Front - Rear Wheel Drive

[gravion]

what are the pros and cons?

i hear alot of ppl saying tuning FWD cars are not wise, because even u get power, u dont get traction.

but there are heaps of tuned FWD cars like integra, civic.. and when i see some clips on utube, there are nice looking 500hp turbo civic...

also FWD uses the front to brake and accelerate, burning up the tyre and break.

so tuned FWD are basically for enjoyment in driving, and love for their car?

i will be pretty happy if i get 180hp ish on sohc civic, as long as i can enjoy driving and makes good noise...

[pattayabuggy]

Look on the Internet,

Here are the main pros and cons of each layout:

Rear Wheel Drive

There are two main advantages to owning a RWD car. The first is that RWD is both simple and rugged — especially if it’s a solid axle design — and can take a lot of abuse without needing expensive repairs. Accidentally run over a curb in a solid axle RWD car, for instance, and you probably won’t break anything. But hit a curb (or even a deep pothole) in a FWD car and the odds are much higher that something expensive will be damaged. This is why cop cars and other “service” vehicles are overwhelmingly RWD.

The other advantage RWD cars offer is better balance — and because of this, better handling. While a FWD car has most of the weight of the engine and transaxle (the transmission and axle assembly are one unit in a FWD car) over the front wheels, a RWD car spreads the weight of its drivetrain more evenly front-to-rear. This is why most sports cars — and virtually all race cars — are RWD.

And cons? As anyone who has owned one will tell you, RWD cars are at their weakest in poor weather — rain and snow. Even with modern traction control, a RWD car is more prone to loss of traction on slick roads. In snow, RWD cars are best left home.

Front Wheel Drive

As with RWD, FWD offers two main advantages — just very different ones. The first is economy. It is cheaper to design and build a FWD car. There are fewer parts — and the drivetrain is easier and cheaper to install as the car rolls down the assembly line. FWD also helps cut down the car’s weight by eliminating the separate transmission and axle assemblies used in a RWD car. This, in turn helps the car get better gas mileage. This is why FWD is most commonly found in economy-type and lower-cost cars.

The other FDW plus is better traction than a RWD car can deliver — especially in rain and snow. The front wheels pull the car instead of the rear wheels pushing it. And, the weight of the engine/transaxle sits on top of the (front) drive wheels, which further helps the car get a grip. FWD cars are typically very capable in poor weather — even excellent, when fitted with snow tires.

Cons? FWD cars are nose-heavy, which isn’t optimal for handling — especially high-speed, high-load handling. A related problem is that the front wheels have to do two things at once — put the power to the ground and steer the car. This, too, is not optimal for a performance/sporty car. In a high-powered FWD car, it can sometimes be difficult or awkward to keep the car pointed straight ahead as the car accelerates. The front wheels may jerk to the left or right — a problem called “torque steer.” Modern FWD cars are less prone to this thanks to electronic traction control, but it’s still not the hot set-up for performance applications — which is why very few “serious” performance cars are FWD.

The final thing to know about FWD is that it’s relatively fragile. Half-shafts and constant velocity (CV) joints are more susceptible to injury than a rugged lump of cast iron — as in a RWD car’s solid axle. While a RWD car’s axle may outlast the car and never require service beyond the occasional lube change, it is far more likely that a FWD car will need new CV joints/boots or something else as the years roll by.

All Wheel Drive

The best thing about AWD is that it gives you some of the advantages of both RWD and FWD — while minimizing the weaker points of either of those layouts.

The number one advantage of AWD is excellent traction — both on dry pavement and in poor weather. This is why AWD appeals to both the performance-minded enthusiast as well as the person who just doesn’t want to get stuck in the snow. Some AWD systems are based on RWD layouts (examples include the Mercedes Benz E-Class) while others are built around FWD layouts (such as any new Subaru). The RWD-based versions are usually more performance-oriented but all AWD vehicles do an impressive job of balancing handling/driving dynamics with “go anywhere, anytime” bad weather capability.

But there are downsides — the two biggest ones being weight and cost. AWD cars can weigh several hundred pounds more than an otherwise identical RWD or FWD car. This hurts the car’s acceleration — at least, when compared with an otherwise identical RWD or FWD version of the same car. And the added weight means the car will use more fuel — especially if the engine’s power has been increased to compensate for the added weight.

The last downside with AWD is the cost. AWD, when offered as an option, usually adds significantly to the car’s sticker price. If it’s standard equipment, the car will usually cost more than otherwise equivalent FWD or RWD cars. And because there are more components, there are more things that will need to be serviced — and which may eventually fail and hit you up with a big bill as the car gets older.

So, you’ll pay more up front — at the pump — and down the road. But that may be worth not getting stuck every time it snows — and still being able to tear into corners when it’s nice out.

[Deke]

I once had a front-wheel drive Honda Accord. After the car got to be a few years old, the FWD was continually giving me grief. It seemed like there was always something going wrong with it. Plus the turning radius was enormous. Never again.

[t.s]

it is VERY difficult to drift a fwd.

[pattayabuggy]

I don't think that is correct, I think most modern cars, certainly Japanese is FWD, have you checked?

[CDNinKS]

Plus the turning radius was enormous.

By design CV joints just can't handle a short turning radius. I was surprised to find out that the turning radius of my larger Pajero Sport (RWD) is smaller than a Honda Civic (FWD)

[katabeachbum]

Look on the Internet,

Here are the main pros and cons of each layout:

Rear Wheel Drive

There are two main advantages to owning a RWD car. The first is that RWD is both simple and rugged — especially if it’s a solid axle design — and can take a lot of abuse without needing expensive repairs. Accidentally run over a curb in a solid axle RWD car, for instance, and you probably won’t break anything. But hit a curb (or even a deep pothole) in a FWD car and the odds are much higher that something expensive will be damaged. This is why cop cars and other “service” vehicles are overwhelmingly RWD.

The other advantage RWD cars offer is better balance — and because of this, better handling. While a FWD car has most of the weight of the engine and transaxle (the transmission and axle assembly are one unit in a FWD car) over the front wheels, a RWD car spreads the weight of its drivetrain more evenly front-to-rear. This is why most sports cars — and virtually all race cars — are RWD.

And cons? As anyone who has owned one will tell you, RWD cars are at their weakest in poor weather — rain and snow. Even with modern traction control, a RWD car is more prone to loss of traction on slick roads. In snow, RWD cars are best left home.

Front Wheel Drive

As with RWD, FWD offers two main advantages — just very different ones. The first is economy. It is cheaper to design and build a FWD car. There are fewer parts — and the drivetrain is easier and cheaper to install as the car rolls down the assembly line. FWD also helps cut down the car’s weight by eliminating the separate transmission and axle assemblies used in a RWD car. This, in turn helps the car get better gas mileage. This is why FWD is most commonly found in economy-type and lower-cost cars.

The other FDW plus is better traction than a RWD car can deliver — especially in rain and snow. The front wheels pull the car instead of the rear wheels pushing it. And, the weight of the engine/transaxle sits on top of the (front) drive wheels, which further helps the car get a grip. FWD cars are typically very capable in poor weather — even excellent, when fitted with snow tires.

Cons? FWD cars are nose-heavy, which isn’t optimal for handling — especially high-speed, high-load handling. A related problem is that the front wheels have to do two things at once — put the power to the ground and steer the car. This, too, is not optimal for a performance/sporty car. In a high-powered FWD car, it can sometimes be difficult or awkward to keep the car pointed straight ahead as the car accelerates. The front wheels may jerk to the left or right — a problem called “torque steer.” Modern FWD cars are less prone to this thanks to electronic traction control, but it’s still not the hot set-up for performance applications — which is why very few “serious” performance cars are FWD.

The final thing to know about FWD is that it’s relatively fragile. Half-shafts and constant velocity (CV) joints are more susceptible to injury than a rugged lump of cast iron — as in a RWD car’s solid axle. While a RWD car’s axle may outlast the car and never require service beyond the occasional lube change, it is far more likely that a FWD car will need new CV joints/boots or something else as the years roll by.

All Wheel Drive

The best thing about AWD is that it gives you some of the advantages of both RWD and FWD — while minimizing the weaker points of either of those layouts.

The number one advantage of AWD is excellent traction — both on dry pavement and in poor weather. This is why AWD appeals to both the performance-minded enthusiast as well as the person who just doesn’t want to get stuck in the snow. Some AWD systems are based on RWD layouts (examples include the Mercedes Benz E-Class) while others are built around FWD layouts (such as any new Subaru). The RWD-based versions are usually more performance-oriented but all AWD vehicles do an impressive job of balancing handling/driving dynamics with “go anywhere, anytime” bad weather capability.

But there are downsides — the two biggest ones being weight and cost. AWD cars can weigh several hundred pounds more than an otherwise identical RWD or FWD car. This hurts the car’s acceleration — at least, when compared with an otherwise identical RWD or FWD version of the same car. And the added weight means the car will use more fuel — especially if the engine’s power has been increased to compensate for the added weight.

The last downside with AWD is the cost. AWD, when offered as an option, usually adds significantly to the car’s sticker price. If it’s standard equipment, the car will usually cost more than otherwise equivalent FWD or RWD cars. And because there are more components, there are more things that will need to be serviced — and which may eventually fail and hit you up with a big bill as the car gets older.

So, you’ll pay more up front — at the pump — and down the road. But that may be worth not getting stuck every time it snows — and still being able to tear into corners when it’s nice out.

Recent test between VW Scirocco FWD 265 hp and Nissan 370Z RWD approx same power. Scirocco scored better in every handling aspect, and was the winner overall.

[pattayabuggy]

Recent test between VW Scirocco FWD 265 hp and Nissan 370Z RWD approx same power. Scirocco scored better in every handling aspect, and was the winner overall.

Yes, it's only a guide, those Germans are good engineers.

Also remember the domination of rallies in the 60's by the FWD Mini, rules are meant to be broken sometimes. Thank you for pointing that one out.

Still, I personally prefer RWD, we have no snow and ice to contend with here and I prefer the handling, as a general rule, but I have never driven a Sirocco.

Back to the original posters question, the Civic is a good car, look at them winning race after race at Bira. Don't be put off by the fact it's FWD.

[LivinLOS]

If your a hard driver, theres no comparison.. Rear wheel drive tightens the line, FWD loosens it..

I am always annoyed theres so few RWD choices here..

[pattayabuggy]

There are so few choices, full stop, unless you own a bank!

[stingray]

There are so few choices, full stop, unless you own a bank!

You never see a FWD in a formula one and you never see a FWD in a Pick Up Truck. You never see a BMW with a FWD. RWD cars are not only stronger, they are easier to maintenance (gearbox swap), run much smoother and are better to control in a sharp curve (RWD cornering with a handbrake on snow can be fun). All 4 cylinder FWD cars have some typical vibration on idle speed, specially automatic ones, when AC is turned on (sometime the whole dashboard rattles). It's the engine mounts, they get <deleted>... almost every 2 years. Even you replace them the shake and rattles never go compleately away. Once the engine is out of aligment (for example when you hit a speedbump or someting else) it's very hard to fix it again. They always still ratteling.

Drift cars: Yes there are many FWD, exept older Cefiros, but the reason using used Japs and modifie them to a drift car is, because they cost almost nothing in western countries. For 2'000 Dollar you'll get in Eruope a 93 honda prelude or Legent Coupe, for example. If you smash it......., not a big deal. But noone would waste a 69 Camaro insteat.

[LivinLOS]

FWD drift cars ?? Really ??? What models do they use ?? Also I thought the Cefiro was RWD..

One aspect of FWD is they are sort of safer.. Over cook a FWD and you just get under steer, back off and your still pointing the right way (but maybe you lost your corner line and ran out of road).. Over cook a RWD and your fishtailing around..

[b19bry]

One aspect of FWD is they are sort of safer..

That was always my understanding of the reason of the shift from mostly RWD to FWD cars from the 60's onwards

Over cook a FWD and you just get under steer, back off and your still pointing the right way (but maybe you lost your corner line and ran out of road)..

Well the point is if you've overcooked it you simply ease off and you should get the line back onto the road unless you seriously overdid it !!

As an aside the OP mentioned tuned 500hp Civic's, I don't think 500hp through FWD would be sensibly feasible, torque steer would be uncontrollable.

They are also more controllable in snow though the value of that in Thailand must be questionable !

Over cook a RWD and your fishtailing around..

Once you overcook a RWD you've induced oversteer which requires a little more finesse (than simply easing off) in the shape of 'opposite lock' to control and maintain balance. There's also the danger of fishtailing or spinning should this all go wrong !

I'm sure most enthusiast drivers would go for RWD over FWD

[WarpSpeed]

Over cook a RWD and your fishtailing around..

Once you overcook a RWD you've induced oversteer which requires a little more finesse (than simply easing off) in the shape of 'opposite lock' to control and maintain balance. There's also the danger of fishtailing or spinning should this all go wrong !

I'm sure most enthusiast drivers would go for RWD over FWD

Maybe "enthusiasts" but not real drivers.. I'm way past the level of a simple enthusiast and this is a generalization that doesn't apply for me..

[eTiMaGo]

it's a question of what's available too...

let's say you want a new car around a million baht or less, you have lots of options here for FWD. I would say the "sportiest" FWD's here would be the Ford Focus TDi or the Proton Neo CPS?

a brand new, sub-million RWD? pickup truck... or, for something second hand, do what the Thais do... old Nissan Cefiro or Volvo or BMW with a big japanese engine swap, budget racing machine

Yes, RWD does have the image of being the hairy-chested man's man kinda car, the kind of car that requires real skill to control at the limit. But that is not to say you can look down on front wheel drive cars, they have their own set of advantages, snow notwithstanding...

My advice? borrow or buy a Playstation 3 or an Xbox360, and a proper racing simulation (GT5 Prologue on PS3, Forza 3 on the Xbox), and experiment! These games are really good at being a kind of sandbox, although it does not equal real experience, you can really learn a lot from them about the different ways different kinds of cars handle...

[LivinLOS]

Over cook a RWD and your fishtailing around..

Once you overcook a RWD you've induced oversteer which requires a little more finesse (than simply easing off) in the shape of 'opposite lock' to control and maintain balance. There's also the danger of fishtailing or spinning should this all go wrong !

I'm sure most enthusiast drivers would go for RWD over FWD

Maybe "enthusiasts" but not real drivers.. I'm way past the level of a simple enthusiast and this is a generalization that doesn't apply for me..

In what way ??

I think most fast / sport / hard drivers, who like to drive a car beyond the traction limits sometimes, would prefer a RWD car.. Why do you prefer a FWD ??

[FlatOut]

Honda's, especially 90's ones have equal length drive shafts so no torque steer. I know many 300-400 turbo'd CRX's and Civics, admittedly they do use a LSD (Quaife/TranX) and are generally used for 1/4 mile runs.

To the OP, I reckon you'd struggle to get 180 from a SOHC D16 unless turbo, but then the bottom ends are excellent for that and this is where you can run 300bhp quite easily. 250bhp on the road is even too much. Regardless if its boosted or NASP, the best thing you can do is tuning/mapping. You can get piggyback ECU's from Malaysia on the cheap (pm me if you want a contact). Even with simple bolt on mods, get the fueling and ignition right and you make FULL use of them.

My opinion in the whole RWD/FWD thing is , if you have to ask, then you need a FWD. If you already know then you'll be driving a RWD. The best comprimise for a FWD is a Honda in my eyes. They get it right pretty much all of the time, except the money spinning city boxes and SUVs.

[philipm]

FWD- pulls the car, rather then pushs. FWD suffer from under steer, (in a tight apex, with an overpower maneuver it will tend to shift the car to the outside of the apex). FWD are not used for drifting, there is a technique to make the car slide, but with minimum control and needs exceptional driving technique to do it properly. its easy to just pull the hand brake, but its understeer characteristics is opposite of any rwd.

FWD are nices for daily cruzing, track sprints especially when you use a light weight body, (honda civic eg/ek hatch or even the intergra dc5)-which are both world renounced for the handling characteristics.

RWD-Pushs the car, and suffers from oversteer (in tight apex, with overpower maneuver the car will tend to go in Tighter into the apex),

that is why they are used for drifting. when you overpower or pull the handbrake, double clutch kick or use the Norwegian flick, the car will first pull its nose

facing directly at the inner apex, so counter steering the opposite direction is necessary as well as feather the throttle. rwd are easy to drift with decent torque levels, they are also more joy to drive on highway cruize, plus most rwd have traction control, or an lsd for the majority.

if you go for a big sedan, i always recommend a RWD, for a smaller car FWD is more economical.

if you want to modify a car, a fwd is suited for track use and sometimes drag racing-depending on the power level/traction capabilities, rwd is suited for track, drag, drifting.

as for the cefiro, the cefiro old generation is RWD, but the newer cefiro are FWD. thats why the old generation cefiro is definitely the better option in terms of performance.