Thai Ridgeback Dog

[Ikky Plush]

why did it turn so mean?  I know they are guard dogs but do they have an overly aggresive streak bred into them?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I think it's because people haven't been breeding them long compared to other breeds in Europe. Thai Ridgeback's still have that 'wild dog' element. Breeders in Europe and the States describe them as aloof and independent even after intensive training. It seems you don't always know which way they'll go.

[bina]

i reiterate, having worked with large and small dogs and other animals: i wouldnt leave a ridgie alone with a child under age 7 or so (depending on size) as they are fair game as , lieterally, game... i.e. they run and squeack and act like prey and ridgies are predator/hunters...

like canaanim and other pariah dog types, very independant and self reliant with original dog action instincts, i.e. training has to use the dog's intstincts and not have the owner get in to power plays w/the dog... firmly established and MAINTAINED heirerachy ; small reminders that the owner is the head dog:

do not allow the dog to 'body block' i.e. sleep and you have to walk around him, he should get up and move

food: you eat first, he eats after all household members eat

play: you control when to start, when to stop, and stop him before he gets the upper hand, as a mother will control her pups or an older high level male will control a younger pup

dogs with strong pack instincts like consistency i.e. who is boss, who does what when etc since they among themselves establish this in a group setting which remains fairly constant unless something variates: inconsistency brings out the 'guard' attitude: i.e. the person/animal doesnt belong here, is a threat, whatever

one dog acts o.k, two become a pack: our canaans are fine when released singly, when loosed together, woe be it to our baby goats or roaming chickens or people that act 'sneaky' (that is approach the dogs hesitantly or stop and start, or stand and look -a real no no- as opposed to just walking up and past them casually like)

sometimes there are just screwy dogs in a litter regardless of breed genentics or training, but usually an hour or so of watching pups in a litter interacting you can tell personality traits: submissive, aggressive, scared/shy (a potential problem dog when older), watch when they are fed or nursing w/momma, or when playing, how do they approach you etc: this goes really for any breed but more important in larger (bigger mouths) dogs

saw a whole herd of ridgies in a waat paa (forest temple that had a small delapidated zoo) near ban chiang; the two thai women with me stood stock still when the dogs came rushing out, i just lit a cigarette and kept walking same speed with the dogs ghosting me on either side until the mee chi came out to call to them... the two thai women mean time had hopped back in to their car with one dog standing and barking at the car... i like the look but think that this breed doesnt do well in family/well populated areas with lots of perceived (by the dog) invasions of territory and probably doesnt fit most people as i dont think these are cuddly dogs but working dogs with out the specific breeding for specific work like dobies or rotties etc.

it would be a shame to have them become popular and ruined as many canaans have become (the dog prototype personality has become softer and rounded and less 'wild')

[bkkmadness]

Great Post Bina, I never even thought about the walking around the dog when it's sleeping thing.

[Ikky Plush]

i reiterate, having worked with large and small dogs and other animals: i wouldnt leave a ridgie alone with a child under age 7 or so (depending on size) as they are fair game as , lieterally, game... i.e. they run and squeack and act like prey and ridgies are predator/hunters...

like canaanim and other pariah dog types, very independant and self reliant with original dog action instincts, i.e. training has to use the dog's intstincts and not have the owner get in to power plays w/the dog... firmly established and MAINTAINED heirerachy ; small reminders that the owner is the head dog:

do not allow the dog to 'body block' i.e. sleep and you have to walk around him, he should get up and move

food: you eat first, he eats after all household members eat

play: you control when to start, when to stop, and stop him before he gets the upper hand, as a mother will control her pups or an older high level male will control a younger pup

dogs with strong pack instincts like consistency i.e. who is boss, who does what when etc since they among themselves establish this in a group setting which remains fairly constant unless something variates: inconsistency brings out the 'guard' attitude: i.e. the person/animal doesnt belong here, is a threat, whatever

one dog acts o.k, two become a pack: our canaans are fine when released singly, when loosed together, woe be it to our baby goats or roaming chickens  or people that act 'sneaky' (that is  approach the dogs hesitantly or stop and start, or stand and look -a real no no- as opposed to just walking up and past them casually like)

sometimes there are just screwy dogs in a litter regardless of breed genentics or training, but usually an hour or so of watching pups in a litter interacting you can tell personality traits: submissive, aggressive, scared/shy (a potential problem dog  when older), watch when they are fed or nursing w/momma, or when playing, how do they approach you etc:  this goes really for any breed but more important in larger (bigger mouths) dogs

saw a whole herd of ridgies in a waat paa (forest temple that had a small delapidated zoo) near ban chiang; the two thai women with me stood stock still when the dogs came rushing out, i just lit a cigarette and kept walking same speed with the dogs ghosting me on either side until the mee chi came out to call to them... the two thai women mean time had hopped back in to their car with one dog standing and barking at the car... i like the look but think that this breed doesnt do well in family/well populated areas with lots of perceived (by the dog) invasions of territory  and probably doesnt fit most people as i dont think these are cuddly dogs but working dogs with out the specific breeding for specific work like dobies or rotties etc.

it would be  a shame to have them become popular and ruined as many canaans have become (the dog prototype personality has become softer and rounded and less 'wild')

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Been to a couple of kennels in Thailand where the T/Ridgebacks that are 3/4 months will lick you to death. The ones that are a few months older (in cages) act very differently. Definetly not your Bassett hound.

Still, gotta give mine a chance.

Do you reckon the blues have a better temperament than the reds?

[Gary A]

They seem to do quite well with the heat It was explained to me that the longer hair is also an insulator against the heat. There could be something to that looking at the Thai construction workers who wear several layers of clothes when it VERY hot.

I can confuse the issue a little more. I wanted a Doberman but was talked out of that. I decided a Ridge back would do fine since a friend of mine has some puppies. His female is pretty stand offish and does not like many people. After a few weeks of meeting and drinking with my Thai friend the dog (bitch) decided she liked me and he was impressed enough to offer me two puppies. Problem solved. Or not? My girlfriend decided that she didn't want a dog like everyone else has so we now have a Golden Retriever. Whew! Nothing is ever easy when you have a Thai girlfriend.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I like Golden Retrievers. How does your one get on with the heat?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

[bina]

ikky,

licking is not an expression of love; licking is a pup's request to an adult for food; all adult dogs should still WANT to lick us as a food provider implying we are older/alpha etc... the point is to maintain puppy behavior to you while encouraging the chase/agress format for intruders etc which is, as gburns once pointed out, much harder in thai ridgie and other pariah types as they are totally intinctive and have not been specifically bred as a flexible working dog with specific guarding/working traits as bouvier, dobies, rotties, boxers, etc....which means that they are less reliable as far as we are concerned: people need/want dogs that will do what they have to do when the human wants them to do it, not just on intinct of dog.... that is:

turkish/yugoslavian sheepdog types (not the more well bred pyranees etc but the russian KGB TYPE, sharplanitz etc), most pariah dog types etc, guard sheep well but are not very reliable with people and are a very nasty group to deal with, even sometimes with their own sheep (canaanis will often eat newborn kids/sheep when the smell of blood and placenta overrides their guard tendencies)

this may explain the inconsistent behavior a bit.... most of these breeds are one person dogs i.e. one person leads and everything else may be considered THEM

since domination and self confidence vs aggression are two different things in dogs, a human who is aggressive may be seen as a threat (even if the owner) where as a human with self confidence who gives off 'dominance' in manner may never have problems.... this is hard to explain but if you watch your two dogs, perhaps they are too close in age and the one doesnt submit when it should or he or the other one is a bit screwed in the head and is not reading the signals properly as far as doggie behavior goes (something that happens to pups that are removed from their dams before the 7th week when the mother uses intensive discipline on the pup between 6 and 8the week)

to learn the problem, you must do hours of quiet and rather boring observation to find the key to the behavior if it is really important....

or as u did, remove from the scene. this is equally applicable to all breeds and most species of animals from donkeys to alpacas by the way

bkk: dogs use a lot of subtle behavior to 'train' us ; i watch my two boxers for hours and i learned all the many subtle things, even to slight tensing of shoulder muscles and a tightening around the floppy lips, i know what his next move is :putting my bitch back in her bed until he finishes eating and 'allows' her to approach the food , in three different bowls mind you!! he used to block my kids until i taught the kids to say: move!... now he minds them much more (they were young then) and i feel better that even my youngest can control both dogs

an other is pushing past them at the door and rushing out; now he must wait until told to walk out the door... and sit quietly until leashed etc, and not rush down stairs... no one needs a 40 kilo boxer male towing a child down the stairs after a cat.

sorry rather long but i love dog stuff....

[maesai]

My Ridgeback is hardly aloof. A four year old male, he is very attached to me. Wherever I am in the house, he is right there next to me. When working at the computer, for instance, he will often times sit next to me and rest his chin on my knee. Very sweet. If I have visitors, he won’t leave them alone. Especially the ones that don’t like dogs! He must be part of all activities, or he becomes upset. The only aggression he has ever shown to me was when I startled him out of a sleep. He woke up growling, but quickly realized his mistake, and looked pretty guilty.

As bina said, he is very territorial when it comes to other dogs. When in a fight with another dog, he always goes straight for the neck. He got into it with the neighbor’s Bankaew. My dog was on a leash, the Bankaew was running free. The Bankaew bit my dog on the leg. My dog quickly had the Bankaew pinned to the ground by the neck and wasn’t letting go. Had to set some newspapers alight to get him to release. Then the stupid Bankaew came back for more! And yeah, Bankaews bark too much.

[RedHotChilli]

My 8 month Ridgeback 'Sumo' has recently started snapping at me when I grab her collar.

It's really disheartening for me that she's started doing this (I always thought they would never bite the hand that feeds them) not to mention the fact that it makes jump out of my bloody skin.

What's the best way for me to handle this, is this just a phase she's going through or do I need to nip it in the bud now?

Thanks

RHC

BTW She's female

[maesai]

My 8 month Ridgeback 'Sumo' has recently started snapping at me when I grab her collar. 

It's really disheartening for me that she's started doing this (I always thought they would never bite the hand that feeds them) not to mention the fact that it makes jump out of my bloody skin.

What's the best way for me to handle this, is this just a phase she's going through or do I need to nip it in the bud now?

Thanks

RHC

BTW She's female

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I'm no expert, but I would certainly try to nip it in the bud ASAP. I believe in communicating in dog speak. If she did that to me, I would probably grab her by the neck, throw her to the ground, straddle her, and growl in her face big time. But hey, that is just me… I think it is vital to assert dominance, or she will get away with whatever you allow.

Nice looking dog! Wanna mate when she grows up?

[Ikky Plush]

My 8 month Ridgeback 'Sumo' has recently started snapping at me when I grab her collar. 

It's really disheartening for me that she's started doing this (I always thought they would never bite the hand that feeds them) not to mention the fact that it makes jump out of my bloody skin.

What's the best way for me to handle this, is this just a phase she's going through or do I need to nip it in the bud now?

Thanks

RHC

BTW She's female

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I reckon that's one for bina. There seems to be hardly any information in the English language on this breed (apart from 'The Encycopedia of the Dog' by Bruce Fogel). I have bought Thai books and magazines with nice pictures of ridgebacks but can't read them (my fault). My limited knowledge comes from my own experiences with my two ridgebacks (one now - see earlier thread) and going on forums for this breed. The one breeder of them in the UK has also bought her own dogs to my place and I've quizzed her about stuff. People seem to know the history of this breed and how you should try to direct their behaviour but everyone seems to be still learning. Maybe in a few more years...

[RedHotChilli]

My 8 month Ridgeback 'Sumo' has recently started snapping at me when I grab her collar. 

It's really disheartening for me that she's started doing this (I always thought they would never bite the hand that feeds them) not to mention the fact that it makes jump out of my bloody skin.

What's the best way for me to handle this, is this just a phase she's going through or do I need to nip it in the bud now?

Thanks

RHC

BTW She's female

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I'm no expert, but I would certainly try to nip it in the bud ASAP. I believe in communicating in dog speak. If she did that to me, I would probably grab her by the neck, throw her to the ground, straddle her, and growl in her face big time. But hey, that is just me… I think it is vital to assert dominance, or she will get away with whatever you allow.

Nice looking dog! Wanna mate when she grows up?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

LOL, I like your style.

Actually I was giving her a forceful snap on the nose, just to show her whose boss. However, 10 minutes later she goes back to her old ways.

I just figured she had PMT or something, the vet said she'd be in heat around seven months.

I mean hey, if anyone grabbed my (shirt) collar, around that time of the month,

I'd snap at you too

Maesai, I've never thought about breeding, to be honest with you I know nothing about it, but hey if you're in the know how and your dogs a looker then why not, let's talk...

[Skyline]

Dont know if this is of any help,There is an association of Thai ridgeback owners in the States, www.atroworld.org Not sure if theres one in the UK.This should provide some decent info.Try Kinokuna or whatever,that Japanese bookshop in Emporium,They have a good selection of dogiie books.

[Ikky Plush]

Dont know if this is of any help,There is an association of Thai ridgeback owners in the States, www.atroworld.org Not sure if theres one in the UK.This should provide some decent info.Try Kinokuna or whatever,that Japanese bookshop in Emporium,They have a good selection of dogiie books.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I think that's where I got those Thai dog books from. There or Se-ed.

I've often referred to that U.S website - it's pretty interesting.

[bina]

hi, once again, its really hard to 'train' the 'trainer' virtually but:

first, why are you 'grabbing' her collar??

most animals dont like quick grabs near their head and when pulling on some dogs collar it seems to instigate a physiological agressor reaction (like a rottie straining at the leash and then being released and it springs forward growlin)cant find my references but is refrenced not just my emperical evidence... my boxers react the same way so...

1. no need to grab collar, try using vocal commands to restrain such as: settle (lay down for a moment and relax), "back off" (for instance never push my male boxer cause he pushes back), "move" or "wait"... and then leash her w/o mucking around her collar area too much... if she fights, do not pull by collar and then release, she will spring back forward again so and also hard to pull a strong dog moving forward since that have 4 wheel drive so to speak. easier to pull sideways so: leash her, pull her head sidewise (rather like a horse that is about to bolt so you 'lay' his head along his withers so he cant run or buck), distract her with something or " settle" her if the other dog is far away already or move her away fast ...

every day, but every single day, groom her: hands touch firmly but gently on ears, face, neck, chest, down over legs, between legs, if male, fondle testes(no perverts not for fun but for potential vet checks) , move to tail... if she is jumpy, do a little a day, followed by play, quit while you are ahead, that is, before she growls so try to anticipate her next move, watch her shoulder muscles, ears etc to see when she is losing patience.

by the way, when i want my two boxers to realize that i am nervous about an approaching person (generally male and at night), i pull back on the leash and collar and let them strain against it, this makes them, dont know the english term really, rather like a soldier in a bad area w/the finger on the trigger on a loaded gun... if i release them they will go for the person.

the physical domination thing: i am 42 kilo and dont do that to a donkey but am still definately dominant so: that should only ever be used on very very very dominant aggressive dogs and only if you are really strong and can hold the dog down: did it once, and had to sit on its neck so it couldnt get back up to kill me. if u do do this, get up very slowly off her whilst offering a moving ball or something to distract her from leaping at YOU... having them 'settle' 'get up' settle' back off' several commands in a row assert dominance just as much.

forceful snaps on the nose are ineffective for most things just make the dog hand shy... unless she is snapping and you hit her from UNDER her jaw with your hand...try instead: tell her NO sharply and forefully (same as growling at her as far as she's concerned) and settle her, or put her in her corner, or turn your back on her and ignore for 10 minutes etc whatever... find her weak point and use to your advantage... i have seen too many owners afraid of their own dogs, too bad really...

the rhodie ridgies running lose on the kibbutz are a definate menace here and do hassle people and other dogs and cats, they're all mixed w/lab (same litter) and most of the poeple dont bother with proper socialization and training so in the end, these dogs will end up at the pound if they snap at the wrong person

most important, do not be wimbly wombly; dogs hate wimbly wombly (so do i for that matter) and they will take major advantage, you shouldnt jump out of your skin, you should get angry as if you were an adult dog being hassled by a naughty pup as i suggested above; be consistant and dont assume they are like us: they do suffer slightly from pms, just like mares (mares are bitchy as heck when in season) but THAT IS NO EXCUSE, she is a DOG and should behave... she is not like a pekinese that bites with its tiny mouth and you can stuff it in a box when it misbehaves.

an other idea: keep her leashed and with you so wherever u go she goes (a dominance device by the way, you are the definate boss here), teach her to behave with friendly strangers as opposed to intruder types...

maesai: breeds have general tendencies, and personal individual personalities; but breed types give a general idea of what to expect... also in some breeds, it takes up to two years to mature like w/ great danes, etc and for their personality to mature from shy aggressive to confident friendly.... aloof is different than independant: aloof si what many sight hounds are like the salugi and afghan hounds... independant just means that their drive to please (us) is less developed which fits the picture of the thai ridgi since it is a pariah (proto type ) dog...

all in all, sounds a good dog for me once kids are grown and i move to raise goats in the desert...

hope this gave some ideas i had already posted some ridgie sites in someone elses thread here, cant find it now, also about her thai ridgie with separation anxiety after death of partner dog... someone remember?? i listed thai ridge and the other spitz like dog sites there... will try again to locate them.

[bina]

sorry for double post:

link one:

http://www.bangkaew.com its in thai though i think i got some english links cant remember

my favorite site: http://www.workingdogweb.com/Dingo.htm

but links back to the site someone else mentioned : the atra site

"The Thai Ridgeback is a medium-sized pariah-type dog, with a wedge-shaped head, prick ears, and a short, smooth coat. The Thai Ridgeback needs an owner who understands the breed. A Thai who is poorly raised can be aggressive. They require a dominant owner."

http://hem.passagen.se/yvkek/engstart.html

another great site in swedish and english but just re inforces what i know from the canaan pariah dog: very independant, heavy handling does not work, needs confident owner not hesitant owner, etc etc etc...

really interesting the classification of types of ridges!!!

if you are planning to breed, skip her first heat; wait , most of these types of dogs cycle twice yearly although tropical areas may differ, dont know...and dont breed just cause theyre pretty; go for health and temperment, and as for most pariah dog types, do not interfere with the litter, weak pups die, strong ones live and the mothers usually do not need any help...

do the thai ridgies dig dens? the canaanis do dig at least two dens like foxes, and move the pups back and forth, and regurgitate food for the pups too....

[Gary A]

I'm afraid that if my dog snapped at me for grabbing its collar and then didn't immediately look ashamed and try to make up with me I would be watching for the dog trader to come around and would have some new plastic goods. Like wise for any dog that would bite a small child. Some kids over about 5 years old that abuse the dog need a bite but not a big damaging bite. A good dog will take about anything from a baby and will simply avoid the baby.

[bina]

gary a,

that is where most people make the mistake of leaving babies with dogs.

dogs see babies as playthings for the most part , like squeaky toys, especially to the hunting types which is what the ridgie IS...

and dogs DO NOT automatically know how to behave. some is natural tendency or personality of course, but a lot is training... my male boxer arrived to me with attack training incomplete and some wierd behavior patterns at the age of 1 and a half: it took 6 months of intensive steady work with the help of a proffesional and tips from forums before i could leave him out of his kennel box when i wasnt arround.... now, any kid or adult can play with him including squeezzing his balls and pulling his ears; his bite inhibition was excellent to begin with as he had received some training previous, but responded way too quicly for my liking...

my canaan yard dogs are all tolerant of handling any part of their body including a high tolerance to pain with no reaction when needing treatment, but did require to be handled/groomed a lot and socialized well with us; they are excellent yard guard dogs, but all have the hunt intinct for small moving animals and strangers do have to be leary of flinging hands towards the dog's face neck, as the dogs want to meet the person first (sniff hand etc)....

in addition: dogs are domesticated carnivores with some instincts from the wild: the pariah types like the soi/village dogs, ridgebacks, basenjis, canaans etc are much more 'wild' or 'natural instinct' then other types and must be treated with repspect and firmness and never assume anything: 99% the dog wont do something, but it is an animal and there is the 1% that some personality quirck might be the bad tempered type. and all dogs have teeth.

while every lover of every breed will swear by their breed as loyal good pet intelligent etc, people should recongnize that different breeds are used/were meant for different usages and these genetic 'make ups' make the behavior of the dog in relation to the people/environment ;for instance i wouldnt leave any body near the yugoslavian sheep guard dogs even well socialized ones, they are nasty surly no matter how u look at it and do not fit as family dogs ever.

in addition, a dog reprimanding a child for a pinch or pulled ear should have good bite inhibition (may even place teeth on skin but feels the hand/body part and releases before closing teeth, whereas if it does same to other dog, may close teeth) and may PUSH the hand away; my boxers sublimate the bite reaction with a lick reaction, they may growl, swing head around and then lick; they are also more likely to get up and move away to avoid more annoyance.

if, after working with the dog (if you are so inclined to put time and effort in to it) it seems like not a good idea, then the dog should indeed 'go' but then maybe try for a different more applicable to your needs, dog... a big mistake is for people to buy a dog because it is unusual interesnting beautiful, looks nasty, whatever regardless of what they are really needing. in israel the 'criminal' types really like the rotties, big boxers, staffs etc... which in the end often lead to terrible tragedies involving children. fortunately the canaan is a fairly non descript dog (a hairy ridgie w/o the ridge) so not overbred, etc.

my canaans work at the park; my boxers live in my house.

[Ikky Plush]

gary a,

that is where most people make the mistake of leaving babies with dogs.

dogs see babies as playthings for the most part , like squeaky toys, especially to the hunting types which is what the ridgie IS...

and dogs DO NOT automatically know how to behave.  some is natural tendency or personality of course, but a lot is training... my male boxer arrived to me with attack training incomplete and some wierd behavior patterns at the age of 1 and a half: it took 6 months of intensive steady work with the help of a proffesional  and tips from forums before i could leave him out of his kennel box when i wasnt arround.... now, any kid or adult can play with him including squeezzing his balls and pulling his ears; his bite inhibition was excellent to begin with as he had received some training previous, but responded way too quicly for my liking...

my canaan yard dogs are all tolerant of handling any part of their body including a high tolerance to pain with no reaction when needing treatment, but did require to be handled/groomed  a lot and socialized well with us; they are excellent yard guard dogs, but all have the hunt intinct for small moving animals and strangers do have to be leary of flinging hands towards the dog's face neck, as the dogs want to meet the person first (sniff hand etc)....

in addition: dogs are domesticated carnivores with some instincts from the wild: the pariah types like the soi/village dogs, ridgebacks, basenjis, canaans etc are much more 'wild' or 'natural instinct' then other types and must be treated with repspect and firmness and never assume anything: 99% the dog wont do something, but it is an animal and there is the 1% that some personality quirck might be the bad tempered type.  and all dogs have teeth. 

while every lover of every breed will swear by their breed as loyal good pet intelligent etc, people should recongnize that different breeds are used/were meant for different usages and these genetic 'make ups' make the behavior of the dog in relation to the people/environment ;for instance  i wouldnt leave any body near the yugoslavian sheep guard dogs even well socialized ones, they are nasty surly no matter how u look at it and do not fit as family dogs ever.

in addition, a dog reprimanding a child for a pinch or pulled ear should have good bite inhibition (may even place teeth on skin but feels the hand/body part and releases before closing teeth, whereas if it does same to other dog, may close teeth) and may PUSH the hand away; my boxers sublimate the bite reaction with a lick reaction, they may growl, swing head around and then lick; they are also more likely to get up and move away to avoid more annoyance.

if, after working with the dog (if you are so inclined to put time and effort in to it) it seems like not a good idea, then the dog should indeed 'go' but then maybe try for a different more applicable to your needs, dog... a big mistake is for people to buy a dog because it is unusual interesnting beautiful, looks nasty, whatever regardless of what they are really needing.  in israel the 'criminal' types really like the rotties, big boxers, staffs etc... which in the end often lead to terrible tragedies involving children. fortunately the canaan is a fairly non descript dog (a hairy ridgie w/o the ridge) so not overbred, etc.

my canaans work at the park; my boxers live in my house.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

bina,

Never seen a canaan. Do you have photos?

[Ikky Plush]

gary a,

that is where most people make the mistake of leaving babies with dogs.

dogs see babies as playthings for the most part , like squeaky toys, especially to the hunting types which is what the ridgie IS...

and dogs DO NOT automatically know how to behave.  some is natural tendency or personality of course, but a lot is training... my male boxer arrived to me with attack training incomplete and some wierd behavior patterns at the age of 1 and a half: it took 6 months of intensive steady work with the help of a proffesional  and tips from forums before i could leave him out of his kennel box when i wasnt arround.... now, any kid or adult can play with him including squeezzing his balls and pulling his ears; his bite inhibition was excellent to begin with as he had received some training previous, but responded way too quicly for my liking...

my canaan yard dogs are all tolerant of handling any part of their body including a high tolerance to pain with no reaction when needing treatment, but did require to be handled/groomed  a lot and socialized well with us; they are excellent yard guard dogs, but all have the hunt intinct for small moving animals and strangers do have to be leary of flinging hands towards the dog's face neck, as the dogs want to meet the person first (sniff hand etc)....

in addition: dogs are domesticated carnivores with some instincts from the wild: the pariah types like the soi/village dogs, ridgebacks, basenjis, canaans etc are much more 'wild' or 'natural instinct' then other types and must be treated with repspect and firmness and never assume anything: 99% the dog wont do something, but it is an animal and there is the 1% that some personality quirck might be the bad tempered type.  and all dogs have teeth. 

while every lover of every breed will swear by their breed as loyal good pet intelligent etc, people should recongnize that different breeds are used/were meant for different usages and these genetic 'make ups' make the behavior of the dog in relation to the people/environment ;for instance  i wouldnt leave any body near the yugoslavian sheep guard dogs even well socialized ones, they are nasty surly no matter how u look at it and do not fit as family dogs ever.

in addition, a dog reprimanding a child for a pinch or pulled ear should have good bite inhibition (may even place teeth on skin but feels the hand/body part and releases before closing teeth, whereas if it does same to other dog, may close teeth) and may PUSH the hand away; my boxers sublimate the bite reaction with a lick reaction, they may growl, swing head around and then lick; they are also more likely to get up and move away to avoid more annoyance.

if, after working with the dog (if you are so inclined to put time and effort in to it) it seems like not a good idea, then the dog should indeed 'go' but then maybe try for a different more applicable to your needs, dog... a big mistake is for people to buy a dog because it is unusual interesnting beautiful, looks nasty, whatever regardless of what they are really needing.  in israel the 'criminal' types really like the rotties, big boxers, staffs etc... which in the end often lead to terrible tragedies involving children. fortunately the canaan is a fairly non descript dog (a hairy ridgie w/o the ridge) so not overbred, etc.

my canaans work at the park; my boxers live in my house.

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bina,

Never seen a canaan. Do you have photos?

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bina,

just found a picure of a canaan in a book.

[RedHotChilli]

Hey Bina, thanks for all that info... like you said virtually training someone really is quite difficult. If you're in Bangkok, maybe you've found your niche, dog training classes...I'd definitely sign up.

You asked me why i'm grabbing the collar. It's not like I do it all the time... it's just that when someone comes to my house, I don't want her running out the gate.

You know, there's so much I want to say, but by the time I start typing I get a mental block and whatever i've written sounds like total crap....Hence my post count is below 20.

However, I do want you to know that I'm not a bad dog owner and I do try to do right by both of my dogs. I will reread your posts and try out the new techniques. You must admit that you are quite an exceptional person, with a vast amount of knowledge which your average joe 'dog owner' bloggs wouldn't know.

Thanks again

RHC

[siamesekitty]

hope this gave some ideas i had already posted some ridgie sites in someone elses thread here, cant find it now, also about her thai ridgie with separation anxiety after death of partner dog... someone remember?? i listed thai ridge and the other spitz like dog sites there... will try again to locate them.

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Um, are you referring to my thread, bina? How Do I Stop My Dog's Howling?

[siamesekitty]

sorry for the double post, can't edit now

By the way bina, thanks for all the tips in that thread and this one , I'll see what can be applie (if I can find some time! )

My Ridgeback is hardly aloof.  A four year old male, he is very attached to me. 

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Mine is attached to us as well, she was born here in our house and knows no other home or people. She doesn't even try to go out and explore outside when the gate's open!

Her dad (he died before she was born) had a real fighter's instinct. One time when an elephant came into our soi and walked past our house, he ran to the gate, barking and lunging at the bars! Good thing it was sturdy, or we could've ended up with a flat dog in the shape of an elephant's footprint (or perhaps one limping elephant ).

[bina]

thanx for the compliments

dont worry i dont think u are a bad dog owner or u wouldnt be asking: second:

the rushing door problem: i know it well, in fact, because many people on my kibbutz are afraid of large german dogs like boxers, i've installed an outer gate, just in case my kids forget to close the front door properly (the female also knew how to open it so changed the handle upside down; inconvenient for us but she cant open the door now. BUT,

when the kids go out to school in a.m. with book bags, dogs have learned to stand by door but not allowed out... it took lots of practice and correction and very hard to explain over keyboard, i would have to demonstrate, but it can be done. when new people come to door, we tell the dogs, no out (actually in hebrew but thats the gist), and they dont go out, but sometimes they do the rush thing as in yesterday when i was carrying three big cartons of fresh eggs (90!) and the male started to push past (dog down below stairs maybe)and i had 80 of the eggs on the floor. the dogs cleaned them up, minus shells

you might try (this is what i did) keeping a lead on her, or rope, so when someone comes to the door and she rushes, you grab the lead or step on it (with shoes w/o shoes ropes burn your feet take it from me)and pull back sharply, saying, no out , or whatever in whatever language. when u do take her outside, make her sit at the door next to you, fiddle with key or pocket book etc, open door, step out a bit a head of her and tell her: lets go, or 'walk' . this works well for when hiking steep places and the dog is liable to lurch ahead of you and pull you over the edge of a cliff; you climb down first, then tell the dog 'lets go'... repetition repetition, and consistency... and when they hit about 8-10 months they are the terrible teenager types so will test you over everything that they seemed to know before... stick with a few things, once she and you work well together, you can add what is needed.

i love having dogs that listen to me: i dont command them, i request fromthem and they give to me: its great fun to tell a big dog to get on the digital scale at the vet, tell him not to move, and weight him; or tell him to 'sleep' i.e. lay on his side, so vet can do checks.... the same as elephants, and other animals are taught 'tricks' to make life easier for their owner/controllers.

to bad it doesnt work so well with kids

good luck, hope this all helps, you dont have to be an expert trainer this si all basically common sense stuff (i mean, you wouldnt take nonsense from a buffalo would you and i saw the buffalos were fairly well behaved when i was in thailand, and i watched my thai worker move our donkeys, goats, the dogs, even the emu, without lifting his voice or resorting to big sticks, he just sort of does what i do but i learnt this and he just seems to know how)

btw there are pics of the canaans in te workingdog site.... they all have the slightly wrinkly forehead, perked ears, basic size, and colours to fit the area they live in... some canaans look more like husky types but the real ones have a definate 'look' to them.... the originals are the soi dog type that just hang around beduin and arab villages, but a lot are mixed with various dog breeds that were thrown out to fend for them selves, very hard now to find a pure canaan living feral style and the americans, as they always do, seem to like to 'refine' breeds, i like the rough look

http://myrnash0.tripod.com/shaarhagai-canaandogs/id23.html

if lyou get to this site, myrna is my neighbhor (15 minutes away) and ive been to many of her lectures on pariah dogs etc.... if you notice, the blood lines have a lot of 'wild born' in them...

an other link to her site with an amazing story of 'bayud' the beduin sire of some of her stock... it is from the past three years, http://myrnash0.tripod.com/shaarhagai-canaandogs/id18.html

just for comparison, she also notes that the canaan , and i found this too, respond better to women than men ?! all three of ours are like that, too.

i think they look a lot like many of the village dogs i saw in issan; and same behavior too.... very fascinating actually.... maybe if someone was really interested like myrna was in our 'feral' dogs, someone in thailand would work on the village dog type and the ridgie before they become too mixed/extinct like many 'native' dogs in other countries.

what i dont understand is why the thai ridgie is red or blue; ive noticed that my thai worker prefers cream/white and usually with spots or stripes on any animal i let him choose from a herd/flock etc... even 'gan' our yongest canaani mix was chosen because he was 'gan' (spotted;patterned?) and his black brother was given away (they were found by thai workers in the orchards at age 5 weeks, my worker nursed them etc)

oops, i didnt ever know this, she's also a judge for: thai ridge backs!!! dont think we have any in israel so probably when she's in europe... now will have to find her at her pet store on monday to bug her.....

Edited April 22, 2005 by bina

[bkkmadness]

Just surfing around on the net for something else in Thailand and come across this site, I haven't looked through it yet but thought maybe you lot might want to have a read.

Edited April 22, 2005 by bkkmadness

[Ikky Plush]

Just surfing around on the net for something else in Thailand and come across this site, I haven't looked through it yet but thought maybe you lot might want to have a read.

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That's awfully nice of you old chap.

Eastender's was poor tonight.

[bina]

just skimmed thru; nice site.... unusual though for a 'pariah type'dog to have genetic defects as most of these dogs follow the 'survival of the fittest'... ridgies have this dermoid sinus thing.... maybe the same gene that gives them the ridge carries this defect...