly 650 of these establishments elsewhere in Maharashtra.

"The cabinet last night approved a proposal to close the bars in Bombay as well, as they had a bad influence on society," the government spokesman said.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

The good news is all the Dance girls moved/relocated to Bangalore now . So nothing to worry. There are many flights daily to Bangalore which is Sillicon Vally of India and going to be Gate way of South India soon. It is called by Pub City or Garden City in general. Bangalore has Asia's oldest Golf course which is established by British. If anyone want to explore British History in India, better take a tour in the south there are many, especially in Chennai. Air ticket to Bangloare is only 11500. You can easily reach any one of the four southern states in a night travel by Bus/Train/Air.

[Soph]

I spent 6 months travelling all over India when I was 19, it was my first trip out of Europe and I spent the first week hiding in my hotel room in Dehli - every time I stepped out I was confronted by something really weird and fuc*ked up and my brain couldnt handle it.

Shortly after, I completely fell in love with the place, the diversity and the culture, the different aspects of the religions the funny people and of course the railway system!

It certaily spoiled the rest of my travelling experiences a little bit as I have always made comparisons to India and no-where else I have been has ever matched up.

I did have huge plans to go back there, but now I feel I experienced everything I could there, so have no reason to visit again.

[bdenner]

I voted for the last option but I might rethink that after seeing a lot of complimentary posts here on India. Having never been there I was given a very bad impression of it’s people after a number of working trips to Fiji whose population is close to 50% Indian.

Apologies to Vijay Sing – You’re the man!

[Shivek]

I cant believe this, Thai people and have so positive comments about India? All Thais who i meet and talk about India from them say its shit and i wanna shake them and show them what my India is. Its Incredible India! When i get home, i would share to u my memories in India. Really wonderful place and thanks all for giving India so positive comments. You made my day.

Edited September 6, 2005 by Shivek

[Shivek]

Dont forget Bollywood and some excellent Hindi movies. I love them and my country.

[NextStationBangkok]

This is a myth created among foreigners, saying India is full of beggars, people starving for food etc. It is really not.

India is different than any other countries in the world, you can see mixed culture and life style there. Poor and rich living together, While traveling you might noticed difference in cloths, food, language, culture etc in every 200-300 Miles. General complain about India is people are poor, but why no one is analyzing they are happy and enough, materializing and comfort is not life, after all you have leave them when you die. Now we are spoiling our nature by cutting the trees and industrialized for what ? Tsunamis, Typhoons, Hurricanes, Earth Quakes, Flood, Drought, so many natural desasters. Read Mahatma Gandhi’s books you will understand what India is. , when Tsunami hit Indians did not beg anyone in the world, they fixed themselves, did you see Clinton amazed and crying on the TV seen the relief efforts? India has 200 Million Muslims living though Hindu is majority. Don't you amaze that India is the largest democracy in the world after so many differences? Moreover Indian president is a Muslim, Prime Minister is a Sikh, Ruling Party Leader is a Catholic, Ruling party supporter is a Communist and opposition party leader is hardliner Hindu. This is unique in the world every religion has given equal importance. Indian definitely has all the rights to get permanent seat in the UN with Veto power.

[Shivek]

This is a myth created among foreigners, saying India is full of beggars, people starving for food etc. It is really not. 

India is different than any other countries in the world, you can see mixed culture and life style there. Poor and rich living together, While traveling you might noticed difference in cloths, food, language, culture etc in every 200-300 Miles. General complain about India is people are poor, but why no one is analyzing they are happy and enough, materializing and comfort is not life, after all you have leave them when you die. Now we are spoiling our nature by cutting the trees and industrialized for what ? Tsunamis, Typhoons, Hurricanes, Earth Quakes, Flood, Drought, so many natural desasters. Read Mahatma Gandhi’s books you will understand what India is. , when Tsunami hit Indians did not beg anyone in the world, they fixed themselves, did you see Clinton amazed and crying on the TV seen the relief efforts? India has 200 Million Muslims living though Hindu is majority. Don't you amaze that India is the largest democracy in the world after so many differences? Moreover Indian president is a Muslim, Prime Minister is a Sikh, Ruling Party Leader is a Catholic, Ruling party supporter is a Communist and opposition party leader is hardliner Hindu. This is unique in the world every religion has given equal importance. Indian definitely has all the rights to get permanent seat in the UN with Veto power. 

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

What a great post! Thanks for clearing this to some people who dont know anything and start talking bad.

[englishoak]

Great country, lovely people, total chaos and by far the most endearing place iv'e been.

Quite a few years back I decided to the world tour travelling thing.

First destination on the list was India. In fact at the end of my tour I went back 2 years later and it was just as mad as the first time

Conclusion: After the India experience every other place was a breeze. My Thai wife realy wants to visit but she can't get her head around the fact that.

1 the foods not that good

2 there is no such thing as ice

3 the cleanliness is less than perfect

[pluto_manibo]

I visited India on the Hippie Trail in 1971. Crossed the border from Pakistan a week before war broke out. Roadblocks and soldiers everywhere. Deafening air-raid siren testing in the mornings at 6am. During one nighttime blackout test in Bombay a photo shot from an overhead aircraft showed the city lit up like a Christmas tree!

Travelling alone and young at the time it sometimes got me down that huge crowds would sometimes gather around me and stand staring with their mouths open (I had very long hair at the time), but sometimes a middle-class Indian would rescue me and chase the crowd away. Middle-class Indians were generally friendly and helpful, and spoke English, but it was a different story in the small villages I passed through where English was understood but not spoken much. And I got irritated at the constant question: "Are you are tourist or a hippie?" It was as if these were the only two castes for foreigners and you had to belong to one of them.

I have fond memories of the "vegetable cutlets" I ate at railway station restaurants, samosas and masala dhosa. But I did get all kinds of nasty stomach ailments and a painful ear infection.

I tried to avoid places like Goa and Kashmir where there were a lot of hippies. I did get to go inside the Golden Temple of the Sikhs at Amritsar and visit the Taj Mahal though. Got stuck in Bombay for 3 weeks while I was sick, and discovered years later that Charles Sobhraj had been there at the same time.

On the whole I enjoyed Nepal more because it was so laid back and hassle-free. I can't remember why I didn't continue on to Thailand - I think there were rumours that you had to get a haircut to enter Thailand, Malaysia and Singapore. Also, I was short of cash.

In the end I left on a ship for Kuwait, sleeping on the deck, and sold my blood there before continuing overland through Iraq and Syria to southern Turkey.

If I went back to India now it would be to see the various sites associated with the Buddha.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Charles Sobhraj A book about his life was written, an amazing read, "Sepentine". He was released a couple of years ago and lives in Paris.

My fond memories of India, include Sitting on my balcony staring at the Himalayas in Vashisht and renting an enfield to make the trip to/from manali. The goat cheese sandwiches in a small tibetan stall with lots of Chais. The long walks in the mountains, the Tibetan villages, herb growing everywhere, the hot days and cold cold nights.....Bagsu Nag was another slice of heaven next to Dharamsala. Hanging out with the shepherds, having a chat and a chai with the Tibetan monks whilst washing our clothes in the river....The "secret" little hideaway on top of the mountain, playing guitars, bongos, backgammon, the Daila Lamas'Temple, the herd of monkeys which would rob us(banana cakes and lemon pies) on the way back from Dharamsala,...Time would fly. Pushkar in the middle of Rajasthan, sitting on the rooftops doing kite wars just before sunset, chasing monkeys away( the white ones with the long tails), trekking with camels, baking bread in camel dung, smoking beedhees, trading all my shirts for the Hotel bill, which was heavily padded by our host Shiva, amazing Italian food cooked by Indians...Beautiful sunsets and religious ceremonies in this holy place....The vibrant colours of the turbans, the camels, the desert, the music really makes Rajasthan a place to visit...apart from Jaipur which was not appealing (as a poster has stated before)...This is just scratching the surface of my memories of 7 yrs ago. I would love to go back as well. Although, there were some horible aspects of my stay as well, the adventure is one well worth doing. Be prepared to lose a few kilos though, and get out of Dehli fast, concentrate on a section of India at a time, don't rush, or cram as many places as you can in one go....India is also about taking time. Himachal Pradesh is Definetely Shangri La, the most beautiful mountain region I have ever seen...Some people love it, others hate it!

Strangely, leaving was a necessity after a couple of months, I remember all the flights to Bangkok from Dehli had long waiting lists, so I made my ex-gf(thai), cry in front of the desk, so we could cut the line ....we got the last 2 seats!! It was good to leave but somehow a part of you seems to stay there.....it really changes a person....

[taxexile]

include Sitting on my balcony staring at the Himalayas in Vashisht

took the bus from manali through vashisht to the top of the pass , frightning journey in an overcrowded bus full of hashish smoking westerners and bemused indian tourists.

at the top watched some indian tourists who had never touched snow before go crazy up there , rolling around in it , throwing it over each other , saw barefoot shepherds up there bringing animals from ladakh over and down to manali , had tea in a stone and canvas chai hut and almost froze to death up there waiting for a ride back down.

on the way back down to manali , we stopped off at vashisht for a soak in the wonderful baths there , then had tea on the terrace outside with views up to those stupendous 20,000 foot peaks that dominate the area .

great times. 1983.wonder what its like there now. manali had the best porridge ive ever had.

[Shivek]

I reached Delhi and started hating it because of too many people and car horns. I went to Palika Bazaar and bought all the pirated PS2 and PC games i wanted. Then i went to Gurgaon and loved it as it had lots of huge malls to roam in and loved the Indian style cottage cheese pizza which they made in Pizza Hut. Then have the Indian food like kebabs, chicken dishes, and South Indian food. Who says Indian food is not good? It rocks! Then went to Rajasthan side and saw Udaipur and went to that hotel which is surrounded by lake. I forgot the name. Saw Kutb Minar and Red Fort in Delhi, too and they both are outstanding. Went to Agra to see Taj Mahal and it was just amazing! But Agra was not good otherwise. Stayed in Bombay and loved the city! I used to go to watch movies almost everyday and the city was rocking! Havent been to the South side yet but plan to go soon. How are the beaches in Kerala and how is the city? How is the south side? Incredible India!

[englishoak]

It was good to leave but somehow a part of you seems to stay there.....it really changes a person....

Could'nt agree more

[longway]

Its been a few years since ive been to india. i used to live in bangalore when it was still (somewhat) a sleepy town in south india, at that time they did not allow buidings over 4 stories or something. only had one called topkapi, near the symphony cinema on MG road. its changed since then!

going to india is always an experience, if you are not willing to immerse your senses in a totally unque country dont go there. good or bad it will leave its mark on you.

i am am going to ooty for a cousins wedding over christmas, reading tehse posts have really whetted my appetite and awoken some memories, lovely posts guys, great to read about your experiences.

[khall64au]

Aaaaah.... India. Love/hate, love/hate, love/hate!!!! Can't wait to go back

[Neeranam]

Nice to read through this topic again. I'm definately going back to India.

As for the guy who calls himself Ajarn - do you know how this makes you sound?

[Neeranam]

Mount Abu ...... yeah, HEAVEN! 2 months there! biggrin.gif

Did you go to madhuban? I did

[Tywais]

Spent some time in Bombay.

Things do go better with coke!

Couple of new "friends".

[majush]

I dont agree completely with you guys... What Ajarn has mentioned is not wrong if u see india from a frustrated pov. India is beautiful and a must see destination. When you visit India as a tourist, you will never ever see the hard part of that country. You eyes are just of a tourists eyes which looks deeper into the cultural differences and peoples and colors... You unknowingly search for beautiful things and bypass most of real india in that short journey. But have you ever lived there for a 2+ years working in India, paying that heavy tax?? ever gone for a drive through Delhi or Bombay or Banglore in your own car? Ever used the public transport system to reach your office in time? That will really make you get frustrated with the people and the so called culture.

For a tourist, India is a beautiful place....Not for other categories... India is stronger in statitics when you compare it with other countries... 3000 trillion dollar GDP... WOW.... but what use??? every ordinary citizen of that country struggles to make both ends meet..... Knowing a country and its people can be done in a few months time anywhere else in this world.. but not in India... One thing is true. Even a few days visit to India changes a human being....

[longway]

I dont agree completely with you guys... What Ajarn has mentioned is not wrong if u see india from a frustrated pov.

That will really make you get frustrated with the people and the so called culture.

Whats a pov.? do you mean the poor?

//<snip>

I have lived in India and worked with my dad there, I dont disagree with you about the fustrations, make no mistake India is tough. If you cant take the heat get out of the kitchen.

I know how infuriating India can be, but at the end of the day you either adjust and thrive or you get ground down into the dirt. As for poverty, India wasnt always this poor, look at former colonised countries all over the world, the vast majority are dirt poor and the colonisers are vastly rich (see a pattern?), compared to other colonial countries India is doing well and has at least the potential to get better, there is actually a huge middle clas and it is growing fast.

//<snip>

Edited September 19, 2005 by RDN

[majush]

pov=point of view

I am an Indian and my own people have stuck that so called culture up my arse big time... What will you do when a person smokes inside an Aircon Bus/Train where its no smoking area... What will you feel when they spit at you, ask money for that cig butt they threw out becoz u asked them not to smoke.... How will you feel when your closest friend gets raped in a police station where she went to file a complaint.... what will you do when your own people asks you how much he has pay to bang your gf just bcoz she is caucasian??? They are still proud to call all these nonsense as Indian Culture and thats excatly what I refer to.

I have gone through enough shit and didnt had the capacity to take it any longer... So I am out... I feel much relaxed...

[RDN]

Various posts set "invisible" in this thread. One member has already been warned about his racist posts. If you can't keep it civil, I'll start suspending people.

My opinion: India is a fantastic place - I'd recommend it to anyone to visit.

[bkkmadness]

Various posts set "invisible" in this thread. One member has already been warned about his racist posts. If you can't keep it civil, I'll start suspending people.

My opinion: India is a fantastic place - I'd recommend it to anyone to visit.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Good bit of modding RDN, shame to see such a nice thread degenerate.

[Neeranam]

How about a few Indian experiences?

I haven't been to Bharat for 13 years, but hope to go back someday.

On my first night in Bombay, I went down to the gate of india and was a bit shocked by it all - the rats on the street brushing into my sandalled feet!

There was a guy with a dog and a fe tin cans of reducing size - the dog got on the first one and then the guy put a smaller one on top and the dog climbed up. At the end, the dog was about 10 feet high and balancing on a tin of baked beans - bizarre!

[sua yai]

Was there the first time for three months in '81. Stayed the first 10 days in Bombay with family - big appartment overlooking The Arabian Sea. Hardly thrown in at the deep end. Anyway, at 21 y/o and having been there for a week, I thought I knew it all and couldn't understand what all the fuss was about poverty wise. Sure I saw it, but it wasn't affecting me like I thought it would. Until one afternoon in the family's car. Driver, my cousin and me. There's a tapping at the window to the side of me and I turned to see an armless man with a rusty tin can tied round his neck, swinging it into the window begging for money. Well I totally freaked out. My cousin rescued me by dropping some change into the can for him. I knew I'd arrived then and that if I didn't put that experience behind me I'd be on the first plane home and that wasn't part of the plan. Nothing was as bad as that afterwards for me. A tough country, but a hugely rewarding experience.

[somkid]

Never gone to India, but will start working there in february. Going to Gurgaon near New Delhi. All the posts have been great, and really informative, and I am looking forward to it much more now, than when I had only heard a few passing remarks about the country.

Only sad thing, have to leave LOS and the gf. no jobs for a newly graduated, with little experience

Cheers to all the posters,

somkid