Poverty Forces Thai Women Into Foreign Marriages

[Sansai Sam]

I think this one hits a little too close to home for the majority of your readers George!

[chuchok]

 

I'm sure many on this forum can share a simular story.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

err...NO

I certainly don't and I believe many here do not as well.

[slim]

Although it is based on a study in a single north-eastern village, the report by Dr. Rattana Boonmathaya from Mahidol University has wider resonances in a society in which marriage to foreigners is a popular option.

The particular village chosen for the study is noticeable for the fact that nearly one in three of the 330 women aged 20-59 resident there has chosen to marry a foreigner, with 96 percent having married men from Switzerland.

One in three of 330 women ??????

96% having married men from Switzerland???

Pardon?

I married a Thai girl from a N.E. Thai village called Lak Chat near Nam Pong which is about 50 miles from Khon Kaen.

There's only 1 other falang in her village of some 200+ women.

In the entire area of Nam Pong (pop. 25000+ ) I doubt if there's 10 falangs.

We shop in Khon Kaen's (Thailand's 3rd largest city by population 1.7m) biggest supermarket Big C twice a week.

I've never seen more than 3 falangs in the place.

..................and yet this report claims over 100 women from a small village are all married to Swiss citizens?

Mahidol University?

Kindergarden would be more appropriate.

[wolf5370]

What makes you think this study is biased? Without knowing the methodology, there's no way to judge. One assumes a Mahidol professor would know who to design and carry out an empirical study.

Tiny test group, a single village. I presume mostly inhabited by men that through jelousy blame the farang for 'taking their women', women who were overlooked and the majority of the rest couldn't care less either way. Most of the girls actaly married to farang would be away with their farang husbands I would guess - after all a very small percentage actually settle in the village. Most go home or to the big smokes.

So, ask a biased, small audience, and be surprised by the answer - yeah, real empirical.

Most of my farang freinds are married to Thais. About 75% are of similar ages (give or take 5 years) - certainly no difference from western couples. Some do have a large age gap, but I see just as many (or few perhaps) marital problems in both groups! My test group is small too - does it carry the same weight?

My Mrs didn't come from a farming community, she came from a millitary family. She was a school teacher when we met and earned OK. She says she did not want to marry a Thai man - she had her dad turn away a few 'suitors', both Thai and Thai/Chinese. Why? She says Thai men are lazy and untrust worthy and do not care for their wives. I am sure this is not universally true, but it is the thought that is in many Thai girls' heads. Of course, this would not stroke the egos of male Thai news editors and politicians, much easier to blame it on economics.

Poppycock.

[george]

Several inappropriate posts removed due to personal attacks, bad language etc.

/Admin

[Backpack_thailand]

Indeed, some older people even say that they do not want sons at all, describing them as 'useless'.

Sums up the average Thai bloke quite well...!

[dragonmasterzip]

So why the complicated story:  My girlfriend wants me to accept her sister-in-law and children in my home.  While she's working she will pay the women to clean my house and provide wifely service to me.  She thinks we can be a big happy family and I'm worried that relationship problems will mess up the works. 

I love children so no problem here, the problem is having two women together.  I only need to accidently indicate something was good from the sister-in-law and I have problems with my wife. 

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Well I know Muslim religion is not being seen in a very good light, but the fact is Mohammed and even the ancient Christians, state clearly it is your DUTY to accept you dead brother's wife as your own and his children as well.

I think if you find you have problems with them fighting, a simple solution is to bind their arms from wrist to shoulder to each other, Give them both a severe spanking and leave them for 24 hours tied like that.

Having to sleep and go to the toilet while tied like this would make them understand the need to cooperate. And would forge a better bond better them.

Now you would need to have a strong enough personality to do this without anger on your part and strength of personality to make them accept this is a fair thing to do.

I am sure the nice nice nazis who think everyone must be sooo nice will be up in arms at what I have written here, but I find it works.

Just a thought for you.

As to women marry to have a better life, this has only been going on for 100,000 years or so. I would recommend people who were raised in more well to do societies take a look back and see but a few generations ago, your ancestors were doing exactly the same thing.

Most of us in life are trying to get by.

[dragonmasterzip]

I have a little trouble understanding how anything as biased as this report can be called a "study".  It's interesting on what seems to be a slow news day, but it lacks anything that would remotely qualify it as a study.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

What exactly was biased in the study? Seems she went and gathered some facts and talked to people about what happened form a vareity of points of views.

I did not see anthing particaularly biased in what I read, but sounds like YOU might be carrying around a bit.

[dragonmasterzip]

One in three of 330 women ??????

96% having married men from Switzerland???

Pardon?

I married a Thai girl from a N.E. Thai village called Lak Chat near Nam Pong which is about 50 miles from Khon Kaen.

There's only 1 other falang in her village of some 200+ women.

In the entire area of Nam Pong (pop. 25000+ ) I doubt if there's 10 falangs.

We shop in Khon Kaen's (Thailand's 3rd largest city by population 1.7m)  biggest supermarket Big C twice a week.

I've never seen more than 3 falangs in the place.

..................and yet this report claims over 100 women from a small village are all married to Swiss citizens?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

As a widower, I met a Thai woman who was married to an American. She spent about 2 years trying to hook me up with different girls from her village. Asian cultures are far more "pack" like and social than especially Americans.

So the fact that is one village had a 96% rate to Swiss, would not suprise me. I think it would be interesting to study further the dynamics of how it happened.

If you read the article carefully, these swiss were not STAYING in Thailand but apparently taking their brides back home.

I could see further reasons in that the Swiss men would recommen to their friends and Thai women would recommend to Their frineds in hopes to build a small enclave of Thai society in Switzerland.

[DJ Pat]

with 54 percent meeting in entertainment venues where the women are employed. 

That's a new one on me^^

Awhile 20 percent meet by coincidence

That's even a newer one!! ^^

Edited May 4, 2005 by DJ Pat

[ray23]

I have a little trouble understanding how anything as biased as this report can be called a "study".  It's interesting on what seems to be a slow news day, but it lacks anything that would remotely qualify it as a study.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

What exactly was biased in the study? Seems she went and gathered some facts and talked to people about what happened form a vareity of points of views.

I did not see anthing particaularly biased in what I read, but sounds like YOU might be carrying around a bit.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I wonder what the villagers would have said had the interviewer been, a male Farrang. My guess is the answers would have been some what different. Thai's in my experience are polite people and could easily say what they believe is wanted. It really doesn't matter, some of these marriages are good for both parties some are not. Many people are in marriages with similar age differences in the states. I know a couple where the guy is 71, the girl is 30, they are happy I don't know why and I don't care, not my business. They are both Americans and live in Orange County California, he is a retired cop she works for the District Attornies office, they both do well finacially. The was something that made this click wiht the age difference I have no idea. I know the guy is very persoanble and the girl is a well. I don't know why my wife puts up with me, it's not money no one could that with me.

My wife and I share similiar interests and are really friends as well. Any Thia girl or any other girl for that matter, whose only interst in me is money, will be down the road very quickly. Hey if I have to rent then I will drive a new Vette several times a week. But I won't be marrying them and sharing my life with them. Until I met my wife a lived by the fifteen minutte rule, anger me and i replace you in fifteen minuetes. I woudl never do that with my wife and she does ange me from time to time. Why ? Shecan she couldn't be replaces as you would a sex partner.

So maybe a different slant would come from interviewing succesful couples, instead of the envoius nieghbors, who knows.

[slim]

As a widower, I met a Thai woman who was married to an American. She spent about 2 years trying to hook me up with different girls from her village. Asian cultures are far more "pack" like and social than especially Americans.

Since living in Thailand (about 18 months) I have yet to meet one single Thai girl/woman who wants to marry a Thai man.

My wife and I personally know of at least 2 dozen girls/women who want European husbands.

The reason's for this are all too obvious if you know anything of Thailand and Thai men who are generally piss poor fathers, piss heads, gamblers, womanisers, wife beaters, chauvinists, unreliable, untrustworthy.............shall I go on.

This, by the way, is not my opinion its the opinion of my Thai wife (although knowing her father I agree with it 100%).

My wife badgers me constantly to find a husband for 4 members of her own family - her sister, and 3 of her nieces - 2 of whom are "pure" as my wife puts it and are available for marriage if you have the necessary 500,000 baht.

(absolute discretion assured)

I wish I could find ANYONE I know who is in a position to take any of these women as a wife but I cant.

For this survey to claim 110 women out of a population of 330 are married to or have non-Thai partners either living in Thailand or out of Thailand is a statistical IMPOSSIBLITY as anyone with the capacity of logical thought would realize.

[arthsch]

how old is this scientist? just born?

[peter991]

Source: BBC News World Edition

Dateline: 20 July 2004

Link: http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/asia-pacific/3907581.stm

Thailand's 'Swiss village'

By Simon Montlake

Baan Jarn, Thailand

Festival day in rural north-east Thailand is traditionally a day of feasting and dancing.

For Lek Sankaprom, it is also an annual homecoming.

She has spent the past 14 years living in Switzerland, running a restaurant in Basel with her Swiss husband.

But on festival day she is happy to be back home, picnicking outside with her friends and family.

Lek is not alone in her choice of partner. Of the 540 households in Baan Jarn, at least 100 can boast a foreign son-in-law, almost invariably living in Switzerland.

Like clockwork, the wives come home every year bearing gifts.

To many Thais, Baan Jarn is known as the Swiss village - though it is surrounded emerald-green rice paddies rather than snow-capped mountains.

Scores of tall white-washed villas with tiled roofs stand out from the normal wood-and-concrete homes built in the area.

Wedged between her greying Swiss husband and her somewhat tipsy friends, 39-year-old Lek frowned when asked about local attitudes to those who marry foreigners.

"It's normal here. They accept me," she said. "I have many friends here who also married foreign men."

'Growing trend'

The spread of foreign husbands is sending ripples through many villages in Isaan, a region of north-east Thailand where rural poverty has often forced both men and women to seek opportunities elsewhere.

Researchers believe at least 15,000 Isaan women are married to foreign men, part of a growing trend over the last few decades.

These women are known as "mia farang", or foreigners' wives.

The men typically take their wives back home with them, but the couples often send money to Thailand, which pays for houses, cars and even roads.

Their remittances inject around $35m a year into the region's economy, according to the government's National Economic and Social Development Board. This amounts to 6% of the agricultural region's annual economic output.

The windfall has prompted the governor of Roi Et province, where Baan Jarn is located, to try to recruit mia farang to promote regional handicrafts and tourism.

He argues that they can become ambassadors for a region of Thailand that sees few of the 10 million foreign tourists that arrive in the country annually.

The idea has already run into problems because few foreigners' wives live locally, while many of those who do take a dim view of the governor's emphasis on profits.

Sex-trade 'links'

Behind the economic data lies a tangled tale of social norms and discrimination.

In this region of Thailand, relationships between foreign men and Thai women are often viewed through the lens of the country's booming sex trade.

Although everyone insists their sister or daughter met their foreign partners while working as maids, cleaners or cooks, suspicions die hard.

In Baan Jarn, local residents bristle at questions about the trade that lies behind the lofty villas and brand new motorbikes.

"Go away, I don't want to talk to journalists," said one young man, his friendly smile quickly dissolving into a hard stare.

One resident explained that recent media reports had distorted the village's image, by suggesting that many young women wanted to become mia farang.

Researchers say much of the stigma attached to these relationships has begun to fade in recent years, although the stereotypes have yet to completely go away.

"Society has changed in the last 30 years. Now you have television [and] the internet," said Decha Vanichvanod, director of the research centre which commissioned the survey of foreigners' wives.

"People say, okay, if you want to marry, it should be your own choice."

Local officials in Baan Jarn point to the positive qualities of the foreign sons-in-law whose wealth has transformed the village in the past 20 years.

"Even the old men are starting to change their attitude," said Saksri Khomdet, a village chief.

"Before they worried that the women would move overseas and not be treated respectfully," he said.

But foreign husbands say local people's acceptance of them is often more about hard currency than Isaan customs.

They point out that the Roi Et governor's enthusiasm for mia farang is mostly based on their economic yield.

"Sure, everyone wants a foreign son-in-law. They know it means a ready source of income," said a German who married a local woman three years ago.

[LeeX123]

Let me help...

I (farang) am getting wed to a girl on Sunday 8th May (yes in 4 days time) in her village a few km out of Khon Kaen.

Some statistics/facts to help support/argue the study made by Mr Professor.

Me 32 she 26 (not quite 10-18 years difference)

Her never married before

Her - University graduate (Khon Kaen), Me - Univeristy graduate - so no vast disparity in intellect.

Her Village - I am the only farang to have married a girl from her village

Her fellow villagers - over the moon that she's marrying a farang. Good luck to her attitude...no way ashamed of the fact.

For money ? The Dowry is very small and was "up to me", no negotiation at all.

For "my money" - I've showed them my credit card debts back in the UK amounting to £ 20,000 and explained I am essentially poorer than they are, but just "fly by the seat of my pants" by moving the debt from card to card utilising 0% interest free for 6 months promotions.

Back to my home country - she's happy to stay her, there or Timbuktoo (as long as it's with me). Oh yes I'm British not Swiss.

Liked the comment about BIG C. True statement, I never see more than 2 or 3 farang in there at any one time.

Hope this helps.....Wish me luck in my wedding, come along if you're near to Khon Kaen.

Edited May 4, 2005 by LeeX123

[DJ Pat]

Iøm up in Khon Kaen shortly...Best of luck to you and thanks for your honesty.

Many folks on here spend a lot of their time trying to convince all of us faceless forum posters they are the worldøs most successful millionaires married to high class Thai women with bags of money.

[teelac888]

Having lived in Switzerland for many years, most Thai women that I learned of that were living there and married to Swiss men were in some form of an unofficial separation and connected to the flesh trade somehow.

Some were even pimped out by their Swiss husbands.

I have heard of similar stories in Germany but don't know if they are true.

You can take the girl out of the bar but you can't take the bar out of the girl AND

we could replace the word POVERTY in the headline with the word GREED.

How many people in the village studied are short of food or have no house to live in? Not a single one......

Also fair to say that many of us who live abroad go in search of greener grass only to find that it is there but there are a lot of challenges as well.

[jaibelle]

It's a tough culture. I'm not a bar girl or that sort of stuffs but I don't like the way Thai people look at me when I am with my Farang husband. It's sad. And this is the big thing I will consider going back to Thailand or not. You, Farang guys, please carry yourself well when you are out walking with your wife. It will make a little different on how people look and how your wife will feel.

[davidmmurin]

with 54 percent meeting in entertainment venues where the women are employed. 

That's a new one on me^^

Awhile 20 percent meet by coincidence

That's even a newer one!! ^^

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Well here's my story and I'am stickin to it!! Marriage is a business first you are a salesman selling yourself to someone , but have to make a friend according to Dale Carnagie. You get the check if persistance wins over the resistance. When a Thai women meets a guavian through a potential arrange like I did it was a mutual interest thing she liked the idea of having the type of person come into her life whom she could take care of and also help herself as well. As it was explained to me if you are already older than the female it is better to have a younger women to help you in life..You think an old woman can do the lifting for you if bed ridden???????? Well it's working with me so far 58/34 and and we have a very good understanding of each other's spaces. I stay in the U.S.A. now and work then will come to the village in a few months. There seems to be more people coming with similar interests that is to love and have some do for you and take care but .....Where have all the good hearts gone? They aren't found in a bar but have to be found through other good hearts!!

[LaoPo]

It's a tough culture.  I'm not a bar girl or that sort of stuffs but I don't like the way Thai people look at me when I am with my Farang husband. It's sad. And this is the big thing I will consider going back to Thailand or not. You, Farang guys, please carry yourself well when you are out walking with your wife. It will make a little different on how people look and how your wife will feel.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I agree, but doesn't that count also for the Thai ladies, how they dress and behave, walking with their Farang friends/husbands?

I think that's a worldwide issue, not only Thai.

LaoPo

[davidmmurin]

It's a tough culture.  I'm not a bar girl or that sort of stuffs but I don't like the way Thai people look at me when I am with my Farang husband. It's sad. And this is the big thing I will consider going back to Thailand or not. You, Farang guys, please carry yourself well when you are out walking with your wife. It will make a little different on how people look and how your wife will feel.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I keep reading these posts and other things pop into my brain like "Self Image". Thai people do like to carry themselves in fashion maybe not new clothes but clean and ironed especially my wife and daughter every morning get up and sweep and mop and cook and bathe and iron and eat and go to school and go to the farm and work and come home and go to the talat and cook and study and eat and watch the news and sleep and then do it again the next day. They are clean yes squeaky clean and smelly good and are groomed. I don't know too many guavians that have that this kind of personal hygene. There are some that are adapting to the western way of life ...eat fast food get fat don't excercise etc.etc. spend money recklessy gambling and drinking and carry themselves with low esteem. Yes two houses two families and more than two ways of life. I am a grandfather with three sons and love them all and have new wife here in Thailand for two years and love my other family as well ...born a southern gentleman with reguards to the female and respect through parental discipline .. People see the difference in a farange over my visits and what discipline will make and others will want to understand..Ya Know what I mean?

[DJ Pat]

"Self Image". Thai people do like to carry themselves in fashion maybe not new clothes but clean and ironed

I once dated a girl for months on end and when she showed me the family snaps of her six years earlier, I saw that she was wearing the same clothes that she still had.

[davidmmurin]

with 54 percent meeting in entertainment venues where the women are employed. 

That's a new one on me^^

Awhile 20 percent meet by coincidence

That's even a newer one!! ^^

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Well here's my story and I'am stickin to it!! Marriage is a business first you are a salesman selling yourself to someone , but have to make a friend according to Dale Carnagie. You get the check if persistance wins over the resistance. When a Thai women meets a guavian through a potential arrange like I did it was a mutual interest thing she liked the idea of having the type of person come into her life whom she could take care of and also help herself as well. As it was explained to me if you are already older than the female it is better to have a younger women to help you in life..You think an old woman can do the lifting for you if bed ridden???????? Well it's working with me so far 58/34 and and we have a very good understanding of each other's spaces. I stay in the U.S.A. now and work then will come to the village in a few months. There seems to be more people coming with similar interests that is to love and have some do for you and take care but .....Where have all the good hearts gone? They aren't found in a bar but have to be found through other good hearts!!

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Hey! Lao, I know where you are comin from. In public in Thailand or wherever you are visiting to be a gentleman has many rewards. You can get catch more flies with sugar than vinegar.

[moebius]

QUOTE(jaibelle @ 2005-05-04 22:08:35)

It's a tough culture.  I'm not a bar girl or that sort of stuffs but I don't like the way Thai people look at me when I am with my Farang husband. It's sad. And this is the big thing I will consider going back to Thailand or not. You, Farang guys, please carry yourself well when you are out walking with your wife. It will make a little different on how people look and how your wife will feel.

I agree, but doesn't that count also for the Thai ladies, how they dress and behave, walking with their Farang friends/husbands?

I think that's a worldwide issue, not only Thai.

LaoPo

It goes both ways just about everywhere you go. In China people tend to view my mate (Singaporean) and I as an interesting couple.

In Thailand I'm not too sure. But when I'm alone I'm just another sleazy farang looking for a ride.

So I guess there is a lot of work to do.

Can't say it's any better over and across the sea. There's always someone making assumptions about someone without ever bothering to get to know them.

[pautai]

Its also forcing Thai married women into foreign marriages as their thai hubbies cant afford to keep them so they go along with them getting married to a farang to bring in a little extra money

[Heng]

Yeah, Thai man no good. I think the brisk business private investigators are doing, being hired by falangs to check up on their Thai wives/girlfriends is a clear example of this firm (but apparently insecure) belief. "Thai man no good" keep repeating and eventually you'll have yourselves convinced.

[The_Other_Mac]

Yeah, Thai man no good.  I think the brisk business private investigators are doing, being hired by falangs to check up on their Thai wives/girlfriends is a clear example of this firm (but apparently insecure) belief.  "Thai man no good"  keep repeating and eventually you'll have yourselves convinced.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I've never quite been able to picture Heng but I've just realised that he actually spends his days sitting on the kerb in Bannok, playing with bottle caps, scratching his gut, and consuming vast quantities of Sangsom and somtam.

[Heng]

Yeah, Thai man no good.   I think the brisk business private investigators are doing, being hired by falangs to check up on their Thai wives/girlfriends is a clear example of this firm (but apparently insecure) belief.   "Thai man no good"  keep repeating and eventually you'll have yourselves convinced.

I've never quite been able to picture Heng but I've just realised that he actually spends his days sitting on the kerb in Bannok, playing with bottle caps, scratching his gut, and consuming vast quantities of Sangsom and somtam.

Just about spot on. But that's Satoh from 7-11 at 50 Baht a bottle instead of Sangsom.

[bangkokian]

Any given research is biased in one way or another. Take for example the branding of coconut and coconut oil as unhealthy for years before someone sensible enough come up and say that can't be true (at least not universally true--ie. not a fact). To say that coconut oil is super healthy for everyone regardless is also a biased position, one in which many newer research on coconut oil takes. Researchers are just human beings trying to make sense of things they see. They also like to share and tell. Their stories can be helpful, harmful, or make no difference (like the researchers who did some major research on the use of chopsticks and their harms ).

You simply are meant for each other, whoever you get married to, at least for a particular period, if not for the rest of your life.

Appreciate reading all viewpoints here!

[cmmc_3]

Any given research is biased in one way or another.  Take for example the branding of coconut  and coconut oil as unhealthy for years before someone sensible enough come up and say that can't be true (at least not universally true--ie. not a fact).  To say that coconut oil is super healthy for everyone regardless is also a biased position, one in which many newer research on coconut oil takes. Researchers are just human beings trying to make sense of things they see.  They also like to share and tell. Their stories can be helpful, harmful, or make no difference (like the researchers who did some major research on the use of chopsticks and their harms ).

You simply are meant for each other, whoever you get married to, at least for a particular period, if not for the rest of your life. 

Appreciate reading all viewpoints here!

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Well said Bangkokian.

I have been married to a Northeasterner for the last 23 years and just like anywhere else, we have our economical ups and downs. Nevertheless, the outcome of my marriage relationship has always been dependent on not just about money but also based on the mutual trust and care plus support both from our families. I have not felt any regrets to have a Thai wife and fully enjoy each new day living a married life with a 'Mia Thai'