Advice On Buying And Running A Bar In Pattaya

[wcr]

PS I bought a business in Pattaya over 2 years ago now and it has been successful for me. Its not a bar, or a guesthouse and I paid over double what you are looking to pay. Keep your mind and options open.

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But this is now advertised for sale in 'Baht & Sold' Advert #8628

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

And your point is?

The fact that I now wish to sell my business doesn't mean its not successful. I bought it as a going concern, made it more successful and now its time for me to sell it as I have a full time job, which I didn't have before.

[thai_norman]

PS I bought a business in Pattaya over 2 years ago now and it has been successful for me. Its not a bar, or a guesthouse and I paid over double what you are looking to pay. Keep your mind and options open.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

But this is now advertised for sale in 'Baht & Sold' Advert #8628

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

And your point is?

The fact that I now wish to sell my business doesn't mean its not successful. I bought it as a going concern, made it more successful and now its time for me to sell it as I have a full time job, which I didn't have before.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

its obviously not as successful as your full time job is it

[ThaiPauly]

On the money he has to spend he might just be able to build himself a small guesthouse.

Take out a lease on an empty shophouse, and redo the interior/rooms.

He wrote all the funds are available for investment and he has seperate funds to keep him going until there is revenue coming in.

A friend of mine did this (although on a little bigger budget) and got pretty succesful by doing things simply better then all the rest. Make the rooms nicer then average, big TV instead of those silly 14" ones, DVD player, he put a second hand PC in every room, hooked up to ADSL broadband...

Relatively inexpensive investments, but they make the rooms stand out!

He made up a nice website, did some decent promotion for it, and now (after 8 months) he receives tens of e-mails a day requesting info, out of which 20% end up in actual bookings.

He has 80% occupancy in low season now, and had to refuse one booking after the other the past high season...

It's possible, but you need even more business sense over here then you would need back in the West to be succesfull!!!

This IS good advice in my opinion. A Guest House is a far better option than a bar

but I would add that NO MATTER WHAT people are saying they are making  halve it then take another 200,000 baht off for good measure. This does not apply to ALL but MOST IMHO. Another peice of advice. Any potential business you think LOOKS GOOD on the outside, stake  it out for ages, see how many people are going in and out over a week in low season at various times of the day and night, then you will be able to work out for yourself what they are making. I did this myself with a business claiming to be making 1.2 m a year After a stake out and then a confrontation with the owner  on seeing the books they were making 78,000 baht a year, yes that is 78,000. Big difference. I did not buy it , naturally

Good Luck

It's really dog eat dog out here 

Disclaimer

Not advised to the faint of heart though    You will end up with serious stomach ulcers when dealing with the landlord, construction people, staff....

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[Teach]

Assuming the choice of owning/running an hotel/bar is your only desire, perhaps you would do well to first manage someone elses bar to gain valuable experience of how things work here because they certainly do run differently. That experience will hold you in good stead rather than learn all the tricks with your own money. Try Bkk as a starting point for short term or part time management. Who knows the experience might throw a different light on the whole idea..and protect your life savings.

T.

[Heng]

Buy the building (of your bar, spa, auto garage, whatever...). Then you can always transform your business into something else or just close up shop and hang out. It seems a lot of renters stay on board until the whole thing crashes into the ground in hopes of a turnaround.

[Pattaya_Fox]

Assuming the choice of owning/running an hotel/bar is your only desire, perhaps you would do well to first manage someone elses bar to gain valuable experience of how things work here because they certainly do run differently. That experience will hold you in good stead rather than learn all the tricks with your own money. Try Bkk as a starting point for short term or part time management. Who knows the experience might throw a different light on the whole idea..and protect your life savings.

T.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Is it really this complicated??

The bottom line is...he`ll be lucky to survive let alone make any money.

Think of something a bit different rather than the obvious disaster route of a bar...or a bar with a few bedrooms.

Look for a niche in the market if you feel that you must...but I think that with your limited amount of capital and the risks involved you`d be better working for yourself in your home country. Start a business which is flexible with time to suit you.

This will give you the opportunity to go to LOS virtually when you want to without losing the shirt off your back.

[lampard10]

What you have to remember is, a lot of bar owners are quite happy just ticking over. They don't want to make millions. All they want is somewhere to get out of the rat-race of living in their home countries,drink free,eat free,and all this while lounging about in the sunshine. I can always remember in my days in Pattaya,we took a group of tourists out in a fishing boat to the islands. We were all catching loads of fish,drinking loads of beer,eating our fresh catch and generally having a great time. I turned to them and said ' It's all right for you lot,you're on holiday. I'm at work'

I bought 'The Farang Connection' mainly because I was fed up doing nothing all day and needed a hobby. OK when I go into a project I pull out the stops and it has turned into a very busy and lucrative business. In fact we get so busy I am having to take the lease next door to double the size of the pub. I still regard it as a hobby though. Maybe when we get a branch in every town in Thailand,then I'll get serious.

The moral; have fun in your project,don't get too serious.

[sparky38]

That last point by lampard is well made- i could stay in my present industry and earn my 40-50k a year but my heart isnt in it- i would rather be poor and happy than well of an bloody miserable.

i am not motivated by the amount of money i am earning but the quest for happiness. i have a gorgeous thai partner - i know arn't they all and i want to at least have a crack at the dream- there are plenty of businesses over here that fail but that dosn't stop people still having a try.

a lot of bar owners are happy over there from what i can see- even if they do seem to want to drink their bar dry every day.

again i thank everyone for their contribution. its probably about 10-1 against the idea but i knew before i started that living the dream comes at a price.

If i fail at leat i would have had a go an the worst i would have lost is a couple of years of my life and 20k- not bad odds really

[Wanderer]

could anyone give me any advice on first buying and then running a bar in pattaya.

Had enough of blighty and going to sell my house and have about 15-20k spare to go over to pattaya.i have had previous bar management  experience  as well as a sales and marketing background within the toursit industry ie uk holiday parks. tho i suspect this will be as much use as a glass hammer in pattaya.

all the same nothing ventured nothing gained an all that. i just need the lowdown on buyin a bar/ guesthouse mainly and then the problems of running one over there.

as i said any constructive advice would be welcome

cheers

Sparky

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

not an expert or nothing but have been drinking in a lot a beer bars and i know what i lilke, and have been studying the subject but have gone for property invest.

1. do not use blue tiles as a bar counter ( they are cold) go for thr the wood effect

2. Get a nice a pool 'standard' pool table (not american with big pockets)

3. Get pretyy looking barmaids/blokes

4. Put a BAR like enlosure around your gaff, people like to gawk at passing poeple.

5. Play music as per clientlele ie Eminim to a 60 + guy is not going to go well vise/versa7

6. people in pattaya like to look or ............ so make up your niche

7. Obviously if you wife/gfstill wants to do the bar thing, i would be asking her why the &lt;deleted&gt; doesn't she want to do a proper business or does she want to be a Mamma Son s and you a pimp,,, great as a poatcard signing to your mother ;;;;

[zoro]

could anyone give me any advice on first buying and then running a bar in pattaya.

Had enough of blighty and going to sell my house and have about 15-20k spare to go over to pattaya.i have had previous bar management  experience  as well as a sales and marketing background within the toursit industry ie uk holiday parks. tho i suspect this will be as much use as a glass hammer in pattaya.

all the same nothing ventured nothing gained an all that. i just need the lowdown on buyin a bar/ guesthouse mainly and then the problems of running one over there.

as i said any constructive advice would be welcome

cheers

Sparky

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

not an expert or nothing but have been drinking in a lot a beer bars and i know what i lilke, and have been studying the subject but have gone for property invest.

1. do not use blue tiles as a bar counter ( they are cold) go for thr the wood effect

2. Get a nice a pool 'standard' pool table (not american with big pockets)

3. Get pretyy looking barmaids/blokes

4. Put a BAR like enlosure around your gaff, people like to gawk at passing poeple.

5. Play music as per clientlele ie Eminim to a 60 + guy is not going to go well vise/versa7

6. people in pattaya like to look or ............ so make up your niche

7. Obviously if you wife/gfstill wants to do the bar thing, i would be asking her why the &lt;deleted&gt; doesn't she want to do a proper business or does she want to be a Mamma Son s and you a pimp,,, great as a poatcard signing to your mother ;;;;

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

TRY the new craze become a REAL ESTATE AGENT it must be the best buisness.The agents in pattaya must be catching with bar owners .Anyone done a count up.Nightmarch change shifts but take abottle or two.Good luck you will need plenty of it .

[Wanderer]

could anyone give me any advice on first buying and then running a bar in pattaya.

Had enough of blighty and going to sell my house and have about 15-20k spare to go over to pattaya.i have had previous bar management  experience  as well as a sales and marketing background within the toursit industry ie uk holiday parks. tho i suspect this will be as much use as a glass hammer in pattaya.

all the same nothing ventured nothing gained an all that. i just need the lowdown on buyin a bar/ guesthouse mainly and then the problems of running one over there.

as i said any constructive advice would be welcome

cheers

Sparky

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

not an expert or nothing but have been drinking in a lot a beer bars and i know what i lilke, and have been studying the subject but have gone for property invest.

1. do not use blue tiles as a bar counter ( they are cold) go for thr the wood effect

2. Get a nice a pool 'standard' pool table (not american with big pockets)

3. Get pretyy looking barmaids/blokes

4. Put a BAR like enlosure around your gaff, people like to gawk at passing poeple.

5. Play music as per clientlele ie Eminim to a 60 + guy is not going to go well vise/versa7

6. people in pattaya like to look or ............ so make up your niche

7. Obviously if you wife/gfstill wants to do the bar thing, i would be asking her why the &lt;deleted&gt; doesn't she want to do a proper business or does she want to be a Mamma Son s and you a pimp,,, great as a poatcard signing to your mother ;;;;

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

TRY the new craze become a REAL ESTATE AGENT it must be the best buisness.The agents in pattaya must be catching with bar owners .Anyone done a count up.Nightmarch change shifts but take abottle or two.Good luck you will need plenty of it .

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Did i write that gibberish, i must have after a few and thats usually when i get checking my emails and stuff. (although still hate blue tiles)

Yeah i've seen all the new real estate 'agents' popping up everywhere and with ,(i especially like the ones with hotmail addresses) View Talay must have at 6 condo projects on the go. The property market will definatly go tits up in the next couple of years. Everbody is in for the quick buck, moving on to the next project before they even finish the one they are working on. Crash of 97 ? what was that

Think you would want to live here a while before buying into a bar and do alot of research ie visiting/drinking in them

Edited May 17, 2005 by Wanderer

[wilson steer]

There was also a bakery, 7th Heaven, tucked away behind the Bowling club, been there for ages, but now also sadly gone (so my mate tells me, the Scouse owner was thinking of relocating to Goa?).

He's still baking in Sihanoukville Cambodia. As are a couple of ex bar owners from Pattaya that left last year.

BTW. He has kept the same name, 7th Heaven Cafe. If you ever head that way, you will find him on Ekareach St.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I think his name was Dave the baker, but I wish he would come back and make his bread, because the alternative bakery on Soi Xzyte creates asteroid-weight loaves which are inedible and can be used as bowls at the bowling green opposite.

BTW: Original poster; don't buy any business here, I have been here only four years and have seen dozens of friends ruined both metally and financially by imagining that they can make a business work here. Come to Pattaya, bring your money and spend it slowly on having a good time, then go home, earn some more and do it again. That way will cause a lot less heartache and grief.

[barryofthailand]

I agree with Wilson,

every Farrang that owns a bar here in Pattaya will tell you they ate doing great, even a friend of mine who owns a bar on Soi 7. This particular bar is bussier then all the rest in the area., but he still has a hard time making money when it is all said and done. When low season hits like now all the bars are empty.

[Khutan]

My advice;

Do your research

Do a proper business plan.

Only after that can you see if its coing to have half a chance at success.

Try to get as much as you can into the business plan. Even to the point of making a conscious decision if you are going to charge a customer for breaking a glass (some places do that)

If you don't do the research and the plan, you can only guess.

Good Luck.

[Steve Ireland]

Hey All,

I plan to emmigrate to Thailand (Pattaya) in April 2007. I am in the process of seeking premises in a Gay area and I need to know the Visa situation for setting up business and residing there. My understanding, having spoken with other 'farangs' and 'expats' is that I can do so provided I set up business within 6 months and employ a minimum of 50% thai staff (which frankly would be my intention). I am looking for bars (preferably in or near Boyztown rather than Suni Plaza, New build or existing and must be large enough for substantial entertainment program., not interested in a go-go bar, I'm going in a completely different direction. I firmly believe that knowledge is power so if anyone has ANY advice whatsoever I'd be most grateful. Not really interested in partnerships and I have 16 years Management experience. HELP. Oh and I HAVE identified a niche and I'm coming with 4.5 Million Baht and further security/funds in Ireland.

Edited November 23, 2006 by Steve Ireland

[rocky]

A Fool and their money are very easily parted. Money will be taken from your hands here in Thailand quicker than you can count.

Most small business farang owned in Thailand fail.

Do you have experience in running a guest house-bar ?

Would you condider opening the same business at home ?

Have you ever ran your own business ?

If the answer to the above three questions is no, i can tell you within one or two years you will be broke,

[Buckwheat]

My advice;

Do your research

Do a proper business plan.

Only after that can you see if its coing to have half a chance at success.

Try to get as much as you can into the business plan. Even to the point of making a conscious decision if you are going to charge a customer for breaking a glass (some places do that)

If you don't do the research and the plan, you can only guess.

Good Luck.

Amen to the above...

1) Location (a bar in the midst of 25 other bars trying to "out volume" the next probably isn't a real good idea)

2) Do something unique that the other 5000 bars aren't doing

[Little Black Duck]

could anyone give me any advice on first buying and then running a bar in pattaya.

Had enough of blighty and going to sell my house and have about 15-20k spare to go over to pattaya.i have had previous bar management experience as well as a sales and marketing background within the toursit industry ie uk holiday parks. tho i suspect this will be as much use as a glass hammer in pattaya.

all the same nothing ventured nothing gained an all that. i just need the lowdown on buyin a bar/ guesthouse mainly and then the problems of running one over there.

as i said any constructive advice would be welcome

cheers

Sparky

You've been given a lot of good advise,,Up to you if you take it..

A Fool and his money are easily parted.. Spot on the Mark buying a Beer bar..

A Guest House with a little restaurant and bar,,,Maybee..

Groucho Marx said"There's a sucker born every minute!!"

My question is "Are You a Sucker??"

[twix38]

Just give me your money and I will tell you how the bar failed and you lost all your savings and still owe a bit more with suppliers, key money and corruption/protection payments. If I used the money to buy a premises, then I can leave you with the running costs until you find another mug!!

At best, after a short while it's stressfull, unprofitable or put out of business and an unltimately unrewarding experience and at worst you are dead or single again and broke.

I don't understand what makes anyone willingly throw GBP 15 - 20k away along with a solid relationship. This is no business to get into for a prosperous future, no matter how appealing it sounds from good old Blighty.

I put your chances of success, profitability and happiness at less than 3%.

Sorry, but you need to wake up to the Micro and Macro, business and cultural dynamics of what you plan. I guarantee a time will come when you think to yourself "this was a mistake". Well within year 1!!!!!!

[Pattaya_Fox]

Hey All,

I plan to emmigrate to Thailand (Pattaya) in April 2007. I am in the process of seeking premises in a Gay area and I need to know the Visa situation for setting up business and residing there. My understanding, having spoken with other 'farangs' and 'expats' is that I can do so provided I set up business within 6 months and employ a minimum of 50% thai staff (which frankly would be my intention). I am looking for bars (preferably in or near Boyztown rather than Suni Plaza, New build or existing and must be large enough for substantial entertainment program., not interested in a go-go bar, I'm going in a completely different direction. I firmly believe that knowledge is power so if anyone has ANY advice whatsoever I'd be most grateful. Not really interested in partnerships and I have 16 years Management experience. HELP. Oh and I HAVE identified a niche and I'm coming with 4.5 Million Baht and further security/funds in Ireland.

Why don`t you contact Thai visa sponsor Sunbelt Asia. They transfer businesses including bars and they have an office in Pattaya....I am sure that they will provide you with the up to date legal requirements and details of suitable businesses which they have on their books.

[thaiflyer1]

Double amen to the last 4 posts.......

[libya 115]

I have had three friends who decided to buy a bar-beer in Pattaya. Their stories I relate below.

MR 'A'

Mr 'A' was a bit daft, a bit slow, but had a very good heart. He bought a bar-beer with his Thai girlfriend, who was also a bit daft and slow. It went very well for a month, then it began to lose money. Mr. 'A' blamed it on stolen stock and dishonest staff. The bar on Soi 8 folded after just 11 months. Mr 'A' can see the funny side now. He lost around 35K GBP, but he is lucky, he has a nice big pension and is still with the same Thai girlfriend.

So, even with a good wife/girlfiend, failure is possible.

MR 'B'

Mr 'B' was confident from the beginning. His Thai girlfiend was keen so he bought a bar on Soi 7. He lasted just nine months. He never made money, and had trouble with extortion and dishonest staff. It turned out his girlfriend did not love him, and she milked every baht out of the business. He lost his life savings. He lives on a British pension, and sits opposite Soi Bukhaew market every Tuesday and Friday, cursing invisible ghosts, clearly insane and befuddled with Chang beer at 8.00 am.

When I look at his (defunct) laminated business card proudly advertising his Soi 7 bar, I am moved to tears.

MR 'C'

Mr 'C' was the nicest guy in the world. He fell in love with a bar girl, went back to the U.K. sold his house (for 115K GBP) and bought a bar-beer. He lasted three years. His girlfriend had a secret Thai lover and milked the business of cash. He poisoned himself by drinking a bottle of nitric acid, he died two weeks later, in agony, after admitting to doctors, family and friends he wished he hadn't tried to kill himself and had just gone back to the U.K. and sic 'started again'.

So take your pick. Some business ideas might work, most fail. But after failure there always seems to be tragedy or loss of sanity. My advice would be to keep your money in your high-interest account and just have a long holiday.

Edited November 23, 2006 by libya 115

[twix38]

Agree Libya115,

Sorry to hear those sorry tales, but not particularly surprised.

Anyone going ahead with a venture like this after reading the general tone of advice clearly has had a large dose of early insanity and wants to test everything to be seen as a shinning star amongst the fallen angels.

Chance of overall and enduring success. 3% was trying to be encouraging. LOL

[h5n1]

there are two types of people that make money on bars:

landlord

people doing the build out

you lose -

[CharlesDavid]

For most farangs buying a bar in Pattaya turns out to be the worst decision since Gary Glitter decided to get his computer serviced.

Some however (under 10%) do manage to make a living out of it. If you are to be successful spend a lot of time looking for the right bar and a lot of time checking out the bars that are being run successfully. If you can put your finger on what makes them a success(location, ownner's personality, ambience, good food, dart league member, outgoing and vivacious staff) and can replicate the formula in your own bar you may have a chance.

I couldn't do it and wouldn't even risk trying but as I've said a very small percentage do make it.

Edited November 23, 2006 by CharlesDavid

[roadking95]

I have read the posts on here and buying a beer bar sounds like a minefield. I am looking at a Guesthouse and small bar which sounds a bit better than a beer bar. So if these types of business are so bad, what type of business would you buy in Pattaya. I couldnt move there and sit off my arse and live off my investments that would bore me to death, that is why I would entertain the thought of a small business. Someone in Pattaya has to be making money on a business surely, I am also looking at business in Vietnam and Cambodia but I think that it could have the same problems

And talking of businesses for sale,after reading adverts for business for sale on certain sites, they say they are making money, not a great return but a fair return. These companies must be telling fibs from what I read on here. I was wondering what most of the posters on here do for work, if you dont own a business you must be working for someone, or have most of you retired due to age.

Steve

[Sir Burr]

Groucho Marx said"There's a sucker born every minute!!"

Nope. It was P.T. Barnum that said that.

[CharlesDavid]

And talking of businesses for sale,after reading adverts for business for sale on certain sites, they say they are making money, not a great return but a fair return. These companies must be telling fibs from what I read on here. I was wondering what most of the posters on here do for work, if you dont own a business you must be working for someone, or have most of you retired due to age.

Steve

There are many businesses making money in Pattaya and by and large they are not for sale. People do not sell successful businesses and nobody advertises an unsuccessful business for sale truthfully (I am losing/ have lost my life savings and want somebody to take it off me).

Have a look round at the businesses that are not for sale. What are they doing that you could replicate or even improve on?

I went into business here by doing just that and am happy with my returns so far.

Some businesses that seem to be doing okay in Pattaya from what I can see:-

Motorcycle rental

McDonalds franchise

Subway franchise

7/11 franchise

2nd hand bookstores

Cafes with cheap English food

Gymnasiums

[monty]

Quite a few businesses make a good profit, but as said above they are generally not for sale, unless forced due to outside reasons (health, family reasons, etc).

If you're making money and like the job (a pre-requisite to be succesfull in my opinion), then where is the reasoning in selling your place unless somebody is willing to pay silly money!

Unless you are really really sure of what you are doing, I would advice something with a low initial outlay, and especially a low monthly overhead. It's the high overhead killing most businesses during low season.

The secondhand bookshop was an excellent example of such a low overhead business, and it's proven succesfull. Unfortunately for you there are plenty already...

Combine the low overhead with a year round target market (read the budgetted expat as opposed to the rich but only temporary tourist) and you stand a good chance of surviving the low season. As above, who you think buys secondhand books???

[monty]

I just re-read the post of the member who picked this thread back up and it seems he has the business plan already.

He looks more advice re the legal side to set his venture up, so better he posts in the business section.

As well, he looks to set-up shop with gays as a target market, which is not a bad idea as generally they seem to have a higher success rate. Guess they stick a bit more together (no pun intended ).

Just hope he actually is gay himself, can't see it to be a happy job if you're straight!