Atm Problems

[livingthedream]

My missus has a cirrus card linked to my account that she can use to draw money out from most ATM's. whilst I am back in UK working.

This system has worked well for the past five years and the account she draws from is one I set up just for this purpose (ie it is not my main current account) and as I say it has not been a problem in the past...apart from the bloody annoying 150 baht surcharge!!

Anyway she phoned to say she had tried to draw money from the green stand-alone booth of Kasikorn Bank ATM in the PTT petrol station on the main Mukdahan-Nakon Phanom road/crossroad lights (it has the ubiquitous 7-11 and Cafe Amazon)

After entering her pin and the amount to be drawn the machine then displayed the account balance! -this has never happened before and then followed by the message please take your card and wait for your money (or something similar)

she waited and waited...no money was forthcoming, no receipt was delivered and the card returned.

On checking my bank statement the transaction was completed and debited to the tune of 15150 baht!

I told her to go to the main branch of Kasikorn and tell them what happened. Without anything as proof shes on a wasted mission.

Now , I'm no greenhorn here - I don't expect them to hand over the money with a smile and an apology but it must be reported so that whoever the thieving b***d might be is stopped before others suffer the same fate. If its a software problem or technical glitch then surely the machine can be 'audited' and would therefore be 'up' to the tune of my money (and anyone else that may have been conned since it was serviced) I can't help being suspicious of the whole thing.

And before you cynics out there accuse my wife of conning a few quid out of me I have absolute faith she is telling the truth.

Just a word of caution to those who may be using this ATM. (or any ATM in the world for that matter...I'm starting to think it would be safer putting her cash in the post!)

Any other thoughts/ideas welcome

[Ratsima]

Does your bank statement show the transaction as an ATM withdrawal?

[tonititan]

Has she talked to the bank yet? I'm curious to hear what they say. I've had my share of ATM mishaps, including having my card "retained" by the ATM and having it give me the wrong amount of money. My bank (which is a different one) took care of the problems pretty quickly and with no fuss.

[kangeroo]

i have had the same problem with my ATM i withdrew 4 times but it shows i have withdrawn 6 times rang the bank with no real response except with the comment that they would check it .

bloody annoying i know

[Farma]

Some bank atm's show the account balance on screen or the receipt. The atm we use does. Onscreen it normally shows after the transaction is complete.

If she's reported the transaction problem to the bank the missing amount should be credited to your account in a few days. If not you will need to file a report with your bank so they can investigate from their side.

[livingthedream]

Does your bank statement show the transaction as an ATM withdrawal?

yes it does including the code for the bank and presumably the ATM but surely it is her word against theirs whether the money was actually dispensed or not. There was no transaction receipt issued from the machine...not that it matters because it would probably make things worse if she went in brandishing a receipt for the transaction. I will persue this as far as is reasonably practicable but feel it is futile but will make me feel better if I bombard them with info and what you gonna do about it?

[livingthedream]

Thanks for the replies everyone, shes going to the bank later today so I will let you know their response.

Its not so much about the money (well it IS really) its the principal that we are at the mercy of these infernal machines and I wonder how many cases go unreported or unsatisfied ...all those 150 bahts charges must go somewhere to compensate machine errors.

[lopburi3]

(15k is below the allowed daily limit from UK bank at current exchange rate? The account balance was above that amount?). I suspect transaction was not complete and your home bank will be crediting to your account when K bank does not follow up. I would have her try a lower amount next time and if possible do inside a bank with bank employee present.

[KHUNDAN]

I had the same thing happen at a Kasikorn Bank in Korat. The branch informed Bangkok and in 7 days I was credited the money back to my account.

They can check the tape from the ATM she used and it will show what happened. In my case the ATM showed it gave me 15,000 Baht and then it went into an out of service mode, also no receipt given.

Kasikorn checked the register against the moneies left in the machine and it showed there was 15,000 over in the machine from what the tape read.

Takes time, but will get it back I'm sure. TIT.

Things happen

Hope this relieves your stress and the misses somewhat.

Dan

[livingthedream]

Cheers for that Dan, the positive replies have given me good reason to hope that this can resolved.

I have told the wife to only use machines inside the bank where if the problem occurs again it can be reported immediately.

chok dee

[scorecard]

This is not an answer to the posters situation but probbaly worth sharing.

Inside Japan some banks offer another ATM option. You can request either on screen, or with a slip printout, the last 5 or the last 10 transactions and this of course gives you a current up to date balance.

In the posters situation this would be a way to instantly check whether the tranactions has actually recorded money out*, and new balance. (* But I'm not suggestiong that this is a rock solid guarantee that the cash did actually come out.)

Pity all banks didn't offer this service, shouldn't be difficult.

[Boo]

I thought that all atm have built in cameras that activate when the atm is used? In which case the bank "should" be able to see your wife wasn't given money?

Good luck with it.

[mizzi39]

This happened to me about 3 months ago using a KrungThai bank ATM at Big C. Machine kept churning like it was about to dispense money then went into a "out of service' mode. It did spit out my receipt showing that a 5,000 baht withdrawal had been made. I went to the main branch and explained what happened at what ATM, filled out a form and my account was credited 3 days later. The machines are audited daily. Once they see that the machine is over what it should be it is easy to figure out what account needs to be credited. Keep us updated!

[spacemand]

I work in the Debit card business and we see this on a regular basis that the ATM malfunctions.

Wait a couple of days and it might be credited back to your account by the owner of the ATM if this does not happen and they are not helpful you should contact the bank that issued the card then they will charge back the transactions for money not dispensed it can be a lengthy process of up to 60 days but in most cases the bank that owns the ATM will not contest the charge back because they can see there is a surplus in the ATM.

Our card holders are most often told by the bank owning the ATM to contact the issuing bank so don't be surprised if the bank is not cooperating

Edited February 2, 2010 by spacemand

[dmax]

surely the atm will record this transaction, it doesnt sound like a scimming scam to me or it wouldnt have given her a balance so im thinking its a system fault and nmore likely your wifes not the only one either.

[Dodobird]

I thought that all atm have built in cameras that activate when the atm is used? In which case the bank "should" be able to see your wife wasn't given money?

Good luck with it.

Correct, every ATM machine has a built in camera that activate when in used. I would suggest that you make a police report about the incident and file an official complain (attach with the Police Report) to the bank that you opened an account. Voila! you will see how fast they work on your case....

[Farma]

Correct, every ATM machine has a built in camera that activate when in used. I would suggest that you make a police report about the incident and file an official complain (attach with the Police Report) to the bank that you opened an account. Voila! you will see how fast they work on your case....

Hmmmm let me see. What happens if the girl is using a spare card provided by the account holder. It's my understanding account holders are the only ones allowed under bank rules to use the card.

Do you really want to have the girl arrested for illegal use of the card and the bank refuse to credit the account holders account as he allowed someone else to use his card?

[Dodobird]

Correct, every ATM machine has a built in camera that activate when in used. I would suggest that you make a police report about the incident and file an official complain (attach with the Police Report) to the bank that you opened an account. Voila! you will see how fast they work on your case....

Hmmmm let me see. What happens if the girl is using a spare card provided by the account holder. It's my understanding account holders are the only ones allowed under bank rules to use the card.

Do you really want to have the girl arrested for illegal use of the card and the bank refuse to credit the account holders account as he allowed someone else to use his card?

This is his opening statement :-

"My missus has a cirrus card linked to my account that she can use to draw money out from most ATM's. whilst I am back in UK working."

[Farma]

That’s not to say the card is her name. Some countries/banks will not allow accounts to non citizens.

It’s possible the linked account is in the account holders name and the card from that account is handed to the girl to use. I know more than a few people who use this method allowing their wife access to overseas funds.

If the account is in the girls name there won’t be a problem. If the situation is the same as I wrote a police report can cause unnecessary problems.

[Dodobird]

the account she draws from is one I set up just for this purpose (ie it is not my main current account) and as I say it has not been a problem in the past...

I think this is not so simple as many of us thought...

[lopburi3]

What law prevents you allowing another person use your ATM card?

In Thailand that is a major cry from bank if your card is used by a thief (that you had authorized the thief to use the card so they will not refund money taken).

[kalasin]

Another possibility: Thieves insert something into the slot where the money come out. Sits wainting accross the street watching people trying to get some money out of the ATM. But the money don't seem to be released. Then after an hour or so, they take this something away from the slot along with all the money people didn't get.

I have tried it in Denmark - to get cheated that is. And when I didn't get the menoy the first time, I tried one time more.... Grrrrhhhh

[Nip]

I had the same problem here in Phuket inside Home Pro (Lotus). Exact same amount of money as it happens. I rang the Bank in question (there was a contact number on the ATM) and the Bank said that my account would be credited within 3/4 weeks and it was. I would however like to add to your post... I have on 2 separate occasions in the past few months used ATM's to transfer money to other Bank accounts and the money was not transfered. I noticed within 24 hours and it was only after I rang the Bank that my account was credited. The first amount that went missing was 36K Baht the 2nd 40K Baht. Methinks something is amiss and it is necessary to keep a close eye on all Bank transactions!

[lopburi3]

Those are same bank transfers? I know BBL limits transfers to 20k per transaction to other banks.

[Chaimai]

What law prevents you allowing another person use your ATM card?

In Thailand that is a major cry from bank if your card is used by a thief (that you had authorized the thief to use the card so they will not refund money taken).

Not "Law" but covered by Terms & Conditions of issue i.e. Nationwide:-

Security

43. (a) The care of your cheque book, cards, PINs, statements and other security information is essential to help prevent fraud and protect your accounts. Please make sure that you follow the steps given below:

(i) always take reasonable steps to keep your card and cheque book safe and your PIN, password and other security information secret at all times;

(ii) you must memorise your PIN immediately and destroy the notification promptly on receipt. You must keep your PIN secret. You must not tell anyone your number not even our staff or the police. You should never write down your PIN;

[prakhonchai nick]

Not "Law" but covered by Terms & Conditions of issue i.e. Nationwide:-

The Bank Manager speaks. Good to see you back Chaimai.

[Chaimai]

The Bank Manager speaks. Good to see you back Chaimai.

Thanks Nick.

I like your new avatar - young pussy chai mai - right up your street

[livingthedream]

Since I started this topic I am now happyto disclose that the "missing" money has now been credited back to my account. Only took 3 weeks! Mai Pen Rai

[Chaimai]

Since I started this topic I am now happyto disclose that the "missing" money has now been credited back to my account. Only took 3 weeks! Mai Pen Rai

Good result - well done (I bet it took more than one phone call ?)

[livingthedream]

Since I started this topic I am now happyto disclose that the "missing" money has now been credited back to my account. Only took 3 weeks! Mai Pen Rai

Good result - well done (I bet it took more than one phone call ?)

Actually it took just two calls (both to my own bank) and a copy of my statement faxed to Kasikorn Bank, all in all I'm just glad it has been resolved. Missus now has a card in her own name and I have cancelled the other cards ..just playing it safe!! Thanks for everyones input , much appreciated.