Thaksin: Flowers Not Bombs For Prem

[webfact]

Flowers not bombs for Prem, says Thaksin

By THE NATION

Published on December 31, 2009

Fugitive ex-premier Thaksin Shinawatra yesterday said he wanted to send flowers rather than bombs to Privy Council President Prem Tinsulanonda as a New Year present.

In a Twitter message, Thaksin said: "If I can make an order, I will send a bomb that is full of flowers and has the scent of tea rose to his home so that HE Prem has some sympathy for me."

The ex-leader was responding to messages from "followers" of his Thaksinlive account on the Twitter social-networking website.

One of them said: "I hope there is no bomb during the New Year celebrations. I'd like you to please order your men about this."

Another message read: "Where will you order to have an explosion tomorrow? My friends and I will avoid that place. I still want to join red-shirt rallies but don't want to see my leg cut off."

Meanwhile, the Privy Council president yesterday rejected any political implications when he wore his military uniform to greet a group of senior generals wishing him a happy new year earlier this week.

Prem, who served as the Army commander-in-chief in the late 1970s, said he simply wanted to stress his belief that people should love their work and career.

"All of us must love our country. And we also love the organisations where we are working. I once told civil servants that if you are teachers and you don't love your students, you should quit the job," he said.

"If you have no love for your career, you will never progress. Similarly, if you are soldiers and you don't love the career, there's no point in remaining as soldiers."

Prem, who served as a non-MP prime minister between 1980 and 1988, said he liked the phrase "Old soldiers never die".

A few months before the coup of 2006, the chief adviser to His Majesty the King was often seen wearing his military attire to public functions.

He was speaking in a recorded interview to be broadcast on FM 101 radio on Monday.

When asked to comment on the ongoing social division in the country, Prem said it was normal for people to have different viewpoints but that such differences should not cause them to dislike each other or regard as enemies people with views different from theirs.

He said there were bad people in every country and it was unlikely everyone could be made into good people. The point is to try to prevent bad people from running the country, he added.

-- The Nation 2009/12/31

[newsfooter][/newsfooter]

[givenall]

I would like him to deliver the flower himself

[animatic]

Thaksin said:

"If I can make an order, I will send a bomb that is full of flowers and has the scent of tea rose to his home so that HE Prem has some sympathy for me."

The debuting of the sentence with the word bomb is pretty nutzo....

So the bomb has flowers and a nice smell,

it is still a bomb he says to send...

It seems the pressure is pretty high in his brain pan this week.

tick tick tick tick

[mccw]

Thaksin said: "If I can make an order, I will send a bomb that is full of flowers and has the scent of tea rose to his home so that HE Prem has some sympathy for me."

lost his marbles

[Ricardo]

If former-PM Thaksin wishes former-PM Prem to have more sympathy for him, a good start would perhaps be to stop arranging riots, outside Prem's Bangkok home, or encouraging the UDD to overthrow the legal government.

[Bagwan]

He thinks he can buy Prem's support with a bunch of flowers? It might work with a teenage beauty, but Prem? Taking up residence at the Bangkok Hilton for a couple of years might work, I suggest.

I particularly liked Prem's mantra that 'If you are not in love with being a soldier, there is little point in being one'. I've drawn this to the attention of my 18 year old stepson and suggested he try it out in a few days time when he attends the Amphur to find out if he will be drafted or not.

[caf]

There was a reference in the opening post.

"it was normal for people to have different viewpoints but that such differences should not cause them to dislike each other or regard as enemies people with views different from theirs."

Very much a Thai way of speaking.

Some posters criticising Thaksin in a violent sarcastic or insolent way and being overly critical would do well to rememeber that that is not the Thai way

When he was last in Thailand he made a wai to Prem which was acknowledged. " Bad mouthing" is a western and not a thai trait"

It is not inconceivable that he will come back to Thailand, maybe many many years hence. If that happens there will still be that outward show for which the Thais are famous.

Only my opinion but I think most Thais would understand the point.

[Bagwan]

There was a reference in the opening post.

"it was normal for people to have different viewpoints but that such differences should not cause them to dislike each other or regard as enemies people with views different from theirs."

Very much a Thai way of speaking.

Some posters criticising Thaksin in a violent sarcastic or insolent way and being overly critical would do well to rememeber that that is not the Thai way

When he was last in Thailand he made a wai to Prem which was acknowledged. " Bad mouthing" is a western and not a thai trait"

It is not inconceivable that he will come back to Thailand, maybe many many years hence. If that happens there will still be that outward show for which the Thais are famous.

Only my opinion but I think most Thais would understand the point.

I do hope that you were not trying to hijack the concept of peaceful disagreement by suggesting that it is a Thai trait. Surely it is a practice adopted by intelligent, considerate people worldwide. You might give some consideration to the Thai Mafia gangs and their actions when confronted with a difference of opinion. Offering physical harm or even death would be the Thai way according to some. I doubt very much that there is a Thai equivalent of 'we'll just have to agree to disagree'.

The outward show of civility, respect, even homage, practiced by Thais could well be described at 'the smile on the face of the tiger'.

[caf]

There was a reference in the opening post.

"it was normal for people to have different viewpoints but that such differences should not cause them to dislike each other or regard as enemies people with views different from theirs."

Very much a Thai way of speaking.

Some posters criticising Thaksin in a violent sarcastic or insolent way and being overly critical would do well to rememeber that that is not the Thai way

When he was last in Thailand he made a wai to Prem which was acknowledged. " Bad mouthing" is a western and not a thai trait"

It is not inconceivable that he will come back to Thailand, maybe many many years hence. If that happens there will still be that outward show for which the Thais are famous.

Only my opinion but I think most Thais would understand the point.

I do hope that you were not trying to hijack the concept of peaceful disagreement by suggesting that it is a Thai trait. Surely it is a practice adopted by intelligent, considerate people worldwide. You might give some consideration to the Thai Mafia gangs and their actions when confronted with a difference of opinion. Offering physical harm or even death would be the Thai way according to some. I doubt very much that there is a Thai equivalent of 'we'll just have to agree to disagree'.

The outward show of civility, respect, even homage, practiced by Thais could well be described at 'the smile on the face of the tiger'.

No I certainly was not hijacking the concept. I also was not trying to say that the moon was made of cheese.

Perhaps concentrate on what I did say rather than what I did not say.

Yes there are problems with the mafia gangs and the fighting, but I am on the side of Prem and His Majesty with their public announcements. Let's think positively about how the majority of Thais want to live in harmony with one other. I would hope you would agree with that. Progress will come with optimism not with being an eternal pessimist.

caf

[folder]

Some posters criticising Thaksin in a violent sarcastic or insolent way and being overly critical would do well to rememeber that that is not the Thai way

Someone needs to inform the Thai political cartoonists then that they are not following the Thai way. Sarcasm and insolence are a near daily occurrence in their Thai newspapers.

btw, is it so wrong to be "insolent" against a megalomaniacal despot? Would it be so terrible to be disrespectful to Marcos et al?

[animatic]

Some posters criticising Thaksin in a violent sarcastic or insolent way and being overly critical would do well to rememeber that that is not the Thai way

Someone needs to inform the Thai political cartoonists then that they are not following the Thai way. Sarcasm and insolence are a near daily occurrence in their Thai newspapers.

btw, is it so wrong to be "insolent" against a megalomaniacal despot? Would it be so terrible to be disrespectful to Marcos et al?

Don't dare be insolent in the face of their betters?

Oh so kow tow an attitude.

Gonna get the BNP folks knickers in a twist with that one.

[mca]

Prem said it was normal for people to have different viewpoints but that such differences should not cause them to dislike each other or regard as enemies people with views different from theirs.

Slightly ironic coming from a Thai army general.

[animatic]

Most soldiers I have met all prefer and want peace.

They just think peace is not pursued from a position of weakness.

[Publicus]

There was a reference in the opening post.

"it was normal for people to have different viewpoints but that such differences should not cause them to dislike each other or regard as enemies people with views different from theirs."

Very much a Thai way of speaking.

Some posters criticising Thaksin in a violent sarcastic or insolent way and being overly critical would do well to rememeber that that is not the Thai way

When he was last in Thailand he made a wai to Prem which was acknowledged. " Bad mouthing" is a western and not a thai trait"

It is not inconceivable that he will come back to Thailand, maybe many many years hence. If that happens there will still be that outward show for which the Thais are famous.

Only my opinion but I think most Thais would understand the point.

I recall the news reports during the late summer of 2006 of Prem giving Thaksin a wai from Prem's navel. I guess that maybe it's like a secret handshake in the West.  Or maybe not.

[nisakiman]

If former-PM Thaksin wishes former-PM Prem to have more sympathy for him, a good start would perhaps be to stop arranging riots, outside Prem's Bangkok home, or encouraging the UDD to overthrow the legal government.

You jest, of course.

This government was implemented via military coup, elite minority pressure and the illegal occupation of an international airport.

Hardly a democratic mandate.

And certainly not legal.

[animatic]

If former-PM Thaksin wishes former-PM Prem to have more sympathy for him, a good start would perhaps be to stop arranging riots, outside Prem's Bangkok home, or encouraging the UDD to overthrow the legal government.

You jest, of course.

This government was implemented via military coup, elite minority pressure and the illegal occupation of an international airport.

Hardly a democratic mandate.

And certainly not legal.

The process was complicated by the above occurences

or minority group interests.

But none of those actually installed ANY GOVERNMENT.

The people who installed the current government were the

elected representatives of the people of Thailand,

who were able to form an alternative coalition,

because PTP couldn't and still can't get the job done,

nor fulfill the roles of governance needed in a obvious

world financial crisis the PPP had utterly ignored

or missed coming from incompetence.

Thaksin was deposed from a non elected government, sans mandate,

since he had called a snap election himself and disolvec parliament

And then his TRT cheated and the election commission went to jail for malfeasances.

His attempts to wrest power during his 2nd stint as care-taker PM

and visibly obvious instability, earned him an quicker than planned exit.

But he was NOT the elected Prime Minister of Thailand on that date,

He was grandstanding as such in NYC but was nothing mo0re than caretaker PM,

pending another election cycle

Post removal, commonly known as a coup,

and a new constitutional referendum voted by all Thais.

Then his own party PPP was elected as his proxy

after the new constitution was voted by the people.

PPP also cheated in almost the exact same way

and was on route to being dissolved just as it's predecessor was

for getting caught cheating. These guys never learn from their mistakes.

Samak lied on court and got kicked out of office for it,

he could have got back in almost immediately,

but ALSO was not asked back to be PM by Thaksin himself.

Somchai was an ineffectual puppet until such time as he also was dissolved with PPP

The 3rd string dregs of TRT / PPP, now PTP, were even more ineffectual than PPP was,

and could not hold a coalition together, they remain the elected opposition party.

Proving their utter incompetence almost daily ever since.

Yes the Airport take over showed Somchai/PPP's utter failings at leadership,

and may have accelerated by days, not even weeks the pending decision to dissolve PPP.

But didn't do anything to distort the FACTS that caused the dissolution, only a minor amount of timing.

[Bagwan]

There was a reference in the opening post.

"it was normal for people to have different viewpoints but that such differences should not cause them to dislike each other or regard as enemies people with views different from theirs."

Very much a Thai way of speaking.

You obviously didn't understand the thrust of my previous post. It is not solely a Thai way of speaking, indeed I suspect that it is a concept that has been imported from Europe. When thinking of Asia Genghis Khan, Bushido, all those benevolent Chinese emperors come to mind. Not a Voltaire amongst them. What is a Thai way of speaking is 'You think too much.'

I enjoyed 7 years of my Thai lady neighbour hating me because I mentioned to another neighbour (a farang) that I wished she didn't make so much noise when she hit the bottle - a frequent event. He kindly reported that back to her. Every card that she played in her hate campaign I trumped - my favourite response being to play a recording made by the Pipes and Drums of the 1st Battalion, The Black Watch on full blast with all the windows open. All my attempts at reconciliation were rebuffed.

I am alienated from my father in law and his eldest son after a difference of opinion about how deep they could mine into my wallet. My wife was the passenger on a motorbike driven by a work colleague involved in a minor accident. The other driver was held to have caused the accident and had to pay medical bills and pay off the police. My wife's colleague blamed my wife ( ????????? - even the boggles boggle ) and has not spoken to her since, thus isolating herself at work.

Thaksin was not renowned for ignoring a slight. It seems that, as ever, actions speak louder than mere words. Prem's good words are but a pipe dream in a Thai context.

P.S. I am aware that the moon isn't made of cream cheese. There are not,as far as I know, any cows on Planet Earth's satellite.

[Publicus]

There was a reference in the opening post.

"it was normal for people to have different viewpoints but that such differences should not cause them to dislike each other or regard as enemies people with views different from theirs."

Very much a Thai way of speaking.

You obviously didn't understand the thrust of my previous post. It is not solely a Thai way of speaking, indeed I suspect that it is a concept that has been imported from Europe. When thinking of Asia Genghis Khan, Bushido, all those benevolent Chinese emperors come to mind. Not a Voltaire amongst them. What is a Thai way of speaking is 'You think too much.'

I enjoyed 7 years of my Thai lady neighbour hating me because I mentioned to another neighbour (a farang) that I wished she didn't make so much noise when she hit the bottle - a frequent event. He kindly reported that back to her. Every card that she played in her hate campaign I trumped - my favourite response being to play a recording made by the Pipes and Drums of the 1st Battalion, The Black Watch on full blast with all the windows open. All my attempts at reconciliation were rebuffed.

I am alienated from my father in law and his eldest son after a difference of opinion about how deep they could mine into my wallet. My wife was the passenger on a motorbike driven by a work colleague involved in a minor accident. The other driver was held to have caused the accident and had to pay medical bills and pay off the police. My wife's colleague blamed my wife ( ????????? - even the boggles boggle ) and has not spoken to her since, thus isolating herself at work.

Thaksin was not renowned for ignoring a slight. It seems that, as ever, actions speak louder than mere words. Prem's good words are but a pipe dream in a Thai context.

P.S. I am aware that the moon isn't made of cream cheese. There are not,as far as I know, any cows on Planet Earth's satellite.

We know there are farang and there are farang, just as there are Thais and there are Thais. None the less, this post gets my vote.

 

[Old Man River]

If former-PM Thaksin wishes former-PM Prem to have more sympathy for him, a good start would perhaps be to stop arranging riots, outside Prem's Bangkok home, or encouraging the UDD to overthrow the legal government.

You jest, of course.

This government was implemented via military coup, elite minority pressure and the illegal occupation of an international airport.

Hardly a democratic mandate.

And certainly not legal.

You can argue whether this is a good government or not, who supports it, whether it is democracy at its best etc., but there is no question that it is legal.

[caf]

There was a reference in the opening post.

"it was normal for people to have different viewpoints but that such differences should not cause them to dislike each other or regard as enemies people with views different from theirs."

Very much a Thai way of speaking.

Some posters criticising Thaksin in a violent sarcastic or insolent way and being overly critical would do well to rememeber that that is not the Thai way

When he was last in Thailand he made a wai to Prem which was acknowledged. " Bad mouthing" is a western and not a thai trait"

It is not inconceivable that he will come back to Thailand, maybe many many years hence. If that happens there will still be that outward show for which the Thais are famous.

Only my opinion but I think most Thais would understand the point.

I recall the news reports during the late summer of 2006 of Prem giving Thaksin a wai from Prem's navel. I guess that maybe it's like a secret handshake in the West. Or maybe not.

Prem giving Thaksin a wai from the navel. ??

[caf]

There was a reference in the opening post.

"it was normal for people to have different viewpoints but that such differences should not cause them to dislike each other or regard as enemies people with views different from theirs."

Very much a Thai way of speaking.

You obviously didn't understand the thrust of my previous post. It is not solely a Thai way of speaking, indeed I suspect that it is a concept that has been imported from Europe. When thinking of Asia Genghis Khan, Bushido, all those benevolent Chinese emperors come to mind. Not a Voltaire amongst them. What is a Thai way of speaking is 'You think too much.'

I enjoyed 7 years of my Thai lady neighbour hating me because I mentioned to another neighbour (a farang) that I wished she didn't make so much noise when she hit the bottle - a frequent event. He kindly reported that back to her. Every card that she played in her hate campaign I trumped - my favourite response being to play a recording made by the Pipes and Drums of the 1st Battalion, The Black Watch on full blast with all the windows open. All my attempts at reconciliation were rebuffed.

I am alienated from my father in law and his eldest son after a difference of opinion about how deep they could mine into my wallet. My wife was the passenger on a motorbike driven by a work colleague involved in a minor accident. The other driver was held to have caused the accident and had to pay medical bills and pay off the police. My wife's colleague blamed my wife ( ????????? - even the boggles boggle ) and has not spoken to her since, thus isolating herself at work.

Thaksin was not renowned for ignoring a slight. It seems that, as ever, actions speak louder than mere words. Prem's good words are but a pipe dream in a Thai context.

P.S. I am aware that the moon isn't made of cream cheese. There are not,as far as I know, any cows on Planet Earth's satellite.

"Every card that she played in her hate campaign I trumped - my favourite response being to play a recording made by the Pipes and Drums of the 1st Battalion, The Black Watch on full blast with all the windows open."

Rather childish, so your next comment is hardly surprising.

"All my attempts at reconciliation were rebuffed."

( Incidentally Prem was echoing the words of His Majesty)

[caf]

There was a reference in the opening post.

"it was normal for people to have different viewpoints but that such differences should not cause them to dislike each other or regard as enemies people with views different from theirs."

Very much a Thai way of speaking.

You obviously didn't understand the thrust of my previous post. It is not solely a Thai way of speaking, indeed I suspect that it is a concept that has been imported from Europe. When thinking of Asia Genghis Khan, Bushido, all those benevolent Chinese emperors come to mind. Not a Voltaire amongst them. What is a Thai way of speaking is 'You think too much.'

I enjoyed 7 years of my Thai lady neighbour hating me because I mentioned to another neighbour (a farang) that I wished she didn't make so much noise when she hit the bottle - a frequent event. He kindly reported that back to her. Every card that she played in her hate campaign I trumped - my favourite response being to play a recording made by the Pipes and Drums of the 1st Battalion, The Black Watch on full blast with all the windows open. All my attempts at reconciliation were rebuffed.

I am alienated from my father in law and his eldest son after a difference of opinion about how deep they could mine into my wallet. My wife was the passenger on a motorbike driven by a work colleague involved in a minor accident. The other driver was held to have caused the accident and had to pay medical bills and pay off the police. My wife's colleague blamed my wife ( ????????? - even the boggles boggle ) and has not spoken to her since, thus isolating herself at work.

Thaksin was not renowned for ignoring a slight. It seems that, as ever, actions speak louder than mere words. Prem's good words are but a pipe dream in a Thai context.

P.S. I am aware that the moon isn't made of cream cheese. There are not,as far as I know, any cows on Planet Earth's satellite.

We know there are farang and there are farang, just as there are Thais and there are Thais. None the less, this post gets my vote.

how is what you write relevant to the two posts you are quoting?

[Publicus]

There was a reference in the opening post.

"it was normal for people to have different viewpoints but that such differences should not cause them to dislike each other or regard as enemies people with views different from theirs."

Very much a Thai way of speaking.

You obviously didn't understand the thrust of my previous post. It is not solely a Thai way of speaking, indeed I suspect that it is a concept that has been imported from Europe. When thinking of Asia Genghis Khan, Bushido, all those benevolent Chinese emperors come to mind. Not a Voltaire amongst them. What is a Thai way of speaking is 'You think too much.'

I enjoyed 7 years of my Thai lady neighbour hating me because I mentioned to another neighbour (a farang) that I wished she didn't make so much noise when she hit the bottle - a frequent event. He kindly reported that back to her. Every card that she played in her hate campaign I trumped - my favourite response being to play a recording made by the Pipes and Drums of the 1st Battalion, The Black Watch on full blast with all the windows open. All my attempts at reconciliation were rebuffed.

I am alienated from my father in law and his eldest son after a difference of opinion about how deep they could mine into my wallet. My wife was the passenger on a motorbike driven by a work colleague involved in a minor accident. The other driver was held to have caused the accident and had to pay medical bills and pay off the police. My wife's colleague blamed my wife ( ????????? - even the boggles boggle ) and has not spoken to her since, thus isolating herself at work.

Thaksin was not renowned for ignoring a slight. It seems that, as ever, actions speak louder than mere words. Prem's good words are but a pipe dream in a Thai context.

P.S. I am aware that the moon isn't made of cream cheese. There are not,as far as I know, any cows on Planet Earth's satellite.

We know there are farang and there are farang, just as there are Thais and there are Thais. None the less, this post gets my vote.

how is what you write relevant to the two posts you are quoting?

Thanks for your question. I'm always pleased to assist a fellow forumist if and as I might be able to do so.

My statement "this post gets my vote" is a manner of speaking to indicate that, among other of my reactions to the post, in certain respects I identify with it, I understand it, I've experienced some of the same as the poster, and I like the writing, the mood, tone and voice of the post. I consider that elaborating on it would be unnecessary and, while I too easily could enter some of my own experiences and thoughts to perhaps expand on the essence of the post, I should think the poster made the point more than adequately.

I hope this responds to your enquiry, but do let me know if I can be of further assistance to you.     

[animatic]

There was a reference in the opening post.

"it was normal for people to have different viewpoints but that such differences should not cause them to dislike each other or regard as enemies people with views different from theirs."

Very much a Thai way of speaking.

Some posters criticising Thaksin in a violent sarcastic or insolent way and being overly critical would do well to rememeber that that is not the Thai way

When he was last in Thailand he made a wai to Prem which was acknowledged. " Bad mouthing" is a western and not a thai trait"

It is not inconceivable that he will come back to Thailand, maybe many many years hence. If that happens there will still be that outward show for which the Thais are famous.

Only my opinion but I think most Thais would understand the point.

I recall the news reports during the late summer of 2006 of Prem giving Thaksin a wai from Prem's navel. I guess that maybe it's like a secret handshake in the West. Or maybe not.

Prem giving Thaksin a wai from the navel. ??

Not sure where you see news and such,

but a picture of this incident has been posted many times in TVF.

It was quite the discussion because the wai WAS so low as to be a DIS big time in Thai circle.

Featured in this iconic photo was Anupong Center looking on, Prem with a VERY low wai,

and Thaksin, bent hands under chin supplicant style, the clear message coloquially is 'this guy is toast....'

No forgiveness on offer today, you have gone to far Mr. T.

Wow and such a great distance of fall between that picture showing Kuhn Thaklsin and a previous

Coup Leading General, where Thaksin is seen all but cupping his testicles in delight as the coup leader,

puts a hand on his shoulder in public. Also see in it's full splendor here on TVF in the last several months.

Seems said chain smoking coup leader would shortly give him a rather plum government concession

to do with as he chose. And from such lumps of obsequious clay are dynasties built,

and of such egos from which those dynasties come to fall too.

Might be lost with SJ's lost image trove. But maybe not.

Edited January 5, 2010 by animatic

[Steve2UK]

BURNING ISSUE

Forget Thaksin, PM should rethink strategy, ties to Pheu Thai

By Avudh Panananda

The Nation

Published on January 5, 2010

Although chief royal adviser General Prem Tinsulanonda and fugitive ex-premier Thaksin Shinawatra appear to be worlds apart, the two are bound to collide with one another, causing shocks and reverberations.

The Prem-Thaksin collision is fuelled by political polarisation and not any personal grudges between the two. The government has a pivotal role to end the polarisation and ensure normalcy.

Once the polarisation has dissipated, Prem and Thaksin are likely to diverge from their colliding paths and go separate ways.

But the problem is how to convince parties on either side to see the light, when they choose to believe what they want - instead of embracing the truth. This is the dilemma Prime Minister Abhisit Vejjajiva faces.

Society expects Abhisit to project his leadership to bring about reconciliation. The pressure on this task multiplies; the longer the polarisation persists, the more harm will be done to the monarchy.

Thaksin and his army of red shirts may insist on loyalty to the King. But their relentless attacks on Prem, whose office in the Privy Council is intrinsic to the country's revered institution, have sown seed of doubt about the monarchy.

The proliferation of messages in cyberspace questioning and blaming the monarchy for what people perceive to be setbacks for democracy should be a cause for alarm.

If allowed to spread unchecked, the attacks, despite being barmy and false, can and will alter perceptions about the monarchy in the long run.

As president of the Privy Council, Prem is duty-bound to uphold the monarchy. Since his heyday Thaksin has attributed his predicament to the "power beyond the Constitution".

Even though Prem and the Privy Council have never had any involvement in the unfolding of political events, Thaksin and the red shirts blame the King's men for his downfall.

It is a moot point to argue what really happened when Thaksin and the red shirts convinced a vast number of people, particularly those in rural areas, into believing that Prem had a role in the 2006 coup.

Even to this day, Thaksin and the red shirts have effectively portrayed Prem and the Privy Council as villains against democracy. The false portrayal of Prem is an effective tool to rouse the masses.

Whenever the sentiment for street protests sinks into a lull, the red shirts rally their mob by faulting the King's men, while cheekily professing their undying loyalty.

Next week, rally organiser Weng Tojirakarn will lead a march at Khao Yai Thiang, Nakhon Ratchasima, to attack Privy Councillor Surayud Chulanont for alleged forest encroachment. This is seen as a ploy to boost the red shirts' morale ahead of a planned rally to oust the government.

Only Thaksin, who insists on being a royalist, can answer for why he keeps encouraging the red shirts to pick on the King's men.

Regardless of Thaksin's wrath, Abhisit is obligated to try to stop, or at least cushion the adverse impacts from this bashing of the Privy Council.

The prime minister and his government might have limited options, or none at all, in reasoning with Thaksin, but fences can still be mended with the opposition Pheu Thai Party and the red shirts.

If Abhisit can sever or weaken the ties between Thaksin and his supporters, this will help overcome the polarisation. In the past year the government did almost nothing to reason with the opposition movement.

It is high time for Abhisit to rethink his strategy. A sincere commitment to negotiate an acceptable solution on how to proceed with the charter rewrite might be a good starting point to mend some fences.

-- The Nation January 5, 2010

[newsfooter][/newsfooter]

http://www.nationmultimedia.com/2010/01/05...cs_30119690.php

[LaoPo]

There was a reference in the opening post.

"it was normal for people to have different viewpoints but that such differences should not cause them to dislike each other or regard as enemies people with views different from theirs."

Very much a Thai way of speaking.

Some posters criticising Thaksin in a violent sarcastic or insolent way and being overly critical would do well to rememeber that that is not the Thai way

When he was last in Thailand he made a wai to Prem which was acknowledged. " Bad mouthing" is a western and not a thai trait"

It is not inconceivable that he will come back to Thailand, maybe many many years hence. If that happens there will still be that outward show for which the Thais are famous.

Only my opinion but I think most Thais would understand the point.

I recall the news reports during the late summer of 2006 of Prem giving Thaksin a wai from Prem's navel. I guess that maybe it's like a secret handshake in the West. Or maybe not.

Prem giving Thaksin a wai from the navel. ??

Not sure where you see news and such,

but a picture of this incident has been posted many times in TVF.

It was quite the discussion because the wai WAS so low as to be a DIS big time in Thai circle.

Featured in this iconic photo was Anupong Center looking on, Prem with a VERY low wai,

and Thaksin, bent hands under chin supplicant style, the clear message coloquially is 'this guy is toast....'

No forgiveness on offer today, you have gone to far Mr. T.

do you mean this one ?

Caption:Thaksin Shinawatra gives Privy Council president Gen Prem Tinsulanonda a wai at the funeral rites for the mother of army commander Gen Anupong Paojinda Thursday night. It’s the first time the two have met since the Sept 19, 2006 coup. — Thiti Wannamontha

or this one on another occasion ?

Who's Waiing Who ?

Show me the picture you're talking about and I will sincerely apologize

BTW: you can find both pictures on Gen Prem's own website

LaoPo

[animatic]

I recall the news reports during the late summer of 2006 of Prem giving Thaksin a wai from Prem's navel. I guess that maybe it's like a secret handshake in the West. Or maybe not.

Prem giving Thaksin a wai from the navel. ??

Not sure where you see news and such,

but a picture of this incident has been posted many times in TVF.

It was quite the discussion because the wai WAS so low as to be a DIS big time in Thai circles.

Featured in this iconic photo was Anupong Center looking on, Prem with a VERY low wai,

and Thaksin, bent hands under chin supplicant style, the clear message colloquially is 'this guy is toast....'

No forgiveness on offer today, you have gone to far Mr. T.

do you mean this one ?

Caption:Thaksin Shinawatra gives Privy Council president Gen Prem Tinsulanonda a wai at the funeral rites for the mother of army commander Gen Anupong Paojinda Thursday night. It’s the first time the two have met since the Sept 19, 2006 coup. — Thiti Wannamontha

or this one on another occasion ?

Who's Waiing Who ?

Show me the picture you're talking about and I will sincerely apologize

BTW: you can find both pictures on Gen Prem's own website

LaoPo

There is another pic from the Anupong family funeral very similar to the one above,

possibly shot seconds later, and shot at a lower angle or farther back.

Needless to say using this one, the faces and body language are pretty darned harsh

by Thai standards of comportment. If eyes were daggers Thaksin would be dead where he stood.

One might caption this:

'You have a lot of nerve coming here today.' And that would be putting it quite nicely.

This shot doesn't even show Prem giving the HINT of a wai...

Speaking volumes in Thai polities symbolism.

In the lower shot of earlier times Prem is giving a proper respectful wai of an older higher stationed man,

while Thaksin is in a clearly subservient much deeper wai of a significantly lower personage.

Something he acknowledges by that wai.

So what has changed in Thaksin's mind to think he is suddenly so elevated? Or daring?

Edited January 6, 2010 by animatic

[LaoPo]

There is another pic from the Anupong family funeral very similar to the one above,

possibly shot seconds later, and shot at a lower angle or farther back.

Care to show it ? Surely, if you say that photo exists you can find it or ask around...... right ?

And.....I'm sure Thaksin would post it on his website if such a photo existed but I'm too lazy to find it; after all I took the time to post the other two, didn't I ?

LaoPo

[Steve2UK]

I recall the news reports during the late summer of 2006 of Prem giving Thaksin a wai from Prem's navel. I guess that maybe it's like a secret handshake in the West. Or maybe not.

Prem giving Thaksin a wai from the navel. ??

Not sure where you see news and such,

but a picture of this incident has been posted many times in TVF.

It was quite the discussion because the wai WAS so low as to be a DIS big time in Thai circle.

Featured in this iconic photo was Anupong Center looking on, Prem with a VERY low wai,

and Thaksin, bent hands under chin supplicant style, the clear message coloquially is 'this guy is toast....'

No forgiveness on offer today, you have gone to far Mr. T.

<snip>

Perhaps the picture featured on the The Nation/Daily xPress report at the time is the "missing one"? I would never claim to be an expert on Thai body language, but I think I've been here long enough to recognise any form of "wai" when I see one and this picture doesn't show Prem wai-ing at all - not low or otherwise....... his hands are clasped.

http://www.nationmultimedia.com/search/rea...newsid=30074453

For those anxious to deduce messages from their choice of single photographs, there is a rather more informative alternative available in NBT's video report of the funeral - which also prominently features the impressive line-up of royal wreaths. While I'm also no expert on Thai royal protocol, I think one might reasonably surmise that Gen Prem as President of the Privy Council is attending not only as a friend/colleague of Gen Anupong but also as personal representative of HM the King. As it happens, the video does show Prem both bowing his head to and wai-ing Thaksin at 1'23". I'll leave it to others to dissect what significance they choose to find in just how low Prem's head does or doesn't bow and agonise about how high his hands were for the wai......

[animatic]

Yes that is the second picture I meant.

It doesn't even show a real wai, since it doesn't appear,

from evidence presented thus far, that one was even given in return...

Actually in the video Prem bows his head slightly while walking forward towards Thaksin,

and raises his head as his arms come together slightly.

But we see NOTHING of Prem wai'ing Thaksin in this video.

We then see the individual lower side shot of Prem's clasped hands,

and a more saddened face, and no wai at all. This is logically at the time

when the video of Prem's is hidden by Thaksin's back.

In the top shot, we see eyes drilling into Thaksin like daggers without hands shown.

Interestingly this is the shot chosen for Prem's website.

No wai and clear disapproval of his presence, so clear even a farang can tell at a glance,

For Thai's this must be anything but subtle.

All pretense of Thai traditional greetings towards Thaksin seem to be missing from any media of this event.